SGU or Howard

[Karebear07]

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Hi,

In your perceptive do you believe that Howard Medical School in D.C. is a better choice than SGU in the Caribbeans? What do you believe are the pro's and con's of going to Howard over SGU or vis versa?

Thank you

 

[RussianJoo]

Hi,

In your perceptive do you believe that Howard Medical School in D.C. is a better choice than SGU in the Caribbeans? What do you believe are the pro's and con's of going to Howard over SGU or vis versa?

Thank you

if you can get into howard go there. it's a US school.. SGU is a carib school. you'll be a US medical school grad if you go to howard and you'll be a US-IMG if you go to SGU. that should be reason enough to pick any and i mean any US med school over SGU. The only pro I see of going to SGU over Howard is that SGU is on a tropical island with beautiful beaches. Karen no one at SGU was able to get into a US school and that's why they went to SGU. SGU is a back up, no matter how great SGU might sound, they can't compare to any US or Canadian med school. If you want a harder time getting a residency and being discriminated against because you're an IMG then by all means go to SGU.

 

[wasvsdal]

What about D.O. vs. Caribbean?

 

[howelljolly]

What about D.O. vs. Caribbean?

I hope youre joking.

Howard is better than SGU. The only way you should consider a foreign degree as possibly a better choice than Howard, or any US school, is if it is from Oxford or Cambridge or something.

DO before Caribbean. You'll never be without a (reasonable) job as a DO. Quite possibly as a caribbean.

 

[RussianJoo]

I hope youre joking.

Howard is better than SGU. The only way you should consider a foreign degree as possibly a better choice than Howard, or any US school, is if it is from Oxford or Cambridge or something.

DO before Caribbean. You'll never be without a (reasonable) job as a DO. Quite possibly as a caribbean.

👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍

 

[igcgnerd]

I'm curious as to what you mean by without a job. I assume you mean residency. I assume reguardless fo where you went to medical school as long as your licensed and residency trained your not going to have problems finding a job.

 

[dragonfly99]

They meant residency...I agree w/you, if a Caribbean grad makes it through residency and does fine, then unemployment would be unlikely.

I would go to Howard over SGU. Aside from it being a US school, which make you a US grad and you avoid the stigma of being foreign-trained, with Howard being in DC it probably has some interesting options for internships, etc. to do between 1st and 2nd years. I am also assuming that the financial aid would be better at Howard, and your overall cost of attendance less (right?) which is not a minor thing.

 

[Ariee]

I'm sorry, maybe my insomnia is getting to the best of me, but is this a serious question?

I've seen this OP get on here and ask a lot of silly questions...in my books this is a troll, troll, troll!

But if I'm wrong (which is likely considering I haven't slept much yet), the answer is HOWARD, HOWARD, HOWARD & here is my reference for you:
http://lmgtfy.com/?q=Howard+University+School+of+Medicine

Gees louise folks!

P.S. If you're smart enough to get into Howard, then you are smart enough to know the answer to this question!

 

[NRAI2001]

Definitely go to howard...the DO vs Carribean route is debatable depending on what field you want to go into and what region of the US you are from.

 

[PeterDO2B]

I'm curious as to what you mean by without a job. I assume you mean residency. I assume reguardless fo where you went to medical school as long as your licensed and residency trained your not going to have problems finding a job.

Its getting extremely difficult for IMGs to get residencies. I know more than a few who went the Caribbean route, did well on the USMLE, and have not gotten a residency. If the OP got into Howard, I cannot believe he or she is even thinking about a Caribbean school. You have to be out of your mind to pick a foreign school, especially a Caribbean school over one in the US. DO schools are way better choices than island schools as well.

 

[howelljolly]

My thoughts at the time I wrote: "(reasonable) job" is - primarily, meaning a residency. Secondarily, A Caribbean MD is essentially useless outside of clinical medicine.

Nobody is going to hire you for serious research or teaching when your doctorate involved cramming for the Step1 on a deserted island for two years, and bouncing around underserved hospitals in the US for another two years. Unless you have a graduate degree from the US, of course.

