Residency Statistics for Caribbean Medical School Transfer Students

[HopeMD13]

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I attended AUA and ended up repeating med 1 and med 3 due to health and personal reasons and was eventually dismissed due to poor academic standing. I am still interested in becoming a doctor and looking to transfer to another Caribbean Medical School to complete my education. If I pursue this path and got very good grades at the new medical school, did really well on all of the STEP exams and even got good recommendation letters, can anyone help me understand the chances of matching for residency in the US? I understand it will be very challenging for a transferring Caribbean student to end up being successful and matching for residency but what are the odds of actually pulling it off? I personally don't know too many doctors or medical students who have gone down this path and succeeded. Can anyone please let me know before I make the decision to transfer to another caribbean school? I just really want to know what I might be up against.

 

[W19]

From what I have read in this forum, your chances will be slim... If taking care of people is your passion, you should look into PA or RN---->NP...

 

[laricb]

I attended AUA and ended up repeating med 1 and med 3 due to health and personal reasons and was eventually dismissed due to poor academic standing. I am still interested in becoming a doctor and looking to transfer to another Caribbean Medical School to complete my education. If I pursue this path and got very good grades at the new medical school, did really well on all of the STEP exams and even got good recommendation letters, can anyone help me understand the chances of matching for residency in the US? I understand it will be very challenging for a transferring Caribbean student to end up being successful and matching for residency but what are the odds of actually pulling it off? I personally don't know too many doctors or medical students who have gone down this path and succeeded. Can anyone please let me know before I make the decision to transfer to another caribbean school? I just really want to know what I might be up against.

If your grades are good and your step 1 score is above a 240. Apply widely over 30 programs, Be able to explain your circumstance and you should receive some interviews look into IM, Family Med. P.S do well on your step 2 also above 240

 

[slopes23]

I attended AUA and ended up repeating med 1 and med 3 due to health and personal reasons and was eventually dismissed due to poor academic standing. I am still interested in becoming a doctor and looking to transfer to another Caribbean Medical School to complete my education. If I pursue this path and got very good grades at the new medical school, did really well on all of the STEP exams and even got good recommendation letters, can anyone help me understand the chances of matching for residency in the US? I understand it will be very challenging for a transferring Caribbean student to end up being successful and matching for residency but what are the odds of actually pulling it off? I personally don't know too many doctors or medical students who have gone down this path and succeeded. Can anyone please let me know before I make the decision to transfer to another caribbean school? I just really want to know what I might be up against.

What a lot of people fail to take into account in this situation is the low probability that all these things will happen. While if you were to score very very well on Step 1 and 2 you would have a shot at some lower tier programs perhaps, the fact that you had to repeat not 1 but 2 separate years means you likely will not. Is it impossible? No, but you would do well to regard the huge financial risk involved and associated downside. Not to mention all of this happened at a Caribbean institution it makes the hurdle you have to surmount that much higher/harder. If you truly are set on healthcare still, I believe a better path for you would be as someone else suggested RN->NP or PA school. I would suggest more strongly RN to NP however as PA schools are actually pretty competitive and are not saving seats for students in your predicament.

Good luck.

 

[Ceusina]

I would not consider transferring to a different medical school in the Caribbean. With a track record of not doing well in medical school, I think it will be very difficult to make all the changes necessary for success.

I have a classmate that went to Ross for one semester, didn't do well (but didn't fail out), realized going the Caribbean route would make matching much more difficult than going the DO route, came back to the US, did a post-bacc, and is now doing fine in medical school. He managed to turn things around and will have much better residency options than if he stayed on the island.

If you're serious about medical school, it would make sense to do a post-bacc, proving to yourself (and admission committees) that you have what it takes to succeed. And then reapply to US medical schools.

 

[Bancrofti]

If you're willing to put in the time by restarting at a different carib school because you want to become a doctor that bad, then the smartest option for you would be to find some SMP program to take you, kill it, and gain admission to a US school somewhere. As mentioned above, you're playing with too many what ifs for an already shaky situation even for good carib graduates.

 

[HopeMD13]

If you're willing to put in the time by restarting at a different carib school because you want to become a doctor that bad, then the smartest option for you would be to find some SMP program to take you, kill it, and gain admission to a US school somewhere. As mentioned above, you're playing with too many what ifs for an already shaky situation even for good carib graduates.

I understand it would be difficult especially for a caribbean student who had to transfer to another caribbean school. Do you know if the chances of matching for residency could increase if i started over from med 1 at a different caribbean school instead of applying as a transfer student. I know it would still show on my record that I was dismissed but I wouldn't be applying for residency as a transfer student anymore. Could you shed some light on this situation please?

