Safety Schools - Overqualified

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sparklingwater

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Back when we applied to our undergraduate schools, if you were over-qualified for a school, say straight A's and a 2400 SAT, decent extracurricular in high school, you can essentially guarantee yourself into your state school and a few top schools. Even for law schools, it seems as long as your LSAT is close to 180 and you have a near 4.0 GPA, you can get into a top school no problem. You could basically apply to 1 school and guarantee yourself in if you were good enough.

However, for medical school, I was wondering how getting into a particular school. If you have a 3.9 + 40 MCAT did a solid amount of volunteering, research, activities, etc. can you guarantee yourself into your state school? From what I gather on these forums, you have to apply to 20 schools and hopefully a few of them will take you but you have little control over which. Your state school might think you are overqualified, just applying as a safety, and not take you. Usually for undergrad/law/grad school admissions, it doesn't seem to work that way - instead, if you are qualified, you have a very good shot of getting in.
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I have mixed thoughts on this topic.

The short answer- Don't dare apply to only one or two schools. the admissions game is very "random" at times and you never know what is going to work out and where you might be a good fit.

For the whole being "overqualified" and then getting a rejection from a safety school because of it:
- I can say from experience that (with interview session more than half-way done) I have been able to interview at all my top schools (ranks all in the top 20- my "reach" schools), but any school that I applied to with the sole purpose of thinking that I had the stats and the qualifications to get an interview (a "safety" if you will)- I have been passed over for an interview (then again I haven't been rejected- basically on hold).
- However on SDN people have taken jabs at the logic of a med school rejecting someone because they are overqualified. It is kind of stupid when you think about it. A better reason would be that the school thinks your not a good fit.

So I don't know the answer. I have experienced a bit a what you have talked about, but I take this "overqualified" argument with a grain of salt. I do think it would be nice if an admission officer could weigh into this....
 
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sparklingwater said:
However, for medical school, I was wondering how getting into a particular school. If you have a 3.9 + 40 MCAT did a solid amount of volunteering, research, activities, etc. can you guarantee yourself into your state school? From what I gather on these forums, you have to apply to 20 schools and hopefully a few of them will take you but you have little control over which. Your state school might think you are overqualified, just applying as a safety, and not take you.
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This is an interesting question. I think that there is a misunderstanding here that state schools will reject applicants because they perceive the applicants to just be "too good" for them. More likely, state schools reject applicants because they haven't demonstrated a sufficient interest in the school to convince the school that the applicant is taking this opportunity seriously.

When applicants see schools as "safeties", there's a tendency to feel like they've got an acceptance in the bag, and perhaps don't put full effort into the essays and can come off as cocky at the interviews. After rejection, the applicant feels like they must have been "overqualified" for the school, when in reality this was not the case.

State schools aren't dumb. If you've got a 3.95 GPA and 36MCAT, they realize that you probably have better ranked options that you could attend. You need to show them why you're considering them over these other schools, why do you really want to attend this state school? Don't expect simply saying "you're in the same state as me" to cut it. This is fine, but perhaps not compelling enough for the school to take you seriously...and not without reason. No one wants to be someone's fallback plan.
 
Narmerguy said:
This is an interesting question. I think that there is a misunderstanding here that state schools will reject applicants because they perceive the applicants to just be "too good" for them. More likely, state schools reject applicants because they haven't demonstrated a sufficient interest in the school to convince the school that the applicant is taking this opportunity seriously.

When applicants see schools as "safeties", there's a tendency to feel like they've got an acceptance in the bag, and perhaps don't put full effort into the essays and can come off as cocky at the interviews. After rejection, the applicant feels like they must have been "overqualified" for the school, when in reality this was not the case.

