Step 1, Clinical Grades, and Experience

[Waldeinsamkeit]

Hello, I guess this is similar to a WAMC. Basically, I did well enough on step one that I thought I had a chance at some of the better residency programs. I found some numbers and it looks as though my Step score falls right on the average of these programs. However, my clinical grades have not been stellar. No honors, mostly High Pass, 2 Pass. My question is, looking at some of the better programs (Vanderbilt, Emory, etc), will my clinical scores sink my chances?

An additional factor is that I have an excessive amount of experience in my field (~10 yrs) prior to medical school. I have been told that will be a feather in my cap, but I am uncertain and quite uneasy.

Thank you for your input.

PS: I have tried to talk to my school's "residency counselor" regarding my application and chances, and she has only peppered me with mixed signals.

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[spacegun]

Hello, I guess this is similar to a WAMC. Basically, I did well enough on step one that I thought I had a chance at some of the better residency programs. I found some numbers and it looks as though my Step score falls right on the average of these programs. However, my clinical grades have not been stellar. No honors, mostly High Pass, 2 Pass. My question is, looking at some of the better programs (Vanderbilt, Emory, etc), will my clinical scores sink my chances?

An additional factor is that I have an excessive amount of experience in my field (~10 yrs) prior to medical school. I have been told that will be a feather in my cap, but I am uncertain and quite uneasy.

Thank you for your input.

PS: I have tried to talk to my school's "residency counselor" regarding my application and chances, and she has only peppered me with mixed signals.

What specialty do you want? That's going to determine a lot.

What field you did for 10 years before med school will determine a lot too. If you were a scientist (Ph.D.) for 10 years, then that could help a lot (research background). But if you were a plumber, plumbers are great, but not helpful in getting into a specialty, unless the PD happened to be a plumber too or something.

Unfortunately, I know it's illegal but there can be age discrimination at many places depending on how old you look and act. Especially if you are not as easy to teach by attendings your age or younger.

 

[mybluedog]

What specialty do you want? That's going to determine a lot.

What field you did for 10 years before med school will determine a lot too. If you were a scientist (Ph.D.) for 10 years, then that could help a lot (research background). But if you were a plumber, plumbers are great, but not helpful in getting into a specialty, unless the PD happened to be a plumber too or something.

Unfortunately, I know it's illegal but there can be age discrimination at many places depending on how old you look and act. Especially if you are not as easy to teach by attendings your age or younger.

Sry to derail a bit
Do you feel like age discrimination only exists for that reason for older m4s? Or do you think the same could apply to a say 25-27 y/o m4?

 

[libertyyne]

What field are you applying to ? What else do you have going on , AOA , research, etc?

 

[spacegun]

Sry to derail a bit
Do you feel like age discrimination only exists for that reason for older m4s? Or do you think the same could apply to a say 25-27 y/o m4?

I think it probably only affects people who look 30 or more, as 20's is still young!

 

[sliceofbread136]

Depends on what field, depends on if this “experience” is research

 

[IM-2019]

Sry to derail a bit
Do you feel like age discrimination only exists for that reason for older m4s? Or do you think the same could apply to a say 25-27 y/o m4?

A trad 4+4 student would graduate at 26 already and the median age is late 20s, it wouldn't be atypical at all.

 

[Waldeinsamkeit]

What specialty do you want? That's going to determine a lot.

What field you did for 10 years before med school will determine a lot too. If you were a scientist (Ph.D.) for 10 years, then that could help a lot (research background). But if you were a plumber, plumbers are great, but not helpful in getting into a specialty, unless the PD happened to be a plumber too or something.

Unfortunately, I know it's illegal but there can be age discrimination at many places depending on how old you look and act. Especially if you are not as easy to teach by attendings your age or younger.

I got my masters in Clinical Psychology and worked in an Inpatient Psychiatric Unit for a few years, I did CBT therapy in a correctional facility during my training, then I worked doing applied behavior analysis (writing the plans) for adults with developmental disabilities. I am hoping to go into Psychiatry.

 

[Waldeinsamkeit]

What field are you applying to ? What else do you have going on , AOA , research, etc?

I am going for psychiatry. My grades are probably my weak point. I got all high passes, 2 passes, and no honors. Preclinical grades are average or low-average. Two Honors for doctoring 1 and 2, but I feel like everyone honored those classes.

I did a bunch of research the summer of MS1. 5 posters and 1 paper, but they are multiple fields (I have a stats background, so I did the statistical analysis for multiple studies). This year I am focusing on Psychiatry now and have one poster (case study) and I will be giving one 10 minute presentation (MEDtalk).

Again, I think the probably strongest element is my experience. Since 18 I have only worked with the psychiatric population. Schizophrenic group home before college, acute inpatient psychiatric unit during undergraduate, got masters in clinical psychology, did some therapy in correctional facility, then mostly applied behavioral analysis for adults with autism until I decided to go into medicine.

 

[Waldeinsamkeit]

Depends on what field, depends on if this “experience” is research

Why do I get scare quotes? I have no reason to lie, if I didn't have experience, I would say I didn't have experience.

I go my Master's in Clinical Psychology, and I worked in hospitals and with psychiatric populations until I decided to go into medicine.

