Should I do the mcat a fourth time?

[Doctor W]

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MCAT 1: 18
MCAT 2: 21
MCAT 3: 502

I took mcat 1 and 2 last year. Unfortunately, I didnt know I had GAD, so when ever I studied for it I got anxious. After finding out about my GAD and being diagnosed this year, I did MCAT 3 . Also my first 60 credits my average was awful (C or C-) as a result of the GAD and SAD. But the latter 60 credits will be waaay better. I want to know if I should do the mcat for a 4th time.
Note: For those who think that I should look into another occupation, I graduated highschool at 16, 2 years early. I am also graduating next year at 19 after doing a 3 year honors bachelor. I developed my GAD when I entered university, and I am not giving up!
I also have very good ECs and will be doing a research review paper next semester.
Thanks

 

[JessebenBenjamin]

What's your cumulative GPA? Overall and science only?

 

[tenblackalps]

Time for Plan B.

But if you don't want to consider plan b, then what other option do you have then retaking the mcat? I'd try to go DO at this point based on what I have read on here.

I would imagine that a sequence of 18, 21, 502 is pretty lethal for MD.

 

[doctorleospaceman]

At this point, you would have to be extremely confident that you can do significantly better than a 502 to warrant a retake. Definitely do not rush into a retake if you choose to do so. If you do get your grades up and the rest of your application is in order, DO isn't out of reach with a 502.

 

[Goro]

IF your GAD is well under control, Just apply broadly to DO schools.

If you're boning for that MD, then a retake is required, and with a result like > 514.

 

[Lawpy]

MCAT 1: 18
MCAT 2: 21
MCAT 3: 502

I took mcat 1 and 2 last year. Unfortunately, I didnt know I had GAD, so when ever I studied for it I got anxious. After finding out about my GAD and being diagnosed this year, I did MCAT 3 . Also my first 60 credits my average was awful (C or C-) as a result of the GAD and SAD. But the latter 60 credits will be waaay better. I want to know if I should do the mcat for a 4th time.
Note: For those who think that I should look into another occupation, I graduated highschool at 16, 2 years early. I am also graduating next year at 19 after doing a 3 year honors bachelor. I developed my GAD when I entered university, and I am not giving up!
I also have very good ECs and will be doing a research review paper next semester.
Thanks

Focus strictly on DO schools. 3x low MCAT scores regardless of reasons are lethal for MD schools and present a strong history of poor decision making. Do not retake a 4th time because it's clear that you have peaked even though you have a slight upward trend.

 

[Giovanotto]

I'm always really impressed by someone who took it this many times. After my single attempt, I was telling myself, NEVER AGAIN!
The amount of energy that it drained, I may never gain back.

 

[Tommyguns89]

I'm always really impressed by someone who took it this many times. After my single attempt, I was telling myself, NEVER AGAIN!
The amount of energy that it drained, I may never gain back.

The only reason I didnt void my score even though I thought I did terrible was because I knew that would mean there was a 100% chance I would have to take it again.

 

[Gurby]

Also my first 60 credits my average was awful (C or C-) as a result of the GAD and SAD. But the latter 60 credits will be waaay better.

It sounds like you have some grade repair to do, and it will be a few years before you can think about applying to schools anyways. If you were to retake right now, your scores might be expired by the time you get around to applying. It seems to me that you should wait a year or two, see how your GPA is doing, and then think about this.

 

[xc_stallion92]

MCAT 1: 18
MCAT 2: 21
MCAT 3: 502

I took mcat 1 and 2 last year. Unfortunately, I didnt know I had GAD, so when ever I studied for it I got anxious. After finding out about my GAD and being diagnosed this year, I did MCAT 3 . Also my first 60 credits my average was awful (C or C-) as a result of the GAD and SAD. But the latter 60 credits will be waaay better. I want to know if I should do the mcat for a 4th time.
Note: For those who think that I should look into another occupation, I graduated highschool at 16, 2 years early. I am also graduating next year at 19 after doing a 3 year honors bachelor. I developed my GAD when I entered university, and I am not giving up!
I also have very good ECs and will be doing a research review paper next semester.
Thanks

If you've got a solid GPA, apply DO. Otherwise, retake courses and get that sweet, sweet grade replacement. I wouldn't take it again if I were you. MD is already likely not going to happen, and your score is already good enough for DO.

 

[Hospitalized]

I'm going to PM you something that might really help you.

Share the love.

 

[deleted158872]

don't retake. 502 is not excellent but it's not terrible, either.
do grade replacement if your gpa is not good, and apply to DO schools.

