RN seeking MD/DO/IMG options. In need of advice.

[DiprivanDaddy]

Hey everyone, this is my first post on these forums. This isn't something I would normally do, but a friend recommended I read through the site and potentially discuss my situation.

I am currently a 29-year old male practicing as a registered nurse in a level 2 trauma center in Florida. I work in a neuro/trauma ICU more specifically so my background is caring for some of the most critical patient populations.

I entered nursing as a second-degree seeker after realizing I had no further desire to pursue my original field of study (law). I graduated with a BS in Criminology from Florida State University w/ a 2.87 GPA at the age of 23. The low GPA was admittingly due to my lack of interest in the topics I was studying (or not studying to be honest) and the fun I was having while not taking school so seriously. I discovered the healthcare professions my senior year of this degree and began pursuit of a career in nursing immediately after graduating while working as a server/bartender. This process took me a total of 4 years because I had to continue to work (the ASN degree usually takes 3 years). At the age of 27, I graduated nursing school at a state college summa cum laude with a 4.0 GPA. This included all of my prerequisites for nursing (Bio, A&P 1 and 2, Micro, etc.) and my nursing coursework. I gave the valedictorian speech at my graduation and began work as a nurse within a few short months of graduating. I am now a BSN candidate at the University of Florida where I continue to get straight As and maintain the 4.0 nursing GPA. I am slated to graduate in summer of 2024.

I unfortunately have a significant dilemma and need the advice of other non-traditional students who have been accepted, graduated, and became physicians as well as those currently sitting as admissions counselors.

When I entered nursing, it was because I believed it was the greatest profession on earth and I genuinely wanted to practice nursing. By the time I graduated nursing school, I had the intention of furthering my education as a CRNA or NP. After being in the healthcare field for a couple years now, my beliefs have changed somewhat. I now think that nursing is the second greatest profession, taking a backseat to medicine. The obvious choice for someone in my position who doesn't desire to go against the grain is to pursue a CRNA or NP program, but I have unfortunately became completely and utterly disillusioned by the NP profession and enthralled by the medical profession. NP programs possess no uniformity or standards unlike the PA profession which is a structured and rigorous 2-year program. These 3-year DNP degrees possess more research and theory components than actual clinical sciences and clinical experience. The absurdity that these subpar degrees produce independent providers while PAs practice under the license of a physician blows my mind. The CRNA profession is a rigorous and standardized program (much like that of PAs) but only allows practice in the field of anesthesia and I am not sure that is something I desire. Medicine has completely caught my attention and curiosity and I am contemplating attempting an application cycle or two before I fall back on my backup plan of just going to CRNA school.

As it currently stands, my cGPA is 3.27. I anticipate continuing to maintain straight As during the remainder of my BSN giving me a 3.35 cumulative GPA. I need a total of 8 courses at 4 credits each to complete my premed prerequisites. If I accomplish straight As in these courses, my cGPA will be a 3.43.

My science GPA (Biology, Chemistry, and Physics) is a 3.64 currently just accounting for my biology courses for nursing school and the non-science major survey of life science and physical science courses I took during my first-degree program. Assuming the same scenario above, straight As in my remaining premed courses (namely the chemistry and physics), I will attain a 3.84 for my science GPA.

I do lack volunteering experience and have very limited research experience. I was a research assistant at FSU for a semester. It was in the form of a DIS course where we researched examples of financial fraud in history. I also have a semester of TA experience teaching a white-collar crime course. I do intend on gaining some volunteering hours (probably at a free clinic as a nurse) and have extensive clinical hours as a registered nurse. I don’t foresee myself having any opportunities for research experience beyond the semester I mentioned.

In nursing school, I was admitted to the president's list every semester for the 2 years of the program. I was also admitted to the Phi Theta Kappa honor society during the program.

As far as the MCAT goes, I haven't attempted it nor do I intend to until I complete most if not all of my premed coursework. From my understanding, orgo and biochem are significant components of the exam and I have no experience with them. I am a strong testtaker though and could foresee myself easily passing the 500 mark at least.

