Seeking for advice for a failed reapplicant (Be as harsh as you can, I am not here to look for comfort)

[Mr. Smith_Jones]

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Good morning. My fellow studentdoctor.net comrades. I would like to have some advice from you. I am a 2019 US DO graduate. I failed to match into a residency program last year. I failed to match and soap into a FM, IM, transitional year, and medicine preliminary medicine this cycle too. I need some advice and insights. I only have comlex scores and never attempted USMLE in the past. I passed my comlex level 1 with 486 on the second attempt, level 2 with 442 on the first attempt, comlex PE (equivalent to usmle cs) on my 3rd attempt. I know I have so many red flags with my exams. After finishing medical school last year, i could not find a residency spot and started to work as a medical assistant just to stay clinically related in the past 8 months. I really need some advice to boost my application for the next cycle in case if I do not find anything this year. After this cycle, it feels like my comlex scores are not as sufficient, especially after the merger. I am planning to study hard and sit for usmle step 1 and 2. Do you think it will be beneficial for my application for the next year if I do well on it? Also for clinical experience, what kind of jobs I should do to make my application look better for the next cycle. Any other advice is deeply appreciated as well. Thank you.

 

[Dral]

Minor point, but advise does not have a plural form (’advices’ is not a word).

I think if you pass the usmle steps with better than average scores, you will have a pretty good chance next time around. pass all of them the first time. This is your chance to redeem yourself.

pass all of them the first time.

oh, I did I mention you have to pass all of them the first time?

nose to the grind. Utilize all the study materials people typically use now.

 

[Mr. Smith_Jones]

Minor point, but advise does not have a plural form (’advices’ is not a word).

I think if you pass the usmle steps with better than average scores, you will have a pretty good chance next time around. pass all of them the first time. This is your chance to redeem yourself.

pass all of them the first time.

oh, I did I mention you have to pass all of them the first time?

nose to the grind. Utilize all the study materials people typically use now.

Thank you for your reply, I took your suggestion and fixed the plural form of "advices".
Thanks for confirming that USMLE step 1 and 2 are my chance to redeem myself and improve my application for the next cycle. I truly appreciate your advice. I will contact my school's dean to obtain permission to sit for USMLE now. If you have any other suggestions, please comment below.

 

[deleted480308]

Tell us about how your application strategy went both times , does your school have any residencies that you might be able to talk to?

 

[Dral]

Make sure you take CS very seriously. I’m not sure if you can, but see if there is any way you can get some real time practice for it.

 

[ThoracicGuy]

With step 1 going pass fail, would it be better to focus on step 2ck?

 

[Mr. Smith_Jones]

Tell us about how your application strategy went both times , does your school have any residencies that you might be able to talk to?

The first time I applied, I was still in med school. I applied to mainly FM and IM residency programs in big cities or programs close to New York. I did not participate in the acgme match. I only did AOA match and landed 5 interviews. I had difficulty with passing my comlex pe, mainly due to stage anxiety and failed humanistic portions the first 2 times. My school did not allow me to take the 3rd time until I took the prep course at WV School of Osteopathic Medicine in May. The PE score came out at the beginning of July. So, the PE really held me back for the AOA match. I participated in the acgme soap after the AOA match and soap concluded but did not soap into anything.

This time: I applied broadly to IM, FM, Transitional Years, Medicine Prelim. Mainly FM programs. Over 100 applications were submitted at the beginning of the cycle and only landed 2 interviews. I thought I performed well for the interviews and followed up with each interview and even sent out letter of intentions 10 days before the ranking. I did not match most likely because I did not have enough interviews and multiple failures on my boards. For soap, I submitted 45 applications to those programs which have the most spots and also rural areas broadly. After soap, I called and emailed unfilled spots but most of the programs did not answer calls or respond to my email. I also submitted myeras to some of the programs that responded to my email.

 

[DokterMom]

With step 1 going pass fail, would it be better to focus on step 2ck?

I'm thinking a numerical score would be a distinct plus, otherwise the assumption is likely to be 'barely passed' given the OP's difficult testing history.

My suggestion would be to concentrate your efforts on networking and building interpersonal connections. ON PAPER, your qualifications are very weak, but IN PERSON, you are likely to do much better. IMO, what you need is for people who know you and have worked with you to go to bat for you with other people they know. Look at the places and kinds of places that have unfilled spots, and if you can't find a residency spot there now, find another opportunity nearby so you can make yourself known to people who will be in a position to support your candidacy.

