Science VS Non-science majors

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IvyHopeful20 said:
99% of undergrad science is regurgitation and no critical thinking. If you memorize every step of every reaction and some simple rules, or do every physics problems, you will do well in the class. Period. People throw a hissy fit if there is a problem on the exam that's unlike the homework problems.
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Science is a interesting subject, it's part memorization but also clearly part applying concepts that you learn to novel situations and the like.

All the science classes i've taken with the exception of biology *i'm a chem/bio major* Has forced me to apply the concepts I learned to different problems.

99% is memorization is an extreme statement.

On the other hand I do not believe that a person who knows science is more intelligent than someone else who doesn't, intelligence is relative.
 
iwantMD said:
He’s climbing in your windows
He’s snatchin your people up
Tryna out smart em so y’all need to
Hide your kids, hide your wife
Hide your kids, hide your wife
Hide your kids, hide your wife
And hide your husband
Cuz they’re out smartin errbody out there
You don’t have to come and confess
We’re lookin for you
We gon find you
We gon find you
So you can run and tell that,
Run and tell that
Run and tell that, homeboy
Home, home, homeboy We got your t-shirt
You done left fingerprints and all
You are so smart
You are really smart–for real
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👍:laugh::laugh:
 
IvyHopeful20 said:
Muahah @ memorizing biology = intelligence.

I'm not a science major (major was math). Love the pre-med superiority complex. The ability to analyze arguments, philosophies, etc is a much better sign of intelligence in my mind than memorizing the Kreb's Cycle.
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If that's the extent of what you do in cell bio good luck doing well in that class
 
Actually, iWantMD would be interested to know that the non science GPA and total GPA for bio majors are higher than every other major defined by AAMC. On the other hand, their sGPA is lower than both Math and Physical Science majors. Like I said before, it's the MCAT that makes the difference here. Bio majors have a lower PS MCAT average than humanities majors and a lower average VR MCAT score than every other defined major with the exception of health sciences.

http://www.aamc.org/data/facts/applicantmatriculant/table18-facts09mcatgpabymaj1-web.pdf
 
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serenade said:
Change it if you like analyzing concepts and logic. If you don't then I don't recommend it because you would likely do better in a biology major then a philosophy major. Like others have said, non-science majors get accepted more because they like their subject and thus can do well in it.
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I mean i like Philosophy, i choose Physilogy and Neurobiology(PNB) coz in my college this major has a very broad research area, and i didn't knew what else to pick. The other reason was that my friend who went to the same school and is a junior now recommended PNB as a major coz according to him PNB will help me a lot for the preparation of MCATs, as we have to take genetics and biochem as a requirement for this major.

But i am thinking of changing my major to Philosophy, or sociology, but again as i said earlier i am afraid that if taking non-science major will hurt me on MCATs?
 
wristbandMD said:
I'm not at all saying that science majors are easier/harder. I was agreeing that non-sciences require more critical thinking. In fact, science is much harder for me than any non-science class I've ever taken. But I still believe that non-sciences require more critical thinking.
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I have to agree.

Just look at exam period for instance, how many science students have open book exams for every single class? I can't count a single one. The reason is that a lot of science is theory and derivations and formulas, so exams test for their knowledge of the content. Engineers on the other hand, have mostly open book exams because the exams test their ability to THINK CRITICALLY, RELATE and APPLY concepts rather than regurgitating what was taught in class.

The Arts are a whole different story - just because they have no formulas to memorize or numbers to crunch, it doesn't mean they can't think critically. In fact, a lot of history and other social science classes call upon your ability to analyze, see the links and draw conclusions. If it didn't, I think History PhDs would have long since to exist 😛 how many novel ideas and concepts can you bring to something that already happened?

Without any ability to analyze?

ZERO
 
As for the topic at hand, I can only speak from my experience. Having majored in both a science and a non-science I think I see both sides of this issue pretty clearly. IMO, it is all just regurgitation.

In a philosophy class, you apply an ethical system that you memorized the details of to a specific situation. In econ, you apply a model that you memorized to a certain set of parameters and chug out the result. In chem, you apply specific reaction rules to an array of reactions.

In all cases, the basic rules do not change, you only apply them to new problems/situations. I really think the only difference btw science and non-science is the extent to which this is masked by the problems.
 
XeReX said:
I mean i like Philosophy, i choose Physilogy and Neurobiology(PNB) coz in my college this major has a very broad research area, and i didn't knew what else to pick. The other reason was that my friend who went to the same school and is a junior now recommended PNB as a major coz according to him PNB will help me a lot for the preparation of MCATs, as we have to take genetics and biochem as a requirement for this major.

