Should I stop now?

[ploidy]

I am currently finishing up my sophomore year of college and pursuing a bachelors in human biology. The only reason I am doing human biology is for med school, I understand a lot of classes in that major you need anyways so I thought I might as well do it. For background I transferred from a community college after freshmen year, in CC I had a 3.9 but my university does not factor in your GPA from other schools. My first semester of sophomore year I had a 3.625, and this semester it looks like I'm going to have a 3.25-3.45 depending how finals go. My school only grades in .5 increments: 3.0,3.5,4.0.

My question is if I should stop trying this now before I end up with a bachelors in human biology with no real interest in being a biologist and being unacceptable to med school. As far as my science classes go, molecular biology has been very difficult for me and I will get a 3.0 in it, inorganic chemistry 1 was okay I got a 3.5 and missed a 4.0 by 1.8%, physics has been easy for me I got a 4.0 in the first, and I will either get a 3.5-4 in physics 2.

I live in Michigan, and I wouldn't mind leaving the state for med school if it helps. I really do not want to go overseas for school, but if I have to I will. I applied for some internships for the summer and was denied, so I am now taking classes at my community college to transfer over.

From my short description of myself, and academics, I would like a honest evaluation from someone who knows more about this than me. If I am struggling already in inorganic chem and molecular biology what is the chance I will be able to leave school with a competitive GPA after taking semesters of upper-level science classes?

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[Goro]

You should whatever classes interest you. We don't care what take, only that you do well.

 

[ploidy]

You should whatever classes interest you. We don't care what take, only that you do well.

Honestly these classes are the only ones that do interest me, especially because I will need them for my future (hopefully). I was at first going to do computer engineering, those classes were really easy got 4.0s no problem, but they really were boring. Right now molecular biology is difficult and confusing, but I enjoy learning about how the world works.

 

[rufflev]

You can change majors to something that is not a 'hard science' and still do the pre-med track. That way you can keep your options open in case you ever decide medicine is not the way to go.

 

[ploidy]

You can change majors to something that is not a 'hard science' and still do the pre-med track. That way you can keep your options open in case you ever decide medicine is not the way to go.

Either way I have to do the hard science, in my mind I thought I might as well get a degree. In addition, if I am unable to get a degree in human biology how would I go through medical school?

 

[Dr. Stalker]

I am currently finishing up my sophomore year of college and pursuing a bachelors in human biology. The only reason I am doing human biology is for med school, I understand a lot of classes in that major you need anyways so I thought I might as well do it. For background I transferred from a community college after freshmen year, in CC I had a 3.9 but my university does not factor in your GPA from other schools. My first semester of sophomore year I had a 3.625, and this semester it looks like I'm going to have a 3.25-3.45 depending how finals go. My school only grades in .5 increments: 3.0,3.5,4.0.

My question is if I should stop trying this now before I end up with a bachelors in human biology with no real interest in being a biologist and being unacceptable to med school. As far as my science classes go, molecular biology has been very difficult for me and I will get a 3.0 in it, inorganic chemistry 1 was okay I got a 3.5 and missed a 4.0 by 1.8%, physics has been easy for me I got a 4.0 in the first, and I will either get a 3.5-4 in physics 2.

I live in Michigan, and I wouldn't mind leaving the state for med school if it helps. I really do not want to go overseas for school, but if I have to I will. I applied for some internships for the summer and was denied, so I am now taking classes at my community college to transfer over.

From my short description of myself, and academics, I would like a honest evaluation from someone who knows more about this than me. If I am struggling already in inorganic chem and molecular biology what is the chance I will be able to leave school with a competitive GPA after taking semesters of upper-level science classes?

OP - you're not alone. A lot of people make this, mistake, for lack of a better word.

All you need for medical school are your pre-reqs and anything specific a medical school asks for.

Beyond that, take classes you like and can do well in. If your passion isn't in human biology, just stop! Plain and simple. I ultimately picked a major after heavy debate not because it only satisfied my pre-med reqs, but because I enjoyed the upper division courses I needed to take.

A professor that wrote me a letter of rec told me about his daughter; premed and double majored in french literature and history cause that's what she liked. Adcoms can provide more insight, but so long as you have a strong GPA, and your pre-med reqs are fulfilled, take what you enjoy!