 

[HopeMD13]

If your grades are good and your step 1 score is above a 240. Apply widely over 30 programs, Be able to explain your circumstance and you should receive some interviews look into IM, Family Med. P.S do well on your step 2 also above 240

I was looking into Atlantic University School of Medicine and was considering to start over from med 1 and start fresh instead of applying as a transfer student. Do you think this could help me better with matching for residency in the future than trying as a transfer student? I will of course be aiming to score above 240 on both step exams but i want to see if starting fresh could be a better option for me in this situation

 

[W19]

@HopeMD13 They have given good advice... It's probably the ones you didn't want to hear... Let me say it again: DO NOT TRANSFER TO ANOTHER CARIBBEAN SCHOOL EVEN IF YOU ARE STARTING OVER...

 

[Ceusina]

I understand it would be difficult especially for a caribbean student who had to transfer to another caribbean school. Do you know if the chances of matching for residency could increase if i started over from med 1 at a different caribbean school instead of applying as a transfer student. I know it would still show on my record that I was dismissed but I wouldn't be applying for residency as a transfer student anymore. Could you shed some light on this situation please?

No one can give you your exact chances of matching.

Regardless, I do NOT think starting over at another Caribbean school is a good idea. It's time to do some internal reflection, figure out what really went wrong (I know you said "health and personal reasons," but a lot of medical students have these same issues and manage to succeed), and get a fresh start. For you, I think a fresh start is returning to the US, doing post-bacc work (masters?), and applying to US medical schools. Staying in the Caribbean is not a viable option. Failing out of a Caribbean medical school implies that you're NOT ready to take on the rigor of medical school work. Maybe you will be eventually. But until you figure out what went wrong, fix it, and basically start all over, you're unlikely to succeed.

I was looking into Atlantic University School of Medicine and was considering to start over from med 1 and start fresh instead of applying as a transfer student. Do you think this could help me better with matching for residency in the future than trying as a transfer student? I will of course be aiming to score above 240 on both step exams but i want to see if starting fresh could be a better option for me in this situation

I know this is going to sound harsh, but, in my opinion, someone that was dismissed from medical school (US or Caribbean) is unlikely to ever achieve a 24o on Step 1. That level of performance requires a serious dedication to learning the material correctly, the first time, and having impeccable study skills (which you obviously have not mastered).

Either start over and do things the right way, or consider alternative careers in healthcare (many of which are arguably better than being a physician).

 

[wxman393]

Agree with all above posters. However, how do you transfer to a different program if you were academically dismissed? Wouldn't you need to "start fresh"? I'd be very leery of any program giving you transfer credit when you were dismissed for academic reasons. The debt will continue to pile up with no relief.

 

[deleted480308]

You're done Op, sorry

 

[W19]

@sb247 No reason to be harsh like that. You can clearly see that OP wants to become a physician, but his situation requires careful planning. Going to another Caribbean school will further put him/her in debt with no chances of getting a US residency. However, if OP really wants to increase his/her chances, he/she should come back to the US and do a post bacc to prove to adcoms that he can handle med school courses.... It will probably takes him 2 years to get a DO acceptance, but that's the right thing to do...

 

[MrChance2]

I would absolutely not pursue any further medical schooling.

 

[laricb]

I was looking into Atlantic University School of Medicine and was considering to start over from med 1 and start fresh instead of applying as a transfer student. Do you think this could help me better with matching for residency in the future than trying as a transfer student? I will of course be aiming to score above 240 on both step exams but i want to see if starting fresh could be a better option for me in this situation

Sorry but
I misread your quote I was under the assumption you finished school and had already taken your step 1. my bad, I agree with the other members. If you failed out of a Carib med school your probably done, even if you increased your GPA and received a good MCAT score. Schools will not accept a carib dismissed student not today. You should look into a PA or NP position. My friend works as a PA in long island earning over 140000 per yr, but even those programs are getting harder to obtain. Sorry again for misleading you.

 

[deleted480308]

@sb247 No reason to be harsh like that. You can clearly see that OP wants to become a physician, but his situation requires careful planning. Going to another Caribbean school will further put him/her in debt with no chances of getting a US residency. However, if OP really wants to increase his/her chances, he/she should come back to the US and do a post bacc to prove to adcoms that he can handle med school courses.... It will probably takes him 2 years to get a DO acceptance, but that's the right thing to do...

I'm not harsh, the reality is...