The one non-clinical job I have heard that Carib grads go into is in health insurance. Ever wonder why the doctor working for the insurance company that you're arguing with seems a bit of an ignoramus?

 

[tanny]

Is it really that bad?

I'm thinking of applying to Ross.

 

[Perrotfish]

Is it really that bad?

I'm thinking of applying to Ross.

The problems with the Carib:

1) The Carib has a drastically higher fail out rate. Fail an exam & you're likely gone. On the other hand it's just about impossible to fail out of a US MD/DO school.

2) Even if you don't fail out there just aren't enough residency spots available for all the IMGs applying. You can end up scrambling for a middle of nowhere Family Medicine training despite having what would have been stellar stats for a US graduate. US MD & DO schools, on the other hand, match just about everyone.

3) The lack of decent financial aid means that if you go to the islands and fail out you're going to be drowning in debt forever.

This doesn't mean the Caribbean is a bad decision for everyone, it's just more of a gamble. If the gamble pays off you can be a physicians years earlier than if you had worked to get your application competitive for the US. And once you're done with residency no one will care about where you went to school ever again.

 

[RussianJoo]

The problems with the Carib:

1) The Carib has a drastically higher fail out rate. Fail an exam & you're likely gone. On the other hand it's just about impossible to fail out of the Caribbean.

2) Even if you don't fail out there just aren't enough residency spots available for all the IMGs applying. You can end up scrambling for a middle of nowhere Family Medicine training despite having what would have been stellar stats for a US graduate. US MD & DO schools, on the other hand, match just about everyone.

3) The lack of decent financial aid means that if you go to the islands and fail out you're going to be drowning in debt forever.

This doesn't mean the Caribbean is a bad decision for everyone, it's just more of a gamble. If the gamble pays off you can be a physicians years earlier than if you had worked to get your application competitive for the US. And once you're done with residency no one will care about where you went to school ever again.

your first point kind of contradicts itself. which is it, if you fail an exam you're kicked out or it's almost impossible to get kicked out?


I personally think it's the later, you really have to screw up big time for a carib school to kick you out. Also the older schools like SGU, AUC, Ross have stanford loans and many other loan options in place, sure there might not be as many grants or scholarships, but they do exist and are only given out to top notch students.

 

[howelljolly]

Whatever, it must have been a typo.
Nobody fails out of US schools
More than half fail out of Carib schools.

 

[RussianJoo]

Whatever, it must have been a typo.
Nobody fails out of US schools
More than half fail out of Carib schools.

i don't disagree it was a typo but i didn't know what he/she meant. Those that fail out of carib schools fail out after multiple attempts of retaking a class, not because they simply failed an exam. I know a guy who retook the same class 3 times before the school kicked him out and he transferred to another carib school.

 

[Perrotfish]

i don't disagree it was a typo but i didn't know what he/she meant.

Ooops, late night typing, should have read:

1) The Carib has a drastically higher fail out rate. Fail an exam & you're likely gone. On the other hand it's just about impossible to fail out of US MD/DO schools.

Meaning: US MD/DO schools tend to move mountains to make sure you pass. Fail and you take it again. With a 1 on 1 tutor helping you for as many hours as you need. Fail again and you take it yet again. Still failing? Alright, now they're spreading your first couple of years of course work over 3 or even 4 years to give you a lighter load to give you more time to concentrate.

To the best of my knowledge my school has failed out one person in the two years I've been there (average class size of 180) and that was after she retook 2nd year for the FOURTH time. My impression was that most Caribbean schools didn't give you nearly as much leeway.

And finally, if you ultimately manage to pass the Step 1 and medical school, you pretty much get to go to some kind of residency. With the Caribbean, even if you somehow managed to get through with multiple failures, do you really think you're likely to get a residency anywhere? Ever? This is only going to get worse as US schools matriculate more and more students without significantly increasing the number of residencies they offer.

Again, it's not necessarily a bad decision. Going to the Carib can save you a LOT of time. I just think you need to go with the attitude that you need to do significantly better than you would have had to at a US school to see the same results on match day.