Guess what I'm saying is to develop a proactive strategy and from there, a plan. Then work that plan! It's worked out for people in the past. Reacting in a scattershot fashion by applying to everything you see is unlikely to pan out.

 

[Mr. Smith_Jones]

With step 1 going pass fail, would it be better to focus on step 2ck?

Is it the pass/fail for step 1 not going to be effective until 1/1/2022? You would suggest me to focus on step 2 CK even I reapply next year.

 

[Piebaldi]

The first time I applied, I was still in med school. I applied to mainly FM and IM residency programs in big cities or programs close to New York. I did not participate in the acgme match. I only did AOA match and landed 5 interviews. I had difficulty with passing my comlex pe, mainly due to stage anxiety and failed humanistic portions the first 2 times. My school did not allow me to take the 3rd time until I took the prep course at WV School of Osteopathic Medicine in May. The PE score came out at the beginning of July. So, the PE really held me back for the AOA match. I participated in the acgme soap after the AOA match and soap concluded but did not soap into anything.

This time: I applied broadly to IM, FM, Transitional Years, Medicine Prelim. Mainly FM programs. Over 100 applications were submitted at the beginning of the cycle and only landed 2 interviews. I thought I performed well for the interviews and followed up with each interview and even sent out letter of intentions 10 days before the ranking. I did not match most likely because I did not have enough interviews and multiple failures on my boards. For soap, I submitted 45 applications to those programs which have the most spots and also rural areas broadly. After soap, I called and emailed unfilled spots but most of the programs did not answer calls or respond to my email. I also submitted myeras to some of the programs that responded to my email.

Is there anything else? I mean if you submitted 100 apps and only 2 Interviews, given that FM/IM are not that competitive, particularly FM, I would wonder if there is anything else going on. I mean, as a DO even with a failed comlex and a failed PE several tiems, as a US grad u should be able to land a spot. I know people who have faield a whole year and have managed to match. I find it odd that you didn't even with 100 apps.
also realize that USMLe is generally speaking more difficult than comlex, and studying for these exams is a bear. are there any other red flags?

 

[Mr. Smith_Jones]

Is there anything else? I mean if you submitted 100 apps and only 2 Interviews, given that FM/IM are not that competitive, particularly FM, I would wonder if there is anything else going on. I mean, as a DO even with a failed comlex and a failed PE several times, as a US grad u should be able to land a spot. I know people who have faield a whole year and have managed to match. I find it odd that you didn't even with 100 apps.
also realize that USMLe is generally speaking more difficult than comlex, and studying for these exams is a bear. are there any other red flags?

To be honest, I do not have any other red flags besides these. Did not take a year off or any discontinuation of my medical education during my medical school years. Another possible red flag I possibly can come up with is that I did not do research work or went into a transitional year or TRI positions since graduation. I instead picked up a job at an urgent care to work as a medical assistant. The application process this year is actually more competitive compared to the last year since the merger. I have couple friends who did transitional year and tri last year, they did not match into anything either. I don't want to completely blame the system but this could be a possibility. We used to have so many spots exclusively for DO graduates but these positions were filled up so quickly this cycle. What happened already happened. I graduated from med school already, I can't change the system but I can change myself and improve my application for the next cycle. The longer I stayed unmatched, the less chance I math into a residency program in the future. I am ready to do anything to match into a residency program next cycle. Any practical suggestion are truly appreciated. Thanks

 

[Piebaldi]

To be honest, I do not have any other red flags besides these. Did not take a year off or any discontinuation of my medical education during my medical school years. Another possible red flag I possibly can come up with is that I did not do research work or went into a transitional year or TRI positions since graduation. I instead picked up a job at an urgent care to work as a medical assistant. The application process this year is actually more competitive compared to the last year since the merger. I have couple friends who did transitional year and tri last year, they did not match into anything either. I don't want to completely the system but this could be a possibility. We used to have so many spots exclusively for DO graduates but these positions were filled up so quickly this cycle. What happened already happened. I graduated from med school already, I can't change the system but I can change myself and improve my application for the next cycle.

