Scared about OMM lab

[rls303]

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Hi guys,
I come from a very conservative south asian family and I am very scared about shedding some clothes during OMM lab. Is there a way I can possibly just study my partner instead of me having to shed some clothes? The school in question is AZCOM, but I'm pretty sure that the policy should be applicable to most schools.

For some reason I am having some trouble searching on the specific school but I remember reading in the past that it is generally not allowed and you have to take some clothes off.

Thanks guys!

 

[nicknickp3]

I mean this is a very polite way, suck it up and do it. You are a Health Professional now, when you start seeing patients you aren't going to giggle or be scared to see a penis are you? It's just nerves, the others in the room aren't going to leave the room and be like "zomg she was hideous in her sports bra", or if they do im sure they would get in trouble. Besides, your partner would be getting cheated out of an education if only you were able to see them. Good luck!

 

[Total180]

At DCOM we are allowed to wear shirts and yoga pants/shorts for OMM lab, so I assume it is possible to learn just as well with your clothes on (as long as you are able to either work around the shirt/feel through the clothing). Maybe you could ask the school what your options are. I highly doubt you will never have to be the "patient" because your partner has to learn too, but you might be able to tweak the dress code a bit.

 

[WADO]

You can wear shorts and a t-shirt. You don't have to strip down to your undies. That being said, I wouldn't sweat it.

 

[da Vincis World]

At DCOM we are allowed to wear shirts and yoga pants/shorts for OMM lab, so I assume it is possible to learn just as well with your clothes on (as long as you are able to either work around the shirt/feel through the clothing). Maybe you could ask the school what your options are. I highly doubt you will never have to be the "patient" because your partner has to learn too, but you might be able to tweak the dress code a bit.

This is certainly NOT the tone a most DO schools. Most places will want you to place your hands on the skin and NOT palpate through the clothing.

 

[PharmaTope]

sorry wrong thread

 

[n3xa]

well this is called punishment for your poor eating habbits. hopefully you learn a lesson and start taking better care of yourself.


reality is, everyone is going to notice your flaws and if you pig out and make yourself look disgusting, everyone will be talking about it.

take it as a lesson to never be like that in life again

I don't think the OP said anything about being shy due to weight issues. 😕

 

[mommy2three]

at ccom we wear scrubs to omm lab, i do not see why the sister school should be any different 😕

 

[PharmaTope]

I don't think the OP said anything about being shy due to weight issues. 😕

Sorry about that, i had multi threads open same topic

 

[danzman]

At NSU you take it all off. Totally nude, rectal and vaginal exams on each other. Things get pretty crazy after test days, just devolves into a huge orgy.


Sports bra/shorts for ladies, gym shorts for guys. Nothing to be worried about.

 

[willen101383]

PCOM-Sports bras and gym shorts for women...shirtless and gym shorts for men.

However this policy does noticeably fade as the year progresses.

But OP suck it up. I know plenty of conservative individuals of many different religions and they have no problem adhering to the dress code.

 

[ShyRem]

UNE people wear sweat pants and a t-shirt.

 

[SmokD]

TouroCOM would take religious obligations into consideration as we do have a fairly large Muslim and Orthodox Jewish population. Otherwise it was T-shirt and shorts. Shirts off only when necessary.

 

[Mbeas]

At NSU you take it all off. Totally nude, rectal and vaginal exams on each other. Things get pretty crazy after test days, just devolves into a huge orgy.

Where do I sign up?

 

[ManBroDude]

Judging from your other posts' tone, I'm guessing you're a girl. Since no one has said it yet, I figured why not: Here's a great opportunity to get in shape and feel good about the way you look! (unless you start this Fall and you're waaay out of shape.)

 

[JaggerPlate]

OP,

You'll likely have times in OMM lab where you're only wearing a sports bra and shorts. Keep a few things in mind ...

1. People will act professionally
2. Despite what you may think, there will be various other people in the room more nervous, etc
3. It's not some weird oogling session. Frankly, no one seems to care.
4. It's far, far, far from the most "uncomfortable" thing you'll do during MS-1.

Like someone else said, by the time you learn male GU exams, check for an indirect inguinal hernia on a live male patient, perform a pap, etc, etc, etc, standing in a conservative sports bra in OMM for 20 minutes while someone tries to palpate your back is really no big deal.