 

[sliceofbread136]

@sb247 No reason to be harsh like that. You can clearly see that OP wants to become a physician, but his situation requires careful planning. Going to another Caribbean school will further put him/her in debt with no chances of getting a US residency. However, if OP really wants to increase his/her chances, he/she should come back to the US and do a post bacc to prove to adcoms that he can handle med school courses.... It will probably takes him 2 years to get a DO acceptance, but that's the right thing to do...

That wouldn't work

 

[DokterMom]

About half (presumably the top half) of international grads appear to be able to secure residencies if they apply super broadly and aren't picky about specialty, geography or program malignancy. I'm sorry, but at this point, having already failed two years, there's just no way for you to make it into that top half. Even if you were to nail your Step 1, as a program director, I'd see too many red flags in your history.

What are your options for practicing medicine outside the U.S.? (Because, sorry to say, inside the U.S., they're shot.)

 

[Psai]

@sb247 No reason to be harsh like that. You can clearly see that OP wants to become a physician, but his situation requires careful planning. Going to another Caribbean school will further put him/her in debt with no chances of getting a US residency. However, if OP really wants to increase his/her chances, he/she should come back to the US and do a post bacc to prove to adcoms that he can handle med school courses.... It will probably takes him 2 years to get a DO acceptance, but that's the right thing to do...

you can't fail two years of medical school offshore and think that you will make it in the US
people go to caribbean schools for a reason

 

[Goro]

Your medical career is over. Find another path.

I attended AUA and ended up repeating med 1 and med 3 due to health and personal reasons and was eventually dismissed due to poor academic standing. I am still interested in becoming a doctor and looking to transfer to another Caribbean Medical School to complete my education. If I pursue this path and got very good grades at the new medical school, did really well on all of the STEP exams and even got good recommendation letters, can anyone help me understand the chances of matching for residency in the US? I understand it will be very challenging for a transferring Caribbean student to end up being successful and matching for residency but what are the odds of actually pulling it off? I personally don't know too many doctors or medical students who have gone down this path and succeeded. Can anyone please let me know before I make the decision to transfer to another caribbean school? I just really want to know what I might be up against.

 

[sloop]

I would not pursue med school further. Even the post-bac route seems unlikely to secure a U.S. med school spot. There are plenty of people who did well in post-bacs after having just slightly below acceptable GPAs/MCATs. There are enough of these people to fill the remaining positions in the U.S. These people will obviously get preference over someone who went to a Caribbean med school and was dismissed. It's not like this is an unreasonable or unfair bias, either—the person who didn't totally apply himself when he was in his late teens and thus just barely missed acceptable thresholds but then matured and got his act together in post-bac is very likely to succeed in medical school while the person who went to medical school already (in the Caribbean, no less) and did not succeed is far less likely to succeed in medical school.

This talk about getting 240s on boards in your situation is silly. Is it possible? Maybe technically, but probably not practically. On the whole, the truth is that the people who get 240+ have not failed a single class in medical school, let alone two entire years at a Caribbean institution. In my experience talking to classmates, 240+ scorers at a U.S. allopathic institution are generally at least in the top half to top third of their class. Of course there are exceptions but this is what seems standard for people like this. It's very hard to imagine the type of turnaround one would have to make to score 240s when they: did not do well enough in undergrad to get into U.S. med school in the first place, went to a Caribbean institution, failed two years, were dismissed, and transferred to another Caribbean institution.

It takes a good student to score a 240+ on the boards. Every indication is that you are not a good student (by med school standards). I'm sorry about saying this and I don't want to be mean, but that's the truth.

In my mind, the most likely situation if you transfer to another Caribbean institution is that you fail out again (given your track record). Second most likely is that you pass and get a degree but do nowhere near well enough to secure a residency in the U.S. I'd cut your losses at this point. There are plenty of other jobs that can make you happy. Don't believe the "I'd only ever be happy as a doctor" thing.

 

[Mad Jack]

If you go to another Caribbean school you will never match. That's just reality. Caribbean schools are viewed as third chances to begin with (first and second being MD followed by DO), so your first and second failures were your fourth and fifth chances, respectively, and you blew them. Why would any residency director in their right mind take a student that's already done so poorly so many times?

If you reinvent yourself and get into a US school you could be fine. But those chances are slim, regardless of SMP performance, because of your previous dismissal.

 

[pd1112]

If you want to stay in medicine, find a quick RN or EMT program & start from there. Don't spend another $40k+ post-bacc or SMP, which will result in at least another 1-2 decades of financial struggles on top of what you already owe to the pirates.

 

[Bancrofti]

For the record, I know of 2 people that failed/dropped out of carib school, went DO afterwards and did fine. I also think it might not be in your best interest to continue, but I just wanted to throw that out there, since people tend to say certain things are impossible or have never happened.