 

[samac]

I'd apply DO, but we have no idea what your GPA is which might be lethal they way you're talking.
You're in awful shape for Md and not awesome shape for DO, but possible.
If you retake and go down you're definitely done.

 

[TBV]

DO or PA

 

[Doctor W]

I cant retake courses. At my university, you can only retake courses that you have failed. My first two years (excluding 2 transfer courses) cGPA is 2.24. Even with a 4.0 in the last 2 years, I wont have more than gpa of 3.1. I have asked the university if they make exceptions for retaking courses and they said no. Anyone have any more ideas because I dont think I can even manage DO. I have no idea why Im leaughing, but for some reason I think my situation is hilarious.
Note: For ECs, I volunteer at 8 different organizaitons. Also I am a board member at 2 volunteer departments and at NGO.

 

[22031 Alum]

I cant retake courses. At my university, you can only retake courses that you have failed. My first two years (excluding 2 transfer courses) cGPA is 2.24. Even with a 4.0 in the last 2 years, I wont have more than gpa of 3.1. I have asked the university if they make exceptions for retaking courses and they said no. Anyone have any more ideas because I dont think I can even manage DO. I have no idea why Im leaughing, but for some reason I think my situation is hilarious.
Note: For ECs, I volunteer at 8 different organizaitons. Also I am a board member at 2 volunteer departments and at NGO.

You may have to consider retaking classes at a different institution.

You may have to consider volunteering at fewer organizations. You said in your first post that you have "very good ECs" but all that tells me now is that you can't handle both volunteer work and school work.

 

[jl lin]

I cant retake courses. At my university, you can only retake courses that you have failed. My first two years (excluding 2 transfer courses) cGPA is 2.24. Even with a 4.0 in the last 2 years, I wont have more than gpa of 3.1. I have asked the university if they make exceptions for retaking courses and they said no. Anyone have any more ideas because I dont think I can even manage DO. I have no idea why Im leaughing, but for some reason I think my situation is hilarious.
Note: For ECs, I volunteer at 8 different organizaitons. Also I am a board member at 2 volunteer departments and at NGO.

I can be pretty jovial, but I have no idea why you would be laughing--unless you decided to say, "Ah screw it!" and do something else.

And you can re-take the courses elsewhere. There are many legitimate schools that would be more than happy to take your money for re-takes.

What problem do you have with DO? Even if it's with the OMM, I am sure you could get through it if you wanted--perhaps even grab some takeaways from it.

No offense, but SMH.

 

[Godspeedyou]

I can be pretty jovial, but I have no idea why you would be laughing--unless you decided to say, "Ah screw it!" and do something else.

And you can re-take the courses elsewhere. There are many legitimate schools that would be more than happy to take your money for re-takes.

What problem do you have with DO? Even if it's with the OMM, I am sure you could get through it if you wanted--perhaps even grab some takeaways from it.

No offense, but SMH.

It sounds like he's implying that even DO schools wouldn't accept him. Chill out, maybe, yeah?

 

[Dr.Tao]

......

 

[Doctor W]

1-So with my stats I can do DO?
2-Am I good for Caribbean? I know Caribbean is awful but I dont care.
3-How would I take courses at a different university? Would I have to start a new bachelor's?
Thanks

 

[Doctor W]

You may have to consider retaking classes at a different institution.

You may have to consider volunteering at fewer organizations. You said in your first post that you have "very good ECs" but all that tells me now is that you can't handle both volunteer work and school work.

I now can handle a huge schedule and my avergae for courses taken after year 2 is 80%.

 

[Lawpy]

1-So with my stats I can do DO?
2-Am I good for Caribbean? I know Caribbean is awful but I dont care.
3-How would I take courses at a different university? Would I have to start a new bachelor's?
Thanks

1. Yes
2. You should care. Do not ever think about applying to Caribbean
3. Just enroll as a non-matriculated student and take classes for grade repair

 

[jl lin]

It sounds like he's implying that even DO schools wouldn't accept him. Chill out, maybe, yeah?

Yea, I'm pretty chilled. I'm saying, maybe the is telling him, "Screw it." Maybe, he's had a few too many. IDK. Yes, he's already been told by admins above what to do. Somehow, however, the concept of re-takes at another school eludes him. So....

 

[Doctor W]

I didnt think of doing retakes at another school because I didnt know. Also I am laughing not because I dont care anymore, but because I dont know what to do and rather then get a panic attack, I start laughing at my own misfortune. Its like if you see someone slip on a banana, you would laugh. Well not all of you, but I sure would.

