So, I'm unemployed.

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dandelions

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It’s been a few months since leaving medical school, and I am becoming increasingly disappointed by my current situation. I stand by my decision, which I made for human reasons — the incessant memorization required of me was burning me out big time, and doing an extremely poor job of exemplifying what I’m capable of in terms of general aptitude. My continual sense that output was not equalling input was quite frankly making me sick in the head, and there was no chance that I could have made a healthy future doctor, let alone a healthy person in general, continuing on at that rate.

I would have excelled in the clinical realm, but my dreams of reaching that point were getting further away the harder I worked. There were also some important logistics behind the decision that I made to leave. One such logistic involved a end-of-year rule change requiring students to also remediate low passing scores in addition to failing scores. At that point, I had no failing scores but did have a few low passes on my transcript: one from my first attempt at second year, after my uncle died (and at which point I decided to take a personal leave). The second low score came later on, during the middle of my second attempt at second year, after my grandma died. The third one came a few months after that — it was my first "legitimate" marginal pass and, surprisingly, not a complete fail; I had some real trouble mastering the material in that particular theme.

In essence, I found out at the end of my second year that I would now have to remediate several courses in lieu of studying for Step 1. Then, instead of joining my classmates in starting third year, I would sit-out during the first rotation of my clinical track to study for and take the boards. Unfortunately, this would place me on a “decelerated fourth year,” and I could look forward to an entire additional year of total isolation after my classmates graduated, where I would do internship-style research and/or do work abroad that would bolster my application. I would graduate in 2018, at 30 years of age. And, good luck to me in terms of getting a deserving job after all of that, because it wasn’t looking good in terms of matching for residency — even in family medicine, which I was hoping very much to go into.

The format of my revised future as it was suddenly provided to me by my advising dean was the straw that broke the camels back. I felt like I was being thrown around in there like some sort of puppet, and I had had enough. Their advice to me that I should do a better job of suppressing my emotions in response to the loss of loved ones was quite possibly the most ineffective piece of advice that I’ve ever received. That was, I think, the last piece of advice that I received from my institution before calling it quits — white flag, you win. And, they certainly did win out in this case — they’ve pocketed about $200,000, and haven’t contacted me since.

At our last meeting together, my advising dean told me that I should get out of dodge and go to the Bahamas, which was confusing because I’m broke, and not in any sort of mood to go to the beach right now. I’m intelligent, capable, and still desiring very much so to be a productive member of society. I was accepted into a MD program with a 1.5% acceptance rate. My MCAT score was in the 94th percentile, and I got through first year with all passing grades. To go back to school now for anything seems ridiculous. I am not braindead, and I am not defeated. I still have a lot to offer to the fields of science and medicine, and MD or not, the school didn’t take away my brain; the knowledge I gained over the 2.5 years of extremely hard work that I did is still with me, in my head.

These are the sorts of things that I’ve been wrestling with, lately, and I hope my insight here is helpful to anyone considering entering (or leaving) medicine.

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sorry for this course of events, OP. if the suppression of emotions comment was like you said it was, that is pretty bad.

you've got a bachelor's i'm assuming, so why not go forward with something in there?
 
Why is it ridiculous to go back to school?

Unfortunately, most pre-meds finish with a BA or BS that is useless without a higher degree
 
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A $200,000 hole is a pretty big hole to climb out of. Maybe you should go to the Bahamas, and not pay your loans back.

So for a transcript, what is the difference between Fail and Pass if you have to repeat the class because you marginally passed it? This sounds like a great money making scheme for the university.
 
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Why is it ridiculous to go back to school?

Unfortunately, most pre-meds finish with a BA or BS that is useless without a higher degree

I have just a BA and make 6 figures before dropping it for med school.

OP, go work for a CRO/Pharma and do consulting/BD. You don't need a higher degree and you can make a decent living.
 
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What school has a 1.5% acceptance rate!? Mayo?
 
A $200,000 hole is a pretty big hole to climb out of. Maybe you should go to the Bahamas, and not pay your loans back.

yeah because making other taxpayers pay off his debt is cool

it's a pretty big hole, but a hole he willingly started digging!
 