 

[howelljolly]

Thanks Perrotfish, thats exactly what I was thinking, but I dont have the energy to argue with RJ.

In the Carib, you can take a class 2-3 times, or the USMLE 2-3 times before they kick you out. But the bottom line after all of these concessions, half of the students who enter a Carib school are out before the USMLE. Half fail the USMLE on the first attempt, about half fail their second attempt. An oft quoted statistic is that 1/7 Carib students make it from start to finish.

On the other hand, in the US. If you fail, the school will do everything to get you to pass. Slow you schedule down, 1:1 tutoring with someone who knows what theyre talking about, let you repeat classes until you get them. The attrition rate in US schools in microscopic compared to the Carib.

In fact theres such an obvious disparity between the attrition rates that Im not sure why this is an issue. Anyone who has gone to the Caribbean for med school knows how brutal it is.

About 1/4 of my starting class made it out.

 

[RussianJoo]

what can i say then you went to a crappy carib school I thought all schools were equal but I guess they're not. At SGU they allow you to drop classes before you fail them to ease your schedule and if you do bad on the midterm they infact suggest you drop some classes. They have upper classman run review sessions that occur multiple times a week, weekly professor or TA (who's a foriegn MD trying to get a residency in the US) run review sessions, almost daily professor office hours, and lectures on how to take notes more effectively, different studying suggestions, and how to take multiple choice exams. All for free through the Department of Educational Services, which is part of the Student Success Division.

If you fail a course you can retake it but this time you'll have mandatory weekly meetings with the professor and one on one tutoring (free) also you don't pay for classes that you have to retake because you dropped them or failed them. Our first time step1 pass rate is in the low 90% and our school failure rate is also pretty low maybe at most 15%, about 1/3 of the class drops their work load i.e. decelerates, but that doesn't mean they don't graduate.

This is the experience I have with a caribbean school, and this is the view point I am arguing from. I don't know what other schools do but I assumed they all would want their students to succeed and thus would have things like this in place. But since I didn't attend other carib schools I really don't know and can't comment. But hey I guess that's why SGU is #1 and the most expensive because it provides all these extra services to ensure that their students are successful.

 

[howelljolly]

what can i say then you went to a crappy carib school I thought all schools were equal but I guess they're not. At SGU they allow you to drop classes before you fail them to ease your schedule and if you do bad on the midterm they infact suggest you drop some classes. They have upper classman run review sessions that occur multiple times a week, weekly professor or TA (who's a foriegn MD trying to get a residency in the US) run review sessions, almost daily professor office hours, and lectures on how to take notes more effectively, different studying suggestions, and how to take multiple choice exams. All for free through the Department of Educational Services, which is part of the Student Success Division.

If you fail a course you can retake it but this time you'll have mandatory weekly meetings with the professor and one on one tutoring (free) also you don't pay for classes that you have to retake because you dropped them or failed them. Our first time step1 pass rate is in the low 90% and our school failure rate is also pretty low maybe at most 15%, about 1/3 of the class drops their work load i.e. decelerates, but that doesn't mean they don't graduate.

This is the experience I have with a caribbean school, and this is the view point I am arguing from. I don't know what other schools do but I assumed they all would want their students to succeed and thus would have things like this in place. But since I didn't attend other carib schools I really don't know and can't comment. But hey I guess that's why SGU is #1 and the most expensive because it provides all these extra services to ensure that their students are successful.

No, SGU is not far off from a US school. Really. It is not a typical Carib school. Most others do not care if you do not succeed. In fact, they want you to be in basic sciences as long as possible, and then fail out before they have to pay the teaching hospitals for you, in your Third Year. They want you when you are an asset, they want you out when you are a liability.

In other Carib schools... They take anyone with a pulse. They give you full course load. If you fail one class, you repeat the entire semester (all passed and failed classes)... or you repeat the entire year (If grades are entered after M1 and M2 in that school). And of course, you pay for the full course load... not just the class you need to repeat.

