Stanford AP/AP+CP Program Quota

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deleted113029


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Hmmm...just thought this was interesting.

NRMP says there are currently 5 spots...several weeks ago there were 8.:confused:
 

djmd

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Non match fills?
 
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deleted113029

Non match fills?

not sure what you mean by this...5 spots for the regular NRMP match. (outside the match=non match?) i guess this would be possible but i thought that wasn't allowed.
 

CameronFrye

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not sure what you mean by this...5 spots for the regular NRMP match. (outside the match=non match?) i guess this would be possible but i thought that wasn't allowed.

It's possible if those "outside the match" people are not graduating US 4th year med students.
 
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deleted113029

It's possible if those "outside the match" people are not graduating US 4th year med students.

yeah, that's probably true. I just think it's false advertising when you go to a program that explicitly states (at the interview) there are 8 positions for AP/AP+CP but then changes to 5 a week or two before ROLs are due...that's all. maybe i'm the only one who feels this way...oh well. (it's just a matter of principle for me.)
 

yaah

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Yeah, that bothers me too. But that's the way things go - it doesn't necessarily mean they had those positions filled initially, maybe they decided to do it after interviewing most of the candidates.
 

djmd

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a program that explicitly states (at the interview) there are 8 positions for AP/AP+CP but then changes to 5 a week or two before

They say they are taking 8 residents they never say that the are taking 8 people through the match...

And I find it funny to see the level of hand ringing about residency and matching issues, but people seem unfazed by even less fair play tactics for fellowships...
 

yaah

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That's because everyone is secretly hoping that the evil fellowship tactics will somehow fall in their favor.
 

DarksideAllstar

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yeah, that's probably true. I just think it's false advertising when you go to a program that explicitly states (at the interview) there are 8 positions for AP/AP+CP but then changes to 5 a week or two before ROLs are due...that's all. maybe i'm the only one who feels this way...oh well. (it's just a matter of principle for me.)

I inquired specifically re: the number of spots offered in the match (after seeing 5 on the NRMP site) about 3 weeks ago and I never got an answer back.
 

DarksideAllstar

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shady nonresponse...:thumbdown:

True, but what can you do at this point? Certainly, they got a few people outside the match after the first of the year and reduced the # of spots. I do think that they should have at least updated applicants with the new # they are taking in the match though, not that it would necessarily change my (or anyway else's) ROL.
 
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deleted113029

True, but what can you do at this point? Certainly, they got a few people outside the match after the first of the year and reduced the # of spots. I do think that they should have at least updated applicants with the new # they are taking in the match though, not that it would necessarily change my (or anyway else's) ROL.

you're right...water under the bridge.
 
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DarksideAllstar

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after all, their mascot is a dancing tree....


go GOLDEN BEARS!

My girl is from Berkeley. Her dad went to Cal, she went to Cal, and her sister went to law school at Cal-- the Stanford bashing never ends at that place, particularly around the time of the Big Game. It would make for interesting holiday conversation if I ended up matching there (of course, I would have to show some loyalty to the Cardinal-- and yeah, their mascot sux). :laugh:
 

DarksideAllstar

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you're right...water under the bridge.

There are so many apsects of pre-med/med school/residency apps that I just want to call SHENANIGANS on, I'm not even sure where to begin. Instead, I'll just have me another one of these:

05512_guinness12.jpg
 
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edmacmahon

Darkside,
I hope on behalf of your special lady friend et al. that you don't have to move to the shallow alto...i've never actually been that far south in the bay, but i bet the burritos are far inferior....(not counting san jose of course!)

(just trying to see if i can start a burrito war from my snow cave in laverne and shirley-land....can cun forever!!!)
 

DarksideAllstar

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Darkside,
I hope on behalf of your special lady friend et al. that you don't have to move to the shallow alto...i've never actually been that far south in the bay, but i bet the burritos are far inferior....(not counting san jose of course!)

(just trying to see if i can start a burrito war from my snow cave in laverne and shirley-land....can cun forever!!!)

Dude, the mission by far has the best burritos, but there is the place in the haight called el Balazo that is the ****e. A couple of places I have been to in the south bay were alright, but there's nothing like ordering tripe in a place where they don't habla inglais.
 

SLUsagar

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As AP chief resident here, after reading the posts on here i'm obliged
to address these issues after chatting with some of our directors.
First, I'm not sure where (or why) the # 8 was posted. We have been
accredited for 8, but don't have the funding for that many. And I'm
pretty sure that includes all candidates, including AP/CP and AP & CP onlys.
Candidates have always been told during the interview process that
we've taken 6-7ish in the past, but we don't have any sorta QUOTA. We take the best candidates, simple as that.
Second, 5 is indeed correct as to the # of slots, and may have been
reduced because of selections outside the match. Historically, Stanford has
RARELY taken people outside the match and strongly desires candidates within the regular match process. But this year we had extremely unusual
circumstances surrounding 2 candidates, both with previous training,
that explains the non-match selections.

