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you can also turn down the offer and gun for T20 medical school after college and see the outcome.
the race is real so if you have an opportunity take it and run with it. At the end of the day prestige wont be taking care of patients its knowledge.
It's not clear why you are so hung up on prestige for residency and not for med school, but I'll guess it's because of the guarantee, not because you are in love with the "biggest MD school in the nation." If prestige doesn't matter for med school it shouldn't matter for residency either. On the other hand, why would you think T20 residencies will provide an enormous breadth of opportunities while med schools won't? They will!! After all, there is probably a reason schools like Harvard, Stanford and Penn don't offer BS/MD programs! 🙂Hi all, I'm going to get much more active on the forum as I'm right now making a decision for college. I've been blessed to get into a BS/MD program through UIC's GPPA Medicine program.
The type of doctor I'd like to be is an orthopedic, general, or cardiothoracic surgeon - and have a specialty in "something".
I know I made a post regarding the BS/MD vs a liberal arts college that is Bowdoin College (full ride and $3000 stipend for research/study abroad) and Washington and Lee University (Full Ride and $7000 for research/study abroad), however, I'm here to ask how far could "UICOM" get me?
I have a great hospital system nearby - Northshore University Health System - here in Chicago, and it seems many physicians in the fields above are from UICOM, Feinberg, and Pritzer. UICOM is also the biggest M.D. school in the nation, so it must definitely have the resources, especially when a vast majority of Illinois physicians are going through UICOM.
That being said, how "competitive" is UICOM or valuable? Could an M.D. degree from UICOM get me a residency at a T20 university for those fields and specialties?
Thankfully the GPPA Medicine program isn't restrictive, so I could still apply to other medical schools while having a flagship medical school as a safety net.
Thanks, folks!
No, no, no -- you are taking the wrong thing away from the advice you are getting here!!!! You don't need a top medical school for a top residency, and you don't need a top residency for a competitive specialty any more than you are going to need a top UG to go to a top medical school.Thank you so much, everyone! So it seems like in order to get into a top residency program, I would need to get into a top medical school. I think I might as well take the BS/MD program with UICOM since I can apply out if I perform extremely well on the MCAT!
Is there a way to identify how BSMD students matched vs traditional path students?Looks like University of Illinois has a very strong match list. Lots of students matched into the specialties you're interested in. I'd take the bird in the hand. If you're considering a BS/MD program, I assume you're still in high school. I wouldn't worry too much about matching to a T20 residency just yet.
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Did you mention your interest in doing competitive residency from T20 program in college confidential?Haha see what I mean about my naiveness! Got it and that does make me feel a lot better about pursuing the bs/md program.
At the moment, I'm weighing GPPA program against Bowdoin College. College Confidential parwnts say Bowdoin, but almost if not all responses from doctors have been GPPA.
I don't think you get much different opinions here than college confidential. Same bird in hand/risk aversion vs bigger playing field. Only you know what's important for you.@srk2021 Yep I did - it's a pretty big thread and I've been able to get a lot of perspectives recently. It's just a difficult decision - from a doctor/medicine perspective, BS/MD seems like the way to go, but from a "coming of age", breadth of opportunity, and just a college experience perspective, Bowdoin and some of my other choices seem like a no brainer. It's just hard to take a leap of faith with such a high/difficult goal in mind.
I have a thread about that in /hSDN but haven't had much luck with replies. But I'm trying to get opinions from current medical students or physicians or people within the medical community about the subject matter.
I thought you would make the connection sooner 🙂 Anyway, since you are asking different questions here than CC, I pitched in. on SDN, people move on quickly from the topic so don't expect 50 pages+ responses 😎@srk2021 Oh my gosh you're the person from College Confidential! Quite the small world haha.
@HopeP
In my original thread I did detail my situation of being low income and taking the decision based on a planned-for-medicine perspective, along with the pro's and cons of each school.