After all, you're only in college once! (hopefully )

 

[deleted838145]

your GPA now is not bad for DO. You still have a chance so long as it doesn't drop much further. Also, do well on your MCAT. Don't lose hope just yet.

 

[aformerstudent]

Here's the advice you need man...

1. With regards to undergrad, major in something you will do well in. No point in majoring in something that gets you only a 3.0. Who will hire someone with a 3.0 when there are others with higher GPA's with that major?
2. Medical school does not require knowledge of the pre-reqs or any "undergraduate-level" course to do well. From my experience, it helps to have the science background but it is absolutely not required. I would say you only need a background in a cell and molecular biology to start strong.
3. You take cell biology for 16 weeks in undergrad. In medical school, you do it in one week. So the course itself will not get you ready for med school. What will get you ready is your work ethic and that is demonstrated by your GPA.
4. I wish I majored in sociology in undergrad because that's what I really liked and did really well in. I majored in something harder and totally different and I don't know what to do with that degree.
5. Take a different approach to your classes, don't look at them for what they are. Look at them as hoops to get to med school. When you do that, you'll be motivated to do better in them.

 

[Lawpy]

Honestly these classes are the only ones that do interest me, especially because I will need them for my future (hopefully). I was at first going to do computer engineering, those classes were really easy got 4.0s no problem, but they really were boring. Right now molecular biology is difficult and confusing, but I enjoy learning about how the world works.

Either way I have to do the hard science, in my mind I thought I might as well get a degree. In addition, if I am unable to get a degree in human biology how would I go through medical school?

1. You don't have to major in human biology. Major in computer engineering or whatever. All you need is to do well in prereqs like 1 year general biology, 1 year general chemistry, 1 year organic chemistry, 1 year physics (each with labs), 1 year English, biochemistry, psychology, sociology, and ideally a statistics course

2. People get through med school fine regardless of their undergrad background. Doing well in prereqs and MCAT is key.

 

[ploidy]

Thank you guys for the responses. Honestly, these classes are the ones that interest me, even though they are difficult. From experience, does someone know if I'll even have a chance of getting through medical school (if I get accepted) if molecular biology and chem 1 is hard for me?

Being a doctor is the only profession I would be happy doing, but I do want to know if I am waisting my time. I know none of you guys know me and you can only make assumptions based off the short description I posted. I'm hoping someone who has been through what I am doing can tell me if I can make it or if it's a lost cause.

 

[Goro]

Either way I have to do the hard science, in my mind I thought I might as well get a degree. In addition, if I am unable to get a degree in human biology how would I go through medical school?

You can be an art major and still get into med school.

Med school will teach you what you need to know.

 

[ploidy]

You can be an art major and still get into med school.

Med school will teach you what you need to know.

I understand that now, my concern though is if I can barely maintain a competitive GPA in undergrad what is the chance that I can complete medical school. Also, I have grown an interest to science so I wouldn't really want to change majors. I especially would not want to change majors because I can't do it.

 

[Goro]

I understand that now, my concern though is if I can barely maintain a competitive GPA in undergrad what is the chance that I can complete medical school. Also, I have grown an interest to science so I wouldn't really want to change majors. I especially would not want to change majors because I can't do it.

OK, so it seem, that you're having a downward trend. That's actually quite common, thank;s to Orgo and physics, the major weeding courses. I suggest for you, stick with a major that will allow you to go into a different career in case medicine isn't in the cards. So IF your GPA doesn't rebound by the end of JR year, then seriously think about something else.

In the meantime, visit your school's learning or education center for help with study tips, learning styles, test taking strategies, etc.

Don't even think about going to a Carib diploma mill, or you'll end up like one of the posters in this forum.

 

[mwsapphire]

 

[aformerstudent]

Be sure to check out St. George's University in Grenada. It is a good school should you choose to take that route.

I'm being real unlike some people on this forum that preach platitudes.

 

[Medic741]

Be sure to check out St. George's University in Grenada. It is a good school should you choose to take that route.

I'm being real unlike some people on this forum that preach platitudes.

