Stating career goals as an applicant

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gohogwild

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I find that personal statements tend to have the criterion of stating specific career goals, and I've also heard it's bonus points if your reference letters your career goals.

My issue is, what would that look like as an applicant who's still on outside looking in? How specific to get while remaining honest?

A mix of clinical and research = stereotypical, vague ?

Academia through and through = pigeon holing yourself ? saying what they want to hear ?

Niche private practice = grandiose ?

The reality is, is that I have a lot of time and school to figure this stuff out- and I'm not concerned that I won't figure it out. So do I just tell them what they want to hear? Pick something for the sake of checking this box?

TLDR: I do not know how to prepare a soundbite about my career goals that is accurate, realistic, specific, and attractive to doctoral programs

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I find that personal statements tend to have the criterion of stating specific career goals, and I've also heard it's bonus points if your reference letters your career goals.

My issue is, what would that look like as an applicant who's still on outside looking in? How specific to get while remaining honest?

A mix of clinical and research = stereotypical, vague ?

Academia through and through = pigeon holing yourself ? saying what they want to hear ?

Niche private practice = grandiose ?

The reality is, is that I have a lot of time and school to figure this stuff out- and I'm not concerned that I won't figure it out. So do I just tell them what they want to hear? Pick something for the sake of checking this box?

TLDR: I do not know how to prepare a soundbite about my career goals that is accurate, realistic, specific, and attractive to doctoral programs
I would include something along the lines of when you said “I have a lot of time and school to figure this out.” Be honest about it.

Maybe something like, “At this point in time, my interests range from opening a niche private practice to working in academia. I’m certain as I progress through the program and learn more about the field, I will be better prepared to outline my specific goals.”

I’m not sure if this is what they’re looking for and you may want to have a couple more specifics but I know I always prefer the more honest route. Plus, it shows you have some flexibility, are optimistic about the future/program, and a willingness to learn.

Just my two cents.
 
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If you're not applying this cycle, use that time to figure out what you want. I would advise against just telling people what you think they want to hear. For one thing, that might become obvious when you can't articulate why you're interested in the path you're claiming to want. For another, it won't get you what you want. If you get into a program that doesn't meet your needs, then you're not going to have as good of a time as you could have.

The Splat Lab at the University of Michigan has resources here that might be helpful, particularly the annotated personal statement examples.
 
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I would include something along the lines of when you said “I have a lot of time and school to figure this out.” Be honest about it.

Maybe something like, “At this point in time, my interests range from opening a niche private practice to working in academia. I’m certain as I progress through the program and learn more about the field, I will be better prepared to outline my specific goals.”

I’m not sure if this is what they’re looking for and you may want to have a couple more specifics but I know I always prefer the more honest route. Plus, it shows you have some flexibility, are optimistic about the future/program, and a willingness to learn.

Just my two cents.
I agree that I want to be honest about what I want. I also think there's strategy and responsibility in the details. Personally, if I read that someone was interested in either a niche private practice or working in academia, I would get the impression that they do not know the gravity or focus that either of those specializations takes and that they sound naive. That is just my opinion though, and why I'm puzzled.
 
If you're not applying this cycle, use that time to figure out what you want. I would advise against just telling people what you think they want to hear. For one thing, that might become obvious when you can't articulate why you're interested in the path you're claiming to want. For another, it won't get you what you want. If you get into a program that doesn't meet your needs, then you're not going to have as good of a time as you could have.

The Splat Lab at the University of Michigan has resources here that might be helpful, particularly the annotated personal statement examples.
Thank you for that resource! I don't think I ever would have found that on my own and it gives a lot to consider.

If I were to give my specific situation, I think my problem is, is that I am very interested in research (background in neuroscience, would like to continue that, many of the programs I'm interested in center around behavioral genetics)- but I am also very invested in learning about therapeutic methodology and care a lot about that too (I am also a minority and believe I could attract a niche population).
It also seems like many clinical psychologists piece together their careers to meet their interests, and I don't have a clear step-by-step in my head yet, and I don't know how much communicating any of this would be helpful. Esp when I'm interested research, but am unsure about the stereotypic academic career, and care about having clinical responsibilities.

Thanks for your response, I agree with all of your points.
 
OK, I found the thread I was looking for, should anyone else be curious:



Thanks to those who responded!
 
