School Limitations: Military Spouse

[RainbowBrite769]

Aloha everyone,

I am a military spouse and my wife and I live in Hawaii. I have a Master of Arts in Counseling Psychology and I am currently working in the field. I had been putting of starting a PhD/PsyD until her separation from the military later this year; however, we have recently decided that she will stay in the military for at least 6 more years and possibly retirement. We have no idea where we will be moving next, but we know we will be moving sometime in the next 6 to 18 months.

I am ready and wanting to start my doctoral studies now and I am not willing to put this off for another couple of years. This leaves me with only online programs and I am hoping to gain some insight from all of you...

I have narrowed my options down to two... 1. I can get a clinical psychology PhD from an "online university" and then put in the extra work and struggle to get licensed and employed as a clinical psychologist in whatever state we end up. 2. I can get a psychology PhD in an area I find interesting and worthwhile at a brick and mortar university that offers online and blended modes of attendance and then try to find a career outside of clinical psychology.

For example...

I am already accepted and ready to start (in June) with Walden U. in their clinical psychology PhD program. The downfall is obviously the online university aspect.

Or I can apply to the Chicago School of Professional Psychology (I am originally from Chicago, not that it matters : ) to complete a PhD in International Psychology with an emphasis in Trauma Interventions. International Psychology is something I am personally interested in as I have lived and traveled throughout the world, and my wife and I may be getting stationed in Fiji or Thailand next.

Unfortunately, online options are my only options if I want to further my education.. which I really, really want to do. Thoughts? I really appreciate any insight you all might have as I feel frustrated with this decision.

Thank you,
Christina

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[CobraMedic]

I don't believe that either of those options will get you to where you want to go at least in the US. Walden's PhD in clinical psychology is not APA accredited http://www.apa.org/ed/accreditation/programs/clinical.aspx. As far as I know ( I could be wrong) you have to go to an APA accredited school to even be eligible to apply for internships. I suppose there might be a state out there that may allow people to practice psychology without going to an APA accredited school I just don't know of any. I also believe that you would not be eligible to participate in the internship match process with a degree in international psychology. The APA has curriculum standards that doctoral level students/trainees/practitioners must have. It is likely that a PhD in international psychology will not meet that criteria. I believe that CSPP's only APA accredited program is the PsyD. http://www.apa.org/ed/accreditation/programs/clinical.aspx

 

[erg923]

NOBODY here is going support/advocate/encourage "online" doctoral studies/training in clinical psychology. It water downs the quality of profession, both because of the lack of rigor in the training model (produces low quality product), and how it makes us look in the eyes of other health professions (perception/reputation). Its an embarrassment. We have a thread like this at least twice a year.

I don't know what a Ph.D. in "international psychology" is (sounds like studying the behavior of various cultures?), or what the purpose of its existence is, but suffice to say that it probably pretty worthless on the job market.

I am a Ph.D. clinical psychologist and also a faculty at a university, so I would like to think that I know what I'm talking about here...🙂

 

[graduatingsoon]

Bottomline, these programs will probably prevent you from ever getting licensed. Without licensure as a psychologist, you cannot practice or see patients independently.

 

[erg923]

I would also add that you do not appear to need a doctorate anyway. You are interested in trauma. Great. You are already a masters level clinician working in the mental health field, no? Paying 150 thousand dollars for a Psy.D gives you WHAT in return, exactly?

 

[CobraMedic]

Also Walden's website should send up red flags:

Note on Licensure

The Clinical Psychology specialization in the Ph.D. in Psychology program is designed to prepare graduates to qualify to sit for psychology licensing exams. This specialization is designed to meet the academic licensure requirements of some state psychology boards. However, Walden University's professional specialization in Clinical Psychology is not accredited by the American Psychological Association (APA) and has not received designation by the Association of State and Provincial Psychology Boards/National Register (ASPPB/NR), which are requirements for licensure in some states. Walden enrollment advisors can provide guidance on licensure issues, state-by-state educational requirements, and internship and practicum requirements; however, it remains the student's responsibility to evaluate and understand the licensure requirements for the state or international location in which he or she intends to work as requirements vary widely. Walden University makes no representation or guarantee that the completion of a degree or coursework for graduate credit will permit the learner to obtain licensure.

