Respect from patients/other health care practicioners

[oncogene]

Those already are huge differences doclm - Not having an MD/DO means we can't do a full orthopoedic residency (5 years for the whole body) therefore, we can't take general call - which means any other part on the body. Because, they can take general calls, they are reimbursed more. Those are facts that should not be undermined and are large enough to result in the large gaps between our salaries (starting offers at least).

Look, the DPM training is great - we get great education and excellent residency training. This is what I want to do and I love it. But you gotta accept that our specialties are different from one another. Yes a Foot and ankle orthopoedic surgeon will operate on the foot and ankle just like a podiatric surgeon would - but he can operate on other areas of the body as well, while we employ other aspects of our clinical skills i.e. wound management, diabetic ulcers, etc. For that reason, we can't really be compared because we're separate specialties/areas of medicine

I agree except when we do the same exact surgical procedure we should be paid the same. I don't think that having having the extra training should hold up in this case.

Oncogene

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[cool_vkb]

A pod cannot be sued for taking out the wrong side of a brain. instead they would go to jail for battary/ assult or murder. (for all that are unaware - operating that causes death but is out of scope is considered murder. it can happen to MDs too. )

until you have gone thru 4 years of school, 3 years of residency and been in practice for at least 2 years, please do not promote this profession as an easier side to medicine. it is not.

Iam sorry but wat exactly r u trying to say. A pod doing brain surgery and going to jail . plzz read my posts once again and comment on them. i never said anything like that. u r just making up this by urself. A pod doing brain surgery . i heard pods sometime straying in IM or FM or even general surgery but never did i heard Brain Surgery. thats outrageously funny. leave aside law suit, tat kind of pod shud be shot on the street. i was referring to neurosurgeons doing mistakes in brain surgery. why on the earth will i even give that example of a pod doing something out of his scope . i was giving examples how bad can professional negligence(within the scope of practice) can occur and how badly that might affect th life of the patient.

and may u cud agree a majority of pod's negligence (within his scope) are not life threatning ones when compared to professional negligence done by a cardio or neurosurgeon which cud even cost the life of the patient.

 

[johnnycash]

Ha ha ha!! Type ratings. What a joke that was. My type ride was easier than my private pilot. Try your ATP rating or your CFI, CFII, MEI ratings and tell me how easy they are. Try dealing with a stabilator oscillation at FL390 (39,000). Try shooting an approach in actual with half your FMS inoperative. Try a 0/0 ILS.

You earned your private pilot at 16 huh? Well, the minimum age is 17 so you are obviously a liar. So, what ratings do you hold?

I currently hold my -

CRJ200/700/900 Type, ATP rating, CFI, CFII, MEI, AGI, CSEL.

Whatever you say pal. If I have a 737-200 rating, then I must have an ATP, right? Do you wanna compare airline service? I flew for eagle, air south and PAA 1. That dates me a bit. How about twin turbo time? I actually thought the MEI was a piece of cake and the CFII, too. Conversion to turbine was the hardest. But as you claim I am a liar.

 

[flypod]

Uh huh. If you have a 737 type, that means jack. And in case you dont know aviation very well, you can hold a 737 type with a private pilot certificate. You dont need to hold an ATP to hold any type rating.

Dont dig yourself a hole.

 

[johnnycash]

Uh huh. If you have a 737 type, that means jack. And in case you dont know aviation very well, you can hold a 737 type with a private pilot certificate. You dont need to hold an ATP to hold any type rating.

Dont dig yourself a hole.

right, junior. my type rating means squat. ive been flying for longer than you were able to drive. so how can you get a 737 type with just a private? how do you expect to fly in ifr or above fl180? no sh-t you dont need an atp for a type but try line flying w/o it. do u want to go toe to toe with me junior? lets hear your airline service and i dont mean a crj rating that you paid for at riddle.

 

[dawg44]

I agree except when we do the same exact surgical procedure we should be paid the same. I don't think that having having the extra training should hold up in this case.

Oncogene

Don't hold your breath. Insurance companies aren't begging to dole out more in reimbursement. I'd put this crusade right up there with O.J finding the real killers.

