shadowing is corny crap

[dittozip]

---

Members do not see this ad.

who else thinks that listing shadowing as an activity on amcas is corny crap that means nothing!?!?!?

im so sick of those threads.....

 

[NCF145]

who else thinks that listing shadowing as an activity on amcas is corny crap that means nothing!?!?!?

im so sick of those threads.....

Shadowing shows that you have an interest in medicine and counts toward clinical experience. There isn't many other places to get clinical experience. And every hospital I have ever been in the volunteers get about 0 interaction with the patients. All they do is the scut work for the hospital. So in my opinion shadowing >> volunteering in a hospital. It also gives you something to talk about during your interviews.

 

[TPROrgoTutor2]

My shadowing I scrubbed in on surgeries from day one. I don't think thats useless experience.

 

[braluk]

*puts on flame suit*

 

[chad5871]

My shadowing experiences have been fabulous so far, and I do think that it is a different type of experience than volunteering. When I shadow, I feel almost as if I become "doctor for a day." The physicians that I have worked with have taught me how to interview patients, taught me how they make diagnoses, etc. as well as discussing the difficulties and pleasures of a doctor's life. It has been a very useful learning experience.

As for hands-on patient care, however, I think that volunteering is more useful, especially if you are in a free clinic or missions setting, as you'll probably get more experience (assuming you aren't licensed in any way).

I will be listing both experiences on my AMCAS because I have found both of them useful in helping me confirm my decision to become a doctor.

 

[baylormed]

I think, like others have said, that it depends on your shadowing experience. If you are fortunate enough to get a good doctor (or several) you will have a great time. You can learn nice tricks and maybe even gain some useful practice in bedside manner for when you have to deal with patients for the first time on your rotations.

Also, take it as an opportunity to see the profession from the inside, even if you don't get much hands-on contact.

 

[Severus]

I will preface this by saying that there are some truly great shadowing experiences out there where pre-meds get to do/see tons of great things over an extended period of time.

That said, I believe **and I've said this all before** most of the shadowing that goes on is total BS resume filler. Now, I know someone is going to read that and get all pantybunch about it and try and flame me, but believe me, you will be wrong.

The problems I have with shadowing are:

1.) The pre-meds I've known IRL (which is no small number) tend to collect shadowing experiences just to collect them and later brag about it. Whenever a bunch of these people get together, it reminds me of a "Magic: the Gathering" tournament. "Shadowed a radiologist, eh? Impressive. But I'll see your radiologist and raise you a neurosurgeon. *Fireball! Fireball!!!*"

b.) A lot of times, it's very short-term. Maybe it's just me, but I hate when people put down stuff that they've done for like, a week, let alone a couple of hours. If I didn't put in a substantial amount of time into a project/experience, it never made it on my application.

III.) There are more hands-on/active ways of seeing and experiencing medicine. I'm not suggesting volunteer work at a hospital, because I've been there -- I know -- it's kind of dull and you don't see much. But there are tons of immigrant and community clinics that really need an extra pair of hands. The same thing can be said of senior centers and adult day cares; it might not sound as sexy, but you'll see so much stuff. There is always the EMT option or even ski/wilderness patrol if you're athletically inclined. I used my language skills to become a medical interpreter and that was total gold as I obviously saw/heard lots of things, got lots of patient contact, had to develop a good bedside manner and become adept at asking whatever personal questions the doctor needed answered.

Shadowing can be a great starting point. Just don't stop there. There are a ton of ways to become more involved and to experience medicine other than just accumulating 50 different shadowing experiences. 👍

 

[63768]

i don't know why people are making such a huge deal about shadowing. it's an easy activity, it's not hard to get a shadowing gig, and the AMCAS app is easy too.

that said, shadowing is a requisite commitment for getting into med school. either that or some other clinical experience. undergrads really don't have the time or experience to find something amazing and new.

 

[baylormed]

1.) The pre-meds I've known IRL (which is no small number) tend to collect shadowing experiences just to collect them and later brag about it. Whenever a bunch of these people get together, it reminds me of a "Magic: the Gathering" tournament. "Shadowed a radiologist, eh? Impressive. But I'll see your radiologist and raise you a neurosurgeon. *Fireball! Fireball!!!*"

I can totally picture that.