But i am thinking of changing my major to Philosophy, or sociology, but again as i said earlier i am afraid that if taking non-science major will hurt me on MCATs?
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So you want to major in something so you can take 2 classes? Hello? Dear I'm majoring in psychology and doing that + genetics, biochemisty 1-2, immunology, microbiology, A&P 1+2, cell biology ( maybe). Along with all of my psychology classes. I'm having pretty good fun honestly. Again, doing genetics won't help you on the mcat, nor will doing biochem. This is because you can get all of the topics like those in reading a mcat prep book for 2 weeks.
Totally not worth it. Do what you want to do.

2 questions.
1. Are you doing to University of maryland.
2. Does the username Kirotaan mean anything to you?
 
LuciusVorenus said:
Actually, iWantMD would be interested to know that the non science GPA and total GPA for bio majors are higher than every other major defined by AAMC. On the other hand, their sGPA is lower than both Math and Physical Science majors. Like I said before, it's the MCAT that makes the difference here. Bio majors have a lower PS MCAT average than humanities majors and a lower average VR MCAT score than every other defined major with the exception of health sciences.

http://www.aamc.org/data/facts/applicantmatriculant/table18-facts09mcatgpabymaj1-web.pdf
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Dude are you serious. Nonsicence GPA for all major is approximately the same. So bio majors have .01 GPA higher than humanities major in non science. BIG DEAL. Compare the science GPA vs non science GPA FOR ALL MAJOR. Thank you for posting this. Because you just made my argument stronger.
 
iwantMD said:
Dude are you serious. Nonsicence GPA for all major is approximately the same. So bio majors have .01 GPA higher than humanities major in non science. BIG DEAL. Compare the science GPA vs non science GPA FOR ALL MAJOR. Thank you for posting this. Because you just made my argument stronger.
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Can you stop attempting to rationalize your life? Ok we get it you're a biology major and want to believe you made a good choice. Ok you did, it was your choice and you made it. Now go forth and profit.
 
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serenade said:
Can you stop attempting to rationalize your life? Ok we get it you're a biology major and want to believe you made a good choice. Ok you did, it was your choice and you made it. Now go forth and profit.
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Let that anger out. How dare he? I just want you to know I am here for you.
 
serenade said:
Can you stop attempting to rationalize your life? Ok we get it you're a biology major and want to believe you made a good choice. Ok you did, it was your choice and you made it. Now go forth and profit.
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lollers.jpg
 
serenade said:
So you want to major in something so you can take 2 classes? Hello? Dear I'm majoring in psychology and doing that + genetics, biochemisty 1-2, immunology, microbiology, A&P 1+2, cell biology ( maybe). Along with all of my psychology classes. I'm having pretty good fun honestly. Again, doing genetics won't help you on the mcat, nor will doing biochem. This is because you can get all of the topics like those in reading a mcat prep book for 2 weeks.
Totally not worth it. Do what you want to do.

2 questions.
1. Are you doing to University of maryland.
2. Does the username Kirotaan mean anything to you?
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Yeah i am gonna go with Philosophy as my major.

No i am Not going to Univ of Maryland, and the user name Kirotaan doesn't ring any bells. Why did u asked?
 
XeReX said:
Yeah i am gonna go with Philosophy as my major.

No i am Not going to Univ of Maryland, and the user name Kirotaan doesn't ring any bells. Why did u asked?
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I knew another Xerex once upon a time.
 
iwantMD said:
Dude are you serious. Nonsicence GPA for all major is approximately the same. So bio majors have .01 GPA higher than humanities major in non science. BIG DEAL. Compare the science GPA vs non science GPA FOR ALL MAJOR. Thank you for posting this. Because you just made my argument stronger.
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You missed the point. How do you explain bio majors getting lower MCAT scores than basically every other major on the list? Of course the total GPA is higher than the sGPA, the total GPA includes all the crap GE classes you take to purposely RAISE your GPA. Intro to psych =/= upper div psych. Do you really have that hard of a time understanding that? Or are you seriously going to stand there and tell me that biology is a harder major than EECS/CEMS/BioE/MAE because those majors are considered non-science 🙄.
 
I'm biased but I'm going to say my major is the hardest! 🙂


Also, math majors with the highest overall MCAT out of all the majors. REPRESENT!!!!! 😀






 I'm going to ignore the low statistical sample size because I'm cool like that.
 
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LuciusVorenus said:
You missed the point. How do you explain bio majors getting lower MCAT scores than basically every other major on the list? Of course the total GPA is higher than the sGPA, the total GPA includes all the crap GE classes you take to purposely RAISE your GPA. Intro to psych =/= upper div psych. Do you really have that hard of a time understanding that? Or are you seriously going to stand there and tell me that biology is a harder major than EECS/CEMS/BioE/MAE because those majors are considered non-science 🙄.
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I have no idea what you are talking about but I ll try my best to reiterate my point in case you were too slow to absorb.