Additionally, it's definitely not every OMM session. I'd say we had to take our shirts off (KCOM) maybe 5 times during the first quarter when everyone is getting used to palpation, and it's been very, very few times since then.

Don't stress ... you'll be fine.

 

[Mbeas]

Like someone else said, by the time you learn male GU exams, check for an indirect inguinal hernia on a live male patient, perform a pap, etc, etc, etc, standing in a conservative sports bra in OMM for 20 minutes while someone tries to palpate your back is really no big deal.

Now I'm interested....What do these things entail and what makes it so uncomfortable?

 

[costales]

At NSU you take it all off. Totally nude, rectal and vaginal exams on each other. Things get pretty crazy after test days, just devolves into a huge orgy.


Sports bra/shorts for ladies, gym shorts for guys. Nothing to be worried about.

Damn orgies in OMM at TCOM always left me so tired... and wanting more. Geeeeez. LOL.

Same attire at TCOM. No monkey business.

 

[randomusername]

OP, AZCOM isn't overly anal about OMM. They encourage students who are comfortable with taking clothing off to do so but will not require you to remove more than you're comfortable with (assuming this doesn't entail 800 layers of clothing and a chastity belt). Certainly yours are valid concerns, but you will get more comfortable as the year progresses. Also, as others have pointed out, you will have to get used to the idea of getting out of your comfort zone with such things because this stuff will come up not only in OMM in which you're potentially the "vulnerable" person in the situation (just like your future patients will be and just like you will be anytime you need a more detailed physical exam from your own physician), but also in anatomy doing dissections (penises, vaginas, breasts, and anuses all need dissecting) and in your clinical medicine class (as JP mentioned, you'll be learning some pretty "personal" exams over the first two years and you will be required to do inguinal hernia checks and testicular cancer screenings on teenagers by the end of MS1 at AZCOM).

 

[SNDO]

Hey OP,

I can definitely relate to your worries, as I am also of Asian descent, and I'm as conservative as you can get in my family haha. I was also worried about OMM, but because you and your classmates are health care professionals now, everything that is done at school is supposed to be professional as well. And it's not really fair if only your partner acts as the patient for you to study palpation. Your partner has to learn it too.

So with that in mind, just get over it and deal with it, especially since you won't be the only one feeling this way. I'm in no way "physically fit" but the point of OMM is to learn to palpate on different body types. So it's all about the learning. You might find that your classmates are more considerate than you think, and even if some of them aren't, then shame on them.

If you really have major concerns with it though, just talk to your professors, and try to work something out. Hope that helps!

By the way, ATSU/SOMA makes everyone wear t-shirts and shorts, with girls wearing a sports bra underneath. Shirts are taken off when necessary, and usually the girls put them back on immediately, whereas guys tend to leave them off.

 

[supergumbo]

At NSU you take it all off. Totally nude, rectal and vaginal exams on each other. Things get pretty crazy after test days, just devolves into a huge orgy.

That's quite, umm, hardcore. And crazy.

As for TC, you will be fine. Once you're at lab and get those few minutes of nerves out of the way, you won't even care. And nobody else in the room will either. Things will get a bit crazy later on in OPP lab, and it will seem like daily routine by that time.

 

[spoudaios]

Will having a 6-pack be an advantage? 😛

 

[randomusername]

Will having a 6-pack be an advantage? 😛

Yes, in my experience six beers helps relax most people. 👍

 

[fortitude]

An acquaintance of mine is South Asian conservative practicing Muslim. He used not not even shake hands with women, but now he does (just to put into perspective how he feels about contact.) He attended TouroCOM. Students who were religious would be able to pair up with same-sex students to practice OMM. I'm sure at your school you could request something similar. And there is no reason to be ashamed for it. I do not feel that you should "suck it up;" no one should touch you in a way that you feel is inappropriate (even though like the other posters said, there is nothing sexy about OMM.) You should live your life the way that you want to!

You can even call your school ahead of time and talk to them about arrangements to make before you go to class so there isn't a minor scene. I'm sure they can't kick out out just because you want to have a same-sex partner to do OMM with, especially if they receive Federal funding.

 

[AvidAvatar]

As a very hairy man, I feel bad for my future partner. I hope they can concentrate as they run their fingers through my luscious locks of chest hair.