 

[HopeMD13]

Thank you everyone who replied and gave me your input. It definitely helped me out a lot.

 

[Bancrofti]

I know exactly the same number of people who have been struck by lightning. (Serious)

I met a guy who was struck... twice in his life.

If it seems like I'm annoying, it's fine, I don't mind offering people that little glimmer of hope. If I listened to every person on SDN about how unlikely it is to attain a certain Step score, I'd likely have bought into it and accepted the <228 average my school had. If I had listened to people on SDN after having to retake the MCAT to do well, I would probably be at some desk job that I couldn't stand torturing myself by looking at the clock every day to see when it hit 5.

I feel that regardless of the circumstance, people deserve the full truth. Let them do with it what they may and err on the side of pessimism if you feel that you're truly being altruistic and are trying to lead them in the direction that's in their best interest, but to not tell the full truth is a lie. It's definitely sticky, you don't want to send a bunch of people into a situation that's going to make their life a living hell if they're stuck with a few hundred thousand in debt. However, sometimes people need some glimpse of hope in order to keep working through their situation, and I was that kid.

 

[GoSpursGo]

I met a guy who was struck... twice in his life.

If it seems like I'm annoying, it's fine, I don't mind offering people that little glimmer of hope. I started off at a Carib school, then was able to transfer to a US school. If I listened to every person on SDN who spoke about how extremely unlike/impossible it was and how I was screwed for going there, I'd apparently have graduated from the school I was at and been left with no job. If I listened to every person on SDN about how unlikely it is to attain a certain Step score, I'd likely have bought into it and accepted the <228 average my school had. If I had listened to people on SDN after having to retake the MCAT to do well, I would probably be at some desk job that I couldn't stand torturing myself by looking at the clock every day to see when it hit 5.

I feel that regardless of the circumstance, people deserve the full truth. Let them do with it what they may and err on the side of pessimism if you feel that you're truly being altruistic and are trying to lead them in the direction that's in their best interest, but to not tell the full truth is a lie. It's definitely sticky, you don't want to send a bunch of people into a situation that's going to make their life a living hell if they're stuck with a few hundred thousand in debt. However, sometimes people need some glimpse of hope in order to keep working through their situation, and I was that kid.

That's all well and good. And you're right, there are success stories out there, and I'm glad to hear you are one of them--everyone wants to imagine that they are going to be the one to beat the odds and attain their dreams. But I would argue that you and the OP are in a different position, because he already has a dismissal on this record whereas you were able to kill it from the second you came into your Carib med school--no matter what he does from here on out, that's not going away. There comes a point at which, even if I accept that somehow he is going to change from someone who failed two classes to someone who gets >240 on Step 1, his application is going to be beyond repair.

Furthermore, I think what a lot of these hail marys lack is any clear plan to take him from the student who failed to someone who excels. Before he jumps back in and sinks more money into this venture, I think the first order of business is to take an honest look at what happened. Did they fail simply because they did not try hard enough? If that is the case, why, and what is going to be different this time to prevent the same outcome? Was there something off about the learning environment specific to the first Carib school which will somehow be different at the new school? Something didn't work the first time, and I think the OP needs to figure out exactly what went wrong and how they are going to fix it before they try again--this next attempt will likely be their very last chance, and if they need to take a little bit of time off to come up with a plan of attack, I would strongly encourage that.

 

[jackets5]

Thought i would chime in. Im a Caribbean graduate who is PGY-3 Internal Medicine resident at a University program applying to fellowship now. Sadly, i have seen many of the same situations described above in real life. Almost 100% of the time they end very poorly. Everyone has a plan, is going to score 240+ on boards, have a specific reason why they failed a class or semester due to personal circumstances. Personal circumstances dont go away and you have to deal with that stuff in medical school, residency and beyond. The fact that you have failed 2 semesters is even more concerning. Like others have said the chances of you transfering to a low level Caribbean school, getting through basic sciences, doing well on boards and matching is most likely none. Its you life and you can do whatever you want but the only thing that is going to come over it is a lot of money and time lost. If Medicine is really something you want to do, go do a SMP or Post-Bac program to see if you can really handle the work and then apply in the US to lower tier MD and DO schools.

 

[sloop]

I met a guy who was struck... twice in his life.