I am just looking for some advice on whether I have a chance of becoming a physician the US MD/DO route and what I can do to bolster my resume when applying. I have even contemplated applying to SGU and Ross as a backup. Any input is appreciated and I thank you in advance for taking the time to read this long post and give me feedback.

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[gyngyn]

I have even contemplated applying to SGU and Ross as a backup.

There is always a way forward to be of service without resorting to this extreme.

 

[DiprivanDaddy]

There is always a way forward to be of service without resorting to this extreme.

I am open to suggestions. I already know that some MD programs are completely ruled out for me due to being non-traditional, having a low cumulative (even with a fantastic upward trend and stronger science gpa), and minimal research (especially since its non-medical).

 

[gyngyn]

I am open to suggestions. I already know that some MD programs are completely ruled out for me due to being non-traditional, having a low cumulative (even with a fantastic upward trend and stronger science gpa), and minimal research (especially since its non-medical).

Everyone loves a come-from-behind story.
Research is not a requirement for most schools (especially most public MD and all DO).
Do not take the MCAT until you are confident of a score consistent with success.
Use the AAMC FL's judiciously (don't waste them).
GPA trend is just as important as the total score.

 

[DiprivanDaddy]

Everyone loves a come-from-behind story.
Research is not a requirement for most schools (especially most public MD and all DO).
Do not take the MCAT until you are confident of a score consistent with success.
Use the AAMC FL's judiciously (don't waste them).
GPA trend is just as important as the total score.

Understood. My hope is to apply to the 2026 matriculation so it would mean beginning the cycle in 2025. I intend to finish my BSN I'm currently enrolled in (its a degree from a fairly prestigious university and will continue to boost my GPA). Once I am finished, I plan on taking the prerequisites I'm missing 2 at a time at my state college.

My only real problem is I know applying early is important but I won't have all the courses complete by the time I place my initial application, but I should have a good percentage of them. Will that be a problem?

Also, if I plan on having my MCAT score for when I post my initial application, it means I wont have completed all the prerequisite courses beforehand (which all have material on the MCAT). Is there a way I can prepare for the MCAT, specifically the organic/biochem portions, without taking those classes yet?

 

[gyngyn]

I wont have completed all the prerequisite courses beforehand (which all have material on the MCAT). Is there a way I can prepare for the MCAT, specifically the organic/biochem portions, without taking those classes yet?

Don't take the MCAT until you have completed the courses that form the basis for content on the MCAT.

 

[DiprivanDaddy]

Don't take the MCAT until you have completed the courses that form the basis for content on the MCAT.

That would realistically be the end of the semester of Fall 2025 (after thanksgiving). Is that too late?

 

[gyngyn]

That would realistically be the end of the semester of Fall 2025 (after thanksgiving). Is that too late?

Yes.

 

[DiprivanDaddy]

Yes.

What if I crammed a class somewhere and did my application in the august timeframe?

 

[gyngyn]

What if I crammed a class somewhere and did my application in the august timeframe?

This is no way to prepare for a high-stakes exam.

 

[Goro]

This is no way to prepare for a high-stakes exam.

Career deciding, high stakes exam!

 

[DiprivanDaddy]

Career deciding, high stakes exam!

Fair enough. I'm just getting older and don't want to delay for too long. I think 3 courses a semester is doable and will allow me to put an application in by June of 2025 for the 2026 start dates.

 

[DiprivanDaddy]

@gyngyn @Goro I appreciate the advice/guidance from you both. I'm sure ill require more of it as time progresses.

 

[picklelittle]

At 29 you have time. Starting school at 35 but I'll be 36 this year.

 

[Splenda88]

You are my twin brother except I am older than you.

Here is my story to give you some hope.

I was a computer science major and and left to pursue nursing in my senior year. I became a nurse (ASN) and worked for a few years. My plan was to become a NP. While I was taking a class (Health Assessment) for my BSN that was also going to count toward my NP at a state university in FL, I realized NP was not for me.

