Someone please explain SOMA's curriculum

[keels99]

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Just ignore him. He is not even taking med school classes but thinks he is qualified to give advice on the curriculum of a school he doesn't attend.

 

[Songon12play]

Just ignore him. He is not even taking med school classes but thinks he is qualified to give advice on the curriculum of a school he doesn't attend.

Anyone can get a general idea of what works well in the curriculum and what doesn't from interview days, knowing their learning style, talking with students at each school, and seeing + thinking about what works well and what doesn't. That's exactly what I did. You're hardly discrediting me. If what I said is false a few posts ago then debunk it, otherwise your talk is empty. The CHC system has some serious issues to contend with e.g., putting people across the country and making them stream without choice, what the actual of purpose of these CHCs are (anyone can obtain early clinical experience at med schools without this system and without compromising their ability to attend lecture physically) and their failure to capitalize on the possibility of a personalized medical school education at each site with instructors [now that'd truly be unique and revolutionary], and sticking people with lower quality sites if they are accepted later or even early on based off of admissions criteria.

This isn't even including the unnecessary fragmentation of the class, the lack of resources available and lack of faculty in-person to provide dedicated support for boards during the first two years bc you're too busy being in a fragmented class across the country, the lack of a connected collaborative community at each site (where's the community in streaming from your bedroom?), and how streaming almost all lectures is a direct contradiction to how the curriculum is supposedly active learning based off of the clinical presentations.

Now go ahead and prove me wrong. I'd like to be proven wrong and get some actual answers about this stuff instead of empty vague talk. Just bc you excel at the curriculum doesn't mean its sound. That shows more about who you are than the curriculum. Plenty of students at medical schools across the country succeed in spite of a flawed curriculum. That doesn't mean their curriculum is good.

 

[keels99]

@Songon12play You're not made to stream without a choice because you're not forced to go to SOMA. You go into the program knowing that lectures are streamed second year. If streaming is something that you don't want to do, that's fine. Don't attend. This is why admissions look for certain types of students. I'm already a lecture streamer myself and love it. The only difference during second year is that I will probably be doing my streaming in a public library versus on campus. You seem to have this mindset that the only effective learning style is one in which you interact with the professor directly during lecture. That is not the case unless you're a f**king *****. We have a large faculty that is extremely helpful and responsive when it comes to any topics you have questions about. I actually prefer podcasts/streaming because it allows me to pause and rewind anytime I start losing focus. That's something I would never be able to do in a lecture hall. If you need someone to "hold your hand" to get through lecture, that's your own prerogative. Good luck studying for shelf exams and Step 1 with that mindset.

Furthermore there is no lack of connected collaborative community. You still meet multiple times a week for the clinical presentations at the CHC in a classroom with 9 other students. These are done as small groups the first year as well, so there is no difference in that aspect. We still meet for OPP as well. You seemed to be confused as to what the point of the clinical presentations are. It's not for a huge group of students to go over but rather small groups of 10 in which you work with your facilitator. This is actually my favorite part about SOMA because the clinical cases are always tied back to whatever we are learning about in lectures that week. It allows you to really see the relevance of what may seem like minutia.

Also, you aren't stuck at a "low quality site"; you only rank ones that you are okay with going to. Regardless, I wouldn't even consider any of the sites low quality, just some of them happen to be in rural areas and that is a culture shock for some people. It is ignorant to immediately assume that living in a rural area is equivalent to a low quality site. So that's another thing you're wrong about. You're not "stuck" anywhere.

Lastly, I don't know why you think we don't get preparation for boards. We have an entire block and time off in order to study for boards. We are encouraged to start preparing for boards early and actually have one on one meetings with our advisers in the third month to ensure we are on the right track with beginning our board prep. There is also a lot of support from the second years as far as the best resources for board prep (Firecracker, First Aid, etc.) The school also makes sure we are actually prepared to take them as well by having us take a practice COMLEX beforehand.