NO. NO NO NO. Do not follow this poster's advice. For 300,000 reasons stacked in little green papers. Goro calls it like it is... ^^^

 

[Goro]

OP, here's some disinfectant for some of the bad advice that's been strewn in this thread. Pay very careful attention, and also do a search in these fora as to why the Carib option is a bad one.

As long as you have a pulse and can write an up-front tuition check, chances are excellent.


The point here isn't that there are successful Carib grads. The point is how many additional obstacles to success you face by going to a Carib school.


Quoting the wise gyngyn:

The pool of US applicants from the Caribbean is viewed differently by Program Directors. The DDx for a Caribbean grad is pretty off-putting: bad judgment, bad advice, egotism, gullibility, overbearing parents, inability to delay gratification, IA's, legal problems, weak research skills, high risk behavior. This is not to say that all of them still have the quality that drew them into this situation. There is just no way to know which ones they are. Some PD's are in a position where they need to, or can afford to take risks too! So, some do get interviews.


Bad grades and scores are the least of the deficits from a PD's standpoint. A strong academic showing in a Caribbean medical school does not erase this stigma. It fact it increases the perception that the reason for the choice was on the above-mentioned list!

Just about everyone from a Caribbean school has one or more of these problems and PDs know it. That's why their grads are the last choice even with a high Step 1 score.

There was a time when folks whose only flaw was being a late bloomer went Carib, but those days are gone. There are a number of spots at US schools with grade replacement for these candidates.

It's likely you'll be in the bottom half or two thirds of the class that gets dismissed before Step 1. The business plan of a Carib school depends on the majority of the class not needing to be supported in clinical rotations. They literally can't place all 250+ of the starting class at clinical sites (educational malpractice, really. If this happened at a US school, they be shut down by LCME or COCA, and sued.


The Carib (and other offshore) schools have very tenuous, very expensive, very controversial relationships with a very small number of US clinical sites. You may think you can just ask to do your clinical rotations at a site near home. Nope. You may think you don't have to worry about this stuff. Wrong.

And let's say you get through med school in the Carib and get what you need out of the various clinical rotation scenarios. Then you are in the match gamble. I don't need to say a word about this - you can find everything you need to know at nrmp.org.

You really need to talk to people who made it through Carib into residency, and hear the story from them. How many people were in their class at the start, how many are in it now? How long did it take to get a residency, and how did they handle the gap year(s) and their student loans? How many residencies did they apply to, how many interviews did they get, and were any of the programs on their match list anything like what they wanted?

A little light reading:

Million $ Mistake

Medical School at SGU

 

[aformerstudent]

OP is a sophomore in college. I don't think he cares what you have to say right now. Besides Michigan is an IMG friendly state so who are you to say PD's don't look at IMG's when apparently THEY DO.

Anyway OP, you're not at that point yet but keep all your cards on the table and if the US route doesn't work out for you, just know that there are other options available should you want to become an MD. It won't be easy but just because you don't get into med school in the US doesn't mean you can't become a doctor. Many have done it before, many are doing it now, and many will continue to do it in the future.

 

[mwsapphire]

There are other IMG's besides the on that got to the Caribbean. Goro never said all IMG's have a bad rep- he said Caribbean ones do.

 

[aformerstudent]

2. People get through med school fine regardless of their undergrad background. Doing well in prereqs and MCAT is key.

That's debatable.

 

[aformerstudent]

There are other IMG's besides the on that got to the Caribbean. Goro never said all IMG's have a bad rep- he said Caribbean ones do.

English please

 

[Turkishking]

English please

Individuals that attend these schools are not meant to enter medical school. Maybe a few, but not the majority.

 

[aformerstudent]

Individuals that attend these schools are not meant to enter medical school. Maybe a few, but not the majority.

Ok, I understand now.

 

[Lawpy]

That's debatable.

what do you mean?

 

[RangerBob]

Thank you guys for the responses. Honestly, these classes are the ones that interest me, even though they are difficult. From experience, does someone know if I'll even have a chance of getting through medical school (if I get accepted) if molecular biology and chem 1 is hard for me?

Being a doctor is the only profession I would be happy doing, but I do want to know if I am waisting my time. I know none of you guys know me and you can only make assumptions based off the short description I posted. I'm hoping someone who has been through what I am doing can tell me if I can make it or if it's a lost cause.