That paper has clearly shown that no matter what major you are, average sGPA is far lower than average nonscience GPA. If upper level nonscience classes are so much harder, why is nonsciecne GPA higher than science GPA? Point is simple. Now I have no idea why you are talking about cGPA, MCAT, and naming some courses that I have never heard about. If you think you are being smart, you are not. Stop making it complicated. I don't know what the hell you do not understand about this.
 
IvyHopeful20 said:
I'm biased but I'm going to say my major is the hardest! 🙂


Also, math majors with the highest overall MCAT out of all the majors. REPRESENT!!!!! 😀






 I'm going to ignore the low statistical sample size because I'm cool like that.
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The hardest part of the engineering majors at my school is the 6 classes of calc/linear algebra we have to take. So props to anyone who does 4 whole years of it. We're perfectly content with stealing your ideas for our major 😛

iwantMD said:
I have no idea what you are talking about but I ll try my best to reiterate my point in case you were too slow to absorb.

That paper has clearly shown that no matter what major you are, average sGPA is far lower than average nonscience GPA. If upper level nonscience classes are so much harder, why is nonsciecne GPA higher than science GPA? Point is simple. Now I have no idea why you are talking about cGPA, MCAT, and naming some courses that I have never heard about. If you think you are being smart, you are not. Stop making it complicated. I don't know what the hell you do not understand about this.
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I'll repost it for you since you're so dense. I'll even throw in a hint!
"You missed the point. How do you explain bio majors getting lower MCAT scores than basically every other major on the list? Of course the total GPA is higher than the sGPA, the total GPA includes all the crap GE classes you take to purposely RAISE your GPA. Intro to psych =/= upper div psych. Do you really have that hard of a time understanding that? Or are you seriously going to stand there and tell me that biology is a harder major than EECS/CEMS/BioE/MAE because those majors are considered non-science."

The non-science GPA is artificially higher. Those "classes you've never heard of" are engineering majors...

You're really not helping the "bio majors do poorly on MCAT reading comprehension questions" stereotype are you?
 
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LuciusVorenus said:
The hardest part of the engineering majors at my school is the 6 classes of calc/linear algebra we have to take. So props to anyone who does 4 whole years of it. We're perfectly content with stealing your ideas for our major 😛




I'll repost it for you since you're so dense. I'll even throw in a hint!
"You missed the point. How do you explain bio majors getting lower MCAT scores than basically every other major on the list? Of course the total GPA is higher than the sGPA, the total GPA includes all the crap GE classes you take to purposely RAISE your GPA. Intro to psych =/= upper div psych. Do you really have that hard of a time understanding that? Or are you seriously going to stand there and tell me that biology is a harder major than EECS/CEMS/BioE/MAE because those majors are considered non-science."

You're really not helping the "bio majors do poorly on MCAT reading comprehension questions" stereotype are you?
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Sigh... I had hope for this guy.

MCAT difference is insignificant. And for the fourth time I am going to tell you I am comparing non science vs science. My argument would be invalid if I compared cGPA.

Do you see anyone in here arguing back? Because most people are sensible enough to understand this fact. This is for the third time I am going to tell you that average science GPA is far lower than average non science GPA regardless of major. Therefore, science classes are harder. SIMPLE. if this guy can not understand this simple fact, there is no way this guy is making to medical school.
 
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iwantMD said:
Sigh... I had hope for this guy.

MCAT difference is insignificant. And for the fourth time I am going to tell you I am comparing non science vs science. My argument would be invalid if I compared cGPA.

Do you see anyone in here arguing back? This is for the third time I am going to tell you that average science GPA is far lower than average non science GPA regardless of major. Therefore, science classes are harder. SIMPLE. if this guy can not understand this simple fact, there is no way this guy is making to medical school.
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Nobody is arguing with you because you're so dense it's aggravating.

I could care less that the non-science gpa is higher than the science gpa, because the standard deviation is huge and we aren't even sure if it's statistically significant, and as I've already said, GE classes all fall under non-science and premeds purposely pick GE classes that raise their GPA, regardless of major, artificially increasing the non-science gpa. But let's assume the data does show statistically significant averages, then why is the MCAT difference insignificant. Your argument earlier on was that you were more intelligent that non-science majors because you're majoring in biology. If bio majors have more critical thinking skills/are generally more intelligent, then why do they score lower on the MCAT when compared to every other major? Or did you abandon that part of your argument 😛.

Would you say electrical engineering is a harder major than biology? If yes, then your argument fails because all engineering majors are considered non-science. If no, then I'll just have to forget I ever talked to you.

Also, 🤣 at Burnett's Law because people don't think you're a genius for majoring in what 50% of premeds major in.
 
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LuciusVorenus said:
Would you say electrical engineering is a harder major than biology?

Also, 🤣 at Burnett's Law.
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First, I consider all engineering classes as science even though AMCAS may consider them nonscience.

