Status Among Colleagues

[RexKD]

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I know that doctors are doctors, and each specialty has an important function, but how would you rank the specialties according to the prestige they are given by their fellow doctors?

 

[DrDawg]

Everyone ****s on everyone else. FP and psych get the worst of it.

 

[typeB-md]

well first we all line up in a circle... then we pull down our pants. the guy packing teh most man-meat gets the most respect and so on, until the end.

for women we use breast size instead.

 

[wooo]

1. Derm
2. Ortho/ENT/Optho/Neurosurgery

 

[mddo2b]

I know that doctors are doctors, and each specialty has an important function, but how would you rank the specialties according to the prestige they are given by their fellow doctors?

1. Surgery
2. Surgery
3. Surgery
4.Everything else.....who really cares

 

[Finally M3]

1. Derm
2. Ortho/ENT/Optho/Neurosurgery

Really? I know the derm residents are smart as hell (and thus, could have done anything they wanted), but the "Pimple-popper MD" moniker is firmly entrenched in a lot of physicians minds. That little montage in 'Scrubs' last night isn't far from what some physicians think of derm.

I would put Neurosurg/Vascular/Cardiothoracic Surgery first.

 

[doc05]

1. Surgery
2. Surgery
3. Surgery
4.Everything else.....who really cares

that's about right. every nonsurgeon attending seems to have the utmost respect for surgeons. in part because they work harder than anyone else; and in part because of the "hero" image.

FP, psych get the worst of it. EM varies depending on the institution -- can be hit or miss.

 

[OldPsychDoc]

that's about right. every nonsurgeon attending seems to have the utmost respect for surgeons. in part because they work harder than anyone else; and in part because of the "hero" image.

FP, psych get the worst of it. EM varies depending on the institution -- can be hit or miss.

And in psych we turn it right back around and rag on the arrogance, dismissiveness, and outright narcissism of the surgeons...

This is really pretty much a useless exercise. We need you to come fix the self-inflicted wrist lacs and broken hips in our patients; you need us to evaluate the post-op deliriums, talk down the somatisizing borderlines, and get the drunks and crazies off of your services. So be nice.

 

[mddo2b]

Really? I know the derm residents are smart as hell (and thus, could have done anything they wanted), but the "Pimple-popper MD" moniker is firmly entrenched in a lot of physicians minds. That little montage in 'Scrubs' last night isn't far from what some physicians think of derm.

I would put Neurosurg/Vascular/Cardiothoracic Surgery first.

in my mind....trauma/CC, ped-surg,then CT, endocrine surg/surge-onc
there are a lot of residencies that you have to be the best of the best to get then once you r there your IQ for medicine decreaases

 

[ORS]

I think all specialties are getting more respect. Psych used to get put down, but now it is getting more scientific and a lot of cases that would have been hospitalized are being treated as outpatients just like benign HTN. IM is truly the thinking-man/womans specialty and sugeons are the cutters. Basically we should all try to respect all the other fields b/c they are doing the work WE DO NOT WANT TO!!!

 

[MAC10]

I agree with Dr. Dawg at least in residency EVERYONE sh*ts on everyone else. I think medicine and gen surgery get sh*ted on the worse.

In private practice...who cares at that point? Am i going to be sitting around idolizing other doctors..negative. Respect is earned on a personal basis.

 

[ptolemy]

I actually think everyone looks down on everyone else in medicine. The things that seem so easy for one specialty (b/c they see it everyday) are missed by every other doc, and they bitch about how stupid specialists in X field are.

and like MAC10 said, respect is on a personal basis, if you're friends with a particular specialist, you won't complain about the things they missed b/c you know what they do day in and day out

 

[Furrball]

in my mind....trauma/CC, ped-surg,then CT, endocrine surg/surge-onc
there are a lot of residencies that you have to be the best of the best to get then once you r there your IQ for medicine decreaases

But the Fat Man is an internist, actually GI someplace in California. Just referring to your .sig.

 

[sohsie]

1. Derm
2. Ortho/ENT/Optho/Neurosurgery

Derm? Derm?!?!?!?!?! Are you out of your mind? The "lets try a steroid and if that doesn't work, we'll just cut it out" people? Everyone respects the money that the derm people make. Few respect the medicine that they practice.

I do favor neurosurgery though. Even the people who put down the surgeons the most respect the neurosurgeons.

 

[mddo2b]

But the Fat Man is an internist, actually GI someplace in California. Just referring to your .sig.

Even a surgeon can appreciate genius when he sees it
👍

 

[Ross434]

Most respected docs are the ones that are involved in either really advanced procedures, like neuro and cardio surgeons, or ones that are required to know a lot of science, like subspecialist im docs, and researcher types. I've heard least respected are ortho and psych, simply because they are said to have "copped out" on pretty much everything they learned in med school 😛

 

[RudyRayMoore]

Respected specialties change over time.