If it seems like I'm annoying, it's fine, I don't mind offering people that little glimmer of hope. I started off at a Carib school, then was able to transfer to a US school. If I listened to every person on SDN who spoke about how extremely unlike/impossible it was and how I was screwed for going there, I'd apparently have graduated from the school I was at and been left with no job. If I listened to every person on SDN about how unlikely it is to attain a certain Step score, I'd likely have bought into it and accepted the <228 average my school had. If I had listened to people on SDN after having to retake the MCAT to do well, I would probably be at some desk job that I couldn't stand torturing myself by looking at the clock every day to see when it hit 5.

I feel that regardless of the circumstance, people deserve the full truth. Let them do with it what they may and err on the side of pessimism if you feel that you're truly being altruistic and are trying to lead them in the direction that's in their best interest, but to not tell the full truth is a lie. It's definitely sticky, you don't want to send a bunch of people into a situation that's going to make their life a living hell if they're stuck with a few hundred thousand in debt. However, sometimes people need some glimpse of hope in order to keep working through their situation, and I was that kid.

I'm glad things worked out so well for you. Still, this dude failed two years of a Caribbean med school and was dismissed. I'm not against letting people know the facts either but you've gotta be careful about the way you present anecdote. If the family of someone with rabies takes the information that a few people survived using the Milwaukee Protocol to mean that their dying loved one has a serious chance, they probably just don't understand or know how to accurately utilize the information you just gave them.

Is it technically possible that this guy can defy all odds and make it as a doctor? Yes. It's possible. Highly improbable, but possible.

For all practical purposes though, his medical career is toast. Unless there's something hugely redeeming he hasn't told us, it's just incredibly hard to see someone coming back from flunking out of an offshore med school. Him going back to school is truly akin to a $250K+ lottery ticket at this point. If that's worth it to him, fine, but he should know that's basically what it is.

 

[deleted480308]

Mugsy bogues was 5'3" and in the NBA.....I tell everyone who is 5'3" they won't be in the NBA

 

[W19]

I truly believe OP has a slim chance if he/she can get his/her act together, but that chance will not be thru another Carib school. If OP can do well on a postbacc and has a good MCAT score 28+, a few DO schools might give him another chance...

I am really angry at these Caribbean med schools that are exploiting students, I think all US states should adopt 'California list of approved medical schools'.

 

[Bancrofti]

That's all well and good. And you're right, there are success stories out there, and I'm glad to hear you are one of them--everyone wants to imagine that they are going to be the one to beat the odds and attain their dreams. But I would argue that you and the OP are in a different position, because he already has a dismissal on this record whereas you were able to kill it from the second you came into your Carib med school--no matter what he does from here on out, that's not going away. There comes a point at which, even if I accept that somehow he is going to change from someone who failed two classes to someone who gets >240 on Step 1, his application is going to be beyond repair.

Furthermore, I think what a lot of these hail marys lack is any clear plan to take him from the student who failed to someone who excels. Before he jumps back in and sinks more money into this venture, I think the first order of business is to take an honest look at what happened. Did they fail simply because they did not try hard enough? If that is the case, why, and what is going to be different this time to prevent the same outcome? Was there something off about the learning environment specific to the first Carib school which will somehow be different at the new school? Something didn't work the first time, and I think the OP needs to figure out exactly what went wrong and how they are going to fix it before they try again--this next attempt will likely be their very last chance, and if they need to take a little bit of time off to come up with a plan of attack, I would strongly encourage that.

I'm glad things worked out so well for you. Still, this dude failed two years of a Caribbean med school and was dismissed. I'm not against letting people know the facts either but you've gotta be careful about the way you present anecdote. If the family of someone with rabies takes the information that a few people survived using the Milwaukee Protocol to mean that their dying loved one has a serious chance, they probably just don't understand or know how to accurately utilize the information you just gave them.

Is it technically possible that this guy can defy all odds and make it as a doctor? Yes. It's possible. Highly improbable, but possible.

For all practical purposes though, his medical career is toast. Unless there's something hugely redeeming he hasn't told us, it's just incredibly hard to see someone coming back from flunking out of an offshore med school. Him going back to school is truly akin to a $250K+ lottery ticket at this point. If that's worth it to him, fine, but he should know that's basically what it is.

I've never recommended that someone go to a Carib school, at least without some type of huge disclaimer. I also agree that's it's extremely risky and unwise for OP to attempt what he is saying. My original post in this thread said that he should not attempt to transfer, but try to gain admission to an SMP/post-bacc program and start over with the goal of getting in to some type of US school.

People on here can be unnecessarily cruel for no reason. OP has a good chance of failing out should he/she go to another Carib school. My anecdote was because I personally know of people who didn't even have to do any grade salvaging who failed out and are successful now stateside. Failing at a Carib school does not automatically relegate someone to being a subpar student. I even failed a major exam while there. It's really luck of the draw sometimes. We all go through some ****ty situations. Unfortunately, if you're abroad where there is no P/F system, it only takes 1-2 major screw up and you're out.

