Schools that institute a *strict* numbers cutoff.

[Deuteronomy]

I called UCLA med and a representative told me that students need a 10 minimum on each MCAT subsection and a 3.5 minimum GPA to get through the computer screening. She said the adcom won't even *look* at your essay if you don't meet this requirement.

I called back the next day and *another* person said that they read your essay regardless of your quantitative data. WTF!!

O.K., 1) who's telling the truth? and 2) are there any schools that SDNers are aware of that DO INDEED institute straight computerized cutoffs without reading your essay.

Let's ignore the URM and disadvantaged scenarios for this thread please.. thanks


Deuteronomy

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[Celestron2000]

I would tend to believe in the cut-off.

 

[Brickhouse]

I work at UCLA and took the Kaplan class in Westwood. One of the teachers at that particular Kaplan was a member of the adcomm at UCLA. According to him, they had someone matriculate last year with a 24 on the MCAT. So someone is full of BS, not sure which one.

 

[Brickhouse]

Yes Cel is probably right, this guy was probably just trying to be encouraging - after all, he did tell us this during the pre-MCAT de-stress party. LOL

 

[jlee9531]

thats probably a lie...or else i wouldnt have gotten an interview.

im thinking iowa and ohsu have cutoffs...

a lot of other schools may have "guidelines" to follow...not necessarily a strict cutoffs...but maybe look at applicants with ideal numbers first before they do applicants that dont necessarily meet their "guidelines"

i wouldnt be surprised if many schools did this. i dont like it but it sounds reasonable for adcoms to do.

 

[celticmists18]

I can tell you that at least the part about the MCAT cut-off isn't true. My roomate was asked to fill out a secondary and she did not have above a 10 on every section.

 

[tautomer]

plase tell me that is for out-of-state applicants only. That would stink to be a Cali resident and have such strict cut offs.

 

[Deuteronomy]

thanks for the feedback thus far...and it's encouraging for UCLA at least.

I have been hovering around a 9 on the verbal (on all the practice tests), and I'm worried I may score below 10 on this *particular* section. Darn my ESL background!

If you guys have any other schools on the list besides Iowa + OHSU, I would appreciated it.


Deuteronomy

 

[snapdad]

I've heard that the University of Colorado has one, although I'm not sure what it is. I think ~9 on the verbal would be ok, as I know of people there that got that score.

I'm guessing Rochester may have one as well. They say they "strongly discourage" applicants who don't have double digits on each section of the MCAT.

 

[jlee9531]

Originally posted by frick
That cutoff is probably instituted if you're white/asian.

im asian and i got interviewed with a gpa lower than 3.5.

 

[docmemi]

generally you need at least an 8 on verbal to make computer cutoffs. otherwise you have to be screened by a person at which point they will look at things like clinical experience, other numbers, etc.

 

[edfig99]

i don't know about your case specifically, but some schools do have a computer screen and they choose their secondary application cutoffs...some may go as low as 8s...others double digits. those that aren't computer-screened in at some schools will be automatically rejected. other schools send a secondary to anyone that applied (then they collect your fees and reject you later). others take a random sampling of those rejected by the computer screen and put some people back into the secondary/interview pool. and some schools may look at everyone that didn't screen in, and put some back into the pool. it's pretty variable. i don't think any school REALLY implements a strict numbers cutoff, since much of what makes a student body special is beyond the numbers.

 

[PMED99]

The admissions director for another school told me that if I did not have a 30 on the MCAT and a 3.5 or up that I would get an email that same day rejecting me. He said it firm and right to me in a one on one conversation.

Well, I applied to this out of state school regardless of what he said and I got a secondary and was put into the interview pool. I know its not much to get a secondary but they do limit number of secondaries.

I think its a stupid thing for him to say that to me if it was not true. I would not be surprised if other schools say similar things.

 

[shawred]

There probably aren't many schools (if any) that have strict cutoffs. Lets assume you have a 15 in PhySci, a 15 in BioSci, and a 7 in verbal. It would be stupid to cut that person out based on that one section alone.

 

[jtn]

Originally posted by docmemi
generally you need at least an 8 on verbal to make computer cutoffs. otherwise you have to be screened by a person at which point they will look at things like clinical experience, other numbers, etc.

I agree.

As long as you get a 8 or higher in verbal and double digits in the sciences, you'll be ok.

If you have these MCAT scores, your application will be strong as steel if you also have a 3.75 or above GPA, extremely strong recommendations, and clinical, research, and teaching experiences.

Remember, it's the whole package they're looking at. If you can't improve on your MCAT...then put your energy to improve other areas of your application (essay<---very very important, recommendation letters, experiences, etc.). Think about it, when you go to buy a car, you usually don't buy it just because it has the best cup holder. Your decision to buy is based on many more features on the car.