Your best course of action is to get licensed and practice at the Masters level.

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

Bottomline, these programs will probably prevent you from ever getting licensed. Without licensure as a psychologist, you cannot practice or see patients independently.

+1. Going to an online school will cost a ton, provide poor training, and it will not allow you to be competitive in the field. It is hard enough to get an internship coming from a mediocre program let alone a non-APA acred online program.

 

[JeyRo]

I am curious though - are there benefits or assistance military wives and spouses can take advantage of to get degrees paid for and to get gainful employment? I guess this thread made me wonder.....

I'm not saying the existence of any such programs necessarily makes an online PhD not a poor choice, though. Might change the calculus somewhat.

 

[cara susanna]

International Psychology? Now they're just making stuff up.

 

[Goobernut]

Also, if you want to work with the military in any way (you didn't state that you did, but a lot of us spouses do like to work with that population) you won't be able to if the program is not APA accredited.

Also, online only schools (esp PhD/PsyD) charge for the privilege of being online. I honestly don't think the amount you go into debt (with no aid) justifies the cost of the education. Especially when the program keeps you from getting licensed in quite a few states. As a military spouse -- you have to make sure your license is moveable.

I decided to put off my goals many times (not super happy about it at the time), but I cannot be happier about how it all worked out. I have $2000 in debt from undergrad, and will hopefully have none from my masters. I ended up on a fantastic regional campus that I was scared to death was going to be a joke. Instead, I got a fabulous education (private school sized classes at state school prices), I'm completing an honors thesis, and I've been accepted to a decent MSW program in the fall. I know sometimes it is horrible to have to sacrifice one more time, but in retrospect sometimes its worth it!!!! If I had finished my undergrad online, I'd be $30,000 in debt just for undergrad -- not many programs service you while overseas and they charge a premium for it.

I see sooo many military members and spouses stop by this board and ask the same question -- and I know why! It's because the military culture encourages it and often accepts these degrees when no one else will. However once you get into the area of having to get your state license, or something clinical, the online schools really don't prepare you.

You deserve to get your degree, but you also deserve to get it correctly and not just settle for something because its available.

(Wow I think all my own issues just came out in that post 😉

Good luck to you, and I hope you find a solution! And heck -- go enjoy Fiji and Thailand!!! I saw so many people worried about "wasting time" while in a foreign country. Enjoy it!! Explore every inch of the country

 

[JeyRo]

Aloha everyone,

I am a military spouse and my wife and I live in Hawaii. I have a Master of Arts in Counseling Psychology and I am currently working in the field. I had been putting of starting a PhD/PsyD until her separation from the military later this year; however, we have recently decided that she will stay in the military for at least 6 more years and possibly retirement. We have no idea where we will be moving next, but we know we will be moving sometime in the next 6 to 18 months.

I am ready and wanting to start my doctoral studies now and I am not willing to put this off for another couple of years. This leaves me with only online programs and I am hoping to gain some insight from all of you...

I have narrowed my options down to two... 1. I can get a clinical psychology PhD from an "online university" and then put in the extra work and struggle to get licensed and employed as a clinical psychologist in whatever state we end up. 2. I can get a psychology PhD in an area I find interesting and worthwhile at a brick and mortar university that offers online and blended modes of attendance and then try to find a career outside of clinical psychology.

For example...

I am already accepted and ready to start (in June) with Walden U. in their clinical psychology PhD program. The downfall is obviously the online university aspect.

Or I can apply to the Chicago School of Professional Psychology (I am originally from Chicago, not that it matters : ) to complete a PhD in International Psychology with an emphasis in Trauma Interventions. International Psychology is something I am personally interested in as I have lived and traveled throughout the world, and my wife and I may be getting stationed in Fiji or Thailand next.

Unfortunately, online options are my only options if I want to further my education.. which I really, really want to do. Thoughts? I really appreciate any insight you all might have as I feel frustrated with this decision.

Thank you,
Christina

Whoops. Of course, if you're a female and your wife is female (as you seem to be indicating in your post?) you may not get access to any spousal benefits at all, as the military probably won't recognize your marriage, I'm guessing.... at least at this point.

