St.George's University of London-Nicosia or SGU-Grenada??? Help!!!!

[396592]

Hello everyone,

Long story short, I have been accepted to

St.George's University in Grenada

and

St.George's University of London-Nicosia.

For those of you who don't know much about St.George's University of London, it's a 4-year graduate program specifically designed for international graduates seeking an MBBS/MD degree offered by St.George's University of London in partnership with University of Nicosia in Cyprus. (The degree is from St.George's University of London)
The curriculum consists of 2 years of basic sciences in Cyprus and clinical rotations at Mt.Sinai and Jackson Park in Chicago. Their first class commenced in 2011 so there aren't any numbers with which to assess their performance on the USMLE & Residency, etc. However, their program is recognized by the UK and looks pretty solid.

I'm aware of SGU-Grenada's strong track record and wanted to see what you guys had to say about choosing between the two schools. Thanks!

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[edgerock24]

Reputation wise, St.George's University of London may be a little bit better (UK medical schools are typically pretty solid).

However, what's more important is the success of graduates: do St.George's University of London students find themselves getting good residencies after graduation? Can they practice in all 50 states?

SGU (Grenada) is arguably the best Carib. school. Carib. schools get bad raps for having their students pay a lot of money and have trouble finding residencies; however, SGU's match list has been quite impressive over the years, and has a boatload of affiliated hospitals to do 3rd/4th yr at.

 

[bambi]

St George's in London is a world class medical school. I'm surprised they have that sort of course to be honest but a degree from them or any UK school will look better than any Caribbean degree. The downside of UK schools compared to Caribbean is usually the lack of US experience, that isn't the case here. With a London degree you can practice anywhere in the world. You would be an idiot to go to the Caribbean over London.

 

[bambi]

Reputation wise, St.George's University of London may be a little bit better (UK medical schools are typically pretty solid).

However, what's more important is the success of graduates: do St.George's University of London students find themselves getting good residencies after graduation? Can they practice in all 50 states?

SGU (Grenada) is arguably the best Carib. school. Carib. schools get bad raps for having their students pay a lot of money and have trouble finding residencies; however, SGU's match list has been quite impressive over the years, and has a boatload of affiliated hospitals to do 3rd/4th yr at.

You are clearly very misinformed.

Asking if a student from a UK school can practice in all 50 states is like asking if a student from a US school can. Saying UK school reputation is slightly better than that of Caribbean schools is also the same as saying that about US schools.

 

[edgerock24]

You are clearly very misinformed.

Asking if a student from a UK school can practice in all 50 states is like asking if a student from a US school can. Saying UK school reputation is slightly better than that of Caribbean schools is also the same as saying that about US schools.

Actually, I'm not misinformed. I remember reading a "ValueMD" thread on this after doing some basic research on the school. On here, the school/program was being critiqued for not having approval for its grads to practice in all 50 U.S. states (NY, California, & Florida being the main issues, I believe), and having 3rd/4th year rotations being completed at a non-ACGME approved hospital. This information can be considered accurate because a recruiter for the school even stated this, "Our goal at INTO SGUL is to ultimately have approval in all 50 states for students in our program and we'll definitely be working on getting there." This comment is from roughly 1 year ago, so maybe some changes occurred.

Thread link: http://www.valuemd.com/st-georges-u...ersity-london-uk-courses-intl-students-8.html

The OP should make sure these issues have been sorted out before committing to this school. Personally, I would much rather prefer to attend a UK school over a Caribbean one, all things equal.

 

[396592]

Here's what I've found so far about their program and degree.

Read paragraph 4 and 8 on page 2. I may be mistaken but it pretty much states that the Nicosia program falls under the GMC & St.George's University of London oversight, thereby granting its students the exact same qualifications as those who graduate from London campus.

http://www.gmc-uk.org/08___St_Georg...nd_Israel___revised_post_meeting_47707189.pdf

 

[396592]

This is an email I received from the GMC. I just copied & pasted my questions above the answers they've given me.

Dear *****

Thank you for your email, and apologoes for the delay in responding.

1. Why does the Cyprus campus not have its own separate listing on International Medical Education Directory(IMED)?

2. Would the MBBS(MD) degree earned in Cyprus be fully recognized by the General Medical Council(GMC) as that of St.Georges University of London Medical School?


The GMC decides which bodies or combinations of bodies are entitled to award a UK primary medical qualification (PMQ) and, according to the current legislative framework, the GMC is required to ensure the standards it sets for the award of a UK primary medical qualification is maintained, regardless of where the course is delivered. The current legislation allows us to approve by individual organisation awarding the PMQ, rather than an individual programme of study. This means that if an organisation is on our list of awarding bodies, all programmes of study leading to the award of a UK PMQ are covered. This is also why there is no separate entry for the St George's degree delivered in conjunction with the University of Nicosia on the IMED or the WHO lists.

St George's Hospital Medical School is on the list of bodies that can award UK primary medical qualifications so the quality assurance process for St George's at the University of Nicosia (Cyprus) is about the medical school demonstrating that they continue to meet the requirements set out in Tomorrow's Doctors (2009). You can read the reports of our recent quality assurance activity in relation to the Nicosia programme here.

If the current statutory and regulatory framework remains the same, subject to satisfactory completion of quality assurance activities, St George's will remain on our list, and students from St George's at the University of Nicosia will be able to apply to the UK Foundation Programme as a graduate of a UK medical school. They will also be able to apply for provisional registration with the GMC, and must complete year 1 of the Foundation Programme in order to gain full registration with the GMC and practice as a doctor in the UK.

