Rising M2, live at home with parents or move out

[confusedfuturedoc!]

I am a current M1/rising M2 who has been living at home with my parents. I have lived at home since undergrad with a good scholarship leaving me with no debt from undergrad. I'm also incredibly blessed that my parents can pay for my medical school tuition. So, in theory, if I continue living at home I can graduate debt-free. Living at home for M1 these past 6 months hasn't been horrible until recently. I've gotten into a few fights with my parents (over being quiet, them watching tv late--tv is on a wall under my bedroom, and the time I come home) right before my finals, which has really thrown me off. To note, I am at the library for about 6-8 hours a day to study, so staying out of the house has not solved my issues. I have always wanted to move out although my immigrant parents think it is a disgrace to waste money on this and even worse, to take out loans. I am seriously considering moving out for M2 and M3 and moving back in M4 to completely focus on school. I estimate I would end up taking out 36k in loans in the worst-case scenario. If I do move out, I am set on living alone, I don't find a point in going from one sticky roommate situation to another.

Pros to moving out: privacy, peace and quiet, able to wake up and go to sleep without bothering anyone or being bothered, shorter commute (by 10 minutes so not big deal), not walking on eggshells around one parent because they are easy to set off

Cons: Taking out loans, really missing my family dog, will now be responsible for cleaning, they also occasionally grocery shop and fold laundry

Some feedback I've gotten is that it is time to move out so I learn life and time management skills, and while I agree to a certain extent, I am already for the most part doing my own laundry, grocery shopping, and cooking for myself. I just don't clean the house.

I know this is a personal decision but I'd appreciate insight or any input from similar experiences.

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[Zeldaspikes]

No rules, rules! Nobody to tell you what do and when to do it. Live how I want. King/Queen of my castle: Imma kick my feet up on the table and nobody can tell me no. You know what I’ve been working so hard I’m gonna watch some netflix. I even got my own mail ! Wait what’s this stack? Bills? No problem.
One for rent, no problem, one for electricity, hmm still no problem, wait they charging me for internet too? Hey wait what’s this ? A car note too, and a big letter from the government reminding me once I leave school I better pay up but it’s not even due yet!
Stay home ride the little inconveniences associated with living with parents and move out when you’ve got a JOB paying you money.
You’ll have so much flexibility with no loans and money coming in than you’ll really be the king/queen.

 

[Hollow Knight]

This sounds gross to say, but $36,000 is absolutely chunk change compared to your attending salary. You'll pay that off in like 3 months as a physician (maybe not quite that quick but you get my drift)

Do whatever will help you succeed in school, forget the money

 

[DarkBluMage]

Dealing with paying back loans in residency substantially decreases your quality of life during training. Some residents can’t even afford their own apartment and have like 4 roommates. I would stay at home and remain debt free so that you can be comfortable during residency. You won’t be paid well during residency to begin with, don’t make it harder on yourself by taking on unnecessary debt during medical school.

 

[Smurfette]

My first reaction is "absolutely move out and learn how to be an adult". The debt really will not be a problem long term, unless moving out makes your parents not help pay for school. However, realize that moving out doesn't protect you from noisy neighbors and other problems with your apartment/neighborhood you wouldn't have living at home.

OTOH, you could have a heart to heart with the parents about getting home at odd hours, which will likely worsen once on rotations, and buy some noise cancelling headphones for nights when their tv is driving you crazy. The headphones are cheaper and don't accumulate interest.

Will also mention that if you move out, moving back in as an M4 seems unlikely. Anticipate that once you're out of the house, you won't find moving back all that easy.

 

[confusedfuturedoc!]

Dealing with paying back loans in residency substantially decreases your quality of life during training. Some residents can’t even afford their own apartment and have like 4 roommates. I would stay at home and remain debt free so that you can be comfortable during residency. You won’t be paid well during residency to begin with, don’t make it harder on yourself by taking on unnecessary debt during medical school.

Sorry for the ignorance, but do I need to begin paying off loans in residency?

 

[confusedfuturedoc!]

My first reaction is "absolutely move out and learn how to be an adult". The debt really will not be a problem long term, unless moving out makes your parents not help pay for school. However, realize that moving out doesn't protect you from noisy neighbors and other problems with your apartment/neighborhood you wouldn't have living at home.