Yeah i'm not judging you just trying to understand. I fear that taking usmle might not be the best thing. again usmle is difficult, i am not sure that just passing usmle 1 given the p/f thing really adds anything, and passing ck even ona first attempt might not be super helpful. do u have a mentor at ur school or can u talk to someone there? I mean u are a us grad even if u have red flags - there are quite a few ppl that fail the steps and still match. I just wonder what could be going on

 

[Mr. Smith_Jones]

Yeah i'm not judging you just trying to understand. I fear that taking usmle might not be the best thing. again usmle is difficult, i am not sure that just passing usmle 1 given the p/f thing really adds anything, and passing ck even ona first attempt might not be super helpful. do u have a mentor at ur school or can u talk to someone there? I mean u are a us grad even if u have red flags - there are quite a few ppl that fail the steps and still match. I just wonder what could be going on

Don't misunderstand. I was not saying that you was judging me, I totally understand that your intention is good and want to know more about me so you can give more productive suggestions. To be honest, I started out this post even asking people to give me harsh comments as long as it is helpful. At this point of time, I don't hide myself or feel embarrassed if people know about my weaknesses. I would like you to comment if you have more to advise. Please do not understand, I was not upset or offended. I want to get as more help as possible....Cheers

 

[Piebaldi]

Don't misunderstand. I was not saying that you was judging me, I totally understand that your intention is good and want to know more about me so you can give more productive suggestions. To be honest, I started out this post even asking people to give me harsh comments as long as it is helpful. At this point of time, I don't hide myself or feel embarrassed if people know about my weaknesses. I would like you to comment if you have more to advise. Please do not understand, I was not upset or offended. I want to get as more help as possible....Cheers

I personally would not take steps 1 and 2. I would apply very early next time, get a mind blowing personal statement, unfortunately apply to programs that might be less desirable, apply to more programs, try to see if you can get better/new letters see if you can get in any observership perhaps, etc.

while it's not ideal to have failed steps/comlex, for a US grad it's typically forgivable - u are not the first and wont be the last person who fails an exam.
but again given the difficulty in test taking I think u are asking for trouble by taking the steps.

 

[deleted480308]

Don't misunderstand. I was not saying that you was judging me, I totally understand that your intention is good and want to know more about me so you can give more productive suggestions. To be honest, I started out this post even asking people to give me harsh comments as long as it is helpful. At this point of time, I don't hide myself or feel embarrassed if people know about my weaknesses. I would like you to comment if you have more to advise. Please do not understand, I was not upset or offended. I want to get as more help as possible....Cheers

If it becomes a wait until next year, you would really benefit from some more conversational english tutoring

 

[Mass Effect]

Yeah i'm not judging you just trying to understand. I fear that taking usmle might not be the best thing. again usmle is difficult, i am not sure that just passing usmle 1 given the p/f thing really adds anything, and passing ck even ona first attempt might not be super helpful. do u have a mentor at ur school or can u talk to someone there? I mean u are a us grad even if u have red flags - there are quite a few ppl that fail the steps and still match. I just wonder what could be going on

Yeah, I agree. Taking the Steps is a HUGE risk. As in, if you fail, you may be out of luck, period. I wouldn't do that. I would study my butt off for Level 3 and pass it with an above average score so they know there's no testing problem to getting you licensed. Then apply to any and all programs, multiple specialties, and see what happens. Maybe even see if you can get new letters.

 

[DokterMom]

You don't write like a native English speaker... What is your native language OP? And are there areas of the country where immigrants from your country congregate and are underserved? Fluency in other languages (aside from a few) is relatively uncommon, and could be turned to your advantage.

 

[Mr. Smith_Jones]

I personally would not take steps 1 and 2. I would apply very early next time, get a mind blowing personal statement, unfortunately apply to programs that might be less desirable, apply to more programs, try to see if you can get better/new letters see if you can get in any observership perhaps, etc.

while it's not ideal to have failed steps/comlex, for a US grad it's typically forgivable - u are not the first and wont be the last person who fails an exam.
but again given the difficulty in test taking I think u are asking for trouble by taking the steps.

