Salaries post-fellowship

[UMD2012]

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Anyone know the most up to date salary data (East/Northeast coast)?

Academic General GI
Private General GI
Academic Transplant Hepatology
Private Transplant Hepatology
Academic Advanced ERCP

 

[ShiShiMD]

Anyone know the most up to date salary data (East/Northeast coast)?

Academic General GI
Private General GI
Academic Transplant Hepatology
Private Transplant Hepatology
Academic Advanced ERCP

I have the MGMA book, some medical university or school has it somewhere.

I think is not good to talk about salaries. Last DDW a medscape report came out and everyone was furious.

All I can say is that GI is not making enough.

But if you want to talk about wRVU over 90% in private and over 75% academic for transplant or advance and 50-75-% for General

If you know motility add 5-10% to the production. This is all not including supervisory bonus, quality bonus.

But again where in north east. Also moderator erase this post please.

 

[1Cor1557]

Anyone know the most up to date salary data (East/Northeast coast)?

Academic General GI
Private General GI
Academic Transplant Hepatology
Private Transplant Hepatology
Academic Advanced ERCP

Tough too say widely variable, new grad in northeast in private practice can expect 400k base not including bonus and asc shares buy in, less academics, interview widely and get a copy of mgma/agma/Merritt annual review, as shishi said wherever you go will enjoy $2-3 million in down stream revenue a year thanks to you and you will get a portion of that if you are outside a metro negotiate hard

 

[gutonc]

I have the MGMA book, some medical university or school has it somewhere.

I think is not good to talk about salaries. Last DDW a medscape report came out and everyone was furious.

All I can say is that GI is not making enough.

But if you want to talk about wRVU over 90% in private and over 75% academic for transplant or advance and 50-75-% for General

If you know motility add 5-10% to the production. This is all not including supervisory bonus, quality bonus.

But again where in north east. Also moderator erase this post please.

Not talking about salaries is a terrible idea. The only people that want them hidden are the ones who pay them.

 

[ShiShiMD]

Not talking about salaries is a terrible idea. The only people that want them hidden are the ones who pay them.

I don’t agree. Last year medscape called us the richest doctors in the United States making millions and I personally heard other speciality physicians and resident and fellows before going to DDW meeting saying to each other they don’t deserve it.

I don’t understand why on a public forum salaries have to discussed and so specific.

I personally do not like anyone knowing how much or range I make.

 

[PikminOC]

I don’t agree. Last year medscape called us the richest doctors in the United States making millions and I personally heard other speciality physicians and resident and fellows before going to DDW meeting saying to each other they don’t deserve it.

I don’t understand why on a public forum salaries have to discussed and so specific.

I personally do not like anyone knowing how much or range I make.

Then u don't have to give the info.


I have a gi friend in academics in Midwest. No ercp. Makes 400k. Lots of benefits

 

[gutonc]

I don’t agree. Last year medscape called us the richest doctors in the United States making millions and I personally heard other speciality physicians and resident and fellows before going to DDW meeting saying to each other they don’t deserve it.

I don’t understand why on a public forum salaries have to discussed and so specific.

I personally do not like anyone knowing how much or range I make.

Then don't tell them. Honestly...nothing personal here...but nobody other than maybe your ex-wife's lawyer, cares how much money you make.

 

[bronx43]

All I can say is that GI is not making enough.

I am not GI. I think I don't make enough. Join the club.

 

[anonperson]

I don’t agree. Last year medscape called us the richest doctors in the United States making millions and I personally heard other speciality physicians and resident and fellows before going to DDW meeting saying to each other they don’t deserve it.

I don’t understand why on a public forum salaries have to discussed and so specific.

I personally do not like anyone knowing how much or range I make.

When physicians don't have any idea of salaries and compensation, they get screwed.

Only hospital admins and people cutting the check want to make that information hard to find. Easier to lowball people. I saw this first hand with my salary negotiations with a health system.