Not too long goes by without me hearing a pre-med say "I'm shadowing a CARDIOLOGIST" while daring the others to top that. Then another one will reply "Oh really? Well, I'm shadowing an ONCOLOGIST!". Then the first one will fire back with "My cardiologist lets me observe surgeries", while the other one will say "Well, my oncologist in the only oncologist in the area! Top that, sucker!"....and so on.

Does it really matter who you shadow?

Let me give you a clue: NO.

 

[JohnMadden]

Even if you don't like shadowing, view it as one of many things you will do that you don't necessarily enjoy as you enter a career in medicine.

Anecdote:
I had a buddy who shadowed a surgeon at an academic medical center. He didn't scrub in, but he assisted the anesthesiologist and PAs. He later applied to the medical school and got an interview.

Guess who his interviewer was --> The surgeon...

 

[gujuDoc]

My shadowing I scrubbed in on surgeries from day one. I don't think thats useless experience.

I also had a few other friends who were allowed to help with basic things like sutures while shadowing.

So I don't think it was useless.

Shadowing is done because some adcoms tell you to shadow and that a lack of it will hurt in the ECs dept.

 

[Stolenspatulas]

I also had a few other friends who were allowed to help with basic things like sutures while shadowing.

That is insane. I would sue the 5hit out of that hospital if I found out that happened. I hope you do not mean they had a chance at suturing.... but merely had a chance to hold onto the thread or something more trivial.

 

[MadHopsMD]

I can totally picture that.

Not too long goes by without me hearing a pre-med say "I'm shadowing a CARDIOLOGIST" while daring the others to top that. Then another one will reply "Oh really? Well, I'm shadowing an ONCOLOGIST!". Then the first one will fire back with "My cardiologist lets me observe surgeries", while the other one will say "Well, my oncologist in the only oncologist in the area! Top that, sucker!"....and so on.

Does it really matter who you shadow?

Let me give you a clue: NO.

I think I might have witness such a thing

 

[Stolenspatulas]

OP:

It totally depends on who you shadow/what they let you see/how interested they are in helping you.

I've seen some transplant surgeries (scrubbed in...).

I tell you one thing. That is not useless. Just to see the anticipation of the patient who's going to receive the transplant is ridiculawesome in itself.

 

[gujuDoc]

That is insane. I would sue the 5hit out of that hospital if I found out that happened. I hope you do not mean they had a chance at suturing.... but merely had a chance to hold onto the thread or something more trivial.

A. It was at a teaching hospital and supervised by the surgeons.
B. The patients were ok with it because it was a teaching hospital.
C. The patients are used to it because the med students who help do the same things during 1st and second year preceptorships all the time and they know that its a teaching hospital. Actually, I've never been involved with aiding in anything like that, but I've shadowed at a few places and the patients are actually very open about med students and premed students being there.

 

[gujuDoc]

I will preface this by saying that there are some truly great shadowing experiences out there where pre-meds get to do/see tons of great things over an extended period of time.

That said, I believe **and I've said this all before** most of the shadowing that goes on is total BS resume filler. Now, I know someone is going to read that and get all pantybunch about it and try and flame me, but believe me, you will be wrong.

The problems I have with shadowing are:

1.) The pre-meds I've known IRL (which is no small number) tend to collect shadowing experiences just to collect them and later brag about it. Whenever a bunch of these people get together, it reminds me of a "Magic: the Gathering" tournament. "Shadowed a radiologist, eh? Impressive. But I'll see your radiologist and raise you a neurosurgeon. *Fireball! Fireball!!!*"

b.) A lot of times, it's very short-term. Maybe it's just me, but I hate when people put down stuff that they've done for like, a week, let alone a couple of hours. If I didn't put in a substantial amount of time into a project/experience, it never made it on my application.