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One thing I’d specifically think about regarding this question - especially if it comes up is an interview - is being able to articulate why you want a clinical/counseling PhD instead of either an experimental or masters level degree. Why is this the type of program that will best set you up for your future goals? I think PIs somewhat want to know that you understand the landscape and are have thoughtfully considered your options so you don’t end up in a program realizing you want something else.
 
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Thank you for that resource! I don't think I ever would have found that on my own and it gives a lot to consider.

If I were to give my specific situation, I think my problem is, is that I am very interested in research (background in neuroscience, would like to continue that, many of the programs I'm interested in center around behavioral genetics)- but I am also very invested in learning about therapeutic methodology and care a lot about that too (I am also a minority and believe I could attract a niche population).
It also seems like many clinical psychologists piece together their careers to meet their interests, and I don't have a clear step-by-step in my head yet, and I don't know how much communicating any of this would be helpful. Esp when I'm interested research, but am unsure about the stereotypic academic career, and care about having clinical responsibilities.

Thanks for your response, I agree with all of your points.
Don't try to game it. Be genuine and say what you want so that you get offers at programs that will actually help fulfill your career goals. Moreover, as savvy as you think your gamifying is to make it "attractive" to program, I assure you that they understand this better than you do and can see through this behavior, which doesn't really reflect well on you.
 
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One thing I’d specifically think about regarding this question - especially if it comes up is an interview - is being able to articulate why you want a clinical/counseling PhD instead of either an experimental or masters level degree. Why is this the type of program that will best set you up for your future goals? I think PIs somewhat want to know that you understand the landscape and are have thoughtfully considered your options so you don’t end up in a program realizing you want something else.
That's a great point, thank you Dazen.
 
Sounds like you want to have options. You want a training that gives you the scientific knowledge and practical skills to be successful in a clinical position, academic/research position, or some combination of the two, with a foundation that will serve you well as you advance in your career to more senior leadership positions. That is why you are looking for doctoral level training. (or maybe I'm just putting words in your mouth, but it sounds pretty good, right?)
 
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Don't say what you think they want to hear. I knew many folks who did (often feigning interest in research) and ended up miserable in a setting with people who were <excellent> graduate advisors but were very upfront about the fact that they were aiming to train researchers and not clinicians. Even when trying their best to be supportive, it usually did not go well.

It is tough to give absolute answers as it really depends on the setting. My graduate advisors would be very put-off by almost any mention of a clinical career, but he was upfront about this from the start, it was on the website, it was stated at interviews, graduate students were encouraged to be open with interviewees about this and exceedingly few of their previous students have pursued clinical careers (I think maybe 2-3 out of 20+ are in primary clinical settings, though obviously some people maintain a small clinical component to their job?). Other faculty in the same program felt very differently and (despite being a clinical science program) some were even put off by people who were strongly research-focused as they knew they weren't the best choice of advisor.
 
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Sounds like you want to have options. You want a training that gives you the scientific knowledge and practical skills to be successful in a clinical position, academic/research position, or some combination of the two, with a foundation that will serve you well as you advance in your career to more senior leadership positions. That is why you are looking for doctoral level training. (or maybe I'm just putting words in your mouth, but it sounds pretty good, right?)
That does sound good! Confident and specific, yet so vague.
 
Don't say what you think they want to hear. I knew many folks who did (often feigning interest in research) and ended up miserable in a setting with people who were <excellent> graduate advisors but were very upfront about the fact that they were aiming to train researchers and not clinicians. Even when trying their best to be supportive, it usually did not go well.

It is tough to give absolute answers as it really depends on the setting. My graduate advisors would be very put-off by almost any mention of a clinical career, but he was upfront about this from the start, it was on the website, it was stated at interviews, graduate students were encouraged to be open with interviewees about this and exceedingly few of their previous students have pursued clinical careers (I think maybe 2-3 out of 20+ are in primary clinical settings, though obviously some people maintain a small clinical component to their job?). Other faculty in the same program felt very differently and (despite being a clinical science program) some were even put off by people who were strongly research-focused as they knew they weren't the best choice of advisor.
That's an excellent point. I think that being able to "say what they want to hear", also comes with wanting to say what they want to hear, which is also just being a good match- so yes, this gives me good ideas about thinking about the PIs career and output and lifestyle balance also, which I was going to do anyways, but this also sheds new light :)
 
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