State schools aren't dumb. If you've got a 3.95 GPA and 36MCAT, they realize that you probably have better ranked options that you could attend. You need to show them why you're considering them over these other schools, why do you really want to attend this state school? Don't expect simply saying "you're in the same state as me" to cut it. This is fine, but perhaps not compelling enough for the school to take you seriously...and not without reason. No one wants to be someone's fallback plan.
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This is very true, and something that good applicants should be very weary of. I applied last year as a Kansas resident, mostly to more competitive schools, a couple mid-levels, and KU, thinking since I was so far above KU's typical stats and I was in-state, I had it in the bag. I got an interview, but this probably came into play, and I got rejected from my only real safety school, and well... here I am. Let it be a lesson to others in a similar position I was - take every application seriously, do everything you can to show interest to every school you apply to and be eager to attend every school at the interview.
 
No such thing as a "safety" when it comes to medical school admissions.
 
Sephiroth said:
This is very true, and something that good applicants should be very weary of. I applied last year as a Kansas resident, mostly to more competitive schools, a couple mid-levels, and KU, thinking since I was so far above KU's typical stats and I was in-state, I had it in the bag. I got an interview, but this probably came into play, and I got rejected from my only real safety school, and well... here I am. Let it be a lesson to others in a similar position I was - take every application seriously, do everything you can to show interest to every school you apply to and be eager to attend every school at the interview.
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where are you?
 
Narmerguy said:
State schools aren't dumb. If you've got a 3.95 GPA and 36MCAT, they realize that you probably have better ranked options that you could attend. You need to show them why you're considering them over these other schools, why do you really want to attend this state school? Don't expect simply saying "you're in the same state as me" to cut it. This is fine, but perhaps not compelling enough for the school to take you seriously...and not without reason. No one wants to be someone's fallback plan.
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I agree. They are looking for essays that are very specific "why them". When you get 10,000+ applications, any generic or vague essays or bad spots on your application easily gets you thrown in the reject pile. They have just too many applications to really care.

I've had an interesting cycle along this very topic, and have not even heard from a little more than 1/3 of the schools I applied to since being complete (including my "safetiest" safety*).

*based on MSAR avg accepted stats
 
If you've done a ton of research and your "safety" school isn't research heavy, why would they bother inviting you to interview? They probably assume you'd rather go to a research heavy institution over them. Also if you've blown off the secondary (which I'm guilty of, copy/paste is just so convenient lol) it's probably very obvious to them
 
No, I don't think you can "overqualify" yourself at a school. Schools would be idiotic to reject you based strictly on whether or not you're "overqualified" (whatever that means) - that would likely mean missing out on many incredible candidates.

As Namer and Nymph mentioned, it's all about how you sell yourself to the school. If it appears to the school that you're not taking them seriously, they aren't going to take you seriously. Simple as that.

Even trying to say someone is "overqualified" is a silly thing to do that really indicates your ignorance about the process. No one is "overqualified" in medical admissions.
 
kpcrew2oo2 said:
where are you?
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I'm assuming that was a reference to my "...here I am" statement, which was referring to me reapplying this cycle (hence my status still saying pre-medical rather than medical student)
 
NickNaylor said:
No, I don't think you can "overqualify" yourself at a school. Schools would be idiotic to reject you based strictly on whether or not you're "overqualified" (whatever that means) - that would likely mean missing out on many incredible candidates.

As Namer and Nymph mentioned, it's all about how you sell yourself to the school. If it appears to the school that you're not taking them seriously, they aren't going to take you seriously. Simple as that.

Even trying to say someone is "overqualified" is a silly thing to do that really indicates your ignorance about the process. No one is "overqualified" in medical admissions.
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There are certain schools that obviously reject applicants without reading their applications if they think they're not legitimately going to go there based on stats (BU).

That being said, having gone through the admissions game from the adcom side tho, I can say that the two things reviewers look for in applicants are something to reject them and interesting things that cause their application to merit further review. I can assure you that most med school could fill their applicant pool with 3.8/35 applicants (exc state schools with strict residency requirements and other exceptions) but in general, creating diversity is a priority for med schools.
 
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I do agree that you can be over-qualified. Remember schools can see your AMCAS application. They know where you get accepted. About 10-20students per year at my school are offered admission at a particular SUNY school. They tend to waitlist our insane applicants 3.8+ 35+. These applicants often hold multiple acceptances to better schools. Something is fishy about that.
 