After failing M1, some will leave med school. Those that stay will be allowed to make the same mistakes again. They will not be officially tutored. They might have another student as a study buddy. Some of our more motivated professors would offer to tutor the failing students. But since it was informal, it never was effective. One or the other would give up out of frustration. We had no such thing as mandatory meetings for students in trouble. In fact, the better students got more attention. Professors naturally enjoyed seeing their efforts put to good use.

After repeating the year, your grades would be reviewed. Lather, rinse, repeat. Some schools have a Comp, which you have to pass in order to get your USMLE scheduling permit. Pass all your classes, and fail that final exam... good day sir. Just pack your things and go home. The school does that to keep its USMLE pass rate high. How accurate and reliable is the Comp? Who knows. But they have at least 2 years of tuition from you, and still have a decent USMLE pass rate. Win-win for them.

Arguing from the standpoint of SGU doesnt give folks a picture of what the Carib schools are like. At this point, how can you possibly still think that all Carib schools are equal?

 

[schandan13]

Excellent & informative post. If i may put forward a question...
Is the pereception of a carib graduate essentially the same by residency PDs and other physicians ? Or do they know what a scam other carib schools are and give students from the big 3/4 the benefit of doubt ?

 

[RussianJoo]

No, SGU is not far off from a US school. Really. It is not a typical Carib school. Most others do not care if you do not succeed. In fact, they want you to be in basic sciences as long as possible, and then fail out before they have to pay the teaching hospitals for you, in your Third Year. They want you when you are an asset, they want you out when you are a liability.

In other Carib schools... They take anyone with a pulse. They give you full course load. If you fail one class, you repeat the entire semester (all passed and failed classes)... or you repeat the entire year (If grades are entered after M1 and M2 in that school). And of course, you pay for the full course load... not just the class you need to repeat.

After failing M1, some will leave med school. Those that stay will be allowed to make the same mistakes again. They will not be officially tutored. They might have another student as a study buddy. Some of our more motivated professors would offer to tutor the failing students. But since it was informal, it never was effective. One or the other would give up out of frustration. We had no such thing as mandatory meetings for students in trouble. In fact, the better students got more attention. Professors naturally enjoyed seeing their efforts put to good use.

After repeating the year, your grades would be reviewed. Lather, rinse, repeat. Some schools have a Comp, which you have to pass in order to get your USMLE scheduling permit. Pass all your classes, and fail that final exam... good day sir. Just pack your things and go home. The school does that to keep its USMLE pass rate high. How accurate and reliable is the Comp? Who knows. But they have at least 2 years of tuition from you, and still have a decent USMLE pass rate. Win-win for them.

Arguing from the standpoint of SGU doesnt give folks a picture of what the Carib schools are like. At this point, how can you possibly still think that all Carib schools are equal?

well then i don't see why anyone would go to anyother school besides SGU. seems kind of stupid and careless if you ask me.

 

[schrizto]

No, SGU is not far off from a US school. Really. It is not a typical Carib school. Most others do not care if you do not succeed. In fact, they want you to be in basic sciences as long as possible, and then fail out before they have to pay the teaching hospitals for you, in your Third Year. They want you when you are an asset, they want you out when you are a liability.

In other Carib schools... They take anyone with a pulse.

The "other" Caribbean schools you refer to, do they include schools such as Ross, Saba, AUC which are usually considered along with SGU, or by "other" do you mean the numerous schools that generally people haven't heard about?

 

[howelljolly]

The "other" Caribbean schools you refer to, do they include schools such as Ross, Saba, AUC which are usually considered along with SGU, or by "other" do you mean the numerous schools that generally people haven't heard about?

By other, I mean all others, but to varying degrees. The lesser known schols are probably the worst culprits. The ones you mentioned are good, strong programs.
Still, Ross, for example, starts each class with a huge number of students. There are more students than there are seats in the lecture hall. The weeding out is brutal. Many students fail out in the first two years, and more fail the final comp exam, and can not take the USMLE. They end up with a slightly more manageable group of well qualified students for the clinical years. But at the same time, they are established enough to have a structure that helps students succeed.