Trust me, I wouldn't have come to a place that's shady whatSOever, and
defintely would not want to represent such a place as a chief. PM or
post with any other questions. Later dudes.
 

LADoc00

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after all, their mascot is a dancing tree....


go GOLDEN BEARS!

Ah yes, but it used to be the Stanford Indians, an Indian warrior chief who wore a bear skin! ouch.
 

PathOne

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As AP chief resident here, after reading the posts on here i'm obliged
to address these issues after chatting with some of our directors.
First, I'm not sure where (or why) the # 8 was posted. We have been
accredited for 8, but don't have the funding for that many. And I'm
pretty sure that includes all candidates, including AP/CP and AP & CP onlys.
Candidates have always been told during the interview process that
we've taken 6-7ish in the past, but we don't have any sorta QUOTA. We take the best candidates, simple as that.
Second, 5 is indeed correct as to the # of slots, and may have been
reduced because of selections outside the match. Historically, Stanford has
RARELY taken people outside the match and strongly desires candidates within the regular match process. But this year we had extremely unusual
circumstances surrounding 2 candidates, both with previous training,
that explains the non-match selections.

Trust me, I wouldn't have come to a place that's shady whatSOever, and
defintely would not want to represent such a place as a chief. PM or
post with any other questions. Later dudes.

Makes a lot of sense. At least in academic medicine, programs will from time to time prematch IMG's, sometimes even individuals who barely passed USMLE. However, these almost invariably have A LOT of previous experience, often being fully boarded/attendings in their home country (which explains their USMLE score, as they're several years past all the stuff they learned in med school).

However, compared to the total # of residency spots, we're talking about a very small minority, as far as I'm aware.
 
D

deleted113029

As AP chief resident here, after reading the posts on here i'm obliged
to address these issues after chatting with some of our directors.
First, I'm not sure where (or why) the # 8 was posted. We have been
accredited for 8, but don't have the funding for that many. And I'm
pretty sure that includes all candidates, including AP/CP and AP & CP onlys.
Candidates have always been told during the interview process that
we've taken 6-7ish in the past, but we don't have any sorta QUOTA. We take the best candidates, simple as that.
Second, 5 is indeed correct as to the # of slots, and may have been
reduced because of selections outside the match. Historically, Stanford has
RARELY taken people outside the match and strongly desires candidates within the regular match process. But this year we had extremely unusual
circumstances surrounding 2 candidates, both with previous training,
that explains the non-match selections.

Trust me, I wouldn't have come to a place that's shady whatSOever, and
defintely would not want to represent such a place as a chief. PM or
post with any other questions. Later dudes.

Stanford was definitely one of the best places I visited. With that said, the bolded statement, which was also said many times at the interview, just irritated the crap out of me...sounds elitist to me. No other program even mentioned that they chose the best candidates for their program. I just assumed that was what all programs desired...didn't realize it needed to be vocalized.

tangent i know...but who cares. :)
 

SLUsagar

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Makes a lot of sense. At least in academic medicine, programs will from time to time prematch IMG's, sometimes even individuals who barely passed USMLE. However, these almost invariably have A LOT of previous experience, often being fully boarded/attendings in their home country (which explains their USMLE score, as they're several years past all the stuff they learned in med school).

However, compared to the total # of residency spots, we're talking about a very small minority, as far as I'm aware.

agreed. but the possible pre-matches are not IMGs etc, and passed the boards just fine apparently. They don't let us residents in on the actual selection process of candidates (other than listening to strong fav/unfav opinions we get from interviewees, which they take very seriouslly), but that's what i know.
 
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PathOne

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How can US grads prematch????
 
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b&ierstiefel

How can US grads prematch????
US grads can prematch if they've been out of school and doing something else for a while. For instance, let's say an MD/PhD person graduates in 2000 and goes off to do something else and then applies years later. That person apparently can sign outside of the match. I haven't read the rules closely but this must be some loophole.
 

pathstudent

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US grads can prematch if they've been out of school and doing something else for a while. For instance, let's say an MD/PhD person graduates in 2000 and goes off to do something else and then applies years later. That person apparently can sign outside of the match. I haven't read the rules closely but this must be some loophole.

Not 100% sure about this but I think you can also go outside the match if you are bailing on another residency (such as surgery or family medicine or radiology etc...).
 