I used to hear that all the time, but the truth is if you really believe it you're doing yourself a disservice. Happiness (true happiness) is entirely intrinsic and dependent on how you view and react to the world and your circumstances, not extrinsic and based on the circumstances themselves. Sure, it helps to have money, fun job, etc., but truly happy don't need that to be happy, and unhappy people won't become happy by having it. You know who one of the happiest people I've ever met is? One of the janitors at the VA. All the physicians know him by name because he's such a happy guy, always talking with staff, patients, etc. Many of us might not think his job is great, but he seems to find a lot of meaning and enjoyment in what he does. I'm sure he'd be just as happy as a sewer cleaner or a movie star.

(Plus, for the record, your choice of spouse will have far more impact on your happiness than your career choice)

It will only help you to consider other careers. The worst thing that happens is you fall in love with something else. Listen to the advice of others here--just the pre-reqs are needed. The higher-level courses will hardly help you at all in medical school. Take it from me--I was an art major and I did just fine in medical school. I am very thankful I wasn't a bio/health sciences major--if I didn't get into medical school there was no job I would've wanted where a bio degree was going to help me. I would've looked into architecture or landscape architecture (my alternative career choice).

If you don't see yourself using a bio degree for a career outside of medicine, there's no point in getting that degree--it'd be a waste of time to major in something that won't help you (well, hardly) in medical school or help you get a job in what you want.

 

[Turkishking]

Ok, I understand now.

Not sure if you're being sarcastic.

 

[ploidy]

OP, here's some disinfectant for some of the bad advice that's been strewn in this thread. Pay very careful attention, and also do a search in these fora as to why the Carib option is a bad one.

As long as you have a pulse and can write an up-front tuition check, chances are excellent.


The point here isn't that there are successful Carib grads. The point is how many additional obstacles to success you face by going to a Carib school.


Quoting the wise gyngyn:

The pool of US applicants from the Caribbean is viewed differently by Program Directors. The DDx for a Caribbean grad is pretty off-putting: bad judgment, bad advice, egotism, gullibility, overbearing parents, inability to delay gratification, IA's, legal problems, weak research skills, high risk behavior. This is not to say that all of them still have the quality that drew them into this situation. There is just no way to know which ones they are. Some PD's are in a position where they need to, or can afford to take risks too! So, some do get interviews.


Bad grades and scores are the least of the deficits from a PD's standpoint. A strong academic showing in a Caribbean medical school does not erase this stigma. It fact it increases the perception that the reason for the choice was on the above-mentioned list!

Just about everyone from a Caribbean school has one or more of these problems and PDs know it. That's why their grads are the last choice even with a high Step 1 score.

There was a time when folks whose only flaw was being a late bloomer went Carib, but those days are gone. There are a number of spots at US schools with grade replacement for these candidates.

It's likely you'll be in the bottom half or two thirds of the class that gets dismissed before Step 1. The business plan of a Carib school depends on the majority of the class not needing to be supported in clinical rotations. They literally can't place all 250+ of the starting class at clinical sites (educational malpractice, really. If this happened at a US school, they be shut down by LCME or COCA, and sued.


The Carib (and other offshore) schools have very tenuous, very expensive, very controversial relationships with a very small number of US clinical sites. You may think you can just ask to do your clinical rotations at a site near home. Nope. You may think you don't have to worry about this stuff. Wrong.

And let's say you get through med school in the Carib and get what you need out of the various clinical rotation scenarios. Then you are in the match gamble. I don't need to say a word about this - you can find everything you need to know at nrmp.org.

You really need to talk to people who made it through Carib into residency, and hear the story from them. How many people were in their class at the start, how many are in it now? How long did it take to get a residency, and how did they handle the gap year(s) and their student loans? How many residencies did they apply to, how many interviews did they get, and were any of the programs on their match list anything like what they wanted?

A little light reading:

Million $ Mistake

Medical School at SGU

Yeah I am really not interested in going to a medical school overseas because of the aforementioned stigmas attached to them.