III.) There are more hands-on/active ways of seeing and experiencing medicine. I'm not suggesting volunteer work at a hospital, because I've been there -- I know -- it's kind of dull and you don't see much. But there are tons of immigrant and community clinics that really need an extra pair of hands. The same thing can be said of senior centers and adult day cares; it might not sound as sexy, but you'll see so much stuff. There is always the EMT option or even ski/wilderness patrol if you're athletically inclined. I used my language skills to become a medical interpreter and that was total gold as I obviously saw/heard lots of things, got lots of patient contact, had to develop a good bedside manner and become adept at asking whatever personal questions the doctor needed answered.

Shadowing can be a great starting point. Just don't stop there. There are a ton of ways to become more involved and to experience medicine other than just accumulating 50 different shadowing experiences. 👍

i agree with this post. I've shadowed some different kind of physicians, but only because it was recommended by an adcom at one of my state schools and something they wanted to see, but I also volunteer at two different clinics.

I think adcoms just want to see that you've talked to a few physicians, you know what you are signing up for, etc. Granted that you don't really know what it is to be a physician til you are one, they wanted to see that you thought about it some before diving into the deep end of things.

as per clinics in underserved areas, it might be better where you are but where I'm at its hard to find opportunities with them unless you are already a medical student or trained professional. They don't take volunteers on. I tried calling a bunch of places and that's what I found. I also found that the one place that does take people on is only really for people who are bilingual and can act as translators which I'm not. so that's useless to me.

I spent a few months doing my shadowing experiences so it wasn't a one day thing but I do know a few who did it as a few day thing and stopped going and don't think that's beneficial.

 

[chad5871]

I have a friend who has had an amazing "shadowing" experience. It all began innocently enough when my friend met a trauma surgeon at a local teaching hospital. As they started talking, the surgeon invited my friend to come down and shadow her. My friend quickly obliged. Since then, they have gotten to be extremely close friends, and in the three years that my friend has "shadowed" the physician, she has gotten to scrub in on multiple surgeries, gotten to help with the surgeon's research interests, and even assist with basic clinical procedures. My friend says that everyone is so used to her being at the hospital that they treat her like a medical student, showing her how to do things and teaching her about different cases that come in. They have even given her a personal pageer so that when the surgeon gets paged down to the Emergency Room, my friend can go down, too.

Anyway, my point is just that shadowing is what you make of it. It can be a great experience, or it can be useless resume-filling crap. It all depends on the doctor you shadow and how bold you are to ask about getting to do stuff.

 

[LifetimeDoc]

Just a side note: I feel it helps if you look like (professional, older, etc) and act like a medical student if you are seeking to shadow a physician. It makes the physician and the patients feel at ease if they know you are professional.

 

[chad5871]

Just a side note: I feel it helps if you look like (professional, older, etc) and act like a medical student if you are seeking to shadow a physician. It makes the physician and the patients feel at ease if they know you are professional.

I agree. When I shadow, I insist on wearing nice dress pants, a shirt, and a tie, and looking as neat and professional as I can. Even if the doctor I am shadowing tells me that it's okay to dress down, I feel it is better to dress more professionally to "fit in" with the physicians you will be working with. I also like to wear my ID badge in a clear plastic badge holder that I clip to my pocket so that patients can immediately see that I am a student, and that I belong there. I think it makes them feel better than just seeing some random college student following there doctor into exam rooms.

 

[gujuDoc]

A. It was at a teaching hospital and supervised by the surgeons.
B. The patients were ok with it because it was a teaching hospital.
C. The patients are used to it because the med students who help do the same things during 1st and second year preceptorships all the time and they know that its a teaching hospital. Actually, I've never been involved with aiding in anything like that, but I've shadowed at a few places and the patients are actually very open about med students and premed students being there.

Also, would like to add one more thing to this. The student in question had been doing research with the neurosurgery dept for years and so had some previous experience with how to do sutures granted that they were rats. But he wasn't just any joe shmo and the reason the guy allowed him to shadow was because one of the important people in the med school's adcom had given him a good reference. Oh and so you don't get confused, it wasn't a neurosurgeon that he shadowed, but rather a gen. surgeon who did gastrointestinal procedures.

also, why would you sue someone if your surgery went well just because you suddenly found out a student accepted but not yet started med school had been involved with the very most basic parts of the surgery under the aid and supervision of the surgeon in an academic teaching hospital were M1s-M4s and residents and other students including nursing students or 2 different universities are constantly rotating through??? Hope that long question isn't confusing. I think most of the patients at TGH realize its a teaching hospital and actually say they don't mind because they expect that students are rotating through all the time. I volunteer at a clinic next door to the hospital I'm talking about and that's where I've met several people that have told me that they don't mind. Even at the VA affiliated with our med school, all the patients seemed to be very open to students observing their procedures.