This was more a what if I go to X School question 🙂
One thing I didn't ask on CC is are you factoring in UIC medical school costs? Do they have need based aid or you have to take loans?@srk2021 Oh my gosh you're the person from College Confidential! Quite the small world haha.
@HopeP
In my original thread I did detail my situation of being low income and taking the decision based on a planned-for-medicine perspective, along with the pro's and cons of each school.
This was more a what if I go to X School question 🙂
Wait, won't you get tuition+fees for medicine portion of GPPA as well?@srk2021 Hmm yeah that's definitely important. But I think if it comes down to taking out loans at UICOM, I think it's something I'm prepared, but still need more mental strength, to take them.
If I do get into a prestigious medical school that offers great need-based financial aid or NYU, it would make things much better - but I also plan to make working at a VA Hospital an option (tuition waivers).
As you know more and more schools are giving need based scholarships (75-100%) and unless we go into deep recession/depression the list will grow by the time you apply. That's one of the big reasons I am against BSMD programs and kids with high stats and ECs merit is also possible.@srk2021 Hmm yeah that's definitely important. But I think if it comes down to taking out loans at UICOM, I think it's something I'm prepared, but still need more mental strength, to take them.
If I do get into a prestigious medical school that offers great need-based financial aid or NYU, it would make things much better - but I also plan to make working at a VA Hospital an option (tuition waivers).
To apply out you need to have strong ECs and MCAT scores. Do you think with you will be motivated to do all that with long daily commute and knowing you have a guaranteed admission? Very few BSMD students apply out.@srk2021 That is good news. I think most BS/MD programs lock you in or let you apply elsewhere after forfeiting the guaranteed accepted - but the UIC GPPA Medicine program gives you the guarantee while still letting a student apply outside - it was a big thing they told students during the interview and regarding the program in general.
@HopeP No, not that I am aware.
You don't, but it definitely helps. I usually recommend against BS/MD programs, but in this case I think you should definitely do it. Bowdoin isn't a big enough draw to give up the acceptance in hand; if you were choosing between this program and Williams, I might suggest Williams. But a medical school acceptance is a golden ticket into the American upper class, and you can't bet on doing better than UICOM if you go to Bowdoin. And like you said, if you want to do research at Northwestern and get someone on the faculty in your corner, maybe you can apply there.Thank you so much, everyone! So it seems like in order to get into a top residency program, I would need to get into a top medical school. I think I might as well take the BS/MD program with UICOM since I can apply out if I perform extremely well on the MCAT!
A free ride is always best.Hi all, I'm going to get much more active on the forum as I'm right now making a decision for college. I've been blessed to get into a BS/MD program through UIC's GPPA Medicine program.
The type of doctor I'd like to be is an orthopedic, general, or cardiothoracic surgeon - and have a specialty in "something".
I know I made a post regarding the BS/MD vs a liberal arts college that is Bowdoin College (full ride and $3000 stipend for research/study abroad) and Washington and Lee University (Full Ride and $7000 for research/study abroad), however, I'm here to ask how far could "UICOM" get me?
I have a great hospital system nearby - Northshore University Health System - here in Chicago, and it seems many physicians in the fields above are from UICOM, Feinberg, and Pritzer. UICOM is also the biggest M.D. school in the nation, so it must definitely have the resources, especially when a vast majority of Illinois physicians are going through UICOM.
That being said, how "competitive" is UICOM or valuable? Could an M.D. degree from UICOM get me a residency at a T20 university for those fields and specialties?
Thankfully the GPPA Medicine program isn't restrictive, so I could still apply to other medical schools while having a flagship medical school as a safety net.
Thanks, folks!
@Goro Finance is a consideration for OP and UIC medical school is not cheap though. Also, OP wants to target T20s for residency.A free ride is always best.
You can get into fine specialties and residencies from going to U ILL.
Int he long it, it doesn't matter though. Your salary as an attending will be the same if you attend U ILL, Harvard or CCOM. Getting INTO an uber-specialty is far more on you than your med school And as of right now, you should be concentrating on doing well in UG, not worrying about specialties or residencies. BS/MD programs have high dropout rates, FYI.