It may very well be that OP doesn't really have the ability to perform well. However, appealing to OP in a humanistic way is better than ****ting on his hopes and dreams. You know what makes most people want to do something even more?.. Telling them they can't without appealing to their emotions. At least give people like this some type of solid plan or don't respond at all. "hey, transferring would be extremely unwise... you can already take a look at NRMP data and see match stats for people who haven't failed. If you truly want to be a physician, attempt to gain admission to a post-grad program, fix up your study skills, then reapply. If you don't want to put in that work, but would like to stay in healthcare, you should really look into nursing or PA programs. They are great options and there's no shame in going that route."

Most of us don't like sugarcoating things, we're old enough that most people should be able to take the blunt truth. But when you're dealing with people who are desperate, the type of responses that most give on this board are going to lead to them ignoring you anyway, going ahead with their initial plan, failing out and being in a crapload of debt.

 

[sloop]

I've never recommended that someone go to a Carib school, at least without some type of huge disclaimer. I also agree that's it's extremely risky and unwise for OP to attempt what he is saying. My original post in this thread said that he should not attempt to transfer, but try to gain admission to an SMP/post-bacc program and start over with the goal of getting in to some type of US school.

People on here can be unnecessarily cruel for no reason. OP has a good chance of failing out should he/she go to another Carib school. My anecdote was because I personally know of people who didn't even have to do any grade salvaging who failed out and are successful now stateside. Failing at a Carib school does not automatically relegate someone to being a subpar student. I even failed a major exam while there. It's really luck of the draw sometimes. We all go through some ****ty situations. Unfortunately, if you're abroad where there is no P/F system, it only takes 1-2 major screw up and you're out.

It may very well be that OP doesn't really have the ability to perform well. However, appealing to OP in a humanistic way is better than ****ting on his hopes and dreams. You know what makes most people want to do something even more?.. Telling them they can't without appealing to their emotions. At least give people like this some type of solid plan or don't respond at all. "hey, transferring would be extremely unwise... you can already take a look at NRMP data and see match stats for people who haven't failed. If you truly want to be a physician, attempt to gain admission to a post-grad program, fix up your study skills, then reapply. If you don't want to put in that work, but would like to stay in healthcare, you should really look into nursing or PA programs. They are great options and there's no shame in going that route."

Most of us don't like sugarcoating things, we're old enough that most people should be able to take the blunt truth. But when you're dealing with people who are desperate, the type of responses that most give on this board are going to lead to them ignoring you anyway, going ahead with their initial plan, failing out and being in a crapload of debt.

OP took it well. He responded receptively thanking people for their advice.

I'm not sure what you mean when you say we didn't offer a solid plan. The plan I and others have offered is "pursue something else." What that something else is depends on the OP. The assumption that any failed med student would be happy as a nurse or PA is also kind of presumptuous. Maybe he wants more autonomy than that. Maybe he has an interest in finance. He should do something that makes him happy, whatever that is. Just because medicine was not meant to be doesn't mean he can't be happy.

The reality is that not everybody can be a physician. Not that physicians are all that but there's a reason "doctor" is right next to "astronaut" and "president" as a common dream kids have for their futures and that parents have for their childrens' futures. These are not all in the same league but they're competitive, high-power, high-status jobs with lofty standards and requirements. Not everyone can make it into these jobs and as a profession, medicine values certain things that the OP has fallen short on—namely being a good student of biological science.

Dreams are good but, at some point, you've gotta do something that is both realistic and will make you happy.

 

[Stagg737]

I truly believe OP has a slim chance if he/she can get his/her act together, but that chance will not be thru another Carib school. If OP can do well on a postbacc and has a good MCAT score 28+, a few DO schools might give him another chance...

I am really angry at these Caribbean med schools that are exploiting students, I think all US states should adopt 'California list of approved medical schools'.

OP would have to do better than that for most U.S. schools to consider giving him/her a shot given his current record. A 28 MCAT is now below average at several DO schools, not to mention the majority of MD schools. On top of that, he'd have to get a 3.9+ at the post-bacc, but that still might not off-set the fact that he wasn't able to cut it at a Caribbean school which likely has a less rigorous curriculum than many U.S. schools.