P.S. Please don't take my post the wrong way as I'm not attacking you or your post. I'm just trying to explain myself. So please don't take anything I say the wrong way or personally as I don't mean to come off that way and know its kinda hard to convey what you are trying to say with proper tone over the internet.

 

[NCF145]

That is insane. I would sue the 5hit out of that hospital if I found out that happened. I hope you do not mean they had a chance at suturing.... but merely had a chance to hold onto the thread or something more trivial.

Ha! I shadowed a neurosurgeon and he let me make the incision in the scalp and drill the three holes in the patient's skull. Needless to say this was extremely illegal and unethical. It was cool as hell though. Once the skull was opened he also let me touch the brain. It is pretty cool b/c it pulses with the heart.

 

[gujuDoc]

I agree. When I shadow, I insist on wearing nice dress pants, a shirt, and a tie, and looking as neat and professional as I can. Even if the doctor I am shadowing tells me that it's okay to dress down, I feel it is better to dress more professionally to "fit in" with the physicians you will be working with. I also like to wear my ID badge in a clear plastic badge holder that I clip to my pocket so that patients can immediately see that I am a student, and that I belong there. I think it makes them feel better than just seeing some random college student following there doctor into exam rooms.

Yeah that's what I do too. At one place I shadowed, my old volunteer coordinator let us get in through the volunteer dept. so I'd wear the dressy clothes but I'd wear my vol. badge and coat over my top so they'd know who I am and the residents always said who I was before letting me observe. One of those residents is now an attending at the same school.

 

[gujuDoc]

Ha! I shadowed a neurosurgeon and he let me make the incision in the scalp and drill the three holes in the patient's skull. Needless to say this was extremely illegal and unethical. It was cool as hell though. Once the skull was opened he also let me touch the brain. It is pretty cool b/c it pulses with the heart.

Was it at a place where a med school was affiliated or a private practice??

My experience with shadowing is that people are open to it when it is a medical school affiliated place and hence constantly has students rotate through. When its not an academic institution, both doctors and patients alike tend to be more hesitant about letting students shadow.

 

[Wizard of Oz]

My shadowing I scrubbed in on surgeries from day one. I don't think thats useless experience.

I did this as a patient care tech student. Very boring. Aside from the excitement of putting tubes in people's urethras, I got nothing from it other than an education regarding how surgeons treat residents and students.

 

[NCF145]

Was it at a place where a med school was affiliated or a private practice??

My experience with shadowing is that people are open to it when it is a medical school affiliated place and hence constantly has students rotate through. When its not an academic institution, both doctors and patients alike tend to be more hesitant about letting students shadow.

It was at a regional trauma center, but it wasn't a teaching hospital. The bad part about it was, the patient wasn't informed.😕

 

[Hurricane95]

I have no idea what "patient contact" some people are exactly referring to during volunteering....what patient contact? Most volunteers end up doing the nurse's b**ch work anyway. Volunteering to me is like nurse shadowing, seriously. Unless your idea of great patient contact is small-talk with patients while you wait for the elevator as you wheel them around occasionally, then good for you. You will not be exposed to what doctors do, and certainly will not learn anything really relevant. In my experience, only the very nicest patients will even bother holding a lengthy conversation with the kid wearing the volunteer tag on his shirt.

Shadowing >>>> volunteering, anyday

 

[LifetimeDoc]

Was it at a place where a med school was affiliated or a private practice??

My experience with shadowing is that people are open to it when it is a medical school affiliated place and hence constantly has students rotate through. When its not an academic institution, both doctors and patients alike tend to be more hesitant about letting students shadow.

mmm, I've had the exact opposite experience. At the teaching hospital where I volunteer, they really don't like letting people shadow. They say it's a violation of HIPAA to let pre-meds shadow, but you see medical students from USF/FSU/UF running around all the time, not to mention the many residents in the residency program.