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yeah because making other taxpayers pay off his debt is cool

it's a pretty big hole, but a hole he willingly started digging!

Maybe we need more people not willing to pay for them to realize: increasing tuition + government money =/= free gravy train
 
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yeah because making other taxpayers pay off his debt is cool

it's a pretty big hole, but a hole he willingly started digging!

Yet no one cries foul when the taxpayers bailed out Wall Street to the tune of $700 billion. Or when the government spent $4 trillion on two unwinnable wars. BUT I DIGRESS...

OP: That really sucks, man. Have you considered teaching? The guy who taught my A&P was a med school dropout. He was really good. I'm sure it would be pretty decent money in the interim while you figure out your next step. Although maybe you need to do something totally removed from the medical field so you don't get bummed that you're not in med school. Good luck anyway. I'm sure you'll find your way.
 
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Yet no one cries foul when the taxpayers bailed out Wall Street to the tune of $700 billion. Or when the government spent $4 trillion on two unwinnable wars. BUT I DIGRESS...

You're putting words in my mouth.
 
Why is it ridiculous to go back to school?

Unfortunately, most pre-meds finish with a BA or BS that is useless without a higher degree

Yup, pretty much all of the work and credentials done prior to starting med school, that make one a successful applicant, are useless in other fields.
 
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OP, you say you would have excelled in the clinical realm and wanted to go into family medicine; it sounds to me like you have great people skills and enjoy helping people. I agree with @Dares Dareson in that teaching might be a great next step. You are obviously intelligent and can probably adapt to different subject materials. I know some states won't hire full time teachers without an education major/minor but will hire substitute teachers. I realize you are still burned out and grieving (your family losses and your own "loss of future") and going back to school right now is not something you want to think about. I would say don't rule it out entirely though. As someone who is over 30 and just starting medical school next month, its never too late to go back. Good luck going forward, there's a lot out there for someone who is hardworking, compassionate, and intelligent.
 
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I understand some can make 6 figures. Most can't.

OP was smart enough to get into medical school, they can make 6 figures without an advance degree. They just need to network a bit and search a little harder. The opportunities are definitely there.
 
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I work in pharma/CRO as mentioned above and make over 6 figures with only a BS and MBA. I've been in the field for less than 7 years as well. I'd be more than happy to help if you are interested in learning more about this field. Feel free to message me!
 
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I work in pharma/CRO as mentioned above and make over 6 figures with only a BS and MBA. I've been in the field for less than 7 years as well. I'd be more than happy to help if you are interested in learning more about this field. Feel free to message me!

I swear, so many people on this board are so naive when it comes to what money you can make without an advance degree in tech/pharma/biotech.
 
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I swear, so many people on this board are so naive when it comes to what money you can make without an advance degree in tech/pharma/biotech.

Agreed. Although, it's not like they advertise it in college. It's a huge field. I have always had a huge interest in going to med school but I make what a PCP makes and work 40 hours a week M-F. If it snows, I work from home. Holidays and vacation? Tons. It would be a huge sacrifice.
 
Agreed. Although, it's not like they advertise it in college. It's a huge field. I have always had a huge interest in going to med school but I make what a PCP makes and work 40 hours a week M-F. If it snows, I work from home. Holidays and vacation? Tons. It would be a huge sacrifice.

I work from remotely and visit the main office 1-2 times a month. Very light travel a few times a week, but otherwise work from home. Too bad I'm not the most passionate about it.
 
I work in pharma/CRO as mentioned above and make over 6 figures with only a BS and MBA. I've been in the field for less than 7 years as well. I'd be more than happy to help if you are interested in learning more about this field. Feel free to message me!
what about a bs and mph?
 
I work in pharma/CRO as mentioned above and make over 6 figures with only a BS and MBA. I've been in the field for less than 7 years as well. I'd be more than happy to help if you are interested in learning more about this field. Feel free to message me!
Yup. Worker in pharma, too, and I have a hard time swallowing how I had a good job with pay and am going through this. They pay really well which makes it hard to quit. And their insurance is unbelievably good.
 
what about a bs and mph?