If a physician is making a ton of cash, God bless them. They are usually hustling for it.

 

[GastriqueGraffin]

I don’t agree. Last year medscape called us the richest doctors in the United States making millions and I personally heard other speciality physicians and resident and fellows before going to DDW meeting saying to each other they don’t deserve it.

I don’t understand why on a public forum salaries have to discussed and so specific.

I personally do not like anyone knowing how much or range I make.

Where is the correct forum for this type of discussion if not an open one online?

 

[ShiShiMD]

Then don't tell them. Honestly...nothing personal here...but nobody other than maybe your ex-wife's lawyer, cares how much money you make.

I agree to disagree.

Check my next posts and you will see who will care.

 

[ShiShiMD]

Where is the correct forum for this type of discussion if not an open one online?

Here but in forms of wRVU not $$$ signs

 

[ShiShiMD]

You know what here it is.

Medscape: Medscape Access

 

[ShiShiMD]

Now everyone is informed.

 

[ShiShiMD]

Just watch how fast your reimbursement goes down.

 

[anonperson]

Now everyone is informed.

Lol. So some random statistic that of the small number of physicians worth over $5 million , only 20% are GI, now your reimbursement is going to tank?

I don't see plastics or ortho that worried.

Most of the guys making millions have ancillary revenue streams, not just grinding out rvus (surgery center, cosmetics, etc)

 

[pbrocks15]

What are the secondary incomes streams for GI? How are they able to be worth over $5M with their salary? I see most GI average salaries at $400 - 600K

 

[Suprep]

What are the secondary incomes streams for GI? How are they able to be worth over $5M with their salary? I see most GI average salaries at $400 - 600K

partnership track. ancillary income. overall if they were to retire, their share of the practice is worth $$$$.
Keep in mind that the golden period of gastro is behind us. CMS has been cutting RVUs for GI practices and that directly reflects payments. Non invasive CRC screening will predominate the market in 5-10 years, then most scopes ll be diagnostic for positive screening test or other active GI issue.

IBS is not gonna go away, if you become a specialist in that area, you have enough job security for the next century

 

[bronx43]

partnership track. ancillary income. overall if they were to retire, their share of the practice is worth $$$$.
Keep in mind that the golden period of gastro is behind us. CMS has been cutting RVUs for GI practices and that directly reflects payments. Non invasive CRC screening will predominate the market in 5-10 years, then most scopes ll be diagnostic for positive screening test or other active GI issue.

IBS is not gonna go away, if you become a specialist in that area, you have enough job security for the next century

IBS? Or IBD?

Telling GI that they shouldn’t worry because if they specialize in irritable bowel syndrome, they will have job security is like telling a rheumatologist don’t worry, just specialize in fibromyalgia.

 

[pbrocks15]

partnership track. ancillary income. overall if they were to retire, their share of the practice is worth $$$$.
Keep in mind that the golden period of gastro is behind us. CMS has been cutting RVUs for GI practices and that directly reflects payments. Non invasive CRC screening will predominate the market in 5-10 years, then most scopes ll be diagnostic for positive screening test or other active GI issue.

IBS is not gonna go away, if you become a specialist in that area, you have enough job security for the next century

Might be better, no? You can then fill your practice with scopes that are therapeutic and not diagnostic which will pay more.

I still feel that the field is growing a lot and isnt past the golden period yet. But what do I know?

 

[Suprep]

IBS? Or IBD?

Telling GI that they shouldn’t worry because if they specialize in irritable bowel syndrome, they will have job security is like telling a rheumatologist don’t worry, just specialize in fibromyalgia.

IBS. its the only constant in GI. You can keep IBD in remission but IBS will never go away. It ll be in their EPIC problem list and continue till their death

 

[1Cor1557]

The coasts are saturated like anything else but the rest of the country is wide wide open (in medicine overall really ) but almost ridiculous shortages in GI for docs in the heartland or "fly over country". There are more patients available to you than you can keep up with, and If your not in Manhattan or San Fran you can make a decent clip doing it too, I spent half my morning replying to my schedulers because of all the 3 month return to clinic follow ups I ordered last week when the next available openings in our offices without overbooking is march 2020.