Honestly, the class was easy but students were complaining how hard that class was and reported the professor (an 'old school' NP) to administration. I made up my mind during that class that I was going into med school because nursing standards were LOW. I learned later that professor was not allowed to teach the class anymore because of these complaints

I took my med school prereqs while I was doing my BSN. GPA were 3.5 c/s GPA. I later took the MCAT (hardest test I have taken in my life) and I scored 27.

Got accepted to both MD/DO in my mid 30s. I had ZERO research. Now I am a board certified IM doc; made 405k last year as a hospitalist in a job that I like.

Pursue your dreams. YOLO.

By the way, you will have a great shot at both US MD and DO if you get a decent MCAT score. Good luck!

 

[DiprivanDaddy]

You are my twin brother except I am older than you.

Here is my story to give you some hope.

I was a computer science major and and left to pursue nursing in my senior year. I became a nurse (ASN) and worked for a few years. My plan was to become a NP. While I was taking a class (Health Assessment) for my BSN that was also going to count toward my NP at a state university in FL, I realized NP was not for me.

Honestly, the class was easy but students were complaining how hard that class was and reported the professor (an 'old school' NP) to administration. I made up my mind during that class that I was going into med school because nursing standards were LOW. I learned later that professor was not allowed to teach the class anymore because of these complaints

I took my med school prereqs while I was doing my BSN. GPA were 3.5 c/s GPA. I later took the MCAT (hardest test I have taken in my life) and I scored 27.

Got accepted to both MD/DO in my mid 30s. Now I am a board certified IM doc; made 405k last year as a hospitalist in a job that I like.

Pursue your dreams. YOLO.

By the way, you will have a great shot at both US MD and DO if you get a decent MCAT score. Good luck!

Your story is a huge confidence boost and I appreciate you taking the time and commenting. I hope things haven't changed too much since you took the plunge. I'm more optimistic to hear I'm not alone in this journey from nursing to medicine.

 

[Splenda88]

Your story is a huge confidence boost and I appreciate you taking the time and commenting. I hope things haven't changed too much since you took the plunge. I'm more optimistic to hear I'm not alone in this journey from nursing to medicine.

I graduated med school in 2018, so I doubt things have changed that much.

As someone said above, adcoms love a come back story. In addition, your upward GPA trend and your nursing background will help a lot.

I remember ALL my interviews were centered around nursing because I was a RN.

 

[DiprivanDaddy]

I graduated med school in 2018, so I doubt things have changed that much.

As someone said above, adcoms love a come back story. I addition, your upward GPA trend and your nursing background will help a lot.

I remember ALL my interviews were centered around nursing because I was a RN.

Cant wait to get to the point of applying. Any advice for the MCAT? Seems my entire chances are predicated around a single exam.

 

[macrophagefanatic]

Cant wait to get to the point of applying. Any advice for the MCAT? Seems my entire chances are predicated around a single exam.

In my experience, I can’t emphasize enough how important the practice tests are. AAMC full lengths are the best so those should be used wisely as they’ll be your best barometer of how well you can expect to do on the real thing. I would add in 3rd party practice tests/practice passages as well (Nextstep/blueprint and Jack Westin, UWorld, etc.). A lot of people have had success with 1v1 tutoring from some of the companies mentioned, but that’s something you’d have to decide for yourself (a lot of people are able to study independently and do well). My best suggestion for improving between practice tests is to make a “why I missed it” sheet. When reviewing your exam, list every question you missed (as well as ones you got correct but flagged or know you guessed on), why you put the answer you did, and why the correct answer is correct. Also note what section of content that question is relsted to (as indicated by the question) so you can quickly go back and refresh if needed. This is a really helpful method for plugging gaps in content knowledge after youve already gone through the bulk of content review studying. In terms of my personal recommendations for resources, I used Jack Westin (excellent for CARS in particular), BluePrint, anki (mostly for P/S terminology), and the official AAMC materials (FL, question packs, section banks). Good luck!!