 

[Doctor W]

1-Whats wrong with Caribbean? Yes you choose last in residency, but its still medicine.
2-Would it better I retook courses at another university, or just take more courses and hope I do good at them in my current university?
3-If I were to take extra courses next year, would I have to apply in 2017 or 2016 and say in my document that I am taking more courses?

 

[jqueb29]

2-Am I good for Caribbean? I know Caribbean is awful but I dont care.

Do you have a pulse? Can you get approved for loans? Then you'll get accepted into the Caribbean. But do NOT go there. You will end up in major debt and will never become a doctor to pay it off. It is difficult to match in the U.S. from the Caribbean, and the unfortunate reality that you need to accept is that your stats very very strongly suggest that you would have nothing to show from your time in the Carib except for a pile of debt.

 

[Lawpy]

Do you have a pulse? Can you get approved for loans? Then you'll get accepted into the Caribbean. But do NOT go there. You will end up in major debt and will never become a doctor to pay it off. It is difficult to match in the U.S. from the Caribbean, and the unfortunate reality that you need to accept is that your stats very very strongly suggest that you would have nothing to show from your time in the Carib except for a pile of debt.

@Goro is pleased

 

[Doctor W]

Do you have a pulse? Can you get approved for loans? Then you'll get accepted into the Caribbean. But do NOT go there. You will end up in major debt and will never become a doctor to pay it off. It is difficult to match in the U.S. from the Caribbean, and the unfortunate reality that you need to accept is that your stats very very strongly suggest that you would have nothing to show from your time in the Carib except for a pile of debt.

All right then carribean school is put on hold. That leaves me with DO or retaking/ taking more courses. I could also do a masters.

 

[Doudline]

You have two years of C/C- grades, three sub-25 MCATs, unchecked mental illness (I have a close relative with GAD, and it takes years to tame even with medication and therapy), and ECs that are almost certainly lacking (only two/three years of college, GAD and SAD).

I am not trying to be rude, and I commend you for your hard work through all this, but medical school shouldn't be on your map right now. You are still young; take a few years off to repair your GPA travel, work, volunteer, do stuff you're passionate about, learn about yourself. Try to become a better person (not that you aren't a great person already!).

Perhaps you will get into a bottom-tier DO school -or not-, but going in only because someone will take you sounds like a disaster.

But of course, that's just my opinion.

 

[Doctor W]

You have two years of C/C- grades, three sub-25 MCATs, unchecked mental illness (I have a close relative with GAD, and it takes years to tame even with medication and therapy), and ECs that are almost certainly lacking (only two/three years of college, GAD and SAD).

I am not trying to be rude, and I commend you for your hard work through all this, but medical school shouldn't be on your map right now. You are still young; take a few years off to repair your GPA travel, work, volunteer, do stuff you're passionate about, learn about yourself. Try to become a better person (not that you aren't a great person already!).

Perhaps you will get into a bottom-tier DO school -or not-, but going in only because someone will take you sounds like a disaster.

But of course, that's just my opinion.

Thank you for your honesty. I am 3 years ahead of my peers as I am impatient. Taking a few years off would be a great idea for me. Just one question: Why are my ECs lacking? I have hundreds of hours in clinical and non-clinical volunteering, would multiple board memberships and a research review next semester. Is that not "good"?

 

[Tommyguns89]

1-So with my stats I can do DO?
2-Am I good for Caribbean? I know Caribbean is awful but I dont care.
3-How would I take courses at a different university? Would I have to start a new bachelor's?
Thanks

I just want to say if you actually analyze the data, caribbean match rates from students applying the first time, from schools like SGU arent AWFUL if you are ok with likely matching into primary care. However those rates are only for students who make it to graduation. They have high attrition because they accept a lot of people who shouldnt be there. The question is, will you be one of those people? IMO if you are a decent stat applicant(3.4/28+) who doesnt get love from US MD/DO for whatever reasons(and it is SO competitive these days that those reasons can be quite trivial) then a school like SGU isnt that bad as a last resort. However if the reason you cant get into a US school is academic in nature, going to the caribbean is very likely to be a big mistake, at least until you figure out why you are having trouble performing.

 

[Doctor W]

I just want to say if you actually analyze the data, caribbean match rates from students applying the first time, from schools like SGU arent AWFUL if you are ok with likely matching into primary care. However those rates are only for students who make it to graduation. They have high attrition because they accept a lot of people who shouldnt be there. The question is, will you be one of those people? IMO if you are a decent stat applicant(3.4/28+) who doesnt get love from US MD/DO for whatever reasons(and it is SO competitive these days that those reasons can be quite trivial) then a school like SGU isnt that bad as a last resort. However if the reason you cant get into a US school is academic in nature, going to the caribbean is very likely to be a big mistake, at least until you figure out why you are having trouble performing.