 

[Bacchus]

As a very hairy man, I feel bad for my future partner. I hope they can concentrate as they run their fingers through my luscious locks of chest hair.

It's an OMM table, not a coin-operated king bed at Sleazy Sally's Shag-a-lot.

 

[DinoSaysRawr]

It's an OMM table, not a coin-operated king bed at Sleazy Sally's Shag-a-lot.

 

[willen101383]

An acquaintance of mine is South Asian conservative practicing Muslim. He used not not even shake hands with women, but now he does (just to put into perspective how he feels about contact.) He attended TouroCOM. Students who were religious would be able to pair up with same-sex students to practice OMM. I'm sure at your school you could request something similar. And there is no reason to be ashamed for it. I do not feel that you should "suck it up;" no one should touch you in a way that you feel is inappropriate (even though like the other posters said, there is nothing sexy about OMM.) You should live your life the way that you want to!

You can even call your school ahead of time and talk to them about arrangements to make before you go to class so there isn't a minor scene. I'm sure they can't kick out out just because you want to have a same-sex partner to do OMM with, especially if they receive Federal funding.

Yeah...so what happens when you have a female paient but are reluctant to touch that patient based on your religious beliefs? This is medicine, not a desk job and a huge part of med school is developing your self as an individual and as a physician. As a med student you will be thrust into many situations that will make you uncomfortable..and you need to learn to move past those things. As a physician/med student physical contact is required to function as a competent doc and it essential that the OP learn to touch and be touched. It is ridiculous that someone would need special accommodations because they cant put their religious beliefs aside in the name of their medical training. I dont often say this, but if someone cant get over this type of stuff than perhaps they should have considered an alternate career. By getting special accommodations you are doing youself AND your classmates a disservice.

Just my .02

 

[drctother]

Yeah...so what happens when you have a female paient but are reluctant to touch that patient based on your religious beliefs? This is medicine, not a desk job and a huge part of med school is developing your self as an individual and as a physician. As a med student you will be thrust into many situations that will make you uncomfortable..and you need to learn to move past those things. As a physician/med student physical contact is required to function as a competent doc and it essential that the OP learn to touch and be touched. It is ridiculous that someone would need special accommodations because they cant put their religious beliefs aside in the name of their medical training. I dont often say this, but if someone cant get over this type of stuff than perhaps they should have considered an alternate career. By getting special accommodations you are doing youself AND your classmates a disservice.

Just my .02

Beautifully said. I totally agree

 

[Mbeas]

brilliance

You know, I've never actually thought about it this way before...excellent post 👍

 

[tbone1234]

Yeah...so what happens when you have a female paient but are reluctant to touch that patient based on your religious beliefs? This is medicine, not a desk job and a huge part of med school is developing your self as an individual and as a physician. As a med student you will be thrust into many situations that will make you uncomfortable..and you need to learn to move past those things. As a physician/med student physical contact is required to function as a competent doc and it essential that the OP learn to touch and be touched. It is ridiculous that someone would need special accommodations because they cant put their religious beliefs aside in the name of their medical training. I dont often say this, but if someone cant get over this type of stuff than perhaps they should have considered an alternate career. By getting special accommodations you are doing yourself AND your classmates a disservice.

Just my .02

I've been keeping up with this thread, and was waiting for someone to lay it all out there like you did. Very well said.

I'm nervous myself about taking my shirt off in front of people (mainly because I'm a little overweight, but I'm in the process of getting that taken care of... haha), but to request special conditions for yourself is just ridiculous. As said before, it limits your own learning, the learning of your peers, and the treatment of your future patients.

And this topic really makes me feel like saying "if you have a problem with taking your shirt off and touching other people, then go into research. It's nobody's problem but your own, so deal with it."... but I won't say it. Wait... I just did. oops

 

[n3xa]

It's an OMM table, not a coin-operated king bed at Sleazy Sally's Shag-a-lot.

...oh.

🙁

*withdraws from all DO schools*

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

Beautifully said. I totally agree

I wonder what happens when these people do their OB/Gyn rotations or if they have to preform an abortion?

 

[Bacchus]

No one is going to make you perform an abortion. It isn't even required in most OB/GYN residencies. You have to seek out the training.