 

[sliceofbread136]

Why do I get scare quotes? I have no reason to lie, if I didn't have experience, I would say I didn't have experience.

I go my Master's in Clinical Psychology, and I worked in hospitals and with psychiatric populations until I decided to go into medicine.

Just meant that what ever you did probably doesn’t matter much unless it involves productive research with multiple pubs

 

[libertyyne]

i would apply to some reach programs, but I would apply broadly. PD's may or may not GAF regarding your previous life experience. 200+ AMGs did not match into pysch this year which in all likelihood happened because they didnt apply broadly enough.

I would personally be busting my ass to get some more publications and research in psych, and building relationships with the local psych department for excellent Letters.

 

[Skiiiiiing]

I got my masters in Clinical Psychology and worked in an Inpatient Psychiatric Unit for a few years, I did CBT therapy in a correctional facility during my training, then I worked doing applied behavior analysis (writing the plans) for adults with developmental disabilities. I am hoping to go into Psychiatry.

How would having a lot of familiarity with the field already hurt you?

Of course, there will be some people who discount you because of age. Just apply broadly and shrug shoulders when this happens.

 

[Waldeinsamkeit]

i would apply to some reach programs, but I would apply broadly. PD's may or may not GAF regarding your previous life experience. 200+ AMGs did not match into pysch this year which in all likelihood happened because they didnt apply broadly enough.

I would personally be busting my ass to get some more publications and research in psych, and building relationships with the local psych department for excellent Letters.

I am. And I am planning on applying broadly. I just didn't know how big of an impact my clinical scores were going to have.

Even if I had a 260 Step 1 and cured schizophrenia I would still apply broadly - I am too big of a pessimist not to.

 

[Waldeinsamkeit]

How would having a lot of familiarity with the field already hurt you?

Of course, there will be some people who discount you because of age. Just apply broadly and shrug shoulders when this happens.

I am not that old, like <5 yrs older than most classmates, and I look younger than about half of them lol. I have just been working in psych hospitals and group homes since before I went to college.

 

[spacegun]

I think you'll be fine since you said you did average on your Step 1. Just apply broadly like everyone has said. You could take step 2 and kill it if you want to be more sure. Psych is getting more competitive due to good lifestyle and the ability to stay private unlike many other specialties that are becoming employees. But psych still isn't that competitive for a US MD. Look at the NRMP data to confirm.

 

[Waldeinsamkeit]

I think you'll be fine since you said you did average on your Step 1. Just apply broadly like everyone has said. You could take step 2 and kill it if you want to be more sure. Psych is getting more competitive due to good lifestyle and the ability to stay private unlike many other specialties that are becoming employees. But psych still isn't that competitive for a US MD. Look at the NRMP data to confirm.

Yeah, I just wish it was 5 years ago

 

[phonyreal98]

Try posting on the psychiatry subforum- I believe there are at least two PDs who post there with some regularity: Psychiatry

 

[Waldeinsamkeit]

Try posting on the psychiatry subforum- I believe there are at least two PDs who post there with some regularity: Psychiatry

Thank you!!!

 

[Waldeinsamkeit]

Try posting on the psychiatry subforum- I believe there are at least two PDs who post there with some regularity: Psychiatry

Is there a way I can move this one, or do I need to start a new one?

 

[libertyyne]

Is there a way I can move this one, or do I need to start a new one?

Report this thread to the nods requesting a move.

 

[GoSpursGo]

Moved by OP's request

 

[OldPsychDoc]

I am going for psychiatry. My grades are probably my weak point. I got all high passes, 2 passes, and no honors. Preclinical grades are average or low-average. Two Honors for doctoring 1 and 2, but I feel like everyone honored those classes.

I did a bunch of research the summer of MS1. 5 posters and 1 paper, but they are multiple fields (I have a stats background, so I did the statistical analysis for multiple studies). This year I am focusing on Psychiatry now and have one poster (case study) and I will be giving one 10 minute presentation (MEDtalk).

Again, I think the probably strongest element is my experience. Since 18 I have only worked with the psychiatric population. Schizophrenic group home before college, acute inpatient psychiatric unit during undergraduate, got masters in clinical psychology, did some therapy in correctional facility, then mostly applied behavioral analysis for adults with autism until I decided to go into medicine.

You're golden. Just apply broadly.

 

[ziggyhope]

I am going for psychiatry. My grades are probably my weak point. I got all high passes, 2 passes, and no honors. Preclinical grades are average or low-average. Two Honors for doctoring 1 and 2, but I feel like everyone honored those classes.

I did a bunch of research the summer of MS1. 5 posters and 1 paper, but they are multiple fields (I have a stats background, so I did the statistical analysis for multiple studies). This year I am focusing on Psychiatry now and have one poster (case study) and I will be giving one 10 minute presentation (MEDtalk).

Again, I think the probably strongest element is my experience. Since 18 I have only worked with the psychiatric population. Schizophrenic group home before college, acute inpatient psychiatric unit during undergraduate, got masters in clinical psychology, did some therapy in correctional facility, then mostly applied behavioral analysis for adults with autism until I decided to go into medicine.