Thats the problem. I dont have performance problems CURRENTLY. Its my past that is haunting me.

 

[Tommyguns89]

1. Yes
2. You should care. Do not ever think about applying to Caribbean
3. Just enroll as a non-matriculated student and take classes for grade repair

This is what I did as a career changer who needed the pre-reqs. I will warn you, you will likely need to scratch and claw your way into any pre-req classes you need to take. As a non-matriculated you will be the last to register.

 

[Tommyguns89]

Thats the problem. I dont have performance problems CURRENTLY. Its my past that is haunting me.

A 502 MCAT is equivalent to a 26 on the old exam by percentile, and that was after taking it twice. I dont want to come across as mean spirited but I do not think it is all behind you. You should at least try to do grade replacement and apply DO once. Once you start in the caribbean you are basically locked in, and it will be near impossible to go to a US school if you change your mind.

 

[soadhead]

Thats the problem. I dont have performance problems CURRENTLY. Its my past that is haunting me.

You haven't shown it yet. If you can get a 514+ on your 4th MCAT and get 3.8+ GPA the rest of the way, then you can say that you don't have performance problems currently. You might want to hold off on your dream of becoming a doctor ASAP and take an extra year or two after getting your undergraduate degree to raise your GPA to a somewhat "competitive" level. You can do it, but it's going to take a lot of work. I had a 2.1 GPA after 2 years. I went to school for 4 more years to raise my GPA to 3.3 (3.4 if my appeal goes through). Even with that, my well above average MCAT, and veteran status it is still hard to get an interview at lower tier MD schools.

Edit: I just want to add that I am now 31 years old, and I wasn't happy about starting med school as a 30+ year old but I did what I had to do to get my numbers up to a respectable level. You're going to be much younger once you get to that point if you work your butt off, so try not to be in such a hurry.

 

[tortelliniboy]

As an unbiased person you've shown rash/poor decision making, lack of research on the whole process, impatience, not enough evidence you have put your past behind you.

Even if by some miracle you got in this is only the first round in the fight. What's to say you won't fail step 1, step 2, or step 3. Then there's the licensing exams for your specialty and ITE's too.

Repairing your current standings is possible but it will take a few years and money lost in the form of tuition, applications, review material, and lost wages from not working.

 

[123456123456]

I think you should concentrate on DO schools and getting good EC experiences and focus on school, do not retake the MCAT. If you get some great ECs and accumulate a lot of clinical hours volunteering and shadowing and maybe working in the medical field as a scribe, EMT, CNA, ect & get really good grades starting now then you have a very decent chance with DO schools. I knew a few scribes with 27 MCAT scores (similar to the equivalent of a 502) that got into DO schools because they had amazing ECs and average GPAS

 

[jl lin]

I didnt think of doing retakes at another school because I didnt know. Also I am laughing not because I dont care anymore, but because I dont know what to do and rather then get a panic attack, I start laughing at my own misfortune. Its like if you see someone slip on a banana, you would laugh. Well not all of you, but I sure would.

I often like to say, "Panic is contraindicated." No need for that or beating yourself up. If your stress response is to laugh initially somewhere off to yourself, that's fine. Problem-solving is the deal here.

 

[TBV]

I cant retake courses. At my university, you can only retake courses that you have failed. My first two years (excluding 2 transfer courses) cGPA is 2.24. Even with a 4.0 in the last 2 years, I wont have more than gpa of 3.1. I have asked the university if they make exceptions for retaking courses and they said no. Anyone have any more ideas because I dont think I can even manage DO. I have no idea why Im leaughing, but for some reason I think my situation is hilarious.
Note: For ECs, I volunteer at 8 different organizaitons. Also I am a board member at 2 volunteer departments and at NGO.

You could do a master's program but even then the MCAT is damning

 

[TBV]

1-Whats wrong with Caribbean? Yes you choose last in residency, but its still medicine.
2-Would it better I retook courses at another university, or just take more courses and hope I do good at them in my current university?
3-If I were to take extra courses next year, would I have to apply in 2017 or 2016 and say in my document that I am taking more courses?