Every premed wants to target the T20s, of which there are at least 30 schools.@Goro Finance is a consideration for OP and UIC medical school is not cheap though. Also, OP wants to target T20s for residency.
1) Bowdoin and Washington and Lee aren’t big name schools. I don’t think you are more likely to get into a top med school from those schools than from UIC. Whether you choose UIC vs the other schools should focus on cost and other things. If UIC undergrad won’t be crazy expensive, I would take the guaranteed opportunity.@srk2021 Well, to be honest, I think I would be more motivated, and knowing that I have that safety net in hand, I don't have to stress about not having any options after the application cycle. I think it's a give or take - maybe not immediately, but short run/long run.
@longhaul3 I actually do participate in research at Northwestern's Feinberg School at the Mesulam Center. I would focus a lot on getting deeper into my research lab at Northwestern's Medical School, and, when the time comes, apply there with a letter of recommendation from my PI.
NYU is not the only school that's offering need based aid.@Pepe18 Ah thank you for your insight. Cost-wise, UIC would be "free" for the undergrad years, but at the cost of commuting.
Medical school wise, as an in-state student, UIC estimates from M1-M4, tuition only would be roughly $190,000 while the total cost of attendance (dorm, housing, loan fees, etc) would cost $295,000. It is quite a lot to take in but would be cheaper considerably than an outside state school - unless I make it to a demonstrated need medical school or NYU.
I think you and everyone else who gave advice is right about the T20 residency as it may matter merely for academia.
WashU has free tuition (need-based). Other medical schools have significant aid - Harvard, Yale, Stanford, Cornell, Dartmouth, Johns Hopkins, Pritzker (UChicago), Vanderbilt, Penn, and UMich are the ones that come to mind.NYU is not the only school that's offering need-based aid.
Yes, that's why I argue against BSMD here and on CC 🙂WashU has free tuition (need-based). Other medical schools have significant aid - Harvard, Yale, Stanford, Cornell, Dartmouth, Johns Hopkins, Pritzker (UChicago), Vanderbilt, Penn, and UMich are the ones that come to mind.
Not free, but pretty significant cuts in medical school tuition.
I am highly doubtful that you will apply out if you take UIC BSMD program and will have strong enough ECs to be competitive for schools like WashU.@srk2021 But I don't understand the connection - are you speaking primarily to UIC as an undergrad institution? The GPPA program isn't binding at all.
Biggest thing is motivation 🙂 To get into top schools you need to differentiate yourself with strong GPA, MCAT and ECs. Do you think you can do all those while commuting from home and also knowing you really don't need to do all that given you have a guaranteed admission? You can get clinical experiences wherever there are hospitals, hospice, senior centers etc.. You can also get those and research during summer in Chicago. You can go non-clinical volunteering like tutoring at any place.@srk2021 Ah okay I see. What would make Bowdoin the stronger contender and better prep to get me into those medical school? Based on geography alone it's quite the desert for shadowing, clinical experience, and significant research on the fields I'm interested in (at least on first look). However, that $3000 stipend could be useful for study abroad programs outside the country.
What would you consider to be strong enough ECs?
Congrats! You can live at home during med school and even if you didn't, most schools overestimate living expenses. That is a very good deal.@Pepe18 Ah thank you for your insight. Cost-wise, UIC would be "free" for the undergrad years, but at the cost of commuting.
Medical school wise, as an in-state student, UIC estimates from M1-M4, tuition only would be roughly $190,000 while the total cost of attendance (dorm, housing, loan fees, etc) would cost $295,000. It is quite a lot to take in but would be cheaper considerably than an outside state school - unless I make it to a demonstrated need medical school or NYU.
I think you and everyone else who gave advice is right about the T20 residency as it may matter merely for academia.
Not surprised 🙂 GL to you! Keep us posted here and/or on CC about your journey thru UG and medical school.Alrighty! I just ended up committing to UIC's GPPA Medicine program 🙂