You guys are too focused on degrees than skills. You can do very well in business development in the pharma/CRO world with just a BA/BS. No need for fancy degrees. An MBA might help if you would prefer to be on the inside (operations as opposed to direct client facing). You will make a lot less if you work on the science/clinical side of things, which is kinda funny. If I were to stay on this track I would probably end up making more than some medical directors with a lot less training/education.
 
I'm not looking for a job right now, but I'm curious. How do you get started in pharma with an MD? All the job offerings I see want a PhD, or are looking for oncology experience, or an MBA and experience as an analyst, evaluating startups etc. As an MD, I have no experience in any of those areas.
 
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Thanks all for the advice, here.
yeah because making other taxpayers pay off his debt is cool

it's a pretty big hole, but a hole he willingly started digging!

I am a female, and I am not in a hole.
 
OP....If I were you I would be calling the dean and asking for a chance to take them up on their offer again. A year later graduating med school is something I would consider a far better situation than withdrawn after 2. You might have to eat crow, but schools love their graduation rates and you both win if you go back. An insensitive comment by staff doesn't change that you are better off with that degree. I'd eat all the crow necessary to get it.

I'm legitimately sorry for what happened to you but you might want to consider that this is like cutting off your nose to spite your face


Yet no one cries foul when the taxpayers bailed out Wall Street to the tune of $700 billion. Or when the government spent $4 trillion on two unwinnable wars. BUT I DIGRESS...
I cried foul.....but I digress ;)
 
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OP....If I were you I would be calling the dean and asking for a chance to take them up on their offer again. A year later graduating med school is something I would consider a far better situation than withdrawn after 2.

I think OP said she didn't want to be a physician anymore, but if that's not the case, this would be my recommendation too. You can get a residency even if you do end up having to repeat an entire year of medical school. 30 isn't that old; a lot of my class, myself included, will graduate in our earlier 30s.
 
I think OP said she didn't want to be a physician anymore, but if that's not the case, this would be my recommendation too. You can get a residency even if you do end up having to repeat an entire year of medical school. 30 isn't that old; a lot of my class, myself included, will graduate in our earlier 30s.
OP was hurt and embarrassed by being held back (I get it, it would hurt) and then rage quit after the Dean said something that hurt them further. The idea that 30 is sooooo old isn't logical. The idea that you can't match family med after repeating so low passes is not logical.

I don't know if it's too late to go back and eat crow, it might be.....but on paper, this was a bad decision
 
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With a US MD you can get into a FM residency. I don't know why you think otherwise.
 
With a US MD you can get into a FM residency. I don't know why you think otherwise.
With enough red flags, you can prevent yourself from landing any residency. I knew a student that was thrown under the bus by their school (albeit justifiably). They had failed multiple rotations and courses, had horrible letters, etc. No program would touch them, not FM, not prelims, nothing. You pretty much have to go out of your way to end up in that sort of situation though.
 
With enough red flags, you can prevent yourself from landing any residency. I knew a student that was thrown under the bus by their school (albeit justifiably). They had failed multiple rotations and courses, had horrible letters, etc. No program would touch them, not FM, not prelims, nothing. You pretty much have to go out of your way to end up in that sort of situation though.

any bridge will burn if you try hard enough
 
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I am very happy with my decision to leave. That system is a crazy trail that's bound to go off its own rails, and I'm relieved to no longer be part of it. It's just taking some time for me to decide on what to do next, and my disappointment lies only in my former institutions complete incapacity to assist me with an exit strategy. But I'm figuring it out on my own, and things are slowly but surely resolving. My life over the past few months has improved significantly in every possible realm. My post was one of encouragement to those feeling the same way (because I know they're out there, quietly reading this) -- you can, actually, leave and your life will, actually, become better. Quickly.
 
I am very happy with my decision to leave. That system is a crazy trail that's bound to go off its own rails, and I'm relieved to no longer be part of it. It's just taking some time for me to decide on what to do next, and my disappointment lies only in my former institutions complete incapacity to assist me with an exit strategy. But I'm figuring it out on my own, and things are slowly but surely resolving. My life over the past few months has improved significantly in every possible realm. My post was one of encouragement to those feeling the same way (because I know they're out there, quietly reading this) -- you can, actually, leave and your life will, actually, become better. Quickly.