Thanks for your input. I will take that into consideration. I already did apply over 100 program this year, and 2 of my DO friends, who did TRI or transitional year, still not matched. it makes the situation more concerning. I used to think as the other people do, US graduates have advantages, but each year more med schools, more med students, but residency spots do not match up. Few months ago, I scheduled an appointment with my school's dean and I drove 2 hrs to make the appointment. Then once I sat down in his office, he realized I graduated from med school, he seemed reluctant to help and only spent around 5 mins with me, he said he would bring me up to some residency program directors if there any chance..... I guess he prob did. That is why I feel you guys are more helpful. Would you mind me asking your credentials---student, resident, attending, DO, MD, US IMG or FMG. Thanks

 

[Mr. Smith_Jones]

You don't write like a native English speaker... What is your native language OP? And are there areas of the country where immigrants from your country congregate and are underserved? Fluency in other languages (aside from a few) is relatively uncommon, and could be turned to your advantage.

You was very keen in noticing that english was not my native language. I speak chinese and came to the states at 15. New York and California are normally where chinese immigrants congregated but these are normally the popular spots for residencies.

 

[GoSpursGo]

If it becomes a wait until next year, you would really benefit from some more conversational english tutoring

I have to say, this seems mean but fair. Failing PE x2 and also not matching with 5 or 2 interviews... I don't think this is just your COMLEX scores, something isn't coming across well in person. Furthermore, hoping that you're going to magically do better on the USMLEs when you're several years removed from the material seems like a recipe for disaster--fail one of those exams, and I think you're done, if you aren't already.

If unfortunately your first impression isn't very strong, given your lack of success at interviews, I agree with the advice to try to network and get an "in" at a residency program so that you can show them how dedicated you are and some of your other positives that might not be evident at first glance. Putting your head down and being an MA isn't going to impress anybody--this isn't premed where all you have to do is "smell" a patient and you'll get credit for it. A common route people go is to work as a research coordinator at a residency program and also try to informally do some shadowing or get some other clinical exposure. Getting such a gig is not easy or straightforward, but one way or another I would encourage you to make a direct connection with a program.

 

[AMEHigh]

I personally would not take steps 1 and 2. I would apply very early next time, get a mind blowing personal statement, unfortunately apply to programs that might be less desirable, apply to more programs, try to see if you can get better/new letters see if you can get in any observership perhaps, etc.

while it's not ideal to have failed steps/comlex, for a US grad it's typically forgivable - u are not the first and wont be the last person who fails an exam.
but again given the difficulty in test taking I think u are asking for trouble by taking the steps.

Yeah I agree with this. I don't think you'll get any benefit from take step 1 and 2 and it could possibly harm you even more.
In general FM doesn't really care about your scores, it's more about "fit." So there must be something else off in your application and/or interviews. Have you practiced your interviews? Have you gotten feedback about how you interview?

Can you get new letters of recommendations? Can you do any networking to make connections?
I know people say volunteering doesn't matter, but do you have anything else that would make you stand out?
We just released who matched to our programs and everyone had pretty distinct volunteer and research experience that fit well with our program's mission and values.

 

[DokterMom]

You was very keen in noticing that english was not my native language. I speak chinese and came to the states at 15. New York and California are normally where chinese immigrants congregated but these are normally the popular spots for residencies.

Sadly, there are a great number of medical students who speak various Chinese languages/dialects, so that's unlikely to help. I'd have to agree that improving your conversational English needs to be a goal.

 

[Piebaldi]

You was very keen in noticing that english was not my native language. I speak chinese and came to the states at 15. New York and California are normally where chinese immigrants congregated but these are normally the popular spots for residencies.

Sooooo well California is hard to match - I guess people like California. Alternatively when I say "less desirable" I mean things like North Dakota, Kansas, Miss., etc. NY is also desirable.
I would say as others have suggested that the scores, while certainly not helping you, are not what's truly causing the issue in its entirety. if you can get in some sort of rotation or something that's clinical that would be good.
also interview practice would be helpful too.
lastly while you've had difficulties I wouldn't offer yourself as the sacrificial goat - I mean I think we all want to provide good advice and be helpful, but you don't need people "to be harsh as possible" - realistic should suffice.

 

[deleted480308]

I have to say, this seems mean but fair. Failing PE x2 and also not matching with 5 or 2 interviews... I don't think this is just your COMLEX scores, something isn't coming across well in person. Furthermore, hoping that you're going to magically do better on the USMLEs when you're several years removed from the material seems like a recipe for disaster--fail one of those exams, and I think you're done, if you aren't already.