Let me clear something up though that may change opinions. I'm not looking to have a carrer not in medicine, I'm not doing it for the money or the corvette. If med school does not work out I have other options carrer-wise not related to college.

If I were to average a 3.6-3.8 for the next 4 semesters, with a competitive MCAT and strong volunteer/clinic hours will I still be able to get into a semi-decent American medical school? I know I can do better than I did this semster, I'm not gonna lie to myself or people I'm seeking help from and say I tried my hardest. With proper adjustments to my study schedule I should be able to get no less than a 3.5 in all my next classes. I just hope I didn't damage my GPA too much already.

 

[Sardinia]

@RangerBob That janitor must be a 4.0 pre-medical student.

 

[RangerBob]

@RangerBob That janitor must be a 4.0 pre-medical student.

I sure hope not, because he's at least 60 years old, but how many rational pre-meds do you really meet these days?

 

[jcorpsmanMD]

That's debatable.

How is this debatable? I'm honestly intrigued!

 

[ploidy]

Okay cool. Sounds like I'm going to do two more semesters and evaluate myself again at this same point next year.

 

[mwsapphire]

How is this debatable? I'm honestly intrigued!

I think he means " Doing well is debatable if you want to go to the Carib."

 

[Gilakend]

Here's the advice you need man...

1. With regards to undergrad, major in something you will do well in. No point in majoring in something that gets you only a 3.0. Who will hire someone with a 3.0 when there are others with higher GPA's with that major?
2. Medical school does not require knowledge of the pre-reqs or any "undergraduate-level" course to do well. From my experience, it helps to have the science background but it is absolutely not required. I would say you only need a background in a cell and molecular biology to start strong.
3. You take cell biology for 16 weeks in undergrad. In medical school, you do it in one week. So the course itself will not get you ready for med school. What will get you ready is your work ethic and that is demonstrated by your GPA.
4. I wish I majored in sociology in undergrad because that's what I really liked and did really well in. I majored in something harder and totally different and I don't know what to do with that degree.
5. Take a different approach to your classes, don't look at them for what they are. Look at them as hoops to get to med school. When you do that, you'll be motivated to do better in them.

Is that true? You learn the same material that an undergrad class does in 16 weeks in one week? Oh my Lord.

 

[aformerstudent]

How is this debatable? I'm honestly intrigued!

It's debatable when you look at individual outcomes.

It's like this man, the media can make you believe that police brutality exists all over the country but if it doesn't exist in your town, who are you going to believe? And why would you care if it exists somewhere where you don't live? Same thing here. If I see people succeeding, I could care less if some "stats" show otherwise.

 

[aformerstudent]

Is that true? You learn the same material that an undergrad class does in 16 weeks in one week? Oh my Lord.

Yes

 

[aformerstudent]

I think he means " Doing well is debatable if you want to go to the Carib."

Isn't that where you are going though?

 

[aformerstudent]

Not sure if you're being sarcastic.

If you're going to be a doctor my friend, you can't be "not sure."

 

[FutureOncologist]

Your prereqs help you with the MCAT. Case-in-point I majored in Biochemistry and took a whole year of Biochem. First semester was basics, second was related to human physiology. I passed them both with A's and thought I understood a good concept of human biochemistry.

Then I went to medical school and was thrown into biochemistry. It was a 10-hour course and I went through everything I learned from undergrad in a two-month span. 98% of the content I had to force into my brain was new to everyone in my class, including me.

 

[Goro]

Yes. There are MD schools (and all DO) that reward reinvention. Many schools place more emphasis on the last 2-3 years of coursework.

If I were to average a 3.6-3.8 for the next 4 semesters, with a competitive MCAT and strong volunteer/clinic hours will I still be able to get into a semi-decent American medical school?

 

[ploidy]

Yes. There are MD schools (and all DO) that reward reinvention. Many schools place more emphasis on the last 2-3 years of coursework.

That's good to hear I'm just going to have to kill the next 4 semesters.

 

[aformerstudent]

That's good to hear I'm just going to have to kill the next 4 semesters.

Do not take that individuals advice. The US system is heavily biased towards GPA and MCAT scores with all the other stuff in your app being secondary. If your numbers are not excellent, you will get flat out rejected unless you are bringing something to the table that no one else has.