You can absolutely leave medicine and be fine and happy in life...

But you walked away from a slight hiccup in your training and months later have no job and no plan other than a generic (and unrealistic) belief that you "still have a lot to offer" the fields of science and medicine without actually going back to finish something. 2.5 years of medicine means nothing...you can't logically defend that this is an encouraging story to anyone else thinking about walking away.

If you just don't want it, that's fine. But finishing is the price of admission to "having something to offer"
 
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I am very happy with my decision to leave. That system is a crazy trail that's bound to go off its own rails, and I'm relieved to no longer be part of it. It's just taking some time for me to decide on what to do next, and my disappointment lies only in my former institutions complete incapacity to assist me with an exit strategy. But I'm figuring it out on my own, and things are slowly but surely resolving. My life over the past few months has improved significantly in every possible realm. My post was one of encouragement to those feeling the same way (because I know they're out there, quietly reading this) -- you can, actually, leave and your life will, actually, become better. Quickly.

Definitely should've included that in your OP...it sounded more like you needed advice and that you were sharing your story, not that it was an encouragement to other ppl who might feel this way. Not saying you're wrong, but the wording wasn't done correctly if that was your aim.
 
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I'm not looking for a job right now, but I'm curious. How do you get started in pharma with an MD? All the job offerings I see want a PhD, or are looking for oncology experience, or an MBA and experience as an analyst, evaluating startups etc. As an MD, I have no experience in any of those areas.

I work in pharma and don't have a degree. Feel free to PM me if you want more info!
 
Thanks all for the advice, here.


I am a female, and I am not in a hole.

My apologies for not knowing the gender of an anonymous user.

Also, "in the hole" is a common way of saying in debt. So, by that definition you are. I apologize if you don't use the same definition. Good luck
 
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You're delusional if you think you "have a lot to offer" science, medicine, or anyone for that matter. This country is stamping out college grads faster than its printing money. As an above poster said, finishing a program is 'the price of admission to having something to offer'.

And lets just get this straight, the red flags in your story make you seem like radioactive waste from the perspective of any reasonable employer.
 
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I'm glad the OP clarified that they found satisfaction in being unemployed. The original post made it sound like they were miffed at being unable to continue, because it would be awkward being a class behind and because they would e 30.

Neither reason seemed to hold much weight. People seem to be hold back a year for a variety of reasons... family shrinks, family grows, inferior academics, superior research opportunity, extra degree, etc. I don't think any of our colleagues really care. We are far too busy managing our own lives.

And being in your 30s and in med school isn't the worst thing in the world.
 
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It’s been a few months since leaving medical school, and I am becoming increasingly disappointed by my current situation. I stand by my decision, which I made for human reasons — the incessant memorization required of me was burning me out big time, and doing an extremely poor job of exemplifying what I’m capable of in terms of general aptitude. My continual sense that output was not equalling input was quite frankly making me sick in the head, and there was no chance that I could have made a healthy future doctor, let alone a healthy person in general, continuing on at that rate.

I would have excelled in the clinical realm, but my dreams of reaching that point were getting further away the harder I worked. There were also some important logistics behind the decision that I made to leave. One such logistic involved a end-of-year rule change requiring students to also remediate low passing scores in addition to failing scores. At that point, I had no failing scores but did have a few low passes on my transcript: one from my first attempt at second year, after my uncle died (and at which point I decided to take a personal leave). The second low score came later on, during the middle of my second attempt at second year, after my grandma died. The third one came a few months after that — it was my first "legitimate" marginal pass and, surprisingly, not a complete fail; I had some real trouble mastering the material in that particular theme.