If unfortunately your first impression isn't very strong, given your lack of success at interviews, I agree with the advice to try to network and get an "in" at a residency program so that you can show them how dedicated you are and some of your other positives that might not be evident at first glance. Putting your head down and being an MA isn't going to impress anybody--this isn't premed where all you have to do is "smell" a patient and you'll get credit for it. A common route people go is to work as a research coordinator at a residency program and also try to informally do some shadowing or get some other clinical exposure. Getting such a gig is not easy or straightforward, but one way or another I would encourage you to make a direct connection with a program.

I was sincerely trying to be helpful, speaking like a native speaker is a big plus in relational settings

 

[NotAProgDirector]

Taking USMLE is almost certainly a waste of time/money. Exams are not your strong suit. Your chances of "blowing the USMLE out of the water" honestly isn't all that good. You could study for S2CK and take some practice exams and see how you do, but failing would be really bad as others have said.

It is often said here that US grads who fail a step do fine in the match -- and that's usually true. But you have failed 3 steps, so that's a bit of a different animal, and failed the PE twice. This is going to make programs very worried that whatever didn't go well in your PE will not go well in residency. Your interview offers will continue to drop over time.

At this point:
1. Keep an eye out for new programs opening between now and July.
2. Programs might have trouble with new interns unable to get a visa. So look for urgent openings right after July 1.
3. Any personal exposure you can get to reasonable residency programs (i.e. places you'd actually have a chance at) is gold.
4. You may never get a spot, and should start considering Plan B

 

[Piebaldi]

Taking USMLE is almost certainly a waste of time/money. Exams are not your strong suit. Your chances of "blowing the USMLE out of the water" honestly isn't all that good. You could study for S2CK and take some practice exams and see how you do, but failing would be really bad as others have said.

It is often said here that US grads who fail a step do fine in the match -- and that's usually true. But you have failed 3 steps, so that's a bit of a different animal, and failed the PE twice. This is going to make programs very worried that whatever didn't go well in your PE will not go well in residency. Your interview offers will continue to drop over time.

At this point:
1. Keep an eye out for new programs opening between now and July.
2. Programs might have trouble with new interns unable to get a visa. So look for urgent openings right after July 1.
3. Any personal exposure you can get to reasonable residency programs (i.e. places you'd actually have a chance at) is gold.
4. You may never get a spot, and should start considering Plan B

🙁 #4 is sad. just saying. seems like such a waste to have someone get through med school, with a supposed physician shortgage, to just have them not be a doctor. just saying.

 

[Aleaz]

OK, harsh it IS. Caps for emphasis only🙂
WHERE did you apply? To the 'Ivy League' Residencies? To the ones that look good on the wall or are close to home? Did you actually GO and rotate thru any of these places? Do well?
If not? I'd not bother with them unless you are a majorly impressive candidate which doesn't seem the case here. sorry.
OK, here it is:
Apply where you will get your hands dirty, where they NEED Residents due to high patient loads. NO ONE WANTS THESE BECAUSE IT DOESN'T LOOK AS GOOD ON THE WALL--but that is total Bull. You will get such stellar training, hands above everywhere else. Huge numbers of procedures, hard calls, but so? You will LIVE, breathe and eat hospital--no matter where you go so WHO CARES if it isn't a beautiful city? You'll never see it anyway. When you do have time, you'l sleep, work out, swim (use the hospital PT/pool at night...bribe someone and get in😉
ARE YOU WILLING TO DO THAT? ARE YOU PHYSICALLY UP TO PAR? If you are a meek, mild mannered person--impressions will work against you. Learn to look up, stand up, and charge ahead for what you want.
BUT BE SURE IT IS WHAT YOU WANT AND NOT SOMEONE ELSE'S IDEAS OF WHAT YOU NEED! (we had many many students forced into med school that hated it--this is the USA and we can choose! CHOOSE!)
*I'm from Hawaii; mixed nationality. We had many foreign students still stuck in the traditional 'meek mild mannered' persona. That does NOT go across well for medicine--so if you were raised that way too, change your demeanor. NOW. Take classes in dance, martial arts, aerobics, work out--to get OUT there and start feeling good about who YOU are. In Hawaii, its called 'shame', and it holds many many of us back to break out and be 'out there' and not laid back and 'whatever' not wiling to go outside that mold. Against tradition is HARD. I lost a lot of frends--but I was HAPPY.

This many failures says that you are NOT comfortable with your own life choices to me. Sorry, harsh.