That's why I don't like this individual because they are buttering you up to believe that everyone has some type of equal chance with US medical school admissions. Trust me, I did the work already for some of you guys and I interviewed with a program director FACE TO FACE. What they say and what they advertise is totally different.

You're going to have to more than kill it my friend.

 

[mwsapphire]

Do not take that individuals advice. The US system is heavily biased towards GPA and MCAT scores with all the other stuff in your app being secondary. If your numbers are not excellent, you will get flat out rejected unless you are bringing something to the table that no one else has.

That's why I don't like this individual because they are buttering you up to believe that everyone has some type of equal chance with US medical school admissions. Trust me, I did the work already for some of you guys and I interviewed with a program director FACE TO FACE. What they say and what they advertise is totally different.

You're going to have to more than kill it my friend.

Don't listen to him. An UW trend is always rewarded. If not at all MD schools, DO schools do.

 

[jcorpsmanMD]

Do not take that individuals advice. The US system is heavily biased towards GPA and MCAT scores with all the other stuff in your app being secondary. If your numbers are not excellent, you will get flat out rejected unless you are bringing something to the table that no one else has.

That's why I don't like this individual because they are buttering you up to believe that everyone has some type of equal chance with US medical school admissions. Trust me, I did the work already for some of you guys and I interviewed with a program director FACE TO FACE. What they say and what they advertise is totally different.

You're going to have to more than kill it my friend.

You seem like a smart individual. I don't understand why you don't believe that if the OP does well in his courses for two years and maintains active in ECs why they can't be accepted to a US MD school? Why are you so pessimistic? Did you not work hard as an undergraduate? I will not sit here and say that medical school is 100% meritocracy but I'd say it's pretty darn close. I knew the formula to succeed in applying & being accepted to a medical school.

1. Get a competitive GPA, 3.6 - 4.0
2. Study well & score above average / average on the MCAT
3. Show interest in medicine via extracurricular activities / and or employment
4. Volunteer to show interest in my community

It's really not that difficult. The system is not actively working against us. The system is actively working to find students that have shown that they have the grit & ability to work hard to succeed as medical students. That's not everybody, I'm sorry. The system isn't perfect but the formula is simple and if one can't do that then maybe they don't deserve to be in medical school. It's a privilege.

 

[ploidy]

You seem like a smart individual. I don't understand why you don't believe that if the OP does well in his courses for two years and maintains active in ECs why they can't be accepted to a US MD school? Why are you so pessimistic? Did you not work hard as an undergraduate? I will not sit here and say that medical school is 100% meritocracy but I'd say it's pretty darn close. I knew the formula to succeed in applying & being accepted to a medical school.

1. Get a competitive GPA, 3.6 - 4.0
2. Study well & score above average / average on the MCAT
3. Show interest in medicine via extracurricular activities / and or employment
4. Volunteer to show interest in my community

It's really not that difficult. The system is not actively working against us. The system is actively working to find students that have shown that they have the grit & ability to work hard to succeed as medical students. That's not everybody, I'm sorry. The system isn't perfect but the formula is simple and if one can't do that then maybe they don't deserve to be in medical school. It's a privilege.

I'm curious now, will medical schools factor in my community college GPA? Cause if that is factored into I'll be at like a 3.6 right now even with this terrible semester.

Also, where do you suggest I begin my EC work at? I was not planning on applying straight out of undergrad, but I do want to start now.

 

[jcorpsmanMD]

I'm curious now, will medical schools factor in my community college GPA? Cause if that is factored into I'll be at like a 3.6 right now even with this terrible semester.

Also, where do you suggest I begin my EC work at? I was not planning on applying straight out of undergrad, but I do want to start now.

Your undergraduate school may not factor in your CC GPA but I'm fairly certain AMCAS just looks at your courses / grades and sees your overall GPA. (I might be mistaken, but I know the few courses I took at a CC changed my AMCAS GPA). I would suggest you do whatever EC's make you happy & fulfilled. Don't want to volunteer somewhere if you don't like it. Just find 1-2 places to volunteer at and do it for the next two years. Find somewhere you can get clinical experience at whether it be volunteering or work (scribe?). Shadow but you don't have to do much at all if you don't want. 50-100 hours? It's honestly not rocket science man. Do well in school & get involved. I promise you things will work out if you work hard. Most valuable thing I ever learned growing up. It works.