 

[flypod]

right, junior. my type rating means squat. ive been flying for longer than you were able to drive. so how can you get a 737 type with just a private? how do you expect to fly in ifr or above fl180? no sh-t you dont need an atp for a type but try line flying w/o it. do u want to go toe to toe with me junior? lets hear your airline service and i dont mean a crj rating that you paid for at riddle.

Acutally my airline paid for it. Anyone with a private pilot certificate and an instrument rating can fly anove FL180. FOs fly the line without a PIC type rating. Toe to toe? Ha ha!! Get real.

My airline experience (you asked for it!)

BS Aeronautical Engineering, UC Davis
US Naval Flight School, Pensacola, FL
US Navy Flight Assignment, T 38 instructor
Ameriflight - Single pilot IFR, BE99
Skywest Airlines - Senior Captain CRJ 700

Total time 6953
Turbine (ME/SE) 5865
Insturment 561
Military 1763

Care for anything else old timer?

 

[johnnycash]

still with a commuter? let me know if you get to a legacy. old timer? i think almost 10 years with pan am is something special. cant match that yet, jr. ah, a good ol' p-ssing contest. it's fun though. why are you giving it up for medicine?

 

[AZPOD Rocks]

Acutally my airline paid for it. Anyone with a private pilot certificate and an instrument rating can fly anove FL180. FOs fly the line without a PIC type rating. Toe to toe? Ha ha!! Get real.

My airline experience (you asked for it!)

BS Aeronautical Engineering, UC Davis
US Naval Flight School, Pensacola, FL
US Navy Flight Assignment, T 38 instructor
Ameriflight - Single pilot IFR, BE99
Skywest Airlines - Senior Captain CRJ 700

Total time 6953
Turbine (ME/SE) 5865
Insturment 561
Military 1763

Care for anything else old timer?

Flypod,

I wonder where your aggressive online personality is going to fit into a healthcare practice? Do you think this doesn't carry over into other areas of your life?

How will you be successful when all day long you are working with others and behave as you have over the short time you have been posting on SDN. Nearly everything you say is derogatory or contentious. For your own good and for the good of those you will work with, please learn to control yourself a little better... or choose something else.

From many of your posts, it shows that you have the potential for intellectual endeavors, but this combined with an aggressive/contentious way of being will not bear the fruits you seek.

Remember, you are addressing students with whom you have expressed a desire to work. However, we now know enough about you that a few words to the admissions committees about your poor attitude might reduce your chances for admissions into this profession. THEN... you would really have something to gripe about.

As things stand, unless you have a serious change of heart, I don't intend to have you as one of my classmates and will make sure your online behaviour is brought to the attention of the right people at AZPOD.

Straighten up or ship out.

AZPOD

 

[flypod]

As things stand, unless you have a serious change of heart, I don't intend to have you as one of my classmates and will make sure your online behaviour is brought to the attention of the right people at AZPOD.

Straighten up or ship out.

AZPOD

AZPOD, I am just addressing what has been challenged or asked of me. A difference of opinion is looked at as agressive? No disrespect, but you have no idea who I am. Dont try to tell me that you're going to make sure I dont get into AZPOD. Thats actually pretty funny. I'll make sure you're never a passenger on my aircraft

 

[cool_vkb]

Flypod,

I wonder where your aggressive online personality is going to fit into a healthcare practice? Do you think this doesn't carry over into other areas of your life?

How will you be successful when all day long you are working with others and behave as you have over the short time you have been posting on SDN. Nearly everything you say is derogatory or contentious. For your own good and for the good of those you will work with, please learn to control yourself a little better... or choose something else.

From many of your posts, it shows that you have the potential for intellectual endeavors, but this combined with an aggressive/contentious way of being will not bear the fruits you seek.

Remember, you are addressing students with whom you have expressed a desire to work. However, we now know enough about you that a few words to the admissions committees about your poor attitude might reduce your chances for admissions into this profession. THEN... you would really have something to gripe about.

As things stand, unless you have a serious change of heart, I don't intend to have you as one of my classmates and will make sure your online behaviour is brought to the attention of the right people at AZPOD.

Straighten up or ship out.