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

No one is going to make you perform an abortion. It isn't even required in most OB/GYN residencies. You have to seek out the training.

Don't you have to do them if you want to specialize in Ob/Gyn?

 

[thomasfx10]

I am not an expert but I know of a few Christian OB's that would never perform an abortion so I doubt if that is a requirement. I know I would not be going down that route

 

[LesBois88]

Yeah...so what happens when you have a female paient but are reluctant to touch that patient based on your religious beliefs? This is medicine, not a desk job and a huge part of med school is developing your self as an individual and as a physician. As a med student you will be thrust into many situations that will make you uncomfortable..and you need to learn to move past those things. As a physician/med student physical contact is required to function as a competent doc and it essential that the OP learn to touch and be touched. It is ridiculous that someone would need special accommodations because they cant put their religious beliefs aside in the name of their medical training. I dont often say this, but if someone cant get over this type of stuff than perhaps they should have considered an alternate career. By getting special accommodations you are doing youself AND your classmates a disservice.

Just my .02

You are only addressing touching patients. There is a big difference between performing your duties as a physician (which of course includes making physical contact with other people) and being touched in ways that may not seem appropriate to you.
If a school doesn't mind setting up OMM labs in a way that avoids contact that would seem uncomfortable, I don't see why it shouldn't be done. I'm proud that TouroCOM does this.

Don't you have to do them if you want to specialize in Ob/Gyn?

Absolutely not.

 

[denco88]

You are only addressing touching patients. There is a big difference between performing your duties as a physician (which of course includes making physical contact with other people) and being touched in ways that may not seem appropriate to you.
If a school doesn't mind setting up OMM labs in a way that avoids contact that would seem uncomfortable, I don't see why it shouldn't be done. I'm proud that TouroCOM does this.

How are your other classmates supposed to learn? Sorry, but if you haven't noticed the male and female bodies are quite different. I don't think I would want a doctor examining me who had never dealt with a female patient before and if the OP is put into groups that are only females touching females or males touching males, they are missing out on important differences.

 

[LesBois88]

How are your other classmates supposed to learn? Sorry, but if you haven't noticed the male and female bodies are quite different. I don't think I would want a doctor examining me who had never dealt with a female patient before and if the OP is put into groups that are only females touching females or males touching males, they are missing out on important differences.

That isn't how it works. Each student doctor gains sufficient experience with both male and female MSK anatomy.

Certain individuals with a religious preference to not have certain techniques performed by members of the opposite sex are accommodated in that matter. Simple as that.

 

[DocEspana]

You are only addressing touching patients. There is a big difference between performing your duties as a physician (which of course includes making physical contact with other people) and being touched in ways that may not seem appropriate to you.
If a school doesn't mind setting up OMM labs in a way that avoids contact that would seem uncomfortable, I don't see why it shouldn't be done. I'm proud that TouroCOM does this.

How are your other classmates supposed to learn? Sorry, but if you haven't noticed the male and female bodies are quite different. I don't think I would want a doctor examining me who had never dealt with a female patient before and if the OP is put into groups that are only females touching females or males touching males, they are missing out on important differences.

from an osteopathic point of view... they really arent. The difference between male and female anatomy fall into two categories: A) Fat distribution and B) things that should make no difference if you can palpate well.

If youre a female who wishes to only be touched by other females you wont lose a thing. If the argument is that only being palpated by females means you'll likely only palpate females (not necessarily true as even the most conservative people will jump to anyone who has an interesting finding to feel it. but *mostly* true), then I posit to you this: will they really be thrown for a loop by a smaller carrying angle or a thinner innominate? I think these are things we know to expect and dont need to palpate male hips if we've palpated the female hip 100 times. Its known that its thinner. You wont freak out if you palpate your first male patient and the width is 15% thinner than you'd expect for a female. As for fat distribution: no one palpates fat (or if they do, they are palpating through it).

In an ideal world everyone touches everyone. But ideal world is not our world. People have rules they must live by. My understanding is most of them fall into the "I can touch whatever I have to for my profession, but I'd prefer to not have "x" touch me". Thats not a big deal and its good to have established criteria to work around it and not hinder anyone's education.