Apply to inner city crowded, huge patient load get-those-hands-dirty we will take you because we NEED you...and LEARN like no place else! It is worth it! GREAT training!
Also, Apply to: Botsford DO program has a GREAT Transitional rotating Internship in case your Residency choice doesn't pan out. But you will never get in unless they know you--have you done well MS3-4 rotations? CLARIFY please.

You applied 'all over' on your updated info: NO. You will seem too desperate. You do not seem to truly know where you want. I'd do a transitional year. But GO THERE and work there and let them know who you are because these are hard to get into if you didn't rotate thru or do well there. IF you did, and did well--get one of THOSE Attendings to write you a letter of rec.
TIPS:
1. Make NO excuses! you will seem cowardly--admit you were unprepared, SPEAK UP and say you don't test well, and what you DID do to remedy that--as in take a prep test course!
2. Stay busy. Work as near to your chosen field as possible while waiting--even as a volunteer. If you cannot afford that, then work in a lab...etc.

3. Stay positive, stay healthy, do NOT self flagellate, do hypnosis if needed, meditation--to re-program the 'failure consciousness' and get positive and make it. Work out, take 'out there' classes as mentioned to get OUTSIDE your own limitations... to keep endorphins pumping and stay healthy and energized.
*also find out what programs have open slots! APPLY now. Many are desperate for Residents. Try WVa (good training, poor poor population)!etc.
Good luck.
Sorry so longwinded😉

 

[Piebaldi]

OK, harsh it IS.
WHERE did you apply? To what field? To the 'Ivy League' Residencies? To the ones that look good on the wall? Probably, right?
OK, here it is:
Apply where you will get your hands dirty, where they NEED Residents due to high patient loads. NO ONE WANTS THESE BECAUSE IT DOESN'T LOOK AS GOOD ON THE WALL--that is total Bull. You will get such stellar training, hands above everywhere else. Huge numbers of procedures, hard cals, but so? You will LIVE, breathe and eat hospital--no matter where you go so WHO CARES if it isn't a beautiful city? You'll never see it anyway. When you do have time, you'l sleep, work out, swim (use the hospital PT/pool at night...bribe someone and get in😉

Apply to inner city crowded, huge patient load get-those-hands-dirty we will take you because we NEED you...and LEARN like no place else! It is worth it! GREAT training!
Also, Apply to: Botsford DO program has a GREAT Transitional rotating Internship as a last pick in case your Residency choice doesn't pan out. It is great training if you are D.O. (you don't say) There should be rotating internships MD as well?

Take the USMLE, yes. Take a PREP pre-test class prior to these exams. Some people are great hands on and not so much on testing--you are probably one of these.
TIPS:
1. Make NO excuses! you will seem cowardly--admit you were unprepared, don't test well, and what you DID do to remedy that--as in take a prep test course!
2. Stay busy. Work as near to your chosen field as possible while waiting--even as a volunteer. If you cannot afford that, then work in a lab...etc.

3. Stay positive, stay healthy, do NOT self flagellate, do hypnosis if needed, meditation--to re-program the 'failure consciousness' and get positive and make it. Work out to keep endorphins pumping and stay healthy and energized.
Good luck.

Taking USMLE as we all have pointed out is a massive waste of time, energy, money and a HUGE risk. If OP fails the test - he will be done. Even if he passes, they will be useless. What will these tests say at this tiem?Nothing.
Realistically I think OP probably applied to programs that were out of his league -California, NY, etc.
I would imagine that if he applied to more programs and outside of desirable cities he would likely find something.

yes going to "undesirable residency x" might not be sexy on the wall, but ending up with a career in medicine after all the work should be worth it, vs ending up working as a lab tech

but please don't counsel op to take the steps - worst advice ever.

 

[GoSpursGo]

I was sincerely trying to be helpful, speaking like a native speaker is a big plus in relational settings

I do honestly agree with you--I think some people might read such a terse comment as just being harsh, but clearly something is wrong with how the OP comes off in person, in addition to the obvious exam scores. So your suggestion actually is not a bad idea, and I hope it isn't dismissed out of hand.

 

[Mr. Smith_Jones]

Taking USMLE is almost certainly a waste of time/money. Exams are not your strong suit. Your chances of "blowing the USMLE out of the water" honestly isn't all that good. You could study for S2CK and take some practice exams and see how you do, but failing would be really bad as others have said.