AZPOD

Flypod may be suffering from dipression related syndrome. these type of peope are very different in their normal life. they are completely opposite to their online personality. u can also call dual personality. they have this anger building up in their normal lives which they cant take out. so they see for an alternate way. many people take their anger out by playing aggresive video games, shouting like cattle in baseball or football games, some do boxing and some great people come to a forum and take out there anger by wirting posts

and if u have observed, no one else in this forums, reminds other people of their authority and expertise then him. In every thread he makes sure he mentions "You dont who iam?" , "you dont know abt my experience", or " what do i know, i just fly planes". this is called as self admiration and imposing authority on others by showing he is the best. by doing this the subject experesses himself in a way which he cudnt have done in real life. it can be 100% that flypod doesnt even fly planes. he has just visited some forums and learnt abt it.

No offense flypod but Sir if u really have this much great experience in flying and veteran status why r u even wasting ur precious time among youngsters like us and arguing abt something that has no such concern to u. iam sure u must be around mid ages now (based on ur invaluable flying experience) and someone of ur calibre must be very succesfull and rich and happy. why this attitude sir? its like u just ask a question and then happily gives the answer by urself but in the way u ignite so many debates. It looks like as if u just want to start a heated debate where u cud post ur views and lighten the burden on ur heart.

 

[flypod]

Oh! You must have learned about psychiatry in "podiatric medical shool" right? After all, it is medical school.

 

[Podman]

Oh! You must have learned about psychiatry in "podiatric medical shool" right? After all, it is medical school.

Actually, this is the one rotation that we don't typically undergo - so his psychiatric analysis is solely his own knowledge - we got nothing to do with this .

Otherwise, I just wanted to say that it would be great if we can maintain a level of respect and conduct on this forum from all the members participating. This is a forum to exchange ideas and thoughts - not to bash and vent.

thank you all

 

[cool_vkb]

iam going for 3 days vaccation, so no bashing from my side. thank u and sorry!

 

[jonwill]

Actually, this is the one rotation that we don't typically undergo - so his psychiatric analysis is solely his own knowledge - we got nothing to do with this .

Otherwise, I just wanted to say that it would be great if we can maintain a level of respect and conduct on this forum from all the members participating. This is a forum to exchange ideas and thoughts - not to bash and vent.

thank you all

Well said Podman.

 

[krabmas]

Iam sorry but wat exactly r u trying to say. A pod doing brain surgery and going to jail . plzz read my posts once again and comment on them. i never said anything like that. u r just making up this by urself. A pod doing brain surgery . i heard pods sometime straying in IM or FM or even general surgery but never did i heard Brain Surgery. thats outrageously funny. leave aside law suit, tat kind of pod shud be shot on the street. i was referring to neurosurgeons doing mistakes in brain surgery. why on the earth will i even give that example of a pod doing something out of his scope . i was giving examples how bad can professional negligence(within the scope of practice) can occur and how badly that might affect th life of the patient.

and may u cud agree a majority of pod's negligence (within his scope) are not life threatning ones when compared to professional negligence done by a cardio or neurosurgeon which cud even cost the life of the patient.

calm down, I am not flypod. I wasn't saying that you said all that. but pods can make life altering changes good or bad to the patient.

 

[Dr_Feelgood]

Acutally my airline paid for it. Anyone with a private pilot certificate and an instrument rating can fly anove FL180. FOs fly the line without a PIC type rating. Toe to toe? Ha ha!! Get real.

My airline experience (you asked for it!)

BS Aeronautical Engineering, UC Davis
US Naval Flight School, Pensacola, FL
US Navy Flight Assignment, T 38 instructor
Ameriflight - Single pilot IFR, BE99
Skywest Airlines - Senior Captain CRJ 700

Total time 6953
Turbine (ME/SE) 5865
Insturment 561
Military 1763

Care for anything else old timer?

I thought you said you didn't make much as a pilot??? If you have this much flight experience than you must be lying.

 

[Dr_Feelgood]

Sounds like some old marketing propaganda from the schools. Work 40 hours a week, be a doctor, no call, do surgery, ect ..

Salary from my research says 40-60K to start and after 5-10 years $90K. The US Bureau of Labor Statistics says pods make $94K on average. The Health Guide also reports average earnings of $94,400 annually.