10 years ago it was easy as sin to match rads.

Now it's hard.

Derm is hard also. Very hard.

When fellow medical students tell me they matched derm, I at least think they're above average because it's hard to match into derm these days.

How much medicine are these derms going to know? Not as much as those in some other specialties since working only 40 hours a week isn't that much.

EM docs know a lot more general medicine than derm. But the respect students going into EM get is a bit less than derm because it's not as hard to get into the field this days.

Why do Harvard grads get more pretige than UMass grads? One of the main reasons is because it's harder to get in.

While Harvard will always be hard to get into, derm and rads won't. So if you're choosing your specialty according to the status, you may be disappointed in 10 years when your speciality is easy to get into.

Also, the status among non-doctors should be considered if you are especially status hungry.

The public worships EM, CT ("heart surgeons"), NS ("brain surgeons").

They think a radiologist is the guy who snaps the XRay pictures.

A derm gets rid of pimples.

A pathologist is some sort of sicko.

Anesthesiologist is about the same level as a dentist who administers novocaine.

Psychistrists are seen as non-doctors. The public generally can't differentiate between psychiatrists and psychologists.

Ophthamologists sell glasses.

Neurologists are geniuses.

Ah. Don't forget Plastic Surgeons. They're up there with EM, CT, and NS.

If your goal is status, choose what the public thinks is high status. I've never met a fellow doc who "looks up" to doctors in another specialty. However, I've met countless non-doctors who look up to EM ("ER docs"). Think about it: If you're trying to pick up a woman in a bar, what works better, "I'm an ER doctor" or "I'm a radiologist"?

If you tell her you're a radiologist she's likely to reply: "Oh. My girlfriend is a radiologist but she's studying to become a nurse!"

Future rad, Rudy

 

[Strap]

If you choose your speciality merely on status, then you'll be in a lifetime of hurt. While it is true that we've all chosen the field of medicine partly because of status (show me someone who says otherwise, and I'll show you a liar), once you really get your hands dirty and see all facets of every field, and you're still only interested in status, then you're a fool.

Anyone who demonstrates a passion and expertise in any field will be admired, whether it be Neurosurgery or Psychiatry.

 

[blue2000]

I think the most respected specialties are the ones that you can always count on -- and that can vary depending on your area of the world/hospital. In my hospital, the surgeons, the cardiologists, GI, and critical care are always available. Now, what IR does is pretty effing cool, but since they can't be bothered to come in on the weekends, they get zero love. Anyone who helps you out in the middle of the night with a problem you can't solve on your own get's props.

 

[kas23]

This has to be one of the most stupid threads seen here in a long while, but I'll reply to it nonetheless.

Regardless of what other people say, in the hospital (not on a message board), physicians generally have little respect for other physicians. Everyone always believes what they do is the best.

Medical docs believe surgeons have no brains, but just use their hands. Surgeons believe medical docs just sit around and mentally masturbate and sit on their hands and write notes. Both of them believe psychiatrists just hand out drugs and do little else. Everyone thinks radiologists are at their own personal beck and call. FP docs know a little about everything, but can't do anything with this knowledge. Remember, these are all stereotypes, but nevertheless lack of respect is rampant all over the hospital.

However, docs will respect one another only if they know the doc personally and have witnessed they are very good in what they do. And this respect may be achieved regardless of specialty.

 

[b&ierstiefel]

I've seen this quite a bit here too kas23. It's not surprising since doctors have a high degree of self-esteem/ego (the only way to move up this grueling hierarchy in medicine without going insane is to convince yourself that you are the bomb and everyone else sucks). So this issue becomes one big pissing contest. It's quite funny if you take a step back and look at it from a distance.

 

[ahsa]

I think the most respected specialties are the ones that you can always count on -- and that can vary depending on your area of the world/hospital. In my hospital, the surgeons, the cardiologists, GI, and critical care are always available. Now, what IR does is pretty effing cool, but since they can't be bothered to come in on the weekends, they get zero love. Anyone who helps you out in the middle of the night with a problem you can't solve on your own get's props.

I certaintly agree with above, but most services, albeit radiology, are always available. don't you think it takes a little more than just a warm body to be respected? But, in you're defense, you do write "anyone" in the middle of the night solving a problem you can't gets props...

 

[Dupree]

I've heard lots of doctors talk bad about how doctors in specialities other than theirs are as a whole dumber, lazier, sell-outs, etc. But I have yet to hear any doctor say those negative things about the field of neurosurgery. Sure they may not like a particular neurosurgeon here and there but for the most part they hold the specialty in very high regard.