 

[Goobernut]

Whoops. Of course, if you're a female and your wife is female (as you seem to be indicating in your post?) you may not get access to any spousal benefits at all, as the military probably won't recognize your marriage, I'm guessing.... at least at this point.

I noticed that and refrained from giving her the long list of services she won't be able to utilize 🙁 I can't wait till they fix this discrepancy.

 

[roubs]

Please take the above advice, we aren't giving it because we are jaded or grizzled*, it is really for your benefit.

*Some people may be jaded and/or grizzled, but that's not the motivation behind the advice :/

 

[JeyRo]

I noticed that and refrained from giving her the long list of services she won't be able to utilize 🙁 I can't wait till they fix this discrepancy.

Well, but like I said, just because the military or the VA might pay for one's near-worthless online mental health degree AND might even find you employment after you obtain it - it still doesn't mean that getting said near-worthless online mental health degree is worth it. Moreover, it's even less of a good idea if these kinds of benefits aren't even available because one isn't in a marriage that's recognized by the state.....

It's just a bad idea all around. If I was the OP, I'd instead work on building my qualifications as a top-notch masters-level practitioner (e.g., through specialized trainings and certifications, etc.), rather than sinking untold amounts of cash tilting at online doctoral windmills.....

 

[Goobernut]

I agree completely with you. What you describe below, is exactly the path I'm trying to take and decided was the best option for multiple reasons. I just hope the OP takes the same advice. I empathize with the OP, because as a military spouse you really get tired of putting your life on hold in so many ways. But I think in the end, she would be doing herself a favor to be patient and wait until her spouse retires or separates to pursue a PhD.

Well, but like I said, just because the military or the VA might pay for one's near-worthless online mental health degree AND might even find you employment after you obtain it - it still doesn't mean that getting said near-worthless online mental health degree is worth it. Moreover, it's even less of a good idea if these kinds of benefits aren't even available because one isn't in a marriage that's recognized by the state.....

It's just a bad idea all around. If I was the OP, I'd instead work on building my qualifications as a top-notch masters-level practitioner (e.g., through specialized trainings and certifications, etc.), rather than sinking untold amounts of cash tilting at online doctoral windmills.....

 

[RainbowBrite769]

Wow... That is quite a lot to take in from everyone. Thanks for the feedback. Interesting that in the field, the opinions I come across about "worthless online doctorates" are quite different and not as severe.

I appreciate the feedback none-the-less. The fact of the matter is, I am a military spouse and do not have the luxury of going to school on campus... Trust me. I wish I could. I have a stellar GPA, high GRE scores, and I love what I do. I have to make the best decision based off of the opportunities I have managed to find.

I am aware that the Walden online clinical psych degree is not ideal. I am surprised to see how many people do not realize that most states do not require a PhD from an APA-accredited university (right or wrong, they don't). Hawaii is one of them. But like you all, my professional opinion of online psych degrees is less than positive... Again... I have to make due with what I have available.

The International Psych (see section 52 of the APA... It is an actual thing) degree is not clinical and I am aware of that. I can practice with my master's at the master's level. The PhD is to further my education in a particular area, which is the point of going back to school... Not prestige, not bragging rights... Learning.

So for the sake of learning, I am choosing to go back to school rather than wait 10 years. And yes... I am a military spouse in a same-sex marriage, not recognized nor supported by the federal government or military. Thanks for the support!

 

[RainbowBrite769]

Oh... And I forgot to add that I have post 9/11 GI Bill benefits, so the government will be funding my education.

And The Chicago School of Professional Psychology offers the International Psych degree on campus and in the online/blended format... So who will be the wiser?

🙂

Christina

 

[erg923]

But like you all, my professional opinion of online psych degrees is less than positive... Again... I have to make due with what I have available.

Well, no...you don't, actually. I think that's the crux of the matter...and why opinions about online Ph.Ds are the way they are. A doctorate is hard. It requires sacrifice. It is not suppsed to be convienent. Get it?

The movement that all educational opportunities should be available to all and at anytime, no matter what else they have going on and dont want to/cant give up, infuses attitudes of entitlement into higher ed that is quite toxic. I see it everyday in my students...at a brick and mortar school

 

[RainbowBrite769]

Yes... I get it. Your opinion (which I personally feel reeks of entitlement) has been "heard" loud and clear. I am not entitled... Far from it. I am a veteran and a spouse with limited access to brick and mortar education, willing to sacrifice that ideal for something less than ideal for the sake of learning and supporting my family.