 

[Tigerz_Fan]

The "other" Caribbean schools you refer to, do they include schools such as Ross, Saba, AUC which are usually considered along with SGU, or by "other" do you mean the numerous schools that generally people haven't heard about?

Basically, yes.

And Howell-Jolly is right. Not all Carib schools are created equal. Many of the unknown schools do take anyone with a pulse. And I also only graduated with 1/4 of my starting class.

The "big 4" as they are called are the schools with the strongest programs. And the things that HJ is stating about Ross are along the same things that I have heard from their grads I work with, in addition to a great difficulty getting rotations. Over the past few years, I have had the opportunity to work with carib grads from quite a few schools, and everyone's experiences vary.

Schandan, the medical community's (PDs included) perception of us greatly varies. I have had many people who really don't seem to mind, and then run into a person or two that definitely makes their opinion known. As a Carib grad, you will run into the prejudiced against us, and you need to be prepared on how to handle it. It sucks, yes, but sometimes is a part of life.

 

[mdfirst]

I have a friend that I went to high school with who is in his 3rd year at SGU and he assured me that it is possible to get into good residencies...There are a few from SGU and Ross who matched in competitive specialties, although most go into primary care. Competitive specialties are not impossible though.

 

[howelljolly]

thanks for the update

 

[RussianJoo]

thanks for the update

lol

 

[Nyotek]

So much of the negativity about Carib schools (in my opinion) can be broken down into 3 types:

1.) The first is "hear-say"- basically the 1 or 2 major horror stories out of 100 that get blown way out of proportion and then go through a game of "telephone operator". The end result is thousands upon thousands of already neurotic/ nail biting premeds (later turned into neurotic/ nail biting med students, residents, PDs, etc) spreading this information in an almost viral manner via regurgitation of this hear-say combined with their own potential unfounded (and inexperienced) fears.

2.) The second is information that is put out (i.e. published on a blog or forum) by a medical student that is frustrated by a certain situation that they hold the individual school responsible for. When the issue is resolved and potentially found out to be "no big deal" in the long run, their initial complaints remain (like old posts on a forum). Medical school is tough- as it should be because of the gravity of our responsibilities, and yes going through a that kind of a program you're going to have complaints along the way. The problem is when good students (like everyone here) do their research and find all these minor or one time moderate complaints and begin compiling them into this gargantuan nightmare. Having formed said nightmare, the next logical step is to attach a categorical identity (ie a particular medical school or group of schools), and that's how you get "Carib schools- the bastard children of medical education, hungry for your money, crushers of hopes, and destroyers of dreams". When in reality, it's highly likely that they may never encounter even one of their feared issues.

3.) Finally, the third are the actual major horror stories that spawned the hear-say I discussed in #1. These 1-2% of students can be broken down into 2 more categories: 1.) the "damn, that sucks" situation and 2.) the "you're an idiot for even applying to medical school" situation. The first one is completely excusable because we all know that it is certainly possible that something insanely wrong goes on in our lives that leaves us with major irreconcilable issues leading to quitting the medical profession. The second is of course the ridiculous one where you get people that don't belong in medical school- the only way I can think of this now is via examples. Like the student that wants to be a surgeon and knows that they are insanely disturbed by blood, thinking that they'll get over it (but in the mean time had be excused from every undergrad bio/ a&p lab dissection). Or the example situation (grossly invented btw lol) is the Psychology undergrad with a 2.1 GPA/ 12 MCAT score getting accepted into a medical school, not being able to cut it and getting kicked out, then proceeding to bad mouth the school for the rest of their lives for putting them into debt and crushing their dream. When in reality, they were never cut out for it- I know I sound like an a** right now but everyone reading knows people like this.