OTOH, you could have a heart to heart with the parents about getting home at odd hours, which will likely worsen once on rotations, and buy some noise cancelling headphones for nights when their tv is driving you crazy. The headphones are cheaper and don't accumulate interest.

Will also mention that if you move out, moving back in as an M4 seems unlikely. Anticipate that once you're out of the house, you won't find moving back all that easy.

I unfortunately did have a heart to heart with them at the beginning of the year about this and it lasted ~6 months. I am definitely very torn because I am undoubtedly comfortable here but this explosion of fights this past week has really impacted my mental health and ability to focus on school. It’s a bit of a gamble to see when the next explosion is. Also, one of my parents who was previously against me moving out and taking out loans has now taken a different stance and I’m sure I’ll be hearing “move out” screamed at me the next time I tick them off. While the other parent is still heavily against me moving out. I know nobody can tell me what is right but dang… I’m really in an emotional and possible financial pickle

 

[chilly_md]

Do be sure to get someplace that seems relatively new if you do move out. You don’t want to have to deal with things breaking in an apartment because that headache replaces the one you are trying to escape from.

 

[mrbreakfast]

Sorry for the ignorance, but do I need to begin paying off loans in residency?

Yes, but in a way that (generally speaking) is manageable. You will likely have to pay a small percentage of your income; depending on your loan amount, we are probably talking $200-300/month for the average med student.

If your total loan burden is going to be $36,000, you payments may be inconsequential, and depending on how frugal you are, you may be able to pay much/all of of that off as a resident (if you wish).

 

[DarkBluMage]

Sorry for the ignorance, but do I need to begin paying off loans in residency?

Yes

 

[Dral]

"Some feedback I've gotten is that it is time to move out so I learn life and time management skills, and while I agree to a certain extent, I am already for the most part doing my own laundry, grocery shopping, and cooking for myself. I just don't clean the house."

Managing a budget, paying utilities/rent/mortgage, fixing things that break or break down, even just feeling less safe since you live alone. These are all things (and many others) that you find out change when you move out on your own.

I think you should agree to a relatively large extent, not just a certain extent. I would say you would benefit from moving out now. If not now, do it during 4th year when you will have time to get your feet wet with being on your own but are not overwhelmed timewise (as you likely will be during residency).

 

[emergentmd]

I don't want to sound harsh. I grew up in an immigrant family and would never treat my kids the way I was. BUT. You want to be an adult but are not acting like an adult. You can't "use" their money for school, live free, eat free, and everything else free then not follow their rules.

Put yourself in your parents shoes. ey are paying for everything, supported you throughout school/life, etc and you expect them to be quiet in their won house? Put on some noise cancelling headphones or whatever it takes.

 

[confusedfuturedoc!]

I don't want to sound harsh. I grew up in an immigrant family and would never treat my kids the way I was. BUT. You want to be an adult but are not acting like an adult. You can't "use" their money for school, live free, eat free, and everything else free then not follow their rules.

Put yourself in your parents shoes. ey are paying for everything, supported you throughout school/life, etc and you expect them to be quiet in their won house? Put on some noise cancelling headphones or whatever it takes.

Totally get that and I think moving out would solve the issue of me “putting restrictions on them”. I also do have noise cancelling headphones lol but it doesn’t block out them having a screaming match or yelling across the house. We had many fights about me moving out prior to medical school (they’re very against it) and they tried to convince me they would be quiet(er) and go to bed by 11pm if I have to get up early. I feel bad telling them to do these things but also they asked for it? I love them to death and yes they’ve done so much for me, yes I am spoiled, but they really cause a lot of emotional turmoil. They’re upset whether I live with them and tell them to be quiet or if I move out against their wishes. I went to tour an apartment today and when I got home they were crying to give them another chance. I just don’t know what to do.

 

[confusedfuturedoc!]

"Some feedback I've gotten is that it is time to move out so I learn life and time management skills, and while I agree to a certain extent, I am already for the most part doing my own laundry, grocery shopping, and cooking for myself. I just don't clean the house."