Next?...

 

[erg923]

Yes... I get it. Your opinion (which I personally feel reeks of entitlement) has been "heard" loud and clear. I am not entitled... Far from it. I am a veteran and a spouse with limited access to brick and mortar education, willing to sacrifice that ideal for something less than ideal for the sake of learning and supporting my family.

Next?...

I didn't say you were. The movement that created online phds is. I do think it spreads though. Subtly. Much the way that narcissism has increased gradually over successive generations. It becomes part of the culture, thus making it less pathological.

I am "entitled" to this opinion, but not much else.

 

[PHD12]

Yes... I get it. Your opinion (which I personally feel reeks of entitlement) has been "heard" loud and clear. I am not entitled... Far from it. I am a veteran and a spouse with limited access to brick and mortar education, willing to sacrifice that ideal for something less than ideal for the sake of learning and supporting my family.

Next?...

If you cannot get licensed as a psychologist from attending this program, then what are you hoping to get out of it?

 

[roubs]

Yes... I get it. Your opinion (which I personally feel reeks of entitlement) has been "heard" loud and clear. I am not entitled... Far from it. I am a veteran and a spouse with limited access to brick and mortar education, willing to sacrifice that ideal for something less than ideal for the sake of learning and supporting my family.

Next?...

I think most of us here genuinely appreciate your circumstances, but why are you prevented from doing the work you want with the counseling degree you have already? We are just pointing out that the cost/benefit of further sub-par education is not going to work out in your favor.

 

[JeyRo]

If you cannot get licensed as a psychologist from attending this program, then what are you hoping to get out of it?

Well, so the Walden degree can lead to licensure, theoretically - although employment would be difficult. The "international psychology" degree would be just for learning, as she said. Either way, apparently the taxpayer is on the hook for the bill, so I suppose the only cost to the OP is opportunity costs....

 

[cara susanna]

Interesting that in the field, the opinions I come across about "worthless online doctorates" are quite different and not as severe.

Most people here are in the field, too. Many are also on internship selection committees, which will be relevant if you pursue a clinical degree at Walden.

 

[edieb]

Oh... And I forgot to add that I have post 9/11 GI Bill benefits, so the government will be funding my education.

And The Chicago School of Professional Psychology offers the International Psych degree on campus and in the online/blended format... So who will be the wiser?

🙂

Christina

Great! So my tax dollars get to fund your worthless degree 😍 No wonder the USA is in financial trouble, just because you want something does not mean you should receive it!

 

[RainbowBrite769]

And this is a forum of mental health professionals? Frightening.

You are absolutely right... Wanting should not always equate to receiving... Which is why I plan on earning my PhD. Kind of how I earned my GI Bill benefits. You are welcome.

 

[JeyRo]

http://articles.latimes.com/2012/jul/16/nation/la-na-vets-colleges-20120716

 

[JeyRo]

And this is a forum of mental health professionals? Frightening.

You are absolutely right... Wanting should not always equate to receiving... Which is why I plan on earning my PhD. Kind of how I earned my GI Bill benefits. You are welcome.

Didn't your spouse earn your GI Bill benefits, technically?

 

[edieb]

And this is a forum of mental health professionals? Frightening.

You are absolutely right... Wanting should not always equate to receiving... Which is why I plan on earning my PhD. Kind of how I earned my GI Bill benefits. You are welcome.

I think what is most frightening is the fact that you cannot reason well even with all the data being given to you! You come on here asking for advice and then slam persons as "entitled" when they try to help you. If this is how you take constructive advice, then you have a long, hard road ahead of you. This is particularly true given that those same "entitled" people are the ones who will be deciding whether you get an accredited internship and a job. Looking at Walden's stats, you probably won't obtain either.

Furthermore, reading your post makes me sad that our society has become so venal as prey on the weak who are willing to do anything to be called "Dr." despite the fact they cannot put for the effort and/ or lack the cognitive resources to attend programs that have admissions requirement above and beyond whether or not you can pay the bill.