Espadaleader said:
I do agree that you can be over-qualified. Remember schools can see your AMCAS application. They know where you get accepted. About 10-20students per year at my school are offered admission at a particular SUNY school. They tend to waitlist our insane applicants 3.8+ 35+. These applicants often hold multiple acceptances to better schools. Something is fishy about that.
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Actually med schools cannot see where else you have been accepted until after May 15th. Since most offers of admission have been made at that point, I would say where else you have been accepted has no bearing on your acceptance at other schools.
 
pooghe said:
Actually med schools cannot see where else you have been accepted until after May 15th. Since most offers of admission have been made at that point, I would say where else you have been accepted has no bearing on your acceptance at other schools.
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I believe they can also see where you've been accepted if they have accepted you, but your point still stands:)
 
drizzt3117 said:
There are certain schools that obviously reject applicants without reading their applications if they think they're not legitimately going to go there based on stats (BU).

That being said, having gone through the admissions game from the adcom side tho, I can say that the two things reviewers look for in applicants are something to reject them and interesting things that cause their application to merit further review. I can assure you that most med school could fill their applicant pool with 3.8/35 applicants (exc state schools with strict residency requirements and other exceptions) but in general, creating diversity is a priority for med schools.
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I knew it! Just like I'm being discriminated against for being a white middle class male, I'm also being discriminated against for being a 3.8/35 applicant!

And yeah, BU rejected me pretty quickly, which kinda surprised me, but given how many ppl they reject early, not too surprised. I really am curious what it is they are looking for then.

jesse120 said:
If you've done a ton of research and your "safety" school isn't research heavy, why would they bother inviting you to interview? They probably assume you'd rather go to a research heavy institution over them.
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That's actually something I didn't think of before but may have hurt me as well at schools that are more community service-focused; even though I've done a fair amount of community service, research makes up a much larger portion of my ECs.

Actually, I think a big problem I, and possibly others similar to me, may also be facing is that I have an application that's geared more toward top schools, but aren't quite good enough for those top schools, but the lower ranked schools are looking for something different (e.g. not much research, community service being a much greater focus of ECs). Dunno how true that is, just a thought.
 
Espadaleader said:
I do agree that you can be over-qualified. Remember schools can see your AMCAS application. They know where you get accepted. About 10-20students per year at my school are offered admission at a particular SUNY school. They tend to waitlist our insane applicants 3.8+ 35+. These applicants often hold multiple acceptances to better schools. Something is fishy about that.
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I wouldn't say this is fishy, but rather, smart. If the "insane applicants" really do want to go to that particular SUNY, they would probably stay on the waitlist and probably send in some sort of update letter/letter of intent/interest.

The majority of the time, the "insane applicants" will probably go somewhere else anyways, and SUNY didn't a hold a valuable pre-may acceptance seat for them.
 
CougarMD said:
I believe they can also see where you've been accepted if they have accepted you, but your point still stands:)
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Alright, fair enough. Still, like you said, it doesn't affect your chance for admission at that particular school.
 
You guys ruin everything. It was much easier to believe I got rejected because I was too awesome! :mad:
 
dpsPanda said:
I've heard this about BU from other interviewers as well, but I do think that BU at least reads their secondary essays pretty closely. I put in a lot of effort to answer their essays and didn't treat them as a safety. Ended up getting an interview there (n=1). I have no ties to the state and many other people with similar stats were being rejected right off the bat. Granted I may be the one exception, but I feel that even for these schools with many applicants, they don't reject you based on high stats alone. Having high stats will probably make them look more closely at how 'sincere' your application is.
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I got a rejection 2 hours after my secondary was complete during my cycle. I got interviews at 26/32 schools including 9 out of the top 10 fwiw. I did undergrad in Boston and my secondary talked about that and how I had family there. Obviously they didn't read it.
 