I'm actually glad you didn't decide to come to our program if you got accepted like you claim, because your arrogant attitude about our program is, quite frankly, annoying as hell. This thread is dedicated to those who don't understand the curriculum. If you don't like SOMA, that's fine, I'm not trying to change your mind in that regard. But you're not helping those who want to truly understand how the schools set up works.

 

[Songon12play]

@Songon12play You're not made to stream without a choice because you're not forced to go to SOMA. You go into the program knowing that lectures are streamed second year. If streaming is something that you don't want to do, that's fine. Don't attend. This is why admissions look for certain types of students. I'm already a lecture streamer myself and love it. The only difference during second year is that I will probably be doing my streaming in a public library versus on campus. You seem to have this mindset that the only effective learning style is one in which you interact with the professor directly during lecture. That is not the case unless you're a f**king *****. We have a large faculty that is extremely helpful and responsive when it comes to any topics you have questions about. I actually prefer podcasts/streaming because it allows me to pause and rewind anytime I start losing focus. That's something I would never be able to do in a lecture hall. If you need someone to "hold your hand" to get through lecture, that's your own prerogative. Good luck studying for shelf exams and Step 1 with that mindset.

Furthermore there is no lack of connected collaborative community. You still meet multiple times a week for the clinical presentations at the CHC in a classroom with 9 other students. These are done as small groups the first year as well, so there is no difference in that aspect. We still meet for OPP as well. You seemed to be confused as to what the point of the clinical presentations are. It's not for a huge group of students to go over but rather small groups of 10 in which you work with your facilitator. This is actually my favorite part about SOMA because the clinical cases are always tied back to whatever we are learning about in lectures that week. It allows you to really see the relevance of what may seem like minutia.

Also, you aren't stuck at a "low quality site"; you only rank ones that you are okay with going to. Regardless, I wouldn't even consider any of the sites low quality, just some of them happen to be in rural areas and that is a culture shock for some people. It is ignorant to immediately assume that living in a rural area is equivalent to a low quality site. So that's another thing you're wrong about. You're not "stuck" anywhere.

Lastly, I don't know why you think we don't get preparation for boards. We have an entire block and time off in order to study for boards. We are encouraged to start preparing for boards early and actually have one on one meetings with our advisers in the third month to ensure we are on the right track with beginning our board prep. There is also a lot of support from the second years as far as the best resources for board prep (Firecracker, First Aid, etc.) The school also makes sure we are actually prepared to take them as well by having us take a practice COMLEX beforehand.

I'm actually glad you didn't decide to come to our program if you got accepted like you claim, because your arrogant attitude about our program is, quite frankly, annoying as hell. This thread is dedicated to those who don't understand the curriculum. If you don't like SOMA, that's fine, I'm not trying to change your mind in that regard. But you're not helping those who want to truly understand how the schools set up works.

1) Stop assuming so god damn hard about me and my learning style, when you obviously know nothing. Most medical schools are versatile within the way they teach so students of all different learning styles are able to learn/find ways. Interacting with a professor does NOT equal hand-holding. You learn more by interacting and asking questions during the lecture, than passively following a prerecorded lecture. That is a fact. That's not hand-holding. Good luck being able to treat patients ever if you're just going to jump down their throat and assume based off of nothing like you did with me. Patients like me will not hesitate to take you to task for your BS. There's a difference between excelling in a lecture through attendance and interacting than expecting my handheld, and if you cant figure that one out your clueless. Not offering students the option to be able to attend the bulk of lectures is ridiculous for any school.
2) I never said it was a huge group for clinical presentations. All I said is it baffled me how clinical presentation active learning occurred when the class was so hyper-fragmented. What you say about the clinical presentations does sound good. This is exactly what I was hoping for. Doing OPP in person is a given, but what about personalized curriculum towards each site? If that's not there this program is wasting a lot of potential with these sites. What about unique lessons offered at each site and community involvement? If a CHC allowed you to gain breadth/exposure to board material and the curriculum in a way associated with the curriculum, I guarantee you not only would be better off for boards, but more prepared for your future practice. Until this school adopts something like that it's mostly wasted potential and pure gimmick.
3) If individuals aren't stuck with low quality sites, then explain how individuals are stuck with sites they don't want. If your post-interview scores aren't very good, it's very hard to get a desirable site, and if you're admitted late in the cycle you can kiss the chances of getting a site you want good bye.
4) Are these advisors located on each CHC? The prep resources are good and every place has that, but what about a curriculum that has board style questions? What about the ability to interact with faculty who are board exam question writers in-person? You can say all you want about emailing, but interacting with an instructor in-person and learning from them is totally different. That's not hand-holding, that's interactive learning.
5) Cool, I wouldn't attend some because the CHCs and forced streaming don't mesh with my learning style in the slightest. I'm a fan of active learning, but this system is very flawed. I also wouldn't want you as a peer. You're the type of person, who moans about people asking questions during class when they're doing so to learn, while making off the cuff generalizations about them, and if you actually listened you'd learn something too.