Read this, it is long but its a good read and tells all about why you shouldn't go to the Caribbean
https://milliondollarmistake.wordpress.com/

 

[TBV]

I just want to say if you actually analyze the data, caribbean match rates from students applying the first time, from schools like SGU arent AWFUL if you are ok with likely matching into primary care. However those rates are only for students who make it to graduation. They have high attrition because they accept a lot of people who shouldnt be there. The question is, will you be one of those people? IMO if you are a decent stat applicant(3.4/28+) who doesnt get love from US MD/DO for whatever reasons(and it is SO competitive these days that those reasons can be quite trivial) then a school like SGU isnt that bad as a last resort. However if the reason you cant get into a US school is academic in nature, going to the caribbean is very likely to be a big mistake, at least until you figure out why you are having trouble performing.

If you're ok with matching into family medicine you should be a DO. So you can get more favorable loans, have less debt, and stand a better chance of matching.

 

[TBV]

Not all off-shore schools are the same and the 50% match rate needs to be examined with:
1) how many students who start the program earn a degree (attrition rate)
2) How many graduates remain active applicants and rank in match (ie pass USMLE and get interviewed/ranked for match)
3) how many students match in residency (not after match placement)
4) how many students match in prelim spots
5) how many students place in after match SOAP or off cycle contracts

For comparison, US MD/DO schools have a 94% graduation rate after 5 years (97% after 8 for dual degree) with a 94% Match rate (and near 100% placement.) So about 88% of students who start graduate and match a slot within 5 years. This number would be closer to over 95% if taking into account all who graduate (thru 8 years) and then either match or place. So if 97% graduate and 99% match/place (some dont get a spot or dont even seek a spot) means 96% of students who start a US MD/DO program with graduate and get a residency slot.

Better Caribbean schools (the big 3/4) have a 50% attrition rate and at best, 85% placement (with 55%-60% match and 30% after match). So they have 40%-45% rate of starting school and getting any residency slot, including less desired specialties, geographic locations, specific programs, and prelim spots. In short, alot of spots that are not particularly wanted

Yeah, I know.

 

[Med Ed]

MCAT 1: 18
MCAT 2: 21
MCAT 3: 502

I took mcat 1 and 2 last year. Unfortunately, I didnt know I had GAD, so when ever I studied for it I got anxious. After finding out about my GAD and being diagnosed this year, I did MCAT 3 . Also my first 60 credits my average was awful (C or C-) as a result of the GAD and SAD. But the latter 60 credits will be waaay better. I want to know if I should do the mcat for a 4th time.
Note: For those who think that I should look into another occupation, I graduated highschool at 16, 2 years early. I am also graduating next year at 19 after doing a 3 year honors bachelor. I developed my GAD when I entered university, and I am not giving up!
I also have very good ECs and will be doing a research review paper next semester.
Thanks

You will graduate at 19. The average medical school matriculant is 24. The average allopathic matriculant has over a 32 on the MCAT. You have taken it three times and barely cracked the equivalent of a 25. You have also been diagnosed rather recently with an anxiety disorder. Medical school is fertile ground for anxiety.

Your best course of action is to spend a few years doing something else, continuing to mature, and learning how effectively you can manage your GAD. Even if you can somehow snag a spot at a DO school, rushing into medical school under your circumstances is a recipe for disaster.

 

[Goro]

To follow up on my learned colleague's comments, medical school is a furnace, and I've seen it break even healthy students.

You will graduate at 19. The average medical school matriculant is 24. The average allopathic matriculant has over a 32 on the MCAT. You have taken it three times and barely cracked the equivalent of a 25. You have also been diagnosed rather recently with an anxiety disorder. Medical school is fertile ground for anxiety.

Your best course of action is to spend a few years doing something else, continuing to mature, and learning how effectively you can manage your GAD. Even if you can somehow snag a spot at a DO school, rushing into medical school under your circumstances is a recipe for disaster.

 

[TBV]

To follow up on my learned colleague's comments, medical school is a furnace, and I've seen it break even healthy students.

M2 be like...

 

[Demosthenes1]

You have two years of C/C- grades, three sub-25 MCATs, unchecked mental illness (I have a close relative with GAD, and it takes years to tame even with medication and therapy), and ECs that are almost certainly lacking (only two/three years of college, GAD and SAD).

I am not trying to be rude, and I commend you for your hard work through all this, but medical school shouldn't be on your map right now. You are still young; take a few years off to repair your GPA travel, work, volunteer, do stuff you're passionate about, learn about yourself. Try to become a better person (not that you aren't a great person already!).

Perhaps you will get into a bottom-tier DO school -or not-, but going in only because someone will take you sounds like a disaster.

But of course, that's just my opinion.

Isn't a 502 equivalent to a ~27?

 

[genericscreenname]

Out of curiosity, how did you/are you treating the GAD?