 

[GastriqueGraffin]

IBS. its the only constant in GI. You can keep IBD in remission but IBS will never go away. It ll be in their EPIC problem list and continue till their death

I can understand what you’re saying. Many of our procedures are for functional/psych complaints. But GI is so broad that we pretty much make up the field of most cancers, common issues like reflux, anemia, diarrhea, dysphagia, IBD, not to mention abnormal LFTs or incidental findings on imaging or other soft calls, just to mention a few... the field is only growing even if we do away with routine screening colons.

 

[Thebestofus]

As someone currently looking for a job when I finish fellowship I can say that knowing the usual salaries is very important.

People like ShiShi are pretty selfish in my opinion with the mindset of "I don't want to tell anyone what I make so that they don't tell it away from me!"

It's already difficult enough as it is right now figuring out which groups are good and which are trying to screw me over. I'm lucky to have a pretty good idea of the kind of normal salary in the area I want to know when I'm being low balled

Anyways, I'm still looking. Now I get 15+ phone calls from recruiters a day. Mainly for jobs in the Midwest and near St Louis. Not really areas I want.

 

[pbrocks15]

As someone currently looking for a job when I finish fellowship I can say that knowing the usual salaries is very important.

People like ShiShi are pretty selfish in my opinion with the mindset of "I don't want to tell anyone what I make so that they don't tell it away from me!"

It's already difficult enough as it is right now figuring out which groups are good and which are trying to screw me over. I'm lucky to have a pretty good idea of the kind of normal salary in the area I want to know when I'm being low balled

Anyways, I'm still looking. Now I get 15+ phone calls from recruiters a day. Mainly for jobs in the Midwest and near St Louis. Not really areas I want.

Just curious, where are you looking to be? And what's the salary you're aware of for that?

Just curious to hear if that's alright

 

[ShiShiMD]

As someone currently looking for a job when I finish fellowship I can say that knowing the usual salaries is very important.

People like ShiShi are pretty selfish in my opinion with the mindset of "I don't want to tell anyone what I make so that they don't tell it away from me!"

It's already difficult enough as it is right now figuring out which groups are good and which are trying to screw me over. I'm lucky to have a pretty good idea of the kind of normal salary in the area I want to know when I'm being low balled

Anyways, I'm still looking. Now I get 15+ phone calls from recruiters a day. Mainly for jobs in the Midwest and near St Louis. Not really areas I want.

If you don’t have a lawyer, accountant and MGMA you should get one.
I know Midwest is over 90 percentile. That number starts with a 7 before the other zeros

 

[Thebestofus]

If you don’t have a lawyer, accountant and MGMA you are the selfish one.
I know Midwest is over 90 percentile. That number starts with a 7 before the other zeros

What does having those things have anything to do with knowing what's a "normal salary" in a particular area.

If you apply at a job at McDonald's, you should know what be other new people in your McDonald's make per hour so you know when a manager is trying to screw you over. It's really not that hard of a concept to understand.

 

[GastriqueGraffin]

If you don’t have a lawyer, accountant and MGMA you are the selfish one.
I know Midwest is over 90 percentile. That number starts with a 7 before the other zeros

How does MGMA get their info? Is it based on what some respondents volunteer to submit or is it based on actually being able to access everyone’s salaries?

 

[bronx43]

How does MGMA get their info? Is it based on what some respondents volunteer to submit or is it based on actually being able to access everyone’s salaries?

Volunteer responses. The bigger the field, the more responses you get. For small fields, the N can literally be 5 people...
In 2015, there were like 15 responders for my field.