It is often said here that US grads who fail a step do fine in the match -- and that's usually true. But you have failed 3 steps, so that's a bit of a different animal, and failed the PE twice. This is going to make programs very worried that whatever didn't go well in your PE will not go well in residency. Your interview offers will continue to drop over time.

At this point:
1. Keep an eye out for new programs opening between now and July.
2. Programs might have trouble with new interns unable to get a visa. So look for urgent openings right after July 1.
3. Any personal exposure you can get to reasonable residency programs (i.e. places you'd actually have a chance at) is gold.
4. You may never get a spot, and should start considering Plan B

Thanks for taking time to answer my question. These are very good suggestions. I agree with everything you say, except #4. I will keep fighting and prove to the directors that I deserve a spot in the residency program.

 

[Dral]

How are you with patients?

Residencies a lot of time want people they will get along with. Once you get the interview, proving you will be good to work with is a big part of moving forward with getting ranked to match (programs use the interview to determine what candidates mesh with their program). Sometimes odd, cold, or different personalities don’t do well here (during the interview).

If this might be the case with you, have you considered path or rads? I’m not sure your test fails would be ok for rads, but I’m not sure. Preventive medicine may be another option.

 

[ThoracicGuy]

How are you with patients?

Residencies a lot of time want people they will get along with. Once you get the interview, proving you will be good to work with is a big part of moving forward with getting ranked to match (programs use the interview to determine what candidates mesh with their program). Sometimes odd, cold, or different personalities don’t do well here (during the interview).

If this might be the case with you, have you considered path or rads? I’m not sure your test fails would be ok for rads, but I’m not sure. Preventive medicine may be another option.

Still need an intern year to go into Occupational or Preventative Medicine.

 

[ThoracicGuy]

I'll echo a bit of what @Aleaz says. You really need to look at where you apply. Make sure it is places that take DO grads, probably even mostly DO grads. Look for places that have trouble filling in the match. Look at places that are not desirable.

Certainly keep looking for spots that may open up between now and July. Be ready and available to do a skype or in person interview at a moment's notice.

Work with someone that you trust will give you honest feedback for practice interviews. If you are near your medical school, maybe you can find someone there that can help you with this.

 

[Mr. Smith_Jones]

Everyone, I really appreciate that everyone offered valid points here. I will think about all the suggestion and advices. I am really thankful to @aProgDirector answered my private message and took time to answer my question here. I also thank @Piebaldi, @GoSpursGo, @Aleaz, @AMEHigh, you all give good advices, also every one else.

 

[Dral]

Everyone, I really appreciate that everyone offered valid points here. I will think about all the suggestion and advices. I am really thankful to @aProgDirector answered my private message and took time to answer my question here. I also thank @Piebaldi, @GoSpursGo, @Aleaz, @AMEHigh, you all give good advices, also every one else.

Again, ‘advices‘ is not a word. Please take sb247‘s advice. I believe it can only help with your actual interview encounters.

 

[Dral]

Still need an intern year to go into Occupational or Preventative Medicine.

Yep. As is the case with rads as well.

 

[Mr. Smith_Jones]

Again, ‘advices‘ is not a word. Please take sb247‘s advice. I believe it can only help with your actual interview encounters.

thanks, you right, detail matters

 

[Splenda88]

I will say the doors are not shut down on you as l learned on Monday that one of my classmates who failed step 1 twice and failed both CK/CS once matched FM without CS/CK... Yes, she has not passed them yet and still has to take them... I have no idea how she pulled that off..

My advice to you is to apply to 250+ FM and 50+ low tier pathology programs next cycle... You probably already have 300-400k in student loan, so spending another 10k to get a spot is not that much...

 

[Giovanotto]

I know OP is now 2 years post graduation, but shouldn't he be getting some help from his medical school? You know, with their job being placing students into residency and all? Did you go through them after your first failed cycle? What did they offer? Even I have issues with my school but I'd like to think they'd at least be there somewhat were I not to match. Am I wrong?

 

[Splenda88]

I know OP is now 2 years post graduation, but shouldn't he be getting some help from his medical school? You know, with their job being placing students into residency and all? Did you go through them after your first failed cycle? What did they offer? Even I have issues with my school but I'd like to think they'd at least be there somewhat were I not to match. Am I wrong?