In essence, I found out at the end of my second year that I would now have to remediate several courses in lieu of studying for Step 1. Then, instead of joining my classmates in starting third year, I would sit-out during the first rotation of my clinical track to study for and take the boards. Unfortunately, this would place me on a “decelerated fourth year,” and I could look forward to an entire additional year of total isolation after my classmates graduated, where I would do internship-style research and/or do work abroad that would bolster my application. I would graduate in 2018, at 30 years of age. And, good luck to me in terms of getting a deserving job after all of that, because it wasn’t looking good in terms of matching for residency — even in family medicine, which I was hoping very much to go into.

The format of my revised future as it was suddenly provided to me by my advising dean was the straw that broke the camels back. I felt like I was being thrown around in there like some sort of puppet, and I had had enough. Their advice to me that I should do a better job of suppressing my emotions in response to the loss of loved ones was quite possibly the most ineffective piece of advice that I’ve ever received. That was, I think, the last piece of advice that I received from my institution before calling it quits — white flag, you win. And, they certainly did win out in this case — they’ve pocketed about $200,000, and haven’t contacted me since.

At our last meeting together, my advising dean told me that I should get out of dodge and go to the Bahamas, which was confusing because I’m broke, and not in any sort of mood to go to the beach right now. I’m intelligent, capable, and still desiring very much so to be a productive member of society. I was accepted into a MD program with a 1.5% acceptance rate. My MCAT score was in the 94th percentile, and I got through first year with all passing grades. To go back to school now for anything seems ridiculous. I am not braindead, and I am not defeated. I still have a lot to offer to the fields of science and medicine, and MD or not, the school didn’t take away my brain; the knowledge I gained over the 2.5 years of extremely hard work that I did is still with me, in my head.

These are the sorts of things that I’ve been wrestling with, lately, and I hope my insight here is helpful to anyone considering entering (or leaving) medicine.

Have you applied for any type of position?

My cousin has a B.S. in Chemistry and does water quality testing for the state department of health. Of course he had to take exams to get this job, but he didn't go to grad school at all. There are private companies that do this type of work, and for some of these companies, one doesn't need a degree in chemistry for it. The degree could be in biology or some other scientific field.

What is your BA/BS degree in? This could make a big difference. For example, if you have a B.S. in Medical Technology/Engineering/ or any other type of education, you are still employable.

Just some suggestions.
 
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Also, "in the hole" is a common way of saying in debt. So, by that definition you are. I apologize if you don't use the same definition. Good luck

Well... nothing (from my reading) of their original post said they were in debt. The OP mentioned that the school pocketed 200,000 of their money. But perhaps it's one of those "parents paid for school" situations, or something else where they didn't accumulate loans. They mentioned being broke now, but perhaps they're right at the $0 balance point.
 
To go back to school now for anything seems ridiculous. I am not braindead, and I am not defeated. I still have a lot to offer to the fields of science and medicine, and MD or not, the school didn’t take away my brain; the knowledge I gained over the 2.5 years of extremely hard work that I did is still with me, in my head.

No offense intended, but nothing you "learn" in medical school is worth a damn. If you are banking on someone hiring you based off 2.5 years of fairly worthless regurgitation, you are mistaken. Everyday, people with far more education than you (in biological fields) are denied jobs and have to settle for service industry work. Again, I don't mean to be mean, but you need to be realistic. GET A SKILL THAT SOMEONE IS WILLING TO PAY YOU TO EXERCISE. I know my fair share of high school grads making $100,000 + after going to 12 week codes schools. I also know people who are making bank in blue collar jobs.
 
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A $200,000 hole is a pretty big hole to climb out of. Maybe you should go to the Bahamas, and not pay your loans back.

So for a transcript, what is the difference between Fail and Pass if you have to repeat the class because you marginally passed it? This sounds like a great money making scheme for the university.

This isn't my first time hearing this atrocity. What is the point of passing a class if you have to remediate it? I have come within 2 points fo failing, maybe a 1/4th of my classes. I would have had to drop out if my school had this system.
 
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I work in pharma/CRO as mentioned above and make over 6 figures with only a BS and MBA. I've been in the field for less than 7 years as well. I'd be more than happy to help if you are interested in learning more about this field. Feel free to message me!
Nothing to do with this thread, but where would one find info in your field? Am I also free to message you?
 
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