 

[spoudaios]

I am a Christian and I think i will be okay with it. But I tickle a lot. If l laugh too much, it will be distracting to others. 😛

 

[JaggerPlate]

That isn't how it works. Each student doctor gains sufficient experience with both male and female MSK anatomy.

Certain individuals with a religious preference to not have certain techniques performed by members of the opposite sex are accommodated in that matter. Simple as that.

What if my religion commands that I cannot dissect the dead? Should I still be accommodated? Can I skip gross dissection or just look at slides on a computer?

I just want to see where the line is drawn between respecting one's religious beliefs and essentially removing students from pieces of information that are tested on national boards and relied upon every day in a clinical setting?

 

[KeyzerSoze]

What if my religion commands that I cannot dissect the dead? Should I still be accommodated? Can I skip gross dissection or just look at slides on a computer?

I just want to see where the line is drawn between respecting one's religious beliefs and essentially removing students from pieces of information that are tested on national boards and relied upon every day in a clinical setting?

It's pretty straightforward. The line is drawn at learning things you need to practice medicine. This excludes participating in learning exercises for the benefit of others, especially when your abstention will have no real negative effect on their education.

 

[DocEspana]

What if my religion commands that I cannot dissect the dead? Should I still be accommodated? Can I skip gross dissection or just look at slides on a computer?

I just want to see where the line is drawn between respecting one's religious beliefs and essentially removing students from pieces of information that are tested on national boards and relied upon every day in a clinical setting?

Actually, some people can't. Most medical schools (touro included, but I specifically know someone at UMNDJ's MD school) are set up for such a situation. They stya in an observation room and a doctor dissects the body infront of them, through the glass, and then they are given additional online anatomy homework to compensate for lab. They still take the same practical though.

 

[Mbeas]

Actually, some people can't. Most medical schools (touro included, but I specifically know someone at UMNDJ's MD school) are set up for such a situation. They stya in an observation room and a doctor dissects the body infront of them, through the glass, and then they are given additional online anatomy homework to compensate for lab. They still take the same practical though.

Jesus Christ...

 

[DocEspana]

Jesus Christ...

Don't quote me on this (hahaha or do ) but I believe its jehova witness med students who cant touch dead bodies. Or mormons. Its something like that (yes i know jehova's witnesses and TCoLDS are very different)

 

[ozzi22]

Actually, some people can't. Most medical schools (touro included, but I specifically know someone at UMNDJ's MD school) are set up for such a situation. They stya in an observation room and a doctor dissects the body infront of them, through the glass, and then they are given additional online anatomy homework to compensate for lab. They still take the same practical though.

Now that's just absurd 😱

 

[LesBois88]

Some programs (LECOM comes to mind) do not require cadaver dissection.

 

[ParacrineAgent]

Some programs (LECOM comes to mind) do not require cadaver dissection.

If you take the PBL pathway you do not have cadaver dissection, it is computer simulation. For the standard lecture pathway, you do still have a cadaver lab.

 

[JaggerPlate]

It's pretty straightforward. The line is drawn at learning things you need to practice medicine. This excludes participating in learning exercises for the benefit of others, especially when your abstention will have no real negative effect on their education.

Still a bit confused ... how is excluding yourself from an exercise that will help others learn a medical skill/procedure still not detrimental to someone's education? If not your own (most people learn a lot in both the "doctor" and "patient" role), then the experience of a fellow student who will be just as responsible for treating patients?

Listen, I'm 100% for respecting all religious beliefs, but I think people should keep certain things in mind when choosing a program traditionally associated with things like touching other people, palpating members of the opposite sex, wearing 'OMM' garb that may be slightly more revealing, working with cadavers, etc.

I apologize if that sounds offensive or close minded, but the bottom line, in my opinion, is that accommodations are still being made to 'alter' (to say the very least) someone's medical experience, which has effects down the road.

Frankly, I'm sure this is done every day in schools, but it does make me wonder where it finally 'ends.' Are you going to touch patients in residency? Will you stop doing compressions in the middle of a code because on some spiritual level you now think the patient is dead and shouldn't be handled any further? Are you going to refuse to see patients of a certain sex? Are you going to ask for accommodations from surgical attendings and residents during rotations??? It's all just part of the game, and like it or not, it's not for everyone. Again, that probably sounds a bit obtuse, but just the reality of the situation from my POV I suppose ...