call this supposition (because it is), but i almost think that part of my success (i've had interviews at nearly every tier of schools, from top 20 to unranked schools) is because i have an unbalanced application. i have a 3.3 and a 38, and i think the top schools like my 38, and the lower tier schools interview me too because they think i'm a "real person" with my 3.3

that being said, i'm sure my chances at the top schools would have been better if i had a higher GPA
 
cowgomoo said:
No such thing as a "safety" when it comes to medical school admissions.
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I would echo this. Unlike colleges, where there is a huge range, there are only about 130 US allo med schools and all are reasonably competitive, and all will reject a ton of qualified people. Even at the med school with the lowest average GPA, there will be folks rejected with stellar numbers, for a variety of reasons. And there will be a handful of matriculants with stats good enough for the top med school, who opted to go to a less competitive place for geographic reason, etc. Med schools won't generally reject you just because you have good stats making you likely to get in elsewhere, but they will reject you if they get a whiff that you probably won't attend. Like the West coast guy who applies to a school in the Southeast who has no connection with the area and doesn't really explain well why he's interested in that area. A lot of premeds aren't willing to accept responsibility for shortcomings of their applications, so they perpetuate myths like they got rejected because they were too qualified. Lets them save face, and allows them to plod on without changing things up.Most of the time the school has a very different reason they felt the fit wasn't quite right. Often it's something fixable, so it's best not to have the "I was rejected because I'm too superior" mindset.
 
No one can ever be over qualified for medical school. It is just not the right wording, nor is safety schools. I agree no school is safe and accept and rejects all kind of qualifications.

It is more about fit. Your grades and scores do alter your fit for some schools. Schools prefer applicants within a grade range, interest in their programs and dedication to working hard in their program. They also like to reduce their risks of dismissing a student or a student not getting placed in a residency. This is why schools reject applicants with perfect GPAs and MCAT scores commonly. If you have your heart set on a single school you are going to be disappointed. With that said you can make sure you fit a program. Make sure your ECs and grades/scores reflect what they are looking for. If your grades are above what they expect apply EDP. Nothing says your serious about a school like EDP. If your grades are under consider an SMP. SMPs are super hard work that really show schools you have what it takes. Even with all that you still can not say you will get into school X for sure. Apply as broadly as possible and you will most likely fit with a school you like.
 
Sephiroth said:
I'm assuming that was a reference to my "...here I am" statement, which was referring to me reapplying this cycle (hence my status still saying pre-medical rather than medical student)
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a lot of people don't update their status but now i see that you registered last month
 
WorldChanger36 said:
No one can ever be over qualified for medical school. It is just not the right wording, nor is safety schools. I agree no school is safe and accept and rejects all kind of qualifications.

It is more about fit. Your grades and scores do alter your fit for some schools. Schools prefer applicants within a grade range, interest in their programs and dedication to working hard in their program. They also like to reduce their risks of dismissing a student or a student not getting placed in a residency. This is why schools reject applicants with perfect GPAs and MCAT scores commonly. If you have your heart set on a single school you are going to be disappointed. With that said you can make sure you fit a program. Make sure your ECs and grades/scores reflect what they are looking for. If your grades are above what they expect apply EDP. Nothing says your serious about a school like EDP. If your grades are under consider an SMP. SMPs are super hard work that really show schools you have what it takes. Even with all that you still can not say you will get into school X for sure. Apply as broadly as possible and you will most likely fit with a school you like.
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That's just not true. How many applicants (ever, not just each year) even have perfect GPA/MCAT? If you're saying they reject people above their stat averages, than that is certainly true.

It's certainly be possible to be overqualified for a med school, residency, etc. People just say it's not to make themselves feel better. One of the most important things to learn before starting med school is that no matter how good you think you are, there's always going to be someone else better (and in the case of med school, probably a lot of people)
 
NickNaylor said:
No, I don't think you can "overqualify" yourself at a school. Schools would be idiotic to reject you based strictly on whether or not you're "overqualified" (whatever that means) - that would likely mean missing out on many incredible candidates.