I think that to state the career is "easy going job wise and no tension of any big law suit pondering over hear" is a very irresponsible statement. You, as a medical practitioner, will always have the risk of lawsuits. If you decide to work a light load or keep it "easy going" I can guarantee you half the earnings of the average podiatrist and a very high chance of failure as a pod financially. It will take 80-100 hours a week of hard work to be sucessful (in any business).

I am no pod but I can say I think you may be a little misinformed if those are your immediate conceptions of podiatry.

Yes, flypod, our goal is to increase the number of licensed pods so that we make less money. We are hoping to flood the nation w/ pods and our marketing scheme is to tell everyone that pods make about 200K a year. It is genius!

 

[Dr_Feelgood]

Come on now people! Let's quit with all of the name calling and keep it professional. It would be a shame to have to close the thread.

i love this, you haven't had that power for 24 hours and you are ready to use it.

 

[AZPOD Rocks]

AZPOD, I am just addressing what has been challenged or asked of me. A difference of opinion is looked at as agressive? No disrespect, but you have no idea who I am. Dont try to tell me that you're going to make sure I dont get into AZPOD. Thats actually pretty funny. I'll make sure you're never a passenger on my aircraft

Flypod,

Most of us on here have disagreed with others' opinions but most have also done so without personal attacks and blatant disrespect for others.

No offense taken. You are correct in that I don't know exactly who you are but it is not hard to point out to certain AZPOD faculty that there is a "difficult" person applying who flies airplanes, was in the military, and who has credit hours coming from SCC, and who probably lives somewhere near, if not in, Scottsdale, and who is around 30 years old or more. I could even share a list of disrespectful postings.

I don't share these things to put you on the defensive but, right now, I don't want someone who acts the way you have been acting at my school as one of my collegues. Its very simple... if you say to yourself, "This is the way I am in real life," then please don't apply. If you say to yourself, "Because of the anonymity online communications afford, I HAVE been acting pretty rude and maybe I could act a LITTLE more respectful of others," then please apply.

We are a close-knit group at AZPOD (small student population) and the concerns of one student who already gets along with everyone else goes a long way. I don't care if you disagree with opinions, but when you resort to personal attacks and behave in a tactless manner, just realize this is going to influence the opportunities you create for yourself.

AZPOD Rocks

 

[AZPOD Rocks]

i love this, you haven't had that power for 24 hours and you are ready to use it.

You know what I just realized? You joined SDN just one month before me, but you have posted about 8 posts to my every 1 post. Wow!!!

But my posts are typically 8 times longer... lol

AZPOD Rocks

 

[flypod]

I thought you said you didn't make much as a pilot??? If you have this much flight experience than you must be lying.

I dont. Still under six figures. Experience doesnt matter when you leave the military or flight school and then work at an airline. You are assigned a seniority number and work from the ground up. I have 747 captains flying as first year first officers due to 9/11. You think these guys are worth 18/hr? Probably not. They should be teaching most the captains to fly but due to the seniority list, they're at the bottom of the pot.

Check out airlinepilotcentral.com for the pay scales. Just remember that we're paid on a monthly guarantee not a 9 hour day or 40 hours a week.

 

[capo]

We're off topic again.

 

[Dr_Feelgood]

We're off topic again.

This thread has not been on topic for awhile.

 

[jonwill]

The DMU clinic gets tons of respect from patients. One of their favorite patients even brings wonderful snacks everytime he comes (although sometimes they are quite outdated). Yum, Yum!!!

 

[IlizaRob]

The DMU clinic gets tons of respect from patients. One of their favorite patients even brings wonderful snacks everytime he comes (although sometimes they are quite outdated). Yum, Yum!!!

You mean sugar ray?

 

[jonwill]

You mean sugar ray?

 

[JEWmongous]

Thanks for responding to my question for those who kept on topic! So overall, a majority of the pods receive respect from patients and other health care providers. How does the respect lie between pods and orthopedic surgeons, particularly the ones with a foot and ankle fellowship? Thanks

 

[jays2cool4u]

Thanks for responding to my question for those who kept on topic! So overall, a majority of the pods receive respect from patients and other health care providers. How does the respect lie between pods and orthopedic surgeons, particularly the ones with a foot and ankle fellowship? Thanks

I've seen a pediatric orthopedic surgeon roll his eyes in disgust when someone mentioned podiatrist and surgery in the same sentence. I've also heard a surgical technician say that podiatrists are not real doctors. Those were the only two experiences I have encountered between medical staff and pods (indirectly). However, I am sure there is tons of positive examples people have experienced first hand.