 

[MAC10]

I've heard lots of doctors talk bad about how doctors in specialities other than theirs are as a whole dumber, lazier, sell-outs, etc. But I have yet to hear any doctor say those negative things about the field of neurosurgery. Sure they may not like a particular neurosurgeon here and there but for the most part they hold the specialty in very high regard.

Not where im at.......

 

[pbmax]

Primary care physicians, although not held in the highest regard by the academian type, are held in high regard by their patients (which really should count much more). Additionally, many specialists count on the local PCP's for referrals and thus a mutual respect is formed.

And not that it has really been addressed in this thread, but it is really easy to be a bad family physician. However, to be a good family physician is difficult. The smartest guy in my medical school (a very good northeast allopathic school) is going into family medicine (Honored every clerkship, 260 on Step 1) - he wanted to work in the community and be a great family doctor. He is certainly going to be...

 

[GopherBrain]

Neurologists are geniuses.

I keep telling people this, but nobody seems to believe me. 😀

 

[dre]

Respected specialties change over time.

10 years ago it was easy as sin to match rads.

Now it's hard.

Derm is hard also. Very hard.

When fellow medical students tell me they matched derm, I at least think they're above average because it's hard to match into derm these days.

How much medicine are these derms going to know? Not as much as those in some other specialties since working only 40 hours a week isn't that much.

EM docs know a lot more general medicine than derm. But the respect students going into EM get is a bit less than derm because it's not as hard to get into the field this days.

Why do Harvard grads get more pretige than UMass grads? One of the main reasons is because it's harder to get in.

While Harvard will always be hard to get into, derm and rads won't. So if you're choosing your specialty according to the status, you may be disappointed in 10 years when your speciality is easy to get into.

Also, the status among non-doctors should be considered if you are especially status hungry.

The public worships EM, CT ("heart surgeons"), NS ("brain surgeons").

They think a radiologist is the guy who snaps the XRay pictures.

A derm gets rid of pimples.

A pathologist is some sort of sicko.

Anesthesiologist is about the same level as a dentist who administers novocaine.

Psychistrists are seen as non-doctors. The public generally can't differentiate between psychiatrists and psychologists.

Ophthamologists sell glasses.

Neurologists are geniuses.

Ah. Don't forget Plastic Surgeons. They're up there with EM, CT, and NS.

If your goal is status, choose what the public thinks is high status. I've never met a fellow doc who "looks up" to doctors in another specialty. However, I've met countless non-doctors who look up to EM ("ER docs"). Think about it: If you're trying to pick up a woman in a bar, what works better, "I'm an ER doctor" or "I'm a radiologist"?

If you tell her you're a radiologist she's likely to reply: "Oh. My girlfriend is a radiologist but she's studying to become a nurse!"

Future rad, Rudy

sounds about right to me.

 

[MasterintuBater]

Respected specialties change over time.

10 years ago it was easy as sin to match rads.

Now it's hard.

Derm is hard also. Very hard.

When fellow medical students tell me they matched derm, I at least think they're above average because it's hard to match into derm these days.

How much medicine are these derms going to know? Not as much as those in some other specialties since working only 40 hours a week isn't that much.

EM docs know a lot more general medicine than derm. But the respect students going into EM get is a bit less than derm because it's not as hard to get into the field this days.

Why do Harvard grads get more pretige than UMass grads? One of the main reasons is because it's harder to get in.

While Harvard will always be hard to get into, derm and rads won't. So if you're choosing your specialty according to the status, you may be disappointed in 10 years when your speciality is easy to get into.

Also, the status among non-doctors should be considered if you are especially status hungry.

The public worships EM, CT ("heart surgeons"), NS ("brain surgeons").

They think a radiologist is the guy who snaps the XRay pictures.

A derm gets rid of pimples.

A pathologist is some sort of sicko.

Anesthesiologist is about the same level as a dentist who administers novocaine.

Psychistrists are seen as non-doctors. The public generally can't differentiate between psychiatrists and psychologists.

Ophthamologists sell glasses.

Neurologists are geniuses.

Ah. Don't forget Plastic Surgeons. They're up there with EM, CT, and NS.

If your goal is status, choose what the public thinks is high status. I've never met a fellow doc who "looks up" to doctors in another specialty. However, I've met countless non-doctors who look up to EM ("ER docs"). Think about it: If you're trying to pick up a woman in a bar, what works better, "I'm an ER doctor" or "I'm a radiologist"?

If you tell her you're a radiologist she's likely to reply: "Oh. My girlfriend is a radiologist but she's studying to become a nurse!"

Future rad, Rudy

Freakin' Hilarious!! It's funny....cause it's true.