I did sneak an observership form to an attending and he let me shadow. It all somehow got through the official channels at the hospital, probably being due to the fact that I'm older than most of the residents. But when the administration found out, they weren't happy about a pre-med shadowing and prefer to only allow medical students to shadow. I even had a small argument (I decided not to pursue my point so as not to upset him) with an attending about it saying that it was a "requirement" for medical school admissions to shadow. He insisted that shadowing wasn't a requirement for medical school, and that all you had to do was get good grades and an MCAT. Well that's not what the medical school ADCOMs tell me (on here and in person).

When I shadowed a physician in private practice, he/she actually let me do a couple of small procedures which amazed me. That would have been impossible at the teaching hospital. I guess it just depends on where you shadown.

 

[Wizard of Oz]

I'm afraid that I get nothing from shadowing--didn't as a nursing student, don't as an M1. Boring. Boring. I would certainly find humor in pre-meds bragging about it.

Get your hands a little bit dirty. Put yourselves in the true position of peon (like a nurse aide, phleb, or something) to supplement the shadowing during the summertime. It won't help you get into medical school, but it will give you some perspective on the system.

As a nursing student, my first semester was full of procedures and real patient contact. As an M1, just stand there with your cute tie and white coat and look interested. Now go back to your science books, little boy, you're not really a med student yet.

 

[pyrois]

I got nothing from it other than an education regarding how surgeons treat residents and students.

And you think that's not important? It's essential to know how your life will be in the future, especially the bad parts of life.

Some people can't take that sort of pressure, and shadowing is a great way to learn that before they drop $200K on med school and 4 years of their life.

 

[LifetimeDoc]

As a nursing student, my first semester was full of procedures and real patient contact. As an M1, just stand there with your cute tie and white coat and look interested. Now go back to your science books, little boy, you're not really a med student yet.

Doing nursing procedures is different than what a physician does. You need to shadow a doctor not to do hospital stuff, but to see what it's like as a physician, not what the other people in the healthcare team are doing.

 

[Wizard of Oz]

And you think that's not important? It's essential to know how your life will be in the future, especially the bad parts of life.

Some people can't take that sort of pressure, and shadowing is a great way to learn that before they drop $200K on med school and 4 years of their life.

Yeah but if you base your view of a physician's life on surgery, then you're doing yourself a great disservice too. I ALREADY knew that surgeons were rude, and I didn't want to be one before I got there.

I agree with you in the sense that many of my classmates knew squat before coming in (many still don't), but you could get the feel of the OR in a couple of afternoons. You have 3-4 years to be a premed, maximize your time on higher-yield activities like MCAT prep.

Everybody is going to have Patch Adams essays with that one moment that inspired them, but the rare occasion in which you actually worked with an interviewer is only likely if you knew it ahead of time. Plus that interviewer really should recuse him/herself.

Doing nursing procedures is different than what a physician does. You need to shadow a doctor not to do hospital stuff, but to see what it's like as a physician, not what the other people in the healthcare team are doing.

There is a patient element to nursing skills though. I agree that docs do very different things, but a patient letting you interview him/her as an M1 requires a different level of trust than if they are letting you start an IV. That experience is valuable, along with the general hospital operations (chart handling, comfort knowing who you can and can't talk to, etc.).

Many of my classmates came in cold with only outpatient shadowing as a reference. Then they come into the hospital timid and shy, less willing to jump right in.

Shadowing an outpatient doc is barely relevant to medical training.

 

[LifetimeDoc]

There is a patient element to nursing skills though. I agree that docs do very different things, but a patient letting you interview him/her as an M1 requires a different level of trust than if they are letting you start an IV. That experience is valuable, along with the general hospital operations (chart handling, comfort knowing who you can and can't talk to, etc.).

Many of my classmates came in cold with only outpatient shadowing as a reference. Then they come into the hospital timid and shy, less willing to jump right in.