 

[bronx43]

I can understand what you’re saying. Many of our procedures are for functional/psych complaints. But GI is so broad that we pretty much make up the field of most cancers, common issues like reflux, anemia, diarrhea, dysphagia, IBD, not to mention abnormal LFTs or incidental findings on imaging or other soft calls, just to mention a few... the field is only growing even if we do away with routine screening colons.

I mean, I don’t think any medical specialty is in danger of losing its scope of practice. Every field has enough complaints that they deal with to keep them busy. The question is how satisfying are those conditions to treat and what kind of compensation can be derived from them.
The former probably won’t change much. The latter will change drastically in the course of our careers. What is good now may not always be good, and the opposite is true as well.

 

[Suprep]

a big factor should also be how ****ty the administration is. A job that pays 650k in North Dakota has definite catches - bad location, so so administration, inexperienced support staff etc. It might be okay to accept a slightly lower paying position that gives better quality of life, better practice support

 

[Thebestofus]

Just curious, where are you looking to be? And what's the salary you're aware of for that?

Just curious to hear if that's alright

I messaged you.

 

[ShiShiMD]

What does having those things have anything to do with knowing what's a "normal salary" in a particular area.

If you apply at a job at McDonald's, you should know what be other new people in your McDonald's make per hour so you know when a manager is trying to screw you over. It's really not that hard of a concept to understand.

general with advance skills.
mid manhattan call 1:9 pays 90% and partnership. I don’t know about Fargo but if you not making over 18000 wRVU is all on you.

IBD 325$ same location but over 600 in upper New York and places like Maine and Vermont. Where general with advance skills makes 50 less

 

[Thebestofus]

general with advance skills.
mid manhattan call 1:9 pays 90% and partnership. I don’t know about Fargo but if you not making over 18000 wRVU is all on you.

IBD 325$ same location but over 600 in upper New York and places like Maine and Vermont. Where general with advance skills makes 50 less

As far as I know there's no job like that in Manhattan, if you have info then please pm me.

 

[UMD2012]

How about for Transplant hep in an academic setting?

 

[Thebestofus]

How about for Transplant hep in an academic setting?

Highly variable.

Transplant hep is its own beast. You essentially have to become irreplaceable before you break 350k in an academic setting.

 

[ShiShiMD]

As far as I know there's no job like that in Manhattan, if you have info then please pm me.

I have friend who Is considering the job as of now if she turns it down I will pm you.

 

[ShiShiMD]

Highly variable.

Transplant hep is its own beast. You essentially have to become irreplaceable before you break 350k in an academic setting.

Easily 500K starting. Easily

 

[ShiShiMD]

How about for Transplant hep in an academic setting?

transplant hepatologist I know make 7 digit salary but they all ok different boards of pharmaceutical companies and in academics

 

[XTasy]

I don’t agree. Last year medscape called us the richest doctors in the United States making millions and I personally heard other speciality physicians and resident and fellows before going to DDW meeting saying to each other they don’t deserve it.

I don’t understand why on a public forum salaries have to discussed and so specific.

I personally do not like anyone knowing how much or range I make.

LOL. This is so ridiculous. Afraid to talk about salaries even on a public forum? Jesus H christ.

Not talking about salaries is how the man keeps us down.

I share my salary freely and as do most other physicians I interact with. I encourage you to change the way you see this and do the same. When compensation is freely shared among physicians we all benefit as a group. If one person is getting screwed they should know about it. If one person is killing it the other partners should know why and figure out how they can do well too. If they can't and it's unfair then maybe you did them a service so they can look elsewhere. If you signed with a group and got a signing bonus, let your new colleague who just signed know too so they get it as well. Look out for your fellow docs.

No need to hide under a rock with a tinfoil hat afraid to talk about compensation.

 

[Thebestofus]

LOL. This is so ridiculous. Afraid to talk about salaries even on a public forum? Jesus H christ.

Not talking about salaries is how the man keeps us down.