Whether or not you "earned" your GI Benefits is a whole new question.

Good luck with your PhD in international psychology😉

 

[erg923]

And this is a forum of mental health professionals? Frightening.

What is frightening here? Honestly?

The fact that current professionals are taking the time to advise would-be students about the realities of higher education, financial ROI on degree programs, reputation of certain schools and degree programs in the current job market?

Yes, this sounds awful...

You're welcome.

 

[roubs]

And this is a forum of mental health professionals? Frightening.

You are absolutely right... Wanting should not always equate to receiving... Which is why I plan on earning my PhD. Kind of how I earned my GI Bill benefits. You are welcome.

What is the track record of people from online programs getting a decent internship (which will of course be unaccredited), or a post-doc? Both are requirements for licensure. Choosing this kind of PhD ensures you are at the very bottom of competitiveness for future jobs; you are unlikely to get an actual return on your investment. You will be viewed as someone with a MA degree who spent an extra 7 years to be as qualified as you were with your MA degree. Today. That is why this is a giant waste of money for you. It's just unfortunate that these institutions benefit from people's lack of planning.

 

[RainbowBrite769]

This is what you all call advice? That's what I fund frightening. I'll be bidding you all adieu while I go work on my reasoning skills. 😉

FYI... Yes. My wife is active duty, but as you all should know, she is not allowed to pass her gi bill benefits to me as the military does not recognize our marriage and therefore does not consider me her dependent. Common sense or even logic might have led you to the conclusion that I am a veteran also.

Have a nice life and thanks for the "advice"... :/

 

[JeyRo]

This is what you all call advice? That's what I fund frightening. I'll be bidding you all adieu while I go work on my reasoning skills. 😉

FYI... Yes. My wife is active duty, but as you all should know, she is not allowed to pass her gi bill benefits to me as the military does not recognize our marriage and therefore does not consider me her dependent. Common sense or even logic might have led you to the conclusion that I am a veteran also.

Have a nice life and thanks for the "advice"... :/

I don't think common sense or logic needed to figure out you were a veteran - I actually think you mentioned you were a veteran a few posts ago, just missed it earlier. Whatever, not the important part of this thread.

The exchange played out in this thread has happened over and over on this forum over the years - it's practically scripted.

It goes like this - new SDN member comes to this forum describing an ill-advised idea to attend an online diploma mill or some professional school with extremely poor outcomes. Said new SDN member comes to the forum ostensibly looking for advice, but really is just looking for validation that what they're contemplating is a good idea. Then, they proceed to actually get *advice*, which is that online diploma mills and professional schools (particularly FSPS) are predatory, have poor outcomes, and hurt the psychology profession. New SDN poster then proceeds to get huffy, accusations of people being "elitist" or whatnot are thrown about, claims of being aghast at what passes for advice around here are proclaimed ("you're all mental health professionals and you tell me this???") and the person storms off, never to be heard again.

I'll be fair - you're in a better position than lots of people contemplating this choice - you wouldn't be liable for (most? any?) of the bills you'd generate doing this kind of thing, as you'd be able to stick the taxpayer with the tab. So, again, your only costs seem likely be opportunity costs - although those costs could be substantial and shouldn't be underestimated. However, it's my understanding that GI Bill benefits are limited in amount. So, when you blow them, they're gone. If you're into learning for learning's sake - there's plenty of ways to do that without exhausting substantial amounts of finite financial resources.

I wanted to address something that is probably driving your anxiety to embark on these kinds of degree programs hastily (which is what unfunded programs and online programs prey on - haste and desperation).... I work with older adults on a daily basis as part of my clinical work. Believe you me on this - you *can* teach the proverbial "old dog new tricks." You don't suddenly lose the ability to attend graduate school just because you're over 40 (or whatever). You would do yourself and your spouse an enormous favor to wait and do this the right way. If you wait a few more years (and build your credentials as a masters level practitioner and possibly the quality of your application to grad schools - which would probably be time much better spent) you would be extremely well positioned to actually spend your GI Bill monies on an education that could deliver you and your family powerful benefits down the line, as opposed to being a waste of time. Or, you might even gain acceptance to a funded program. I'd also consider something like a psych NP program or a psychiatric PA - which would be a powerful combination with your clinical masters degree. Please think about what you're doing.