 

[aformerstudent]

You seem like a smart individual. I don't understand why you don't believe that if the OP does well in his courses for two years and maintains active in ECs why they can't be accepted to a US MD school? Why are you so pessimistic? Did you not work hard as an undergraduate? I will not sit here and say that medical school is 100% meritocracy but I'd say it's pretty darn close. I knew the formula to succeed in applying & being accepted to a medical school.

1. Get a competitive GPA, 3.6 - 4.0
2. Study well & score above average / average on the MCAT
3. Show interest in medicine via extracurricular activities / and or employment
4. Volunteer to show interest in my community

It's really not that difficult. The system is not actively working against us. The system is actively working to find students that have shown that they have the grit & ability to work hard to succeed as medical students. That's not everybody, I'm sorry. The system isn't perfect but the formula is simple and if one can't do that then maybe they don't deserve to be in medical school. It's a privilege.

Thank you for the compliment.

I'm in my 30's, I've had familiarity with this path for at least twenty years now. I have seen who has made it, who hasn't, and who struggles. I have friends with excellent GPA's and average MCAT's get rejected. I have friends with excellent GPA's AND MCAT scores who get rejected for something else. I don't know anyone who has made it to a US program with average anything. My own cousin got into ONLY ONE DO school just because of a last-minute recommendation and a 99th percentile MCAT.

I also interviewed with an admissions director at my state school who flat out told me they were "looking for excellence" first and foremost.

My point is a lot of people on these forums are naive. If you just tell them to "work hard" you would be misleading them. And that's what a lot of people on here do. The people who get into medical school are NOT ON THIS FORUM because they are too busy working on their excellence.

The four points you list are admirable but I don't think the average person will obtain them easily.

 

[jcorpsmanMD]

Thank you for the compliment.

I'm in my 30's, I've had familiarity with this path for at least twenty years now. I have seen who has made it, who hasn't, and who struggles. I have friends with excellent GPA's and average MCAT's get rejected. I have friends with excellent GPA's AND MCAT scores who get rejected for something else. I don't know anyone who has made it to a US program with average anything. My own cousin got into ONLY ONE DO school just because of a last-minute recommendation and a 99th percentile MCAT.

I also interviewed with an admissions director at my state school who flat out told me they were "looking for excellence" first and foremost.

My point is a lot of people on these forums are naive. If you just tell them to "work hard" you would be misleading them. And that's what a lot of people on here do. The people who get into medical school are NOT ON THIS FORUM because they are too busy working on their excellence.

The four points you list are admirable but I don't think the average person will obtain them easily.

I agree with you, I do. There is plenty of naivety going around these forums and everywhere else. Yes my list is admirable and you're right the average person might not obtain them easily. Those will be the ones who don't go to medical school. That's fine but there will be those who can and will make it happen. Of course medical schools expect excellence. I'd be worried if they didn't. If you're average, don't strive for excellence then yes.. maybe you don't deserve to be a medical student. You're right, sometimes it's best for people to know when it's time to give up instead of going down the path that leads many mediocre students headed to Carib mills but at the end of the day that's their decision anyway and one doesn't garner a work ethic over night. So I'm not too worried about those students anyhow. For the OP though.. they're young. Only a sophomore, it's not too late for them to stride for excellence. I'm glad they're here asking for advice. Work hard OP. What @aformerstudent says is true, you can't expect to be average and be accepted to medical school - this rings true for anybody. You got this though, it's still really early in the game for you. Good luck.

 

[aformerstudent]

I agree with you, I do. There is plenty of naivety going around these forums and everywhere else. Yes my list is admirable and you're right the average person might not obtain them easily. Those will be the ones who don't go to medical school. That's fine but there will be those who can and will make it happen. Of course medical schools expect excellence. I'd be worried if they didn't. If you're average, don't strive for excellence then yes.. maybe you don't deserve to be a medical student. You're right, sometimes it's best for people to know when it's time to give up instead of going down the path that leads many mediocre students headed to Carib mills but at the end of the day that's their decision anyway and one doesn't garner a work ethic over night. So I'm not too worried about those students anyhow. For the OP though.. they're young. Only a sophomore, it's not too late for them to stride for excellence. I'm glad they're here asking for advice. Work hard OP. What @aformerstudent says is true, you can't expect to be average and be accepted to medical school - this rings true for anybody. You got this though, it's still really early in the game for you. Good luck.