OP would likely have to hit the equivalent of a 30+ MCAT, get a 3.9 post-bac GPA, get a few EC's/research to show he's still staying involved, write some extremely convincing essays to show that the semesters (or years?) he had to repeat truly were anomalies and not the norm (which likely isn't the case since he's in the Carib), and get lucky enough for his app to land in front of people that are sympathetic enough to look past the obvious red flags. I'm sure OP probably has some chance at still becoming a physician, but let's not play down how ridiculously small those odds are. He'll not only have to completely re-invent himself academically and possibly as a person, but he'll have to prove that he has to adcoms. Neither of which seems very likely or doable for most people in that situation.

 

[HopeMD13]

I really appreciate everyone's responses but at the end of the day, you guys are right. The decision of what to do next is mine and mine alone. I found a new option. Let's call it option C. As you guys are right that a Director of any residency in their right mind will not give a student a second look if they have a dismissal on their record, I can go to another school and begin from med 1 and basically start over and spend more money. This option is there and will take care of the dismissal on my record but I found a school that will allow me to transfer into the 3rd or 4th semester and if I take comprehensive exams and essentially pass them and get credit for the courses in the previous semester provided in med1 and med2 then when I apply for residency they will never see a dismissal on my record. They will simply see that I received credit for my basic science courses from this university that I found. It seems too good to be true so I will be attending an online webinar to speak with students and grads from this school to find out how legitimate it is. On top of everything it is one of the cheapest schools I found and so I believe this will be my best option to save money and time and to try and redeem myself and get my life back. I will pursue this path as I still see becoming a doctor as a viable option and as it has been my dream since I was in the 5th grade so I am not ready to give up yet. I also have a friend attending this university and they seem to be enjoying it there so this also provides me with more credibility on how legitimate this school is. It is WHO and ECFMG accredited. The rest is up to me. Thank you kindly and wish me luck! For those of you who feel like you are stuck and there are no more options left, keep fighting and pushing forward. If you are determined enough and you want something bad enough, anything can be made possible.

 

[W19]

@HopeMD13 Best of luck!

 

[W19]

....

 

[DokterMom]

I really appreciate everyone's responses but at the end of the day, you guys are right. The decision of what to do next is mine and mine alone. I found a new option. Let's call it option C. As you guys are right that a Director of any residency in their right mind will not give a student a second look if they have a dismissal on their record, I can go to another school and begin from med 1 and basically start over and spend more money. This option is there and will take care of the dismissal on my record but I found a school that will allow me to transfer into the 3rd or 4th semester and if I take comprehensive exams and essentially pass them and get credit for the courses in the previous semester provided in med1 and med2 then when I apply for residency they will never see a dismissal on my record. They will simply see that I received credit for my basic science courses from this university that I found. It seems too good to be true so I will be attending an online webinar to speak with students and grads from this school to find out how legitimate it is. On top of everything it is one of the cheapest schools I found and so I believe this will be my best option to save money and time and to try and redeem myself and get my life back. I will pursue this path as I still see becoming a doctor as a viable option and as it has been my dream since I was in the 5th grade so I am not ready to give up yet. I also have a friend attending this university and they seem to be enjoying it there so this also provides me with more credibility on how legitimate this school is. It is WHO and ECFMG accredited. The rest is up to me. Thank you kindly and wish me luck! For those of you who feel like you are stuck and there are no more options left, keep fighting and pushing forward. If you are determined enough and you want something bad enough, anything can be made possible.

How will this make your record of dismissal go away? Or are you planning on concealing that when you apply for residency?

Please, for your own sake, do double- and triple-check the ECFMG accreditation. There's a thread going around here (or maybe a popular blog) by a Caribbean med grad who was in very much this same situation and has been seeking a residency post for something like 5-7 years. Found out the school he transferred to was not actually fully accredited, or mmaybe by virtue of his transfer, maybe he was ineligible. Anyone remember that thread?

Have you looked at options for practicing overseas?

 

[Winged Scapula]

How will this make your record of dismissal go away? Or are you planning on concealing that when you apply for residency?

Please, for your own sake, do double- and triple-check the ECFMG accreditation. There's a thread going around here (or maybe a popular blog) by a Caribbean med grad who was in very much this same situation and has been seeking a residency post for something like 5-7 years. Found out the school he transferred to was not actually fully accredited, or mmaybe by virtue of his transfer, maybe he was ineligible. Anyone remember that thread?

Have you looked at options for practicing overseas?

Agreed, he will have to lie because every residency application as well as licensing bureau has asked whether or not there is a gap in training and whether or not you have been dismissed or put on academic probation.