I share my salary freely and as do most other physicians I interact with. I encourage you to change the way you see this and do the same. When compensation is freely shared among physicians we all benefit as a group. If one person is getting screwed they should know about it. If one person is killing it the other partners should know why and figure out how they can do well too. If they can't and it's unfair then maybe you did them a service so they can look elsewhere. If you signed with a group and got a signing bonus, let your new colleague who just signed know too so they get it as well. Look out for your fellow docs.

No need to hide under a rock with a tinfoil hat afraid to talk about compensation.

It's no use talking to him. He's a bit of a coward and rather selfish. It's his type that I am doing my best to avoid while finding a job.

Imagine ..... Your own partner concealing information like his income sources so that you don't find out about it and ruin it for him.

 

[ShiShiMD]

It's no use talking to him. He's a bit of a coward and rather selfish. It's his type that I am doing my best to avoid while finding a job.

Imagine ..... Your own partner concealing information like his income sources so that you don't find out about it and ruin it for him.

did I conceal. I simply said say it in wRVU format.

 

[ShiShiMD]

LOL. This is so ridiculous. Afraid to talk about salaries even on a public forum? Jesus H christ.

Not talking about salaries is how the man keeps us down.

I share my salary freely and as do most other physicians I interact with. I encourage you to change the way you see this and do the same. When compensation is freely shared among physicians we all benefit as a group. If one person is getting screwed they should know about it. If one person is killing it the other partners should know why and figure out how they can do well too. If they can't and it's unfair then maybe you did them a service so they can look elsewhere. If you signed with a group and got a signing bonus, let your new colleague who just signed know too so they get it as well. Look out for your fellow docs.

No need to hide under a rock with a tinfoil hat afraid to talk about compensation.

tell us how much you make in wRVU format please

 

[ShiShiMD]

It's no use talking to him. He's a bit of a coward and rather selfish. It's his type that I am doing my best to avoid while finding a job.

Imagine ..... Your own partner concealing information like his income sources so that you don't find out about it and ruin it for him.

dude, I tell you how much I am offered different states. All I am saying is say it in wRVU format.

for instance 8800wRVU each wRVU 73$ over 12000wRVU 78$ over 17000wrVU 83$ for each wRVU paid

not just say I make 7 figures. Everyone should get:
1) a lawyer
2) professional negotiator
3) interview for enough jobs
4) ask for all the documents regarding billing, collection, NP supervisory WRVU which is 22$ per wRVU you make
5) do ERCP and EUS
6) work 55-60 hours week

The ones making 7 figures coming out of fellowship either work 55-60 hrs a week with loads of advance and Taking over either their parents or buying the whole practice.

Is this to much to ask to post as wRVU formula and explain the module of compensation and practice.

 

[ShiShiMD]

LOL. This is so ridiculous. Afraid to talk about salaries even on a public forum? Jesus H christ.

Not talking about salaries is how the man keeps us down.

I share my salary freely and as do most other physicians I interact with. I encourage you to change the way you see this and do the same. When compensation is freely shared among physicians we all benefit as a group. If one person is getting screwed they should know about it. If one person is killing it the other partners should know why and figure out how they can do well too. If they can't and it's unfair then maybe you did them a service so they can look elsewhere. If you signed with a group and got a signing bonus, let your new colleague who just signed know too so they get it as well. Look out for your fellow docs.

No need to hide under a rock with a tinfoil hat afraid to talk about compensation.

please share your salary with us and if you can educate us on the module of productivity, quality bonus and wRVU threshold and how I in per wRVU. I Hope your a GI making 70$ at least per wRVU because all the jobs I am considering are paying 65-75$ Per wRVU and quality of 5% and 20-25$ per wRVU the NP generates and I sign off on the record if I wish. If not NP deals with IBD and liver and nurse does the motility and I read it in 3-5 minutes. Oh the PAs also do all the notes.