 

[erg923]

This is what you all call advice? That's what I fund frightening. I'll be bidding you all adieu while I go work on my reasoning skills. 😉

FYI... Yes. My wife is active duty, but as you all should know, she is not allowed to pass her gi bill benefits to me as the military does not recognize our marriage and therefore does not consider me her dependent. Common sense or even logic might have led you to the conclusion that I am a veteran also.

Have a nice life and thanks for the "advice"... :/

So..you did not want to hear honest advice? Is that it? I don't follow.

As a veteran, I am surprised that you would not understand that sometimes advice is blunt and not really what we WANT to hear. But rather, well intentioned suggestions that will take you out of the clouds (I mean, a Ph.D. in "international psychology"...get real) and save you some serious dough? Sometimes the best advice is dont do it.

I have lots of family in the armed forces and cant say that any of them get pissy with blunt advice/conversation. Whats this about? Isn't that the way of the land in the military?

 

[JeyRo]

So..you did not want to hear honest advice? Is that it? I don't follow.

As a veteran, I am surprised that you would not understand that sometimes advice is blunt and not really what we WANT to hear. But rather, well intentioned suggestions that will take you out of the clouds (I mean, a Ph.D. in "international psychology"...get real) and save you some serious dough? Sometimes the best advice is dont do it.

I have lots of family in the armed forces and cant say that any of them get pissy with blunt advice/conversation. Whats this about? Isn't that the way of the land in the military?

Again, that's the pattern that's been repeated here over and over again. Person comes to SDN wanting their choice to go to a bad program validated, under the guise of wanting advice. Mass refusal to validate person's bad choice ensues. Person gets pissed and says we're elitist scumbags and how dare we call ourselves mental health professionals (as if we're here to give unconditional positive regard to bad ideas). Lather, rinse, repeat.

 

[erg923]

Again, that's the pattern that's been repeated here over and over again. Person comes to SDN wanting their choice to go to a bad program validated, under the guise of wanting advice. Mass refusal to validate person's bad choice ensues. Person gets pissed and says we're elitist scumbags and how dare we call ourselves mental health professionals (as if we're here to give unconditional positive regard to bad ideas). Lather, rinse, repeat.

"And you are/want to be/call yourself mental health professionals" does seem to be stands line to expect from these folks. Right, as if psychologists must treat ALL as if they were a patient in the therapy room.

And, good point, even then we don't validate choices that will inevitable conflict with the person's values or goals.

 

[roubs]

More advice would be taken if it was direct, fact-based, but did not strongly imply that the poster is a ***** or idiot. This doesn't require a therapeutic stance, just taking a few drips of condescension and putting them back in the bucket.

 

[JeyRo]

More advice would be taken if it was direct, fact-based, but did not strongly imply that the poster is a ***** or idiot. This doesn't require a therapeutic stance, just taking a few drips of condescension and putting them back in the bucket.

This is also part of the well-worn pattern. After the poster storms out, some soul-searching as to whether we were big meanies takes place.

I'm not sure what could have been said differently without watering down the message.

 

[erg923]

My students think I am a big meanie...usually said playfully.

 

[roubs]

This is also part of the well-worn pattern. After the poster storms out, some soul-searching as to whether we were big meanies takes place.

I'm not sure what could have been said differently without watering down the message.

I usually leave the thread earlier than this, apparently 😛

There are always examples of people being too harsh, but those posters clearly never see it that way which is part of why the pattern is maintained. It should be obvious that the same aspects of an anon forum that allows for unfiltered advice can slip over into being more rude than we'd be in real life (see: basically the whole internet)

 

[penguinbean]

I appreciate the feedback none-the-less. The fact of the matter is, I am a military spouse and do not have the luxury of going to school on campus... Trust me. I wish I could. I have a stellar GPA, high GRE scores, and I love what I do. I have to make the best decision based off of the opportunities I have managed to find.

This is just really not 100% true. I am a military spouse and am currently attending a traditional, well respected program on campus. I am not currently living with my spouse, but he has been able to swing it so he will be here probably by fall (meaning, we'll have lived apart for a year). I actually applied to schools based on my interests/fit and also based on bases he could get to with his job (not probably the best way of picking schools but it worked out). Its totally not a path everyone can or is willing to take, and it has been a sacrifice, but its worth it to both of us in the end.