 

[AlteredScale]

Lets keep it civil please.

 

[kenjixshadow]

Not a SOMA's student, to any premed who is reading this thread, I'd trust the people who have been through the curriculum, not the people who haven't.

 

[Songon12play]

Not a SOMA's student, to any premed who is reading this thread, I'd trust the people who have been through the curriculum, not the people who haven't.

If you've seen an interview and asked questions like I have that doesn't mean my observations are any less valid. People who have been through the curriculum and our at AT SOMA has a vested interest in finding the perks of it because they're stuck with it honestly. You don't have to be at a school to notice the short-comings of it which are pretty apparent at this place.

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

We get it... You don't like SOMA. Now staaaaaahp. Some people are trying to learn from this thread.

@keels99 how many of the CHCs have rotation sites at decent sized hospitals with GME?

 

[Didierdrogba]

I dislike SOMA too, but when @Songon12play is actually three months into med school, we'll see if he decides to stream lectures or sit in the classroom.

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

I dislike SOMA too, but when @Songon12play is actually three months into med school, we'll see if he decides to stream lectures or sit in the classroom.

But lectures have been proven to be THE only way to actually learn material effectively!! It's a FACT.

......sarcasm.

 

[Songon12play]

I dislike SOMA too, but when @Songon12play is actually three months into med school, we'll see if he decides to stream lectures or sit in the classroom.

Whether or not I decide to stream doesn't change the point that forcing people to stream and depriving them of attending lecture is a poor way to handle the curriculum. I'm predominantly an auditory learner, and do best by learning in lecture. If that changes in med school that's coo, but that doesn't change the fact that attending lecture should be an open possibility in any curriculum.

 

[Songon12play]

But lectures have been proven to be THE only way to actually learn material effectively!! It's a FACT.

......sarcasm.

amazing strawman. whoosh. did you hear that? that's the sound of you missing my points entirely and them going over your head.

 

[IsWhat]

I've come to the conclusion @Songon12play was rejected from SOMA (regardless of what he/she says) and has hurt feelings over it. People don't get this vested in a thread when there is no emotional reason to do so - and there are a few other cases in other threads of disgruntled applicants who sound awfully similar to this character.

Regardless, I found SOMA's curriculum to be a pro for this school and they do a really good job of finding applicants who will thrive in the curriculum.

 

[Songon12play]

I've come to the conclusion @Songon12play was rejected from SOMA (regardless of what he/she says) and has hurt feelings over it. People don't get this vested in a thread when there is no emotional reason to do so - and there are a few other cases in other threads of disgruntled applicants who sound awfully similar to this character.

Regardless, I found SOMA's curriculum to be a pro for this school and they do a really good job of finding applicants who will thrive in the curriculum.

That's not true, I wasn't rejected, but lol believe what you want Idgaf. I just call it how I see and this thread has gotten really stupid with all the dumbo generalizations towards me that aren't true.