Soooooo..... *takes a moment to rest fingers, sip some water, and switch up iTunes playlist*... when we consider all of the above we wind up with things all of us already knew. 1.) Take everything you find out "with a grain of salt" and 2.) Medicine is the same everywhere (ie we all have vital organs that function pretty much the same and our bodies succumb to the same diseases in mostly stereotypical ways) and since we are practicing/plan to practice in the US, we are required to pass a standardized set of examinations to prove our knowledge and skills. It is therefore up to you (us) as the student to "bust your *****" to make sure you rock those exams (ie the MLEs), regardless of the school you attend. Everything else is secondary and the medical schools know this, so choosing which to attend is all about the subjective perception of "convenience" that is purported by each individual school.

Yes, I applied to many medical schools and got several interviews. Funny story- I was accepted to a US program but rejected by Ross (they instead accepted me to their post-bac premed program), 6 weeks later I got accepted to SGU. My choice? SGU 100% Why? Because the US program I got accepted to is part of a religiously denominated university and while not denominational themselves- I would only choose that type of school as a last resort. I would not feel comfortable living in that area (the middle of nowhere) as a gay male with my current long term boyfriend- if you don't understand my discomfort look up Leviticus 18:22 in the Christian Bible, the people that live in this area (not associated with the school of course) are the bigot over zealous type. I applied there because I'd rather risk being harassed by bigots then not go to medical school at all (bring 'em on). While I realize that the Carib also has a stigma, they have the benefit of experiencing many cultures and beliefs and therefore have a civil tolerance- much like Miami/Ft Lauderdale FL where I went to undergrad and lived my whole life.

Ok so I'm going to stop typing now lol, I would really enjoy your feedback on my thoughts- conversation enriches all parties involved. (I'm editing this by adding that I have nothing against anyone and their faiths so long as they practice civility and mutual tolerance).

 

[howelljolly]

Like the student that wants to be a surgeon and knows that they are insanely disturbed by blood, thinking that they'll get over it (but in the mean time had be excused from every undergrad bio/ a&p lab dissection)..

heh.... i actually had a couple of those in my med school class. They didnt quite make it.

Well, to be fair... only one of them wanted to be a surgeon.

 

[LocutusofBorg]

Who would consider an IMG option when offered a domestic one? I can't think of a single reason NOT to attend Howard. U'll get a better education by an all-US staff, and you'll get better picks at residency spots when you graduate. DUH!!!!!

 

[RussianJoo]

So much of the negativity about Carib schools (in my opinion) can be broken down into 3 types:

1.) The first is "hear-say"- basically the 1 or 2 major horror stories out of 100 that get blown way out of proportion and then go through a game of "telephone operator". The end result is thousands upon thousands of already neurotic/ nail biting premeds (later turned into neurotic/ nail biting med students, residents, PDs, etc) spreading this information in an almost viral manner via regurgitation of this hear-say combined with their own potential unfounded (and inexperienced) fears.

2.) The second is information that is put out (i.e. published on a blog or forum) by a medical student that is frustrated by a certain situation that they hold the individual school responsible for. When the issue is resolved and potentially found out to be "no big deal" in the long run, their initial complaints remain (like old posts on a forum). Medical school is tough- as it should be because of the gravity of our responsibilities, and yes going through a that kind of a program you're going to have complaints along the way. The problem is when good students (like everyone here) do their research and find all these minor or one time moderate complaints and begin compiling them into this gargantuan nightmare. Having formed said nightmare, the next logical step is to attach a categorical identity (ie a particular medical school or group of schools), and that's how you get "Carib schools- the bastard children of medical education, hungry for your money, crushers of hopes, and destroyers of dreams". When in reality, it's highly likely that they may never encounter even one of their feared issues.

3.) Finally, the third are the actual major horror stories that spawned the hear-say I discussed in #1. These 1-2% of students can be broken down into 2 more categories: 1.) the "damn, that sucks" situation and 2.) the "you're an idiot for even applying to medical school" situation. The first one is completely excusable because we all know that it is certainly possible that something insanely wrong goes on in our lives that leaves us with major irreconcilable issues leading to quitting the medical profession. The second is of course the ridiculous one where you get people that don't belong in medical school- the only way I can think of this now is via examples. Like the student that wants to be a surgeon and knows that they are insanely disturbed by blood, thinking that they'll get over it (but in the mean time had be excused from every undergrad bio/ a&p lab dissection). Or the example situation (grossly invented btw lol) is the Psychology undergrad with a 2.1 GPA/ 12 MCAT score getting accepted into a medical school, not being able to cut it and getting kicked out, then proceeding to bad mouth the school for the rest of their lives for putting them into debt and crushing their dream. When in reality, they were never cut out for it- I know I sound like an a** right now but everyone reading knows people like this.