My advice it to DIVERSIFY! It works in the financial world and works like a charm when applying to medical school. Don't put all your gold in one pot. Diversify your energy and make sure every part of your application is strong. If you spend to much time working on one part, other parts of the application will suffer. Goodluck. jtn.

 

[boomuntilnoon]

At UT-Memphis as an out-of-state applicant, you must have at least a 10-10-10 on the MCAT to be considered .

 

[ForceField]

For U-Iowa out-of-state applicants, you must have 10B, 9P, 9V, minimum to be interviewed. Ultimately for some schools, yes, there are number cut-offs for certain categories of applicants, but there will always be exceptions for a select few.

 

[louren]

I interviewed out-of-state at Univ of Iowa with numbers less than those. Waitlisted, though, so maybe my numbers killed me after all...

Not an URM.

 

[TheFlash]

NYU has been known to have a pretty strict cut-off for non-URM applicants to determine if they want you to interview.

 

[Tritonslo]

So here is a document I picked up on SDN a while ago explaining how the admission process works at Stanford(2001 admissions Annual Report). I feel like most schools have a similar process where they put you into a computer program and screen you first. Those with great numbers get secondaries, bad numbers rejected and those who are in the middle get evaluated more closely for signs of extracurricular achievement.

I talked to the assistant Dean of Admissions at BU and found that the process there is similar. They have a numbers screen, 30 MCAT, 3.5 GPA. Those above that cutoff get their essay and activities read and based on those are offered interviews. She did say, however, that there is a small group of committee members that shuffles through the "borderline" candidates and those with skewed scores(like a 37 MCAT, 3.3 GPA).

I know it sounds unfair that your application doesn't even get read if you have really low numbers but with 9000 applications I guess its necessary. I wish schools would be straight with applicants about their admissions processes. That way a lot of applicants wouldn't have to spend a 100 bucks for a computer scan and subsequent rejection letter.

 

[krichan]

anyone know which mcat scores they screen if you 've taken it more than once?

 

[LP1CW]

How Can a 30 be the Cutoff at BU when their average is below 30? The math doesn't work out.

 

[apar01]

One of the Deans of Admission from UT Southwestern came to my school and said that for Texas residents, to guarantee an interview you need a 3.5 GPA and 31 MCAT. For out of state, it was more like 3.7/33.

 

[medic8m]

Originally posted by docmemi
generally you need at least an 8 on verbal to make computer cutoffs. otherwise you have to be screened by a person at which point they will look at things like clinical experience, other numbers, etc.

I know someone who matriculated at UCLA and interviewed at UCSF who got a 7 on verbal. (Cali resident)

 

[Tritonslo]

I believe there are two reasons why the average MCAT for BU is below 30 even after the presumed cutoff.

The first is the fact that roughly 30-40 spots out of the 160 at BU go to students in the masters program there. The average MCAT for those students is less than 30, more like 26-27.

The second reason is due to affirmative action. The average MCAT of underrepresented minorities is much less than 30.

I'm willing to bet that the average non-masters student, non-under-represented minority MCAT average is more like 31-32. When you factor in everyone the average goes down to 29 or so.

Its interesting to note that BU's selection rank in the U.S news and world report is 73 even though they are ranked 40 overall. I'm guessing this is due to the multiple pathways into their program.

 

[krichan]

Tritonslo,

Do you know where the person who posted the Stanford annual admissions report found it? I'm wondering whether one can find similar info for each school on the web. That would save me so much trouble.

 

[exmike]

I know someone who matriculated at UCLA and interviewed at UCSF who got a 7 on verbal. (Cali resident)

I know a cali resident that matriculated at UCSF with a 2.9, and was not URM.

 

[Fixed Gear]

It would be awesome if schools were more up front about these numbers and cutoffs. Obviously, it would help applicants save a lot of money if we knew there were schools that wouldn't even get to the rest of our application if we didn't meet a numerical criteria based on our GPA/MCATs. For me personally, that would be a huge help if I knew this since (if I do choose to apply) my Ugrad GPA is like a 3.1 (low) but I'll have a PhD from (what I consider to be) an excellent school and will have a fantastic graduate GPA, tons of teaching, tutoring and community service work as well as (hopefully) a bunch of publications (My PI said I can graduate once I have 2+ middle author AND 2+ first author pubs).

But ultimately, I can't see schools going for it- they'd lose money and their applicant pool would shrink. Two things most schools would be unhappy about.

 

[SailCrazy]

I think that the point of many of these posts was to explain that there is not a strict cutoff at most schools!

It would be awesome if schools were more up front about these numbers and cutoffs. Obviously, it would help applicants save a lot of money if we knew there were schools that wouldn't even get to the rest of our application if we didn't meet a numerical criteria based on our GPA/MCATs. For me personally, that would be a huge help if I knew this since (if I do choose to apply) my Ugrad GPA is like a 3.1 (low) but I'll have a PhD from (what I consider to be) an excellent school and will have a fantastic graduate GPA, tons of teaching, tutoring and community service work as well as (hopefully) a bunch of publications (My PI said I can graduate once I have 2+ middle author AND 2+ first author pubs).