 

[Caribgrad]

For whatever reason, if you have had trouble and you are at a Caribbean school - even if you successfully transfer to another program in the Caribbean - your long term prospects are poor.

www.milliondollarmistake.WordPress.com

 

[AlbinoHawk DO]

@sb247 No reason to be harsh like that. You can clearly see that OP wants to become a physician, but his situation requires careful planning. Going to another Caribbean school will further put him/her in debt with no chances of getting a US residency. However, if OP really wants to increase his/her chances, he/she should come back to the US and do a post bacc to prove to adcoms that he can handle med school courses.... It will probably takes him 2 years to get a DO acceptance, but that's the right thing to do...

LOL in the SDN world "just do a little post-bacc and go to a DO school." In the real world, this applicant will never set foot in any DO school.

 

[W19]

LOL in the SDN world "just do a little post-bacc and go to a DO school." In the real world, this applicant will never set foot in any DO school.

I was not trying to demean the DO path in any way. I am someone who almost chose a DO school over a US MD. It's known that DO schools are more forgiven than US MD. I was not saying that OP will have a good shot, but based on his/her situation, that's the only shot he has now to become a US physician--albeit that shot is very very very slim.

 

[PrettyLadyDoc24]

I attended AUA and ended up repeating med 1 and med 3 due to health and personal reasons and was eventually dismissed due to poor academic standing. I am still interested in becoming a doctor and looking to transfer to another Caribbean Medical School to complete my education. If I pursue this path and got very good grades at the new medical school, did really well on all of the STEP exams and even got good recommendation letters, can anyone help me understand the chances of matching for residency in the US? I understand it will be very challenging for a transferring Caribbean student to end up being successful and matching for residency but what are the odds of actually pulling it off? I personally don't know too many doctors or medical students who have gone down this path and succeeded. Can anyone please let me know before I make the decision to transfer to another caribbean school? I just really want to know what I might be up against.

This may have been said but just letting you know that SGU does not accept transfer students if you've already taken Step 1. Consider all your other options at this point.

 

[NontradCA]

I was not trying to demean the DO path in any way. I am someone who almost chose a DO school over a US MD. It's known that DO schools are more forgiven than US MD. I was not saying that OP will have a good shot, but based on his/her situation, that's the only shot he has now to become a US physician--albeit that shot is very very very slim.

Forgiving for undergrad mistakes, maybe. But if you look on the Osteo forums, you'll find several threads of students who were dismissed from school and are done. If they aren't giving their own students 3rd and 4th chances, why do you think they would give outsiders one?

 

[W19]

@NontradCA Maybe I am wrong! In such case, OP is toast. OP is living out some 5th grade fantasy that 'he always wanted to be a physician since that time'... A lot people are enticed by the 'prestige' aspect of being a physician, which is in some aspect still exist, but is it not as glamorous as pre med and some med students think. It is evident from OP posts that being a physician is the ONLY career that will make him/her happy. To be honest, this is an aspect of the American culture that was hard for me to grab that people think happiness and job have a unshakable relationship. Before there is a flame war about what I said, people should understand that I made the transition from a country where more than half of the population were unemployed to a country (the US) where 7% unemployment rate can cause uproar. Therefore, people where I was born usually think about their livelihood first before even thinking about the 'happiness' part. Enough with my nonsense!


People have given OP sound advice if his/her desire is to have a career in healthcare, but despite these advice, OP tries to come up with unpalatable solution to his situation. How in the world a medical student that failed twice thinks he could go to another school that will make him take a few subject exams, then waive MS1/MS2 and that somewhat would wipe out his/her record? Therefore, one can clearly see that OP has not taken a step back and reflect on his situation. Thus, telling him 'You are done' is very insensitive and will make OP put himself in even a bigger hole that he/she is already in now. Our job is to give him some hope while pointing out that glimmer of hope is very slim...

 

[AlbinoHawk DO]

I was not trying to demean the DO path in any way. I am someone who almost chose a DO school over a US MD. It's known that DO schools are more forgiven than US MD. I was not saying that OP will have a good shot, but based on his/her situation, that's the only shot he has now to become a US physician--albeit that shot is very very very slim.

I don't think you're trying to demean the DO path, but I do think most people confuse grade replacement with meaning that all you have to do is meet a grade threshold to enter.

 

[deleted463521]

Not sure how naive this might sound, but the best thing I could thing of is directly speaking to admissions committees and/or to residency hospitals and see what they think about your particular case.

 

[drrao88]

If you're willing to put in the time by restarting at a different carib school because you want to become a doctor that bad, then the smartest option for you would be to find some SMP program to take you, kill it, and gain admission to a US school somewhere. As mentioned above, you're playing with too many what ifs for an already shaky situation even for good carib graduates.

Hey, would you mind if I messaged you about your Caribbean school experience?

Thanks!