 

[EYESURG]

well first we all line up in a circle... then we pull down our pants. the guy packing teh most man-meat gets the most respect and so on, until the end.

for women we use breast size instead.

I have to agree with this! 😀

 

[waterski232002]

I think the most respected specialties are the ones that you can always count on -- Anyone who helps you out in the middle of the night with a problem you can't solve on your own get's props.

Agree...

 

[dr_almondjoy_do]

Whatever you do in medicine, please remember that it's a JUST A JOB.....

You will be respected if you are respectable. Period. No matter what your chosen field is.

I think that someone who would go through all of this suffering only to do something based on what other people admire is a psychopath that needs help..... and I feel sorry for them.

 

[SticknRudder]

Whatever you do in medicine, please remember that it's a JUST A JOB.....

You will be respected if you are respectable. Period. No matter what your chosen field is.

I think that someone who would go through all of this suffering only to do something based on what other people admire is a psychopath that needs help..... and I feel sorry for them.

I don't belong here, but I thought I'd relay a funny story. I'm in the middle of buying a house right now and, during various conversations, we found out that we had friends in common. My older brother is in a radiology residency, and I know a few of his classmates, and of them lives next door to this insurer. She says, "I couldn't believe it when I found out that radiologists were doctors! For X-rays?"

 

[Apollyon]

I think that someone who would go through all of this suffering only to do something based on what other people admire is a psychopath that needs help..... and I feel sorry for them.

A psychopath? A little harsh, there, maybe?

Have you done your psych rotation yet?

 

[yaah]

Pretty much, every field craps on every other field. And there is no one field that is "respected" above all others. There are certain doctors that are respected, but it is because they are good doctors, not because they are in a certain field.

In path, last week on blood bank, we said the following:

1) Idiot surgeons
2) Stupid interventional radiologists
3) Anesthesiologists with one track minds
4) Annoying pediatricians
5) Pushy heme-onc docs
6) Pain in the ass intensive care docs
7) Clueless gastroenterologists
8) Lazy medical residents

Of course, we probably praised someone in each of these fields at some point, and no doubt they called us idiots too. It's all part of the practice of medicine.

 

[Laryngospasm]

In reality everyone talks about everyone else..but in the end I respect them all.

 

[dr_almondjoy_do]

A psychopath? A little harsh, there, maybe?

Have you done your psych rotation yet?

My apologies... I want to change that to sociopath.... the only difference between the two is that a sociopath will control urges to get what they want....and a psychopath will act on them. Intentions are still the same...

Psychopathy is not a clinical term in either the DSM-IV or the ICD-10. The nearest equivalent to it is, in the DSM-IV is Antisocial Personality Disorder, while the ICD-10 uses the term "sociopathy" or "Dissocial Personality Disorder". With this in mind, I will focus on both the characteristics of the DSM-IV definitions, as well as the general "public definitions" of a psychopath.

These persons, in general, display many of the following traits:

Glibness/superficial charm
Grandiose sense of self-worth
Need for stimulation, with a proneness to boredom
Pathological lying
Conning and manipulating behaviors
No sense of remorse or guilt
A very shallow emotional affect - they display emotions they don't really feel
A lack of empathy for others
They are parasitic - they live off of others
They are impulsive, and show poor control over their behaviors

Essentially, they violate social norms and expectations without the slightest sense of guilt or regret in order to take what they want and do as they please.

It is estimated that 1-4% of the population is sociopathic, put most are able to control it within the limits of social tolerability, only beings termed "socially obnoxious".


http://www.mental-health-matters.com/articles/article.php?artID=292

how's that for someone who has yet to do a psych rotation? lol

 

[Justin4563]

The respect you receive is not what you do it is how you treat other people and your colleagues in the hospital.. You must treat everyone with respect and not be an arrogant prick.. You can be an excellent clinician along with being a decent human being.. so it has nothing to do with what specialty you are in because every specialty is demanding in its own right.. so there you have it.. I know some surgeons who are good who I wouldnt even piss on them if they were on fire...........thats how much contempt I have for them as human beings.

 

[JudoKing01]

Everyone I know thinks that Gastroenterologists are stomach docs that do butt scopes, and that they aren't very smart with anything else. This said, I will one day in the future be happy to be a clueless butt-scoping stomach doc that will take care of their *******es when they have gastritis or UC.

 

[Apollyon]

take care of their *******es when they have gastritis or UC.

No pun intended!

 

[kas23]

No pun intended!

That's rude, nobody asks for UC. Have some class.

 

[Apollyon]

That's rude, nobody asks for UC. Have some class.

Chill out. No one asks for gastritis either. This guy is talking GI and using a slang term meaning rectum/anus to refer to people. I point out the pun - why don't you "diss" the person who actually said it?