3. If I were to earn the MBBS(MD) degree being offered by St.Georges University of London from their satellite campus located in Cyprus, would that give me the the full qualifications I would need in order to obtain internship/residency positions in the U.S.(California, New York etc.) and the United Kingdom?

I am unable to give you an indication of the likelihood of you gaining a place on the Foundation Programme, however, you can find more information about the current requirements for eligibility and the application process on the UK Foundation Programme Office's web site.

With regard to your question about obtaining a residendency/internship position in the US, as this is managed by the regulatory body in the US we are unable to advise on the likelihood of the St George's degree allowing you to apply for a residency/internship position. However, we would encourage you to pursue this point with Dean of Admissions at St George's at the University of Nicosia.

 

[Medstart108]

Watch out though, the California Board which is the toughest in the US has started to distinguish normal courses from "specialized international ones". One reason SGUL might say we are trying to get 50 state approval is because there is a difference between SGUL's normal UK program and its SGUL into nicosia program. I would choose the SGUL nicosia since rotations at Mount Sinai seem nice.

Another thing i would seriously tell you there is a difference between good London schools and bad ones. SGUL has been ranked near the bottom of the league tables in medicine for the past few years...
Also, did you know London Met (a laughable university in London) is offering a joint medical program with a sketchy Caribbean school?

Some schools in the UK are getting lax with its reputation. Schools shouldn't be stooping down to no name Caribbean level.

Overall i would recommend the SGUL nicosia because the rotations seem to be nice but if you are risk averse go with SGU since at least they have a track record and what if they don't get 50 state approval?

 

[bambi]

Watch out though, the California Board which is the toughest in the US has started to distinguish normal courses from "specialized international ones". One reason SGUL might say we are trying to get 50 state approval is because there is a difference between SGUL's normal UK program and its SGUL into nicosia program. I would choose the SGUL nicosia since rotations at Mount Sinai seem nice.

Another thing i would seriously tell you there is a difference between good London schools and bad ones. SGUL has been ranked near the bottom of the league tables in medicine for the past few years...
Also, did you know London Met (a laughable university in London) is offering a joint medical program with a sketchy Caribbean school?

Some schools in the UK are getting lax with its reputation. Schools shouldn't be stooping down to no name Caribbean level.

Overall i would recommend the SGUL nicosia because the rotations seem to be nice but if you are risk averse go with SGU since at least they have a track record and what if they don't get 50 state approval?

UK league tables are based on nonsense and should be treated as such. Personally I wouldn't have chosen SGU over any other London school but there is no problem with its reputation. London Met? It doesn't have a medical school. There is a big difference between good and bad London schools but any with a real medical school are good universities.

 

[396592]

You make a good point Medstart. SGUL-Nicosia is not an INTO program in London although both are 4-year graduate MBBS programs. The question I have is, would U.S. schools differentiate between those who have been taught in London and those from Nicosia when both graduates earn the exact same degree? Or do they just look at the school from which the degree was earned?

 

[Medstart108]

You make a good point Medstart. SGUL-Nicosia is not an INTO program in London although both are 4-year graduate MBBS programs. The question I have is, would U.S. schools differentiate between those who have been taught in London and those from Nicosia when both graduates earn the exact same degree? Or do they just look at the school from which the degree was earned?

I think they probably would differentiate. I mean the SGUL-Nicosia is never taught in London at all right? Its 2 years in nicosia and 2 years in the US doing rotations

I think if its GMC approved you should mention that when applying and it seems like the GMC is following it closely because any degree that is awarded by a GMC approved school like SGUL needs to follow GMC rules.

I don't think though that the program directors will really care too much where you studied your pre-clinical stuff. Its like if i taught you math in egypt vs math in brazil. Its math no matter what.

The difference is in clinical rotations since your patients are different, the healthcare systems are different, diseases could be different as well (less tropical/more chronic). So if you are sure the clinicals are in the US at mount sinai or chicago then it wouldn't be too bad.

It seems a bit odd though that SGUL would want to start a program that isn't taught anywhere near their own campus...

In regards to league tables i do think they are useful to some degree. They do release what they rank schools on namely: Satisfaction rates, Difficulty of entry, Research, Job prospects (i consider Job prospects really just BS.. how are some schools 100 whereas others 99 or 98..) but yeah. Most would agree that SGUL is not the best london school (maybe in the past but not now).

 

[edgerock24]

All good insight from everyone. Regardless, my main issue still remains with uncertainty with students being able to practice in all 50 states. It is kind of sketchy that an employee can't even answer that question him/herself. I hope you do contact the Dean of Admissions and find out before you make any decisions (and keep us posted as well!).

 

[sanam1209]

Hello everyone,

Long story short, I have been accepted to

St.George's University in Grenada

and

St.George's University of London-Nicosia.

For those of you who don't know much about St.George's University of London, it's a 4-year graduate program specifically designed for international graduates seeking an MBBS/MD degree offered by St.George's University of London in partnership with University of Nicosia in Cyprus. (The degree is from St.George's University of London)
The curriculum consists of 2 years of basic sciences in Cyprus and clinical rotations at Mt.Sinai and Jackson Park in Chicago. Their first class commenced in 2011 so there aren't any numbers with which to assess their performance on the USMLE & Residency, etc. However, their program is recognized by the UK and looks pretty solid.

I'm aware of SGU-Grenada's strong track record and wanted to see what you guys had to say about choosing between the two schools. Thanks!

So what school did you finally choose? And what helped you decide?
I am currently in the same dilemma right now and would really appreciate some advise!