 

[DiprivanDaddy]

In my experience, I can’t emphasize enough how important the practice tests are. AAMC full lengths are the best so those should be used wisely as they’ll be your best barometer of how well you can expect to do on the real thing. I would add in 3rd party practice tests/practice passages as well (Nextstep/blueprint and Jack Westin, UWorld, etc.). A lot of people have had success with 1v1 tutoring from some of the companies mentioned, but that’s something you’d have to decide for yourself (a lot of people are able to study independently and do well). My best suggestion for improving between practice tests is to make a “why I missed it” sheet. When reviewing your exam, list every question you missed (as well as ones you got correct but flagged or know you guessed on), why you put the answer you did, and why the correct answer is correct. Also note what section of content that question is relsted to (as indicated by the question) so you can quickly go back and refresh if needed. This is a really helpful method for plugging gaps in content knowledge after youve already gone through the bulk of content review studying. In terms of my personal recommendations for resources, I used Jack Westin (excellent for CARS in particular), BluePrint, anki (mostly for P/S terminology), and the official AAMC materials (FL, question packs, section banks). Good luck!!

I appreciate the advice. I might consider one of those 1 on 1 things. Worth the investment if I get a better score

 

[theoceanman]

UWorld, Anki, and AAMC FL exams will save your score, given you use them appropriately. I had to buy my own UWorld but used FAP for AAMC and Anki was free on my laptop so just used those.

Do not be afraid to spend a little bit of cash to invest in the right resources for you. You ideally want to take this once and get a great MCAT without having to worry about retakes, limiting options, etc.

 

[macrophagefanatic]

I appreciate the advice. I might consider one of those 1 on 1 things. Worth the investment if I get a better score

Yeah, definitely something to consider. It might be a bit costly (depending on how many hours of tutoring you choose), but if it can save you from having to retake it (which could cost you an application cycle), it'd be worth it.

 

[Splenda88]

Cant wait to get to the point of applying. Any advice for the MCAT? Seems my entire chances are predicated around a single exam.

Study hard for it until you can get at least to an equivalent of 25+ if you are ok with DO and 28+ for MD. I studied for it for a whole 4 months (8+ hrs/day and 4-5 days/wk).

75%+ of your time should be spent on doing practice questions. < 25% should be content review.

 

[theoceanman]

Study hard for it until you can get at least to an equivalent of 25+ if you are ok with DO and 28+ for MD. I studied for it for a whole 4 months (8+ hrs/day and 4-5 days/wk).

75%+ of your time should be spent on doing practice questions. < 25% should be content review.

Those are outdated score values, probably go for 504+ to be “safe” for DO’s and 511+ for MD’s (these are just average MCAT’s for those that got accepted).

 

[gramnegative]

Feel free to reach out, I was an ICU RN in my 30s who is now about to be a M3. As long as you have a good narrative for why you are taking this path, one that you can weave through your written essays and interviews, and do well on the MCAT and the rest of your classes, you should find success if you apply broadly. I got a lot of positive attention for being an ICU RN, especially one that worked during the beginning of the pandemic. The biggest questions will be whether you are teachable and whether you can hack the preclinical years/high-stakes testing. There's a lot of good advice in this thread - don't take the MCAT lightly.

 

[mimicooper]

Your post has impressed me in a great way! I also have a very difficult and long story behind. I used to be a foreign attending physician in my country, since I moved over to the US, I started over and committed to going to medical school. Now I am 38 this year, and just graduated from ABSN in FL this summer. Getting a bachelor's degree is the bridge for me to apply for MD/DO in the future. In your post, you mentioned that you were expecting to graduate from your BSN this summer, so I bet we are in the same boat and on the same pace now. If possible, hopefully, we can connect and share more down the road.

 

[jl lin]

Hey everyone, this is my first post on these forums. This isn't something I would normally do, but a friend recommended I read through the site and potentially discuss my situation.

I am currently a 29-year old male practicing as a registered nurse in a level 2 trauma center in Florida. I work in a neuro/trauma ICU more specifically so my background is caring for some of the most critical patient populations.