I also had an MA in counseling before I went back to get my doctorate, so I can relate on that front, too.

I'm just telling you all this, because you can make it work if you really want to, but there are many paths you can find other than getting an expensive degree which may not even get you where you want to be and could put you at a worse place you were before.

Good luck though!

 

[USArmyHPSP]

I'm really hesitant to do this, but I really feel that a couple things need to be said.

First in the defense of the OP, she comes from an environment (no less than three years and probably longer) that encourages online education. Especially for enlisted, it is rammed down their throats that in order to succeed in the military, they need to continue their education through Univ of Phoenix and such. She may have advanced this way, or, at least, watched others. Her experience may say that this is the right path. Remember, the original post asked which of the two choices were best, not should she take online classes or not.

Second, as she has stated, because of her nontraditional lifestyle , she is not considered to be a "dependent". Military members and their family members are afforded more considerations than single members including financial (more pay, health benefits, reduced cost shopping etc.). There is more consideration given with assignments and the length of time of those assignments. Penguinbean, you are to be commended for your sacrifice and the fortitude to continue to pursue your dream and you give very good advice. I thank your husband for his service. I mean that very sincerely. However, you seem to be a dependent and as such are afforded those benefits that the OP may not have should she be separated from her spouse.

Third, JeyRo: Your post last night makes very good points and I agree with the overall theme. I do take offense to the term "you'd be able to stick the taxpayer with the tab". The OP EARNED the GI Bill. She volunteered to do something for a greater cause. If she did this within the past 10 years, she did it at a time when almost 7,000 young people from all over the world have died supporting said cause. She still is doing so by supporting her wife while she is in the military. She EARNED everything and does not deserve a comment that implies she didn't.

Finally, Rainbow: I am intimately aware of what the lower tiered professional schools cost and what they produce. If you are still reading this thread, PLEASE heed the advice to possibly pursue your masters, utilize it until your wife is in a more stable position. You have time and that GI Bill will be there when you can use it for a quality education. Again, thanks for your service.

 

[JeyRo]

I do take offense to the term "you'd be able to stick the taxpayer with the tab". The OP EARNED the GI Bill. She volunteered to do something for a greater cause. If she did this within the past 10 years, she did it at a time when almost 7,000 young people from all over the world have died supporting said cause. She still is doing so by supporting her wife while she is in the military. She EARNED everything and does not deserve a comment that implies she didn't.

So what's your deal? I didn't do enough of the "thank you for your service" thing? That gets tiresome. I work with veterans every day and many of them tell me that's tiresome as well.

As an aside, I stick the taxpayer with the tab for my services on a biweekly basis, whether they like it or not. C'est la vie.

 

[graduatingsoon]

I’m really hesitant to do this, but I really feel that a couple things need to be said.

First in the defense of the OP, she comes from an environment (no less than three years and probably longer) that encourages online education. Especially for enlisted, it is rammed down their throats that in order to succeed in the military, they need to continue their education through Univ of Phoenix and such. She may have advanced this way, or, at least, watched others. Her experience may say that this is the right path. Remember, the original post asked which of the two choices were best, not should she take online classes or not.

I work with and respect veterans as well. I still don't understand why the taxpayer has to foot the bill for these useless sub-par programs. Seems like the government is pushing military folks to get a bunch of potentially useless degrees so that these corporations can continue to profit from us taxpayers. I love how a huge chunk of my taxes are going to fund the military, then pay for useless online for profit universities, and then also pay for the aftermath of these wars.

 

[erg923]

I work with and respect veterans as well. I still don't understand why the taxpayer has to foot the bill for these useless sub-par programs. Seems like the government is pushing military folks to get a bunch of potentially useless degrees so that these corporations can continue to profit from us taxpayers. I love how a huge chunk of my taxes are going to fund the military, then pay for useless online for profit universities, and then also pay for the aftermath of these wars.

My sister in law is in the army (works as a nurse) and the best answer I can give you is that the military is just...well...different. Generally, education is viewed as a means to move-up, improve pay, etc. I think there is little to thought to rigor, (or even pragmatics usage of said education in some cases), in the way that many academics view the subject, by the individuals pursuing it. Hence, online universities are not looked down upon they they often are in the real world.