 

[GastriqueGraffin]

dude, I tell you how much I am offered different states. All I am saying is say it in wRVU format.

for instance 8800wRVU each wRVU 73$ over 12000wRVU 78$ over 17000wrVU 83$ for each wRVU paid

not just say I make 7 figures. Come on man.if anybody is getting screwed over is
1) did not hire a lawyer
2) did not have a professional negotiator
3) did not interview for enough jobs
4) did not ask for all the documents regarding billing, collection, NP supervisory WRVU which is 22$ per wRVU you make
5) doesn’t do ERCP and EUS
6) works less than 40 hours ( I know many )

The ones making 7 figures coming out of fellowship either work 50-55 hrs a week with loads of advance and Taking over either their parents or buying the whole practice.

Is this to much to ask to post as wRVU formula and explain the module of compensation and practice.

How important do you think ERCP/EUS is? Most tell me it doesn’t help RVUs. I hear that from both those who do them and those who do not.

 

[ShiShiMD]

How important do you think ERCP/EUS is? Most tell me it doesn’t help RVUs. I hear that from both those who do them and those who do not.

Is important for patient care and also for your self to make sure you are providing the most paramount care for your patients. In regards to wRVU it all depends on how you will set up your practice. 1 day advance cases 3 days scope and 1 day general clinic. Or 2 half days of clinic and the rest scope with you providing advance care ERCP and eus if needed on a set block.
It is sometimes a deal breaker but now a days most university programs provide ample cases for fellows to be certified in ERCP. If not that is ok also. It all depends on what you are comfortable in doing. On the end side they all will produce the same level of wRVU if they work the hours 40-50 hours a week.

 

[GastriqueGraffin]

Is important for patient care and also for your self to make sure you are providing the most paramount care for your patients. In regards to wRVU it all depends on how you will set up your practice. 1 day advance cases 3 days scope and 1 day general clinic. Or 2 half days of clinic and the rest scope with you providing advance care ERCP and eus if needed on a set block.
It is sometimes a deal breaker but now a days most university programs provide ample cases for fellows to be certified in ERCP. If not that is ok also. It all depends on what you are comfortable in doing. On the end side they all will produce the same level of wRVU if they work the hours 40-50 hours a week.

I guess my question is the amount of time it takes to perform an EUS with ERCP, especially if the case is not a simple stone, you could have done several EGD/Colons. From what I hear, the advanced person has to make a contract where that is taken into account. I completely agree about paramount care but nobody can be a master of everything. Most EUS people become a master of pancreas/bili but aren’t often up to date on other GI things. I will likely pursue advanced training out of interest but from an RVU/money standpoint I was asking how important is it really.

 

[Suprep]

Non profit hospitals let you make only upto 75th percentile for the MGMA region. In midwest, this is 750k, in south 650-660k. that will be your total compensation max in these regions in such hospitals. no limit on private practice and for profit employers. 1 million is possible in few practices but in majority, 600k is whats possible. Academic salaries depend on a lot of factors - how successful one is to get grant money, research support, guest speaker $$$, pharmaceutical board specialty, etc. Success wont come early in academics. One has to grind in for at least 7-10 years to start becoming popular and recognized and going on higher pay scale. administrative duties like APD or PD or director of "sub division" of GI pays extra in academics.

RVU of 70 is a good deal but in south region, MGMA median is 55-56$ and thats what many employers pay. its ridiculously low but south is competitive region, with 50th percentile wRVU of 9300

 

[ShiShiMD]

I guess my question is the amount of time it takes to perform an EUS with ERCP, especially if the case is not a simple stone, you could have done several EGD/Colons. From what I hear, the advanced person has to make a contract where that is taken into account. I completely agree about paramount care but nobody can be a master of everything. Most EUS people become a master of pancreas/bili but aren’t often up to date on other GI things. I will likely pursue advanced training out of interest but from an RVU/money standpoint I was asking how important is it really.

Do advance for patient care enhancement, once you start and working and building patients, volume and reputation money will come.

no one has a crystal ball to tell you if the wRVU increase more. But if takes 2 hours to do a case do it. Not for the money but to make sure the patient is well.

money will come for all good compassionate and competent physicians.