I entered nursing as a second-degree seeker after realizing I had no further desire to pursue my original field of study (law). I graduated with a BS in Criminology from Florida State University w/ a 2.87 GPA at the age of 23. The low GPA was admittingly due to my lack of interest in the topics I was studying (or not studying to be honest) and the fun I was having while not taking school so seriously. I discovered the healthcare professions my senior year of this degree and began pursuit of a career in nursing immediately after graduating while working as a server/bartender. This process took me a total of 4 years because I had to continue to work (the ASN degree usually takes 3 years). At the age of 27, I graduated nursing school at a state college summa cum laude with a 4.0 GPA. This included all of my prerequisites for nursing (Bio, A&P 1 and 2, Micro, etc.) and my nursing coursework. I gave the valedictorian speech at my graduation and began work as a nurse within a few short months of graduating. I am now a BSN candidate at the University of Florida where I continue to get straight As and maintain the 4.0 nursing GPA. I am slated to graduate in summer of 2024.

I unfortunately have a significant dilemma and need the advice of other non-traditional students who have been accepted, graduated, and became physicians as well as those currently sitting as admissions counselors.

When I entered nursing, it was because I believed it was the greatest profession on earth and I genuinely wanted to practice nursing. By the time I graduated nursing school, I had the intention of furthering my education as a CRNA or NP. After being in the healthcare field for a couple years now, my beliefs have changed somewhat. I now think that nursing is the second greatest profession, taking a backseat to medicine. The obvious choice for someone in my position who doesn't desire to go against the grain is to pursue a CRNA or NP program, but I have unfortunately became completely and utterly disillusioned by the NP profession and enthralled by the medical profession. NP programs possess no uniformity or standards unlike the PA profession which is a structured and rigorous 2-year program. These 3-year DNP degrees possess more research and theory components than actual clinical sciences and clinical experience. The absurdity that these subpar degrees produce independent providers while PAs practice under the license of a physician blows my mind. The CRNA profession is a rigorous and standardized program (much like that of PAs) but only allows practice in the field of anesthesia and I am not sure that is something I desire. Medicine has completely caught my attention and curiosity and I am contemplating attempting an application cycle or two before I fall back on my backup plan of just going to CRNA school.

As it currently stands, my cGPA is 3.27. I anticipate continuing to maintain straight As during the remainder of my BSN giving me a 3.35 cumulative GPA. I need a total of 8 courses at 4 credits each to complete my premed prerequisites. If I accomplish straight As in these courses, my cGPA will be a 3.43.

My science GPA (Biology, Chemistry, and Physics) is a 3.64 currently just accounting for my biology courses for nursing school and the non-science major survey of life science and physical science courses I took during my first-degree program. Assuming the same scenario above, straight As in my remaining premed courses (namely the chemistry and physics), I will attain a 3.84 for my science GPA.

I do lack volunteering experience and have very limited research experience. I was a research assistant at FSU for a semester. It was in the form of a DIS course where we researched examples of financial fraud in history. I also have a semester of TA experience teaching a white-collar crime course. I do intend on gaining some volunteering hours (probably at a free clinic as a nurse) and have extensive clinical hours as a registered nurse. I don’t foresee myself having any opportunities for research experience beyond the semester I mentioned.

In nursing school, I was admitted to the president's list every semester for the 2 years of the program. I was also admitted to the Phi Theta Kappa honor society during the program.

As far as the MCAT goes, I haven't attempted it nor do I intend to until I complete most if not all of my premed coursework. From my understanding, orgo and biochem are significant components of the exam and I have no experience with them. I am a strong testtaker though and could foresee myself easily passing the 500 mark at least.

I am just looking for some advice on whether I have a chance of becoming a physician the US MD/DO route and what I can do to bolster my resume when applying. I have even contemplated applying to SGU and Ross as a backup. Any input is appreciated and I thank you in advance for taking the time to read this long post and give me feedback.