Managing a budget, paying utilities/rent/mortgage, fixing things that break or break down, even just feeling less safe since you live alone. These are all things (and many others) that you find out change when you move out on your own.

I think you should agree to a relatively large extent, not just a certain extent. I would say you would benefit from moving out now. If not now, do it during 4th year when you will have time to get your feet wet with being on your own but are not overwhelmed timewise (as you likely will be during residency).

But are these things worth accumulating debt for? I want to be on my own now but also the financially responsible voice in the back of my head is telling me I have the rest of my life to experience these things. I just have to make it through 3.5 years… Difficult for me to weigh these.

 

[DarkBluMage]

But are these things worth accumulating debt for? I want to be on my own now but also the financially responsible voice in the back of my head is telling me I have the rest of my life to experience these things. I just have to make it through 3.5 years… Difficult for me to weigh these.

None of those things are worth accumulating debt. You will learn all those things when you move out. If you want to you can practice setting aside money for expenses etc while still with your parents. It’s not something you need to force moving out to learn immediately just because you’re getting older. Also you need to think about how this will affect your schooling. If you move out against their wishes are there no concerns that your family will stop paying your tuition? Also are you sure the most debt will be only $36,000? Housing in decent/safe areas is expensive depending on what state you’re in and your expenses may actually far exceed what you’re calculating for the year especially if you’re not going to have any roommates. Expenses for rent, utilities, internet, groceries, gas, furniture etc add up quickly, you also have to take into account emergency funds if something happens. Do you have any savings if you miscalculate or if something comes up? Miscalculation will affect your actual debt burden. Once you move out that may also change the family dynamic and moving back in may not be an option which would incur more financial debt. You need to take all of that into consideration. The more loans you have to pay back the less comfortable you will be in residency.

 

[emergentmd]

Let me give you some advice. I am 50, Asian family, blah, blah. I’m sure ur Asian too so I get it.

I left for med school and residency. Came back to hometown and got a job. I was 28 and mom wanted me to stay home.

I am a solution person and boundaries need to be set. I told mom either I go home and rent an apt or I will take a job OOT. This way she made the choice and can’t complain.

Set boundaries and tiger Asian parents (mine were actually very easy) and they will respect u more. Trust me, set the boundaries and they will treat u like an adult

 

[Dral]

But are these things worth accumulating debt for? I want to be on my own now but also the financially responsible voice in the back of my head is telling me I have the rest of my life to experience these things. I just have to make it through 3.5 years… Difficult for me to weigh these.

That is a tough decision that only you can make. I feel it isn't necessarily worth the debt. The bigger question is how much do you want to have some freedom and quiet time to study at home.

It's not an easy choice. In the grand scheme of things, it's not a ton of money, but it's certainly not insignificant. If you can stick it out, you can try to make it through and save the money. Again it will just depend on your tolerance level. If you really are at the end of your rope with noise and conflict, well, some things don't have a money value and are worth more than money (in this case moving out and gaining freedom/quiet).

 

[DarkBluMage]

That is a tough decision that only you can make. I feel it isn't necessarily worth the debt. The bigger question is how much do you want to have some freedom and quiet time to study at home.

It's not an easy choice. In the grand scheme of things, it's not a ton of money, but it's certainly not insignificant. If you can stick it out, you can try to make it through and save the money. Again it will just depend on your tolerance level. If you really are at the end of your rope with noise and conflict, well, some things don't have a money value and are worth more than money (in this case moving out and gaining freedom/quiet).

Also realize moving out may not equal having peace/quiet. Neighbors are unpredictable and people can be incredibly inconsiderate of others and their surroundings. Noisy neighbors can be a stressor in med school as well. It certainly has been an issue for me. The only recourses are speaking to neighbors about being quieter or alerting security/police about noise complaints if they just don’t care to be more considerate at least during night time hours as far as noise. It’s part of the reason that I’m no longer interested in living in an apartment and seriously considering renting or buying a house in residency. You can’t control your surroundings at all and having shared walls is a nuisance. Alot of newer apartments are also cheaply built and you can hear everything going on around you inside your apartment, so that’s something to think about if you decide to go apartment search.