I agree the experience is valuable, especially to get over the timidness. However, with respect to medical school admissions (of which everyone in this particular forum are highly focused on) physician shadowing would show the adcoms that you understand what a physician actually does. Without shadowing, you really have no idea. For example, on the outside it looks like doctors sit on their asses all day and go into see patients whenever they feel like it. Unless you are actually following them around, you don't get to see the actual work they do running from place to place, juggling several patients, and interacting with the patients behind closed doors.

 

[Wizard of Oz]

Yeah, I'll agree with LD on this one. The adcoms do want to see some shadowing (and the LOR that comes with it will be helpful). I think I said something like "supplement" above to cover my view here.

Get your hands a little bit dirty. Put yourselves in the true position of peon (like a nurse aide, phleb, or something) to supplement the shadowing during the summertime. It won't help you get into medical school, but it will give you some perspective on the system.

I should have emphasized that better. 👍

 

[pyrois]

Yeah but if you base your view of a physician's life on surgery, then you're doing yourself a great disservice too.

Not if you were set on becoming a surgeon.

That's why most people shadow a couple different types of doctors.

With respect to the time "better spent prepping for the MCAT" I'm not talking about actually getting into medical school, but making sure that medicine is the right thing for you.

In truth, if you know you want to go into medicine Freshman year, it is not beyond any college student's ability to go to class, do the homework, and pull the 3.5/30 they need to get in somewhere.

But if you don't have a true desire to become a doctor, and don't know why you're working so hard in the first place, all of a sudden waking up to get to lecture seems near impossible and doing homework/reading becomes tedious.

So shadow, but I would recommend shadowing early in the process versus late. To be honest, shadowing isn't a great "extra-curricular activity." I didn't even bother putting it on my AMCAS app. Shadowing is something you do for yourself.

 

[bwonger06]

ive never gotten to scrub in 🙁

although i have seen a lot of procedures, ive never gotten the chance to actually where the blue sterile scrubs while in the OR and was only in there for observational purposes.

 

[Wizard of Oz]

So shadow, but I would recommend shadowing early in the process versus late. To be honest, shadowing isn't a great "extra-curricular activity." I didn't even bother putting it on my AMCAS app. Shadowing is something you do for yourself.

Definitely agree with this big time, but there are two different perspectives being discussed, 😎 and the SDN perspective is often obsessed with the admissions process itself.

However, with respect to medical school admissions (of which everyone in this particular forum are highly focused on).

Regarding surgery, if any of you are interested, general surgery is very military and very lifestyle intensive. Pay is good, but it is the most traditional of all branches of medicine.

Tip: if you're premed, don't bother the surgeon unless he/she addresses you first. 👍

 

[remo]

I have shadowed a trauma surgeon for a year and it is awesome. It has been like a mini-clerkship. A couple days of shadowing is not very useful. You need to be with someone for awhile to actually learn what is going on. Everything I have learned about medicine has come from this experience. I have followed patients all the way from the trauma room to the OR to the ICU to finally being discharged. You would never get that kind of exposure as a volunteer. It is also a huge part of what they want to hear about in my interviews. No one has ever asked about my hospital volunteer experiences. Probably because they know it is a joke to run specimens to the lab, clean beds, etc... Volunteering is total boredom where you are basically doing the nurses's or EMT's job so they can slack off. Unfortunately, you have to do volunteering for your app too so don't blow it off..

 

[christian15213]

First I have to disagree with a lot of the negativity being spewn about shadowing. However, with a lot of it I actually agree. I.e. like the people who do it once or twice and think OMG I have saw surgery I am so ready to become a doctor now. To me that experience is SUPER lame if you only shadow once or twice because its like the beggining of a relationship. Everyone is all impressed and gushy inside, let it go a few months and watch the true colors fly come out.

With that said let me tell you about my shadowing experience thus far. First, for all the complaints I actually have regarding my school their shadowing program is actually tops in my opinion. I am overly impressed and coming from me that is pretty impressive. The first program is where they set you up with doctors in almost every field. You pick the time slots and all you have to do is complete 30 hours by the end of the semester with only 6 hours per speciality.