I think it is just fine that you want to pursue medicine. I must take exception to some of your comments. No one ever is an expert in any area, nursing or medicine, NP, or PA, etc, without years of intensive clinical experience and continuing education (does not have to be formal--in fact, every excellent practitioner should go above and beyond their regular CME requires whenever possible in my view). Truly studious-minded people, those who want to practice well above average in any of these fields continue to eat up didactic knowledge to go along with the clinical experiences. In fact, that is when and where one really begins to learn to practice well, but it involves a commitment to both clinical w/didactic in continued practice, not one or the other. I have seen great MDs, DOs, NPs, & PAs. I have also seen sub-par of all of the latter. Each individual must choose and continue to choose how they will practice...what/how they will continue to invest in clinical/didactic learning. The best practitioners of all of the latter are not those that ever consider learning as a means to an end. They never feel like they have fully arrived. It's ongoing throughout one's career. In fact, what happens after you move through the stages of novice toward expert is that you truly realize the more you know, in many ways, the less you know, which stimulates further inquiry by the practitioner. And in particular, putting the clinical and didactic along with each patient as a true, unique individual, and not some mere one-size-fits-all approach or even such a mentality that evidenced-based-medicine/practice can lead to overuse or algorithms or even missing something unique in the individual patient that causes one to think beyond the algorithm. This push, along with insurance coverage and other financial dictates NEVER makes an excellent practitioner IN ANY OF THOSE FIELDS. So whatever discipline you decide and indeed, congratulations, it seems like you have, consider it is always the individual practitioner that can choose how they practice--the degree to which they are willing to learn, keep learning, studying all the way down to sub-atomic physical considerations in say, oncology, to all the macroscopic levels, to loads of biochemistry and pathophysiological dynamics, to ethics, which at times seem to have in more recent times been put somewhat on a back burners due to certain forces at play. I've certainly seen NPs with very strong (> five years of very high level, high number intensive care to oncology, etc) who took to learning the sciences and clinical with didactics are their own, beyond what is required for licensure and specialization in their areas, who are amazing. Plenty of physicians and patients to back them up too. I have also seen boatloads of the same with very limited clinical experience move pretty much straightaway into any of these eager for money schools for advanced practice, and they got the bare necessities, got licensed, and are MEH in their practice. But I can also say the same for some MDs or DOs or PAs. At the end of the day, it all comes down to the individual, their unique abilities, commitment to learning and care, and their overall investment in the work of true learning/continued learning, which will depend to a great degree upon one's motivation for pursuing any of these disciplines. The biggest advantage to MD or DO is residency requirements. (Yes the sciences help, but once you get the fundamentals, you can learn more by commitment on your own.). B/c post-graduate medical school residencies for licensure have more required hours clinically along with continued didactic and with evaluation of the same, this gives it a huge edge, although some people have less that wonderful residencies experiences, depending on the particular program and other factors. But I have all seen PAs get the sciences and some clinical, but then they may not have the intensive, continued, lengthy clinical combined w/didactic experience of some NPs, thus these NPs pickup on clinical things quicker. BUT IT DEPENDS UPON THE PARTICULAR NP. What we have is a greedy educational system that pushes all these programs and younger/newer nurses to plunge almost directly into advanced nursing programs with little solid clinical experience--and, depending on where you work and who you are in terms of learning, it will make a huge difference. New BSNs jumping into NP or advanced practice programs without at least a good 3-5 solid years of clinical w/ applied didactics, gaining certifications and such in their areas, w/o showing any real interest in understanding the sciences enough or how disease can affect not just certain populations, but individuals--well, a practitioner only really get that through clinical experience and then studying and researching about it as one goes along. Medical programs require this...and that is while PGs are getting their feet burned in the fire of experience through their residency, and if applicable, fellowship experiences. So, on one hand, go for this if it's your desire and commitment! OTOH, don't assume all practitioners are in real life on the same level in understanding, talent, discernment, other gifts that are apart of these disciplines, b/c it depends on the individual and so many factors. I wish you the best in your pursuits.

 

[jl lin]

Also, although I know some people from decades ago that went the way of SGU, however, in more recent times, there are many excellent schools in the USA that are quite worthy of consideration, which is a path to consider before turning to a foreign medical program.