Jays2cool4u

 

[krabmas]

I've seen a pediatric orthopedic surgeon roll his eyes in disgust when someone mentioned podiatrist and surgery in the same sentence. I've also heard a surgical technician say that podiatrists are not real doctors. Those were the only two experiences I have encountered between medical staff and pods (indirectly). However, I am sure there is tons of positive examples people have experienced first hand.

Jays2cool4u

people will always talk trash behind someones back but not necessarily to their face.

There are plenty of health care professionals, docs and physicians... that will think pods should not be doing surgery. But the question is do they know the advances made in our profession, the increased quality of the residency training.

Many people say things out of ignorance.

And there will always be a number of crappy pods out there just like there will always be the MDs and DOs that graduated last in their classes. ANd other not so good docs.

 

[jonwill]

I've seen a pediatric orthopedic surgeon roll his eyes in disgust when someone mentioned podiatrist and surgery in the same sentence. I've also heard a surgical technician say that podiatrists are not real doctors. Those were the only two experiences I have encountered between medical staff and pods (indirectly). However, I am sure there is tons of positive examples people have experienced first hand.

Jays2cool4u

I've seen many doctors roll there eyes when someone mentions another doctor. It has nothing to do with the degree, but rather the competance of the physician. Generally, podiatrists are medical staff at hospitals.

 

[Dr_Feelgood]

I roll my eyes at a pediatric orthopod that worked on my wife's cousin. He is 13 and tall for his age so of course he plays B-Ball. He has noticed a lot of pain in the posterior aspect of his heel right around the insertion of the Achilles. So they took him to the peds orthopod, he did a calcaneal squeeze test and diagnosed him w/ a stress fracture. No X-rays, no single leg hops, no CAM walker or cast. Instead the doc said go get a straight last shoe b/c your shoes do not support your arch and this is what is causing a stress fracture.

All of the upperclass pod students probably have a different DDx which would include Seaver's (which I am convinced is the problem not a stress fracture b/c of the location and h&p). I'm not a doc but 1) I would have got an X-ray; 2) I would have immobilized the foot since the kid could barely walk; 3) I would not have let him go back to playing bball that next day.

So there are lots of idiots in this world who are ignorant.

 

[jonwill]

I roll my eyes at a pediatric orthopod that worked on my wife's cousin. He is 13 and tall for his age so of course he plays B-Ball. He has noticed a lot of pain in the posterior aspect of his heel right around the insertion of the Achilles. So they took him to the peds orthopod, he did a calcaneal squeeze test and diagnosed him w/ a stress fracture. No X-rays, no single leg hops, no CAM walker or cast. Instead the doc said go get a straight last shoe b/c your shoes do not support your arch and this is what is causing a stress fracture.

All of the upperclass pod students probably have a different DDx which would include Seaver's (which I am convinced is the problem not a stress fracture b/c of the location and h&p). I'm not a doc but 1) I would have got an X-ray; 2) I would have immobilized the foot since the kid could barely walk; 3) I would not have let him go back to playing bball that next day.

So there are lots of idiots in this world who are ignorant.

Give the boy some heel lifts and he'll be fine

 

[Dr_Feelgood]

Even better, I talk to his mom a little more on Monday. The doctor actually diagnosed a stress fracture secondary to plantar fasciitis even the the pain is right on the insertion of the Achilles.

 

[defboy]

I am not a doctor. But! great word eh? I think folks that rolls eyes are the ones that have taken the opinion opf others and generalized it to the whole of a specialty, class, race, sexual orientation, etc. You can go on forever about the ignorance of other professions and the training they do or do not get, but without having first hand experience you can't say; you've been weight, you've been measure and you've been found wanting. Most peopel will never walk in anothers shoes. I do not know what training my athletic trainer or the orthopod I saw recieved but the advise they gave me cost me my football career. I see a podiatrist and find out all kinds of things that I could have done to prevent further injuries. I believe KRABMAS hit it on the head. I know some docs barely pass board testing, some as Cool said can buy a degree and some pods fart their way through. Many older pods do great work, it isn't about the new training it is about the individual making an effeort to be the best and not figure out a way to screw someone over for $60.