For me, I had 6 hours in the Cath lab (really 20), 6 hours in Cardiothoracic surgery (near the cath lab really 40 because I went like every thursday), 6 hours in Neurosurgery, 6 hours in pathology cough cough that sucked, 6 hours in invitro fertilization, check that 3.75 hours in invitro I couldn't stand it any longer... With it all said and done I had a lot of experience seeing a little bit of different medical fields. And from the hours you see I put in, the heart was tops in my book. I don't know why I am so obssesive with the heart but I love it the best.

Now, for this semester I do an externship with a doctor I met in the cath lab called an electrophysiologist... I had no idea what EP was before but I absolutly love it now.

Thursday's, are my day to be a doctor. The EP doctor is probably the best person I could have ever thought to of shadowed. I go there in the morning, about 9:00 am or ealier and stay until she about kicks me out and tells me to go home and study. I got the gig by walking into hospital the next semster and just walking up to her and asking if that would be cool to do. She was like sure.

Our day starts out with her trying to induce heart attacks in patients that are getting an "EP study." Happens more often than I thought. Then she tries to ablate <<spelling<< or eventually place an ICD or pace maker into the patient. The field does a little bit of everything, meaning surgery, cath and just regular patient interaction.

For lunch she takes me to the physicians lounge and there is a freaking super buffet with sushi and broiled this and that. I am like freaking wow you all eat like kings for free lol. In between cases and walking through the OR or Cath lab she explains to me studies and the cases she has for the day etc. During lunch she asks me about school and explains what I can do for interviews and all other types of good stuff...

Thursday's are my day and the best day's I will have all semester. The other doctors in the Cath lab know me by my first name and they even referr to me as Dr. so and so's student.

I learn so much I can't even describe it. From the beggining of the study to talking to the family after surgery. I can't imagine a person not doing something like this before they go to medical school.

With that said I spend 8 hours every thursday with her and I feel like I don't have enough time to volunteer. That is my only complaint but I dunno I feel like I should find a migrant workers clinic or something.

I dunno how bad it would look like if I had A super lot of hours for shadowing and not so much for volunteering. I dunno.

 

[chad5871]

Shadowing an outpatient doc is barely relevant to medical training.

That is true, but once again medical schools like to see that you have interacted with doctors and know what the lifestyle is like, and what they do on a day-to-day basis, either in the hospital or in an outpatient setting. They want you to be sure of your decision to pursue medicine. Perhaps you can convince the admissions committee of your decision without shadowing or talking to doctors, but I'd rather have something concrete that I can use as a reference when talking about my decision.

 

[Falco2525]

who else thinks that listing shadowing as an activity on amcas is corny crap that means nothing!?!?!?

im so sick of those threads.....

actually depends on your experience shadowing...I had incredible experiences shadowing and the doctor would even have me go in and take patient histories after a while...it was an incredible experience and made a big difference in my decision to go into medicine

 

[twohearted]

I have no idea what "patient contact" some people are exactly referring to during volunteering....what patient contact? Most volunteers end up doing the nurse's b**ch work anyway. Volunteering to me is like nurse shadowing, seriously. Unless your idea of great patient contact is small-talk with patients while you wait for the elevator as you wheel them around occasionally, then good for you. You will not be exposed to what doctors do, and certainly will not learn anything really relevant. In my experience, only the very nicest patients will even bother holding a lengthy conversation with the kid wearing the volunteer tag on his shirt.

Shadowing >>>> volunteering, anyday

That's some s**ty volunteering experience if I've ever heard it. You should have volunteered at a free clinic. They have me drawing blood, doing lab work, taking patient histories, bps, height, weight, glucose checks, etc. There are some great volunteering oportunities out there if you just look for them. In that, I would say
volunteering >>>> shadowing. You can get MUCH more patient contact. Not to say that shadowing can't be cool though. Some of these experiences people are talking about (suturing) I would love to have.

 

[christian15213]

Ha! I shadowed a neurosurgeon and he let me make the incision in the scalp and drill the three holes in the patient's skull. Needless to say this was extremely illegal and unethical. It was cool as hell though. Once the skull was opened he also let me touch the brain. It is pretty cool b/c it pulses with the heart.