Soooooo..... *takes a moment to rest fingers, sip some water, and switch up iTunes playlist*... when we consider all of the above we wind up with things all of us already knew. 1.) Take everything you find out "with a grain of salt" and 2.) Medicine is the same everywhere (ie we all have vital organs that function pretty much the same and our bodies succumb to the same diseases in mostly stereotypical ways) and since we are practicing/plan to practice in the US, we are required to pass a standardized set of examinations to prove our knowledge and skills. It is therefore up to you (us) as the student to "bust your *****" to make sure you rock those exams (ie the MLEs), regardless of the school you attend. Everything else is secondary and the medical schools know this, so choosing which to attend is all about the subjective perception of "convenience" that is purported by each individual school.

Yes, I applied to many medical schools and got several interviews. Funny story- I was accepted to a US program but rejected by Ross (they instead accepted me to their post-bac premed program), 6 weeks later I got accepted to SGU. My choice? SGU 100% Why? Because the US program I got accepted to is part of a religiously denominated university and while not denominational themselves- I would only choose that type of school as a last resort. I would not feel comfortable living in that area (the middle of nowhere) as a gay male with my current long term boyfriend- if you don't understand my discomfort look up Leviticus 18:22 in the Christian Bible, the people that live in this area (not associated with the school of course) are the bigot over zealous type. I applied there because I'd rather risk being harassed by bigots then not go to medical school at all (bring 'em on). While I realize that the Carib also has a stigma, they have the benefit of experiencing many cultures and beliefs and therefore have a civil tolerance- much like Miami/Ft Lauderdale FL where I went to undergrad and lived my whole life.

Ok so I'm going to stop typing now lol, I would really enjoy your feedback on my thoughts- conversation enriches all parties involved. (I'm editing this by adding that I have nothing against anyone and their faiths so long as they practice civility and mutual tolerance).

just be careful in Grenada.. it's illegal to be a homosexual there, i am not joking and i am not trying to be rude or obnoxious. ask the other students on ValueMD if you don't believe me. while i don't know what the penalties are, i do know that it's illegal and looked down upon by the locals.

 

[howelljolly]

just be careful in Grenada.. it's illegal to be a homosexual there, i am not joking and i am not trying to be rude or obnoxious. ask the other students on ValueMD if you don't believe me. while i don't know what the penalties are, i do know that it's illegal and looked down upon by the locals.

Yup, Its illegal in quite a few of the Caribbean islands. To be specific, the ones with med schools...:

Antigua
Dominica
Grenada
Nevis & St Kitts
St Lucia
St. Vincents & Grenadines
Trinidad

In addition its illegal in the following islands, but im not sure in there are med schools there:
Barbados
Jamaica

 

[RussianJoo]

Yup, Its illegal in quite a few of the Caribbean islands. To be specific, the ones with med schools...:

Antigua
Dominica
Grenada
Nevis & St Kitts
St Lucia
St. Vincents & Grenadines
Trinidad

In addition its illegal in the following islands, but im not sure in there are med schools there:
Barbados
Jamaica

yeah so the choice of going to the SGU to escape bigotry might have back fired because the locals are probably just as bad if not worse than that religious school that are N yotek was accepted to. also because grenada is a 3rd world country some locals might be inclined to use violence to get their point across, and the law might not be on your side when reporting such acts. I am not saying that anything bad will happen, but i am saying be aware of your surroundings and be careful.

 

[digitalising]

. also because grenada is a 3rd world country some locals might be inclined to use violence to get their point across, and the law might not be on your side when reporting such acts.