 

[krabmas]

I am not a doctor. But! great word eh? I think folks that rolls eyes are the ones that have taken the opinion opf others and generalized it to the whole of a specialty, class, race, sexual orientation, etc. You can go on forever about the ignorance of other professions and the training they do or do not get, but without having first hand experience you can't say; you've been weight, you've been measure and you've been found wanting. Most peopel will never walk in anothers shoes. I do not know what training my athletic trainer or the orthopod I saw recieved but the advise they gave me cost me my football career. I see a podiatrist and find out all kinds of things that I could have done to prevent further injuries. I believe KRABMAS hit it on the head. I know some docs barely pass board testing, some as Cool said can buy a degree and some pods fart their way through. Many older pods do great work, it isn't about the new training it is about the individual making an effeort to be the best and not figure out a way to screw someone over for $60.

well thank you

 

[whiskers]

Regardless of how you reason this debate the truth is that many people get a kick out of looking down on others for a billion reasons and the DPM degree will give some people a reason.

As a DPM, I think you'll encounter your share.

Plus it's interesting to note that even some DPMs look down at other professions.

I think it's akin to a pecking order and that's probably why it's kind of important to not wrap your self-image up in a degree or a profession and you won't be disappointed.

 

[Dr_Feelgood]

I look down at short people. But don't we all. (unless you are short)

 

[krabmas]

I look down at short people. But don't we all. (unless you are short)

I look up to them

Does any one watch that show "little people" on TLC?

I love watching it and my husband screams at me - why are you watching that again? you are not a little person.

he is a foot taller than me and says I am not a little person

 

[Dr_Feelgood]

I watch Little People Big World. Its a good show but I didn't notice that they were short. I thought it was a Hollywood camera trick I really do like the show. It is crazy to think about how tough it is for little people in our world.

 

[Dr_Feelgood]

But I meant my comment literally.

 

[Podman]

Regardless of how you reason this debate the truth is that many people get a kick out of looking down on others for a billion reasons and the DPM degree will give some people a reason.

As a DPM, I think you'll encounter your share.

Plus it's interesting to note that even some DPMs look down at other professions.

I think it's akin to a pecking order and that's probably why it's kind of important to not wrap your self-image up in a degree or a profession and you won't be disappointed.

well said

 

[doclm]

Regardless of how you reason this debate the truth is that many people get a kick out of looking down on others for a billion reasons and the DPM degree will give some people a reason.

As a DPM, I think you'll encounter your share.

Plus it's interesting to note that even some DPMs look down at other professions.

I think it's akin to a pecking order and that's probably why it's kind of important to not wrap your self-image up in a degree or a profession and you won't be disappointed.

I actually heard the pecking order being taught by one Anes resident to another, where I used to work as an MT. He went from knocking on primary care, but not as bad as a "OD", however that is not as bad as a "DC". While the other one thought that a DPT was a joke. But both agreed that DC is the lowest.

 

[OSUDDS]

OD or DO?

 

[doclm]

OD or DO?

OD,

My point was that these specific MD's were comparing professions that used the name "doctor" but was not a MD/DO. But all this really means is there are MD's/DO's out there that believe they have the best degree ever. However, its sad that they cannot grasp the big picture.

 

[whynotfeet?]

It's almost like the most of you are trying to find a "back door" to MD/DO. We are Podiatrist; love it or hate it. DPM is a terminal degree- not a stepping stone! We are the authority of foot pathology. Be happy with that designation or don't enter our field.

 

[Dr_Feelgood]

It's almost like the most of you are trying to find a "back door" to MD/DO. We are Podiatrist; love it or hate it. DPM is a terminal degree- not a stepping stone! We are the authority of foot pathology. Be happy with that designation or don't enter our field.

Well said. All to often I here "I just want to be a doctor." I have never understand why people go into podiatry expecting to be a family doctor.

 

[jonwill]

Well said. All to often I here "I just want to be a doctor." I have never understand why people go into podiatry expecting to be a family doctor.

Ya, I think I'll take foot and ankle surgery over family practice or any other field of medicine for that matter!