 

[keels99]

We get it... You don't like SOMA. Now staaaaaahp. Some people are trying to learn from this thread.

@keels99 how many of the CHCs have rotation sites at decent sized hospitals with GME?

I don't have a list of all of the hospitals on me but Phoenix, Seattle, DC, and Brooklyn all have rotations at large hospitals. Flagstaff also has rotations in Albuquerque and Phoenix and would be the location I know most about. The 3rd and 4th year students would be better to ask on the quality of each rotation, I would go to the SOMA thread for better info. I know the school focuses on making sure our rotations are meeting needs of students.

 

[IsWhat]

That's not true, I wasn't rejected, but lol believe what you want Idgaf. I just call it how I see and this thread has gotten really stupid with all the dumbo generalizations towards me that aren't true.

I call it how I see it also. People don't act like you when they have no "skin in the game", as you obviously deny.

Anyways, I wish you the best with your endeavors and hope that you will do us the courtesy of opening this thread up to SOMA students who can better answer the OPs question.

 

[SLC]

I dislike SOMA too, but when @Songon12play is actually three months into med school, we'll see if he decides to stream lectures or sit in the classroom.

I've been meaning to say this all along.

If it's past thanksgiving of first year and you still feel the need to be in lecture, you're doing it wrong. That is no different at SOMA than it is anywhere else.

All I can say is that SOMA was good enough for me to get into a top 20 program in my field. Today one of the ID docs on the wards asked me what year I was, I held up one finger and he instantly walked over and asked where I went to school, when I told him ATSU-SOMA he said "you're a very good resident, I honestly didn't think you were an intern".

My evaluations so far this year have frequently said "it's clear that SLC received excellent training in medical school. SLC's knowledge, clinical acumen and bedside manner are all well above what is expected from a resident at this point in training...

Yeah, SOMA definitely sucks.

 

[Songon12play]

I call it how I see it also. People don't act like you when they have no "skin in the game", as you obviously deny.

Anyways, I wish you the best with your endeavors and hope that you will do us the courtesy of opening this thread up to SOMA students who can better answer the OPs question.

If you call it as you see it then you're stevie wonder because you can't see ****.

I've been meaning to say this all along.

If it's past thanksgiving of first year and you still feel the need to be in love lecture, you're doing it wrong. That is no different at SOMA than it is anywhere else.

All I can say is that SOMA was good enough for me to get into a top 20 program in my field. Today one of the ID docs on the wards asked me what year I was, I held up one finger and he instantly walked over and asked where I went to school, when I told him ATSU-SOMA he said "you're a very good resident, I honestly didn't think you were an intern".

My evaluations so far this year have frequently said "it's clear that SLC received excellent training in medical school. SLC's knowledge, clinical acumen and bedside manner are all well above what is expected from a resident at this point in training...

Yeah, SOMA definitely sucks.

Good for you, you succeeded and attributed your success to the school, which is incorrect. An education is what you make of it that doesn't mean that SOMA did a good job preparing you.

 

[ortnakas]

I just clicked around in SOMA's website out of curiosity, and stumbled upon some sample calendars for first and second year. In one sample (http://www.atsu.edu/soma/prospective_students/academic_med602schedulew5.htm), it looks like students have 4 presumably interactive small-group case meetings, 3 group "scheme presentations," and a group multi-disciplinary conference. Along with that there's 3 webcasts, 2 webcasts with quizzes, a web-based discussion, and two other quizzes. I'm under the impression that students would also meet for an OPP course sometime in the week as well. While this curriculum doesn't sound like a good fit for me, it actually sounds like it allows for plenty of time to interact with other students and facilitators.

Out of curiosity, @Songon12play , what's your typical class size in undergrad? I'm wondering if you're used to small lectures where there's time for students to ask questions, because that would make a lot of your comments made more sense. In med school lectures there's typically 100+ people in the class and a LOT of material to get through, so it tends not to be as interactive as I think you're expecting it to be.