But ultimately, I can't see schools going for it- they'd lose money and their applicant pool would shrink. Two things most schools would be unhappy about.

 

[jlee9531]

I think that the point of many of these posts was to explain that there is not a strict cutoff at most schools!

exactly!

there are only a few schools like iowa that for sure have strict cutoffs.

 

[deejayshakur]

i'm very underwhelmed with UCLA's admissions office.

i'm an undergrad here, and i went in three times last week to speak with an admission officer, asking how they determine the 1 year math requirement when you apply. i won't get into detail, but basically, i got 3 different responses from 2 people. i talked to the same person the 1st and 3rd times. each time i went in, they seemed like they would rather be doing anything else but talking to me.

the OP's experience just confirms their ******edness. makes me wonder if i should even waste money applying here.

 

[jlee9531]

i'm very underwhelmed with UCLA's admissions office.

i'm an undergrad here, and i went in three times last week to speak with an admission officer, asking how they determine the 1 year math requirement when you apply. i won't get into detail, but basically, i got 3 different responses from 2 people. i talked to the same person the 1st and 3rd times. each time i went in, they seemed like they would rather be doing anything else but talking to me.

the OP's experience just confirms their ******edness. makes me wonder if i should even waste money applying here.

yes you should. this type of annoyance and frustration exists on all levels and in all different kind of fields. doesnt mean you shouldnt apply man. ask if you can see a person higher up in the chain.

oh and dont forget to take statistics too.

 

[derf]

I'm also a UCLA student. I asked UCLA if I can waive out of taking statistics since i'm an EE major (took 7 math courses plus probability). They were like absolutely, no problem! Then I called a week later and asked the same question and they were like No WAY, NO Exceptions to the rule...You're not special! WTF!

 

[scootad.]

After having gone through the process and now in medical school my best advice is not to pay attention to these silly requirements. Beyond the obvious premed requirements (bio, chem, orgo, physics, calc) take whatever courses you will enjoy most. Even schools that "say" they require biochem, statistics whatever do not really enforce this and like you guys say you will get 4 different answers from 3 different people from the same school. Its ridiculous. For instance, i never took biochem even though the school i currently attend says it "requires" it in the AAMC book. Needless to say they accepted me anyway and it was never an issue.

 

[AD2020]

I've heard that some schools have a cutoff based on (GPA)*(MCAT score)*(school weight), where the school weight is their subjective weight of the difficulty of your undergraduate institution.

 

[Blade28]

Wow, wish I had known about all this back when I was applying to med school. I didn't know they had screening cut-offs, like some residency programs!

 

[choocoman]

thats probably a lie...or else i wouldnt have gotten an interview.

im thinking iowa and ohsu have cutoffs...

a lot of other schools may have "guidelines" to follow...not necessarily a strict cutoffs...but maybe look at applicants with ideal numbers first before they do applicants that dont necessarily meet their "guidelines"

i wouldnt be surprised if many schools did this. i dont like it but it sounds reasonable for adcoms to do.

you got an interview. did you get in?

 

[Cerbernator]

it would seem my MCAT is my kiss of death

 

[Pinkertinkle]

So do any American schools include writing sample in their screens? Aside from that forsaken Arizona.

 

[Jason110]

there are only a few schools like iowa that for sure have strict cutoffs.

Two schools I know of have VERY, VERY strict cut-offs:

University of Miami
http://www.miami.edu/UMH/CDA/UMH_Main/0,1770,2600-1;14190-2;27122-3,00.html

Secondary Application

"The AMCAS application is used to identify applicants about whom the Committee on Admissions would like more information. These applicants will be invited to complete a Supplementary (Secondary) Application. To be invited to complete a secondary application, Florida residents must have either 1) an undergraduate cumulative GPA of at least 3.2, or 2) a post-bac or graduate cumulative GPA of at least 3.5 (minimum of 15 credits). Residents of other states must have an undergraduate GPA of at least 3.6."


University of Utah
http://uuhsc.utah.edu/som/admissions/brochure.html#APP
They even have requirements for the number of "patient contact hours" and "shadowing hours".

 

[Code Brown]

Creighton specifically states that no one with a sub-3.2 GPA should apply.

 

[choocoman]

it would seem my MCAT is my kiss of death

your 29 isnt that bad, its just average or below average for the schools you want to attend.

 

[WillHague007]

I would agree with that cutoff of an 8 for UCLA, for OUT OF STATE RESIDENTS...I mean, there are only like 10 kids from out of state at UCLA each year so those kids have to be the best of the best of the best to get in....just my 2 cents