I find some of the stuff that nurses can do/get away with in the army to be quite frightening.

 

[futureapppsy2]

an environment (no less than three years and probably longer) that encourages online education. Especially for enlisted, it is rammed down their throats that in order to succeed in the military, they need to continue their education through Univ of Phoenix and such.

Just curious, but why is this the case? Does UPhoenix have some sort of relationship with military? Or are enlisted people just targeted heavily by sales reps due to their GI Bills?

 

[JeyRo]

I think you can look at this much like you can look at a lot of the non miltary folks who come through here with credulous attitudes about fly-by-night FSPS schools- either they're vulnerable and being preyed on by a predatory system, or they're willing dupes.

I tend to go for the former, personally. I think with the military, the interests of big corporations get protected and a bunch of impressionable young people get screwed. I respect PEOPLE. I understand why people join the military. It's sad that sometimes they're sold a bill of goods, and this seems to be one example. Check out the article link I posted.

 

[penguinbean]

Second, as she has stated, because of her nontraditional lifestyle , she is not considered to be a "dependent". Military members and their family members are afforded more considerations than single members including financial (more pay, health benefits, reduced cost shopping etc.). There is more consideration given with assignments and the length of time of those assignments. Penguinbean, you are to be commended for your sacrifice and the fortitude to continue to pursue your dream and you give very good advice. I thank your husband for his service. I mean that very sincerely. However, you seem to be a dependent and as such are afforded those benefits that the OP may not have should she be separated from her spouse.

Well, since I, the "dependent," have chosen to separate myself from my "sponsor," (rather than the military separating us) I have no extra benefits awarded to me for being separated from my spouse. If you are aware of some of these "benefits" I should be getting, I'd love to hear them! lol. I understand as a straight couple in general, I have benefits as a "dependent" that she does not, but that is true regardless where she or I live, separated from our spouse or not.

Mostly I wanted to post to encourage her to think more broadly about her options, she can chose whichever way she wants, but there are more routes than just what she proposed.

 

[deleted176373]

I’m really hesitant to do this, but I really feel that a couple things need to be said.

First in the defense of the OP, she comes from an environment (no less than three years and probably longer) that encourages online education. Especially for enlisted, it is rammed down their throats that in order to succeed in the military, they need to continue their education through Univ of Phoenix and such. She may have advanced this way, or, at least, watched others. Her experience may say that this is the right path. Remember, the original post asked which of the two choices were best, not should she take online classes or not.

I would also expect her to be very sensitive to the issues surrounding being a lesbian in the military, women often are subjected to tremendous pressure as a result of their sexuality (regardless of orientation) but it seems to be particularly pronounced for those who are not heterosexual.

The last place that she expected to face any resistance would be from the psychology community. While I know that was not the intent of those sharing their opinion, she has been marginalized enough by a system that simply has not been supportive of Gay, Lesbian, Bisexual, and Transgendered service members. It was pretty clear that when she was discussing the GI Bill, it was because she herself was a veteran.

I do hope that she sticks around, because amongst the noise and personal feelings, there has been some really great advice given.

Mark

 

[JeyRo]

The last place that she expected to face any resistance would be from the psychology community. While I know that was not the intent of those sharing their opinion, she has been marginalized enough by a system that simply has not been supportive of Gay, Lesbian, Bisexual, and Transgendered service members. It was pretty clear that when she was discussing the GI Bill, it was because she herself was a veteran.

Honestly, no. When I first read her post I thought she was the partner in a hetero couple and she was referring to getting spousal benefits. I was confused, apparently, the first couple times I read her posts / threads. Not that I'm saying that was her fault.

I think this is part of the post-storm-out-after-OP-has-been-told-the-hard-truth soul-searching I was referring to earlier. We weren't being overly mean or homophobic with her, seriously. No one called her dumb or said nasty things about being gay. Maybe the delivery was too brusque (I'm looking at you erg) but seriously, I think this is a double-edged sword. Either you spend a lot of time handling people with kid gloves who want their bad choices validated and risk watering down the important advice you're trying to give, or you risk being overly hard-edged with the advice you deliver.