WHAT THE FFFFFF are you talking about. What doctor or want to be de licensed and BANNED forever as you know it to be a doctor for some idiot kid that slips and drills a big hole is some poor smucks brain. ARE you kidding me. I am not even going to question this because it is so absurd. Anyone standing in the room or watching at the moment would have walked out of the room in disgust of having something so *****ic go on. 😱 plus and lastly, what was your point of saying that. Was someone else supposed to say "OH YEA, well I did a heart transplant and valve replacement all by myself while the doctor took a nap and the nurse was rubbing his shoulders." I mena seriously it is people llike you that make shadowing cheap and uninteresting because people think that if they are not doing things like you they aren't getting the right experience.

In fact, I wouldn't even want to touch the patient really because in the day and age of, "i want to sue you" I wouldn't want to put the doctor that is giving me the oppertunity of standing with her each and every thursday in any controversy or harms way.

If any doctor let you do that he or she is an arse clown and please let me know a name and address so I can nver go to them ever.

 

[Hurricane95]

Relax christian...money on the table says he is lying. No physician in the US would allow a student to do that. Maybe he shadowed a doc in the dominican republic? or is straight up lying.

 

[Hurricane95]

And besides, the brain does not pulse with the heart...perhaps the circle of willis, but certainly not the brain tissue.

 

[christian15213]

wow... hurricane is that avitar you? cause geezzzzz ur nice to study with.

 

[braluk]

Lol no, in the profile it says a 23 y/o male. And id be damned if that was a guy, but who knows with plastics these days


seriously though, who is that in your avatar? I believe you also had a picture of her on some type of workout bench too.

 

[lord_jeebus]

Relax christian...money on the table says he is lying. No physician in the US would allow a student to do that. Maybe he shadowed a doc in the dominican republic? or is straight up lying.

You haven't hung around with many neurosurgeons...they're a special breed and I can see them letting a premed do all sorts of crazy stuff.

They let me do those things (and worse), as an MS3...but trust me there's nothing I learned in med school that made it any safer than if a premed did it.

Yeah, it pulses.

 

[brianmartin]

I volunteer in the OHSU ED....it's sort of like shadowing a bunch of EM docs at once. Our actual job is to screen EMSTAT for patients that could be included in any of the studies currently being run (MRSA, RSV, Rib-fx), then if they meet the criteria, do an oral survey with the patient and possibly their family. We have a bunch of questions that we ask the residents all the time - "Do you think so-and-so in AC15 has a rib fracture?"

I definitely know what an EM doc does on a day-to-day basis. Or should I say minute-to-minute? We have a little cubicle right in the middle of the ED (behind the nurses station). We get to see and hear basically everything that goes on in the ED. We get to be in the resus room when trauma comes in. We are welcome in the meeting room during rounds. We are allowed access to the EM conferences. So on my AMCAS app, would I call this "shadowing," "volunteering," or "research"?

My point is, volunteering is not just pushing beds. A lot of hospitals have cool programs specifically meant for pre-med volunteers who want to do something besides hand out candycanes.

I need to shadow some other specialties though...

 

[gujuDoc]

It was at a regional trauma center, but it wasn't a teaching hospital. The bad part about it was, the patient wasn't informed.😕

Ohh. Now that I don't agree with too much. If you are going to get involved, the patient should be informed. In the case of my friend it was ok I think because the patients all knew it was a teaching hospital that rotated students through it and therefore were open to it. That and the student I'm talking about only did basic sutures.

 

[gujuDoc]

You haven't hung around with many neurosurgeons...they're a special breed and I can see them letting a premed do all sorts of crazy stuff.

They let me do those things (and worse), as an MS3...but trust me there's nothing I learned in med school that made it any safer than if a premed did it.

Yeah, it pulses.

But when you are in med school you are covered by a certain degree of malpractice that premeds are not covered by. So there's that slightly legal difference. Furthermore, what you did was in a teaching hospital where patients are informed of the fact that there are several students and residens rotating through it whereas the case with NCF was one where the patient was uninformed and the hospital was not one where patients regularly saw students rotating through it. That could have caused some legal liabilities.