PathOne

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US grads can prematch if they've been out of school and doing something else for a while. For instance, let's say an MD/PhD person graduates in 2000 and goes off to do something else and then applies years later. That person apparently can sign outside of the match. I haven't read the rules closely but this must be some loophole.

That would make sense, I guess:
1. 4th yr US med student ----> must match/scramble to get Res.
2. Others ("older" US grads/FMG's etc) ---> prematch/match or scramble (but generally harder to match, at least for FMG's)
 

yaah

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There are also people who graduate early from med school - like in january or february of 4th year instead of june. I know of some people who did this, not sure if many schools even allow this. Maybe they had done 5 years instead of 4, I dunno. But they were allowed to prematch.
 

whispers

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Stanford was definitely one of the best places I visited. With that said, the bolded statement, which was also said many times at the interview, just irritated the crap out of me...sounds elitist to me. No other program even mentioned that they chose the best candidates for their program. I just assumed that was what all programs desired...didn't realize it needed to be vocalized.

tangent i know...but who cares. :)

Don't get irritated man be cause "the best candidates for their program" may not be the best candidate for another program. You have to go with the best fit for you just as a program will go for the best fit for them. And hey Stanford may think that you are the best candidates for their program. I hope my first choice shows me some love match day. . . . Good luck everyone and may the force be with you and throw back some karma this way tooo. . . .
 
D

deleted113029

There are so many apsects of pre-med/med school/residency apps that I just want to call SHENANIGANS on, I'm not even sure where to begin. Instead, I'll just have me another one of these:

05512_guinness12.jpg

:love: :luck: I love guiness and ireland. Boy, do i love to drink those.
 

DarksideAllstar

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:love: :luck: I love guiness and ireland. Boy, do i love to drink those.

I can't wait to get back into San Francisco in a couple of weeks. There are a couple of Irish Pubs that realy know how to pour them. The one I hold in my hand is good, but its not the same. :luck:
 

SLUsagar

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Don't get irritated man be cause "the best candidates for their program" may not be the best candidate for another program. You have to go with the best fit for you just as a program will go for the best fit for them. And hey Stanford may think that you are the best candidates for their program. I hope my first choice shows me some love match day. . . . Good luck everyone and may the force be with you and throw back some karma this way tooo. . . .

thanks for addressing that. didn't mean any eliticism (word?) by my earlier comment 'taking the best candidate.' As stated above, Stanford just takes who's best for THEM; these people often aren't the smartest, brighest candidates out there nec....(no knock on my fellow residents!), they just fit in here, which is something important b/c everyone, and i mean everyone, gets along here. Call it selection bias, but hey, everyone from the attendings on down makes this place a happy, easy-going, yet stimulating environment.
 

sequela

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thanks for addressing that. didn't mean any eliticism (word?) by my earlier comment 'taking the best candidate.' As stated above, Stanford just takes who's best for THEM; these people often aren't the smartest, brighest candidates out there nec....(no knock on my fellow residents!), they just fit in here, which is something important b/c everyone, and i mean everyone, gets along here. Call it selection bias, but hey, everyone from the attendings on down makes this place a happy, easy-going, yet stimulating environment.

i have to second this comment. having spent a month on elective at stanford, i, as an objective observer with no expectations, instantly noticed the chemistry amongst the residents, faculty and staff. it's really a lovely, wonderful group of people and it's no accident either...clearly there is serious consideration of "fit" by both the program and the residents. actually that's what impressed me most about stanford...it seems to me they really care about the group dynamic. i never took it for elitism or got that vibe off anyone there.
 

Click Here!

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There are also people who graduate early from med school - like in january or february of 4th year instead of june. I know of some people who did this, not sure if many schools even allow this. Maybe they had done 5 years instead of 4, I dunno. But they were allowed to prematch.

Since I fell into this category (did 1.5 yrs research) I looked very closely at the rules. To pre-match, a US grad must have graduated 6 months prior to the match (ie, before September). So even though I finished my last rotation in November and officially graduated in December, I was not allowed to prematch because according to the NRMP rules I'm still classified as a MS4. Whether a program would have skated around that obscure rule if it needed someone to start in January for whatever reason is another question.
 

TheMightyAngus

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:love: :luck: I love guiness and ireland. Boy, do i love to drink those.

They say that guinness tastes differently in Ireland than in Britain and everywhere else in the world. I couldnt tell any difference other than that the Irish really dont **** around with pouring . They make pouring a craft.
 
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deleted113029

They say that guinness tastes differently in Ireland than in Britain and everywhere else in the world. I couldnt tell any difference other than that the Irish really dont **** around with pouring . They make pouring a craft.

then US bartenders need to get spanked! they all have problems with it...i bet they take the short bus to work.
 
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