I am not sure if most med schools care that much after they give you your diploma. I might be wrong here.

 

[Giovanotto]

I am not sure if most med schools care that much after they give you your diploma. I might be wrong here.

Technically first match cycle is before diploma. Not that might matter all that much to them?

 

[Piebaldi]

Technically first match cycle is before diploma. Not that might matter all that much to them?

Realistically med schools don't give a darn if students match or not aside from whatever reporting they have that may affect whethe rpeople go there or not. I remember totally screwing up my rank list the first match by not knowing how to rank prelim vs advanced programs (i was told something completely off by the NRMP when I called them) and didn't match which was a shock! my med school assistant dean told me to get a spot in FM and I don't like FM at all - I waited it out a year and matched into a Radiology residency. So if anything they only care that you are a body that has placed somewhere - not really where.
Med school like undergard, law school, etc is simply a business. Once they have their $$$, the relationship is over.

 

[GoSpursGo]

I know OP is now 2 years post graduation, but shouldn't he be getting some help from his medical school? You know, with their job being placing students into residency and all? Did you go through them after your first failed cycle? What did they offer? Even I have issues with my school but I'd like to think they'd at least be there somewhat were I not to match. Am I wrong?

Ideally yes they’ve would help, more because it looks bad on them for their match percentage being low rather than it “being their job” to place them in residency—their job is to train them in medicine, give a diploma, and then with some mild help with the mechanics of the first app most AMGs should be able to match.

as others have said there’s only so much that can be done after graduation, and they certainly have no obligation.

 

[Splenda88]

Technically first match cycle is before diploma. Not that might matter all that much to them?

Correct... I don't remember my school did anything extraordinary during the first match cycle. For the most part, people can do a lot more to help themselves than what any school administrators can do for them...

In my opinion, any US student should be able to match (might not be your preferred specialty) as long as their CV is not atrocious and they keep their expectations in check. If you don't have the stats to match derm, apply to a less competitive specialty that you can see yourself doing.


OP can still salvage his/her career if he/she does what I posted in post #38.

 

[VAoccmeddoc]

Another option would be to work as a physician now. In Missouri there was a law passed that allowed med school graduates to work as assistant physicians in rural areas. You'd be working under a licensed physician like a PA. You'd get to actually build your clinical skills and prove that you're up to the demands of being an intern. Hopefully, pick up some new LORs. I don't know the requirements or if you meet the criteria but it's worth a look. I agree with mostly everybody though...interviewing will be crucial. I'd start now with trying to improve your communication skills. Maybe join Toast Masters or something similar in your area.
Otherwise I'd assemble a list of every DO FM program in rural and inner city areas. My old school started one in southwest VA that isn't competitive. I know for sure they filled through SOAP the first year. The other thing I would suggest is to build a narrative before you interview. Do not go in with a sense of desperation. Own your failures, but express how you've grown from them, what you're doing to compensate for them, and what you're doing now to work toward your future goals. Your future goal needs to be more than just becoming a licensed physician. You need to have a compelling narrative. People love the underdog but hate the sad sap.

 

[Dr Tapatio]

You can't be applying to multiple specialties and trying to go to NY with board failures. You need to focus on one exclusively and make the best out of it. My suggestion is to do FM.

1. Attend AAFP or ACOFP AND network hard
2. Instead of only being an MA or whatever, also do an MPH so that it shows you're really busy. Making your time off from school as busy as possible is key because you don't want to seem unmotivated or lazy
3. Come up with a really compelling reason to do FM and have multiple people look over the personal statement
4. If you failed PE twice, it sounds like you probably have trouble during interviews. Try to fix this somehow
5. Look into the Assistant Physician thing in Missouri. It could help you
6. Do NOT take USMLE step 1 or step 2. You are likely to fail them or be marginal, and even with an average score it'll be expected from you considering you finished school. Instead, focus on doing Level 3. I think even a passing 350 looks better when applying than not having one because at least you're not a worry on that front
7. A minimum of 200 applications all in FM would be good, but you need to choose those 200 carefully and not waste money on things university programs or highly desirable locations. Do NOT apply to prelim medicine or surgery or something similar. These programs bank on having people that failed to match who have good board scores and no red flags. I knew a guy with 240s and no red flags that failed to match psych. I know another person that stupidly applied only to Interventional Radiology with 260 and didn't match. These are the targets of these prelim spots.