Second, I have not taken electrical engineering classes so I do not know if they are harder. But giving example of this one major is not going to prove anything.

Third, if by this time you fail to understand that science classes are harder than non science classes, I am not going to reply. You are old enough to understand simple logic. If not, you are free to embarrass your self. I am done with you.

Peace
 
iwantMD said:
First, I consider all engineering classes as science even though AMCAS may consider them nonscience.

Second, I have not taken electrical engineering classes so I do not know if they are harder. But giving example of this one major is not going to prove anything.

Third, if by this time you fail to understand that science classes are harder than non science classes, I am not going to reply. You are old enough to understand simple logic. If not, you are free to embarrass your self. I am done with you.

Peace
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Do you see the problem with your argument now? My major is known to be harder than your major, therefore I am smarter than you. Doesn't seem fair when you're on the receiving end does it?

EDIT: Thank you for my 1000th post 🙂
 
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LOL @ everyone taking iwantMD seriously. Most obvious troll since Tompi, guys.

In terms of the argument, good GPAs are hard to maintain regardless of what your major is. I had a low GPA for my first year or two at college (long story) and I'm working really hard to improve it now. I've found it requires as much effort and thought to get an A in "Archaeological Method and Theory" as it does for "Theory on Japanese Representation" and Organic Chemistry.

Just pick something you like and can talk about; nothing says "I picked my major to look good on applications" like that long "ummmmmm" when you're asked why you selected a particular field of study.
 
Janieve said:
LOL @ everyone taking iwantMD seriously. Most obvious troll since Tompi, guys.

In terms of the argument, good GPAs are hard to maintain regardless of what your major is. I had a low GPA for my first year or two at college (long story) and I'm working really hard to improve it now. I've found it requires as much effort and thought to get an A in "Archaeological Method and Theory" as it does for "Theory on Japanese Representation" and Organic Chemistry.

Just pick something you like and can talk about; nothing says "I picked my major to look good on applications" like that long "ummmmmm" when you're asked why you selected a particular field of study.
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Right on girl. You go girl. Let that anger out. Want a hug?
 
iwantMD said:
Right on girl. You go girl. Let that anger out. Want a hug?
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Hahaha. Not angry. Amused.

I'd love a hug, but not from you. I hear trolls have spikes, and I'm fresh out of bandaids today. Maybe I could get one from serenade or IvyHopeful20.
 
Janieve said:
Hahaha. Not angry. Amused.

I'd love a hug, but not from you. I hear trolls have spikes, and I'm fresh out of bandaids today. Maybe I could get one from serenade or IvyHopeful20.
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*Hug* 🙂
 
Janieve said:
Hahaha. Not angry. Amused.

I'd love a hug, but not from you. I hear trolls have spikes, and I'm fresh out of bandaids today. Maybe I could get one from serenade or IvyHopeful20.
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Yea, may be you could open up little bit more and really let him in.
 
IvyHopeful20 said:
I'm biased but I'm going to say my major is the hardest! 🙂


Also, math majors with the highest overall MCAT out of all the majors. REPRESENT!!!!! 😀






 I'm going to ignore the low statistical sample size because I'm cool like that.
Click to expand...


I envy you. Anyone that can do four years of math is a saint in my book. Haha. I couldn't imagine going past the required Calc classes 😛
 
MM88 said:
I have to agree.

Just look at exam period for instance, how many science students have open book exams for every single class? I can't count a single one.
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This is a really good point. I've had open exams in a science and a non-science class, and was obviously excited when I heard the news. The open exam in my Chem class? Easy peasy pumpkin pie! All I had to do was copy statements from the book. Even on conceptual questions, the answers where right there. However, the open exam in my philosophy class did nothing for me! I spent the first ten minutes looking for answers only to realize that I couldn't copy the answers...I had to think for myself! 😱
 
wristbandMD said:
This is a really good point. I've had open exams in a science and a non-science class, and was obviously excited when I heard the news. The open exam in my Chem class? Easy peasy pumpkin pie! All I had to do was copy statements from the book. Even on conceptual questions, the answers where right there. However, the open exam in my philosophy class did nothing for me! I spent the first ten minutes looking for answers only to realize that I couldn't copy the answers...I had to think for myself! 😱
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A philosophy class is one where you take things you learned from day one and continue to build up and build up in an advanced hierarchy and eventually apply to real life. So for a humanities class open book won't help because you'll be looking through the whole book for the answers. In a science class you'll look through a chapter to find a equation applied or a diagram of a Eukaryotic cell.
Philosophy in itself is a field of deep thinking, asking why skeptically and then figuring out personal reasons for why you support your opinion. In science classes in undergrad ( In graduate programs your actually researching answers) you just read the answer to why and then memorize it. While that doesn't make sciences weaker then humanities. This does however make humanities classes a little bit more interesting and flavorful for most people.
 
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