I think that's true in any country, even the United States. How you deal with the police and how they deal with you here is dependent on who you know, which may be something that is less apparent in the United States. Make good contacts when you get down here.

 

[howelljolly]

I think that's true in any country, even the United States. How you deal with the police and how they deal with you here is dependent on who you know, which may be something that is less apparent in the United States. Make good contacts when you get down here.

What?

Making good contacts is going to keep random people from chasing you with a machete?

 

[digitalising]

What?

Making good contacts is going to keep random people from chasing you with a machete?

Well, he must be pretty pissed if he's chasing you, right? Maybe if you had taken the time to know him...

What I meant was that post-chase, knowing certain people might:
1. Affect how seriously the police take your case.
2. Give you an idea of who to talk to if #1 isn't happening.

Your mileage may vary.

 

[howelljolly]

Well, he must be pretty pissed if he's chasing you, right? Maybe if you had taken the time to know him...

What I meant was that post-chase, knowing certain people might:
1. Affect how seriously the police take your case.
2. Give you an idea of who to talk to if #1 isn't happening.

Your mileage may vary.

Gimmie a break. Any number of things can make a native come after you. It might be as subtle as you not knowing and following a local custom - wearing something with a camo pattern, correcting someone's choice of words... speaking over, or too soon after someone else (native american), sitting such that your sole is visible (mid-east). Or it might be something that you have no or minimal control over, such as being American, a med student, tall, short, fat, gay...

A buddy of mine went down to the islands on vacation recently, and a random local came up to him and picked a fight with him because he's overweight.

"Sir, please... put the machete down. Lets grab a Red Stripe and talk about this. I'd really like to find out why you want to chop up us big-boned folks into small pieces. Yes, thats right. Just leave your cutlass with your friend here, and lets you and I get to know each other. You'll see that I'm just a bit rounder than you, but deep down, we're really just all the same."

 

[digitalising]

Gimmie a break. Any number of things can make a native come after you. It might be as subtle as you not knowing and following a local custom - wearing something with a camo pattern, correcting someone's choice of words... speaking over, or too soon after someone else (native american), sitting such that your sole is visible (mid-east). Or it might be something that you have no or minimal control over, such as being American, a med student, tall, short, fat, gay...

A buddy of mine went down to the islands on vacation recently, and a random local came up to him and picked a fight with him because he's overweight.

"Sir, please... put the machete down. Lets grab a Red Stripe and talk about this. I'd really like to find out why you want to chop up us big-boned folks into small pieces. Yes, thats right. Just leave your cutlass with your friend here, and lets you and I get to know each other. You'll see that I'm just a bit rounder than you, but deep down, we're really just all the same."

One of the problems with Internet forums is that sarcasm is often not understood without a tag, which is the equivalent of canned laughter on a sitcom.

Did you not notice that I started the next paragraph with "what I meant was?"

 

[howelljolly]

One of the problems with Internet forums is that sarcasm is often not understood without a tag, which is the equivalent of canned laughter on a sitcom.

Did you not notice that I started the next paragraph with "what I meant was?"

My apologies.

My clue to the irony was the fact that you are/were actually on the island, so you know how it really is. However, I thought that you must be one of those "cant we all just get along even though I refuse to understand your reason for not wanting to get along" people.

 

[digitalising]

My apologies.

My clue to the irony was the fact that you are/were actually on the island, so you know how it really is. However, I thought that you must be one of those "cant we all just get along even though I refuse to understand your reason for not wanting to get along" people.

Don't worry about it. I'm definitely not one of those people - if someone doesn't want to get along with me then they can be on their merry. Besides, social conflicts are opportunities for personal growth, or regression to one's most base tendencies. Either one is interesting.

As for your story, I definitely believe it. I hope your friend got out of it OK.

 

[schrizto]

just be careful in Grenada.. it's illegal to be a homosexual there, i am not joking and i am not trying to be rude or obnoxious. ask the other students on ValueMD if you don't believe me. while i don't know what the penalties are, i do know that it's illegal and looked down upon by the locals.

I really hope Nyotek reads this... he really needs to know that if he's going there.