Well said.

Just to be transparent. I was one of those people that went the Caribbean route. I withdrew before anything could go wrong. There is a lot to be learned about that path if you get to experience it for yourself; most of it is not good. I'm retaking the pre-reqs and MCAT and believe it or not trying to go back down that route but this time at the best school down there. To each their own but I also don't discredit those programs either. I don't recommend the Caribbean as a whole and I certainly would never recommend lower-tier schools based on my experience but I have seen students who would never make it into a US program make it out of these programs and become doctors and good doctors at that. The Caribbean as a whole is not a dead end but if you know what you are doing, and this may require trial and error for some, I've seen it happen enough that I would endorse that route if someone said they were looking at SGU or Ross and they could demonstrate that they know what they are up against.

A lot of people here that are anti-caribbean are are hearing about it for the most part and not seeing it for themselves.

There is this SGU medical student blog or former medical student blog and when you read through it the author is basically whining about why things weren't handed to her. There is an individual on this forum that suggests that as "light reading" when that whole blog post merely highlights the type of student that should not be applying to the Caribbean as the author of that blog apparently is clueless.

 

[jcorpsmanMD]

Well said.

Just to be transparent. I was one of those people that went the Caribbean route. I withdrew before anything could go wrong. There is a lot to be learned about that path if you get to experience it for yourself; most of it is not good. I'm retaking the pre-reqs and MCAT and believe it or not trying to go back down that route but this time at the best school down there. To each their own but I also don't discredit those programs either. I don't recommend the Caribbean as a whole and I certainly would never recommend lower-tier schools based on my experience but I have seen students who would never make it into a US program make it out of these programs and become doctors and good doctors at that. The Caribbean as a whole is not a dead end but if you know what you are doing, and this may require trial and error for some, I've seen it happen enough that I would endorse that route if someone said they were looking at SGU or Ross and they could demonstrate that they know what they are up against.

A lot of people here that are anti-caribbean are are hearing about it for the most part and not seeing it for themselves.

There is this SGU medical student blog or former medical student blog and when you read through it the author is basically whining about why things weren't handed to her. There is an individual on this forum that suggests that as "light reading" when that whole blog post merely highlights the type of student that should not be applying to the Caribbean as the author of that blog apparently is clueless.

I wish you the best of luck. You have a good head on your shoulders and you seem to know what you're doing. I agree, I don't think the Caribbean is a dead end for everybody. I do not believe in absolutes. But we can both agree that if you have the opportunity to make yourself competitive for a US MD school then you certainly should gun for it instead of giving up and just going to the Caribbean because then as you mentioned - it results in students being grossly unprepared and general naivety about what attending a Caribbean medical school entails, etc. (dropping out, wasting their tuition money, wasting precious years of their life). I wish you and the OP the best of luck in your endeavors,

 

[ploidy]

I appreciate the guidance and advice you guys are providing, haven't had much of that but I also never looked for it. My university has partnerships with the hospital (that's 2 minutes off campus), I'm trying to apply to be a volunteer for the summer, but I might be too late I'll have to do it in the fall during classes. One of the volunteer work is signing in customers and looks like real secretary work, does that sound like a good idea?

As for the GPA and MCAT, I am a lot more comfortable with myself after reading the replies here. Especially if the med school application factors in my CC GPA. This year I decided to have a little bit of a life, but I realize I cannot manage maintaining a competitive GPA and doing **** other than school.

A big question I never understood, how do I log volunteer work in a hospital? I'm not sure how this all works and if there is an official log or if I have to get people to sign my hours or something. Also, as far as research goes with a professor, do I just send emails to professors I don't know in my school and ask to work with them? I have 3 lab courses done: molecular biology, chem 1, physics 1. I don't know if I'm qualified.

Sorry for all the questions, but this is the first time I'm talking to people who know about this.