As Namer and Nymph mentioned, it's all about how you sell yourself to the school. If it appears to the school that you're not taking them seriously, they aren't going to take you seriously. Simple as that.

Even trying to say someone is "overqualified" is a silly thing to do that really indicates your ignorance about the process. No one is "overqualified" in medical admissions.
Click to expand...

I don't know if I can agree. I got rejected from my state school pre-secondary. And my MCAT is 10 points higher than the average matriculating class' at my state school.

But then again, my n = 1.
 
drizzt3117 said:
I got a rejection 2 hours after my secondary was complete during my cycle. I got interviews at 26/32 schools including 9 out of the top 10 fwiw. I did undergrad in Boston and my secondary talked about that and how I had family there. Obviously they didn't read it.
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lol damn
drizzt3117 said:
That's just not true. How many applicants (ever, not just each year) even have perfect GPA/MCAT? If you're saying they reject people above their stat averages, than that is certainly true.

It's certainly be possible to be overqualified for a med school, residency, etc. People just say it's not to make themselves feel better. One of the most important things to learn before starting med school is that no matter how good you think you are, there's always going to be someone else better (and in the case of med school, probably a lot of people)
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4.0/45T? <1 per decade.
 
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XklusivGuy said:
I don't know if I can agree. I got rejected from my state school pre-secondary. And my MCAT is 10 points higher than the average matriculating class' at my state school.

But then again, my n = 1.
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I highly doubt any school would reject somebody for being "overqualified". They probably just thought you would not end up matriculating there, and so chose to use the (limited) interview spot for somebody they felt had a higher chance of matriculating.
 
ClandestineStar said:
.
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XklusivGuy said:
I don't know if I can agree. I got rejected from my state school pre-secondary. And my MCAT is 10 points higher than the average matriculating class' at my state school.

But then again, my n = 1.
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Are you allowed to call, and ask why? If it were me, I'd be in denial, and call admissions to make sure they didn't mix up my MCAT score with someone else's :scared:
 
Nymphicus said:
I highly doubt any school would reject somebody for being "overqualified". They probably just thought you would not end up matriculating there, and so chose to use the (limited) interview spot for somebody they felt had a higher chance of matriculating.
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I.e. Higher than the caliber of candidate they legitimately thought they could get, I.e. Overqualified.
 
Nymphicus said:
I highly doubt any school would reject somebody for being "overqualified". They probably just thought you would not end up matriculating there, and so chose to use the (limited) interview spot for somebody they felt had a higher chance of matriculating.
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That is true. But in the end - same difference. I admit that my state school would be at the very bottom of my list even if they had interviewed me.

ClandestineStar said:
Are you allowed to call, and ask why? If it were me, I'd be in denial, and call admissions to make sure they didn't mix up my MCAT score with someone else's :scared:
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I can. I have been pretty lucky with my interviews so I haven't bothered. I hope it doesn't come back to bite me in the ***** later in the season :scared: .
 
Sephiroth said:
I knew it! Just like I'm being discriminated against for being a white middle class male, I'm also being discriminated against for being a 3.8/35 applicant!
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Maybe this attitude is why they rejected you...


I have a question regarding showing enough interest- how can you really ask the questions you want to at interviews without making it seem like you don't want to go to the school? I've been waitlisted post-interview at my two favorite schools, and I'm concerned that it is because I basically acknowledged that I was "undecided" between the two and asked for my interviewers' opinions...
 
danceonskis said:
I have a question regarding showing enough interest- how can you really ask the questions you want to at interviews without making it seem like you don't want to go to the school? I've been waitlisted post-interview at my two favorite schools, and I'm concerned that it is because I basically acknowledged that I was "undecided" between the two and asked for my interviewers' opinions...
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Research the school as much as you can before the interview. Get excited about one or two things about the school. Use those as springboards on the "Why do you want to come here?" question. With that kind of preface, your interest in the school will not be an issue when they review your application post-interview. Then you can ask your questions about the school.
 
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