@SLC and other students/graduates aren't getting any benefit from saying good things about their school, and med school tends to make you more skeptical, not less, so their first-hand observations from being in the curriculum are more valid than those of someone whose information is coming from the interview packet and the interwebs (which is why I usually avoid discussing schools other than my own on SDN, I'm not sure why I keep letting myself getting sucked into this thread.)

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

Hold still, you will only feel a little poke as the ban hammer comes.

For future reference it isn't wise to tell people they don't know **** when they have first hand experience and far more experience... It makes you look like a child throwing a tantrum. 🙄

 

[Songon12play]

Hold still, you will only feel a little poke as the ban hammer comes.

For future reference it isn't wise to tell people they don't know **** when they have first hand experience and far more experience... It makes you look like a child throwing a tantrum. 🙄

for having actual experience you still haven't substantiated or responded to any of my points. if you did that'd be great, but you didn't, which means your experience doesn't mean jack****.

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

I never said I had experience dude....

 

[Songon12play]

I never said I had experience dude....

figures that explains why you couldn't contribute anything to this discussion, aside from post some bs about me. contribute or eject.

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

You have kept arguing with multiple students from SOMA that know far more than you and you say they know don't know anything...

Sorry but getting info out of the interview packet is about as good as what I can find on their website.

And this discussion was for people to learn about the curriculum at SOMA and I'm mad because we had a good discussion that you ruined with your misinformed opinions that don't contribute anything to the original post. So to you I say, contribute or eject.

At this point the mods should just shut it down because you won't let anyone knowledgable talk about the original subject without telling them they don't know ****.

 

[Songon12play]

You have kept arguing with multiple students from SOMA that know far more than you and you say they know don't know anything...

Sorry but getting info out of the interview packet is about as good as what I can find on their website.

And this discussion was for people to learn about the curriculum at SOMA and I'm mad because we had a good discussion that you ruined with your misinformed opinions that don't contribute anything to the original post. So to you I say, contribute or eject.

At this point the mods should just shut it down because you won't let anyone knowledgable talk about the original subject without telling them they don't know ****.

If they could bother addressing the points I mentioned without the bs, then there would be a discussion. They couldn't, so so much more "oh so knowledgeable".

 

[IsWhat]

You have kept arguing with multiple students from SOMA that know far more than you and you say they know don't know anything...

Sorry but getting info out of the interview packet is about as good as what I can find on their website.

And this discussion was for people to learn about the curriculum at SOMA and I'm mad because we had a good discussion that you ruined with your misinformed opinions that don't contribute anything to the original post. So to you I say, contribute or eject.

At this point the mods should just shut it down because you won't let anyone knowledgable talk about the original subject without telling them they don't know ****.

The "my way or the highway" attitude songin12play has taken shows a clear lack of maturity. The anger is a projection of other issues that are probably not related to the topic of SOMA's curriculum. I think any additional dialogue with this person would be futile - so I agree, mods should lock this thread.

 

[AlteredScale]

If you cannot keep your posts respectable and professional (that means STOP cursing) nor keep this thread on topic. It will be closed. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion and attack another user because they disagree is not OK. Final warning.

 

[keels99]

The "my way or the highway" attitude songin12play has taken shows a clear lack of maturity. The anger is a projection of other issues that are probably not related to the topic of SOMA's curriculum. I think any additional dialogue with this person would be futile - so I agree, mods should lock this thread.

 

[Songon12play]

The "my way or the highway" attitude songin12play has taken shows a clear lack of maturity. The anger is a projection of other issues that are probably not related to the topic of SOMA's curriculum. I think any additional dialogue with this person would be futile - so I agree, mods should lock this thread.

lmao you couldnt refute anything and all keels could do is insult. now that's a total lack of maturity.

 

[AlteredScale]

Since we all can't play along nicely, this thread is closed. Users are reminded to keep posts professional and respectable. It is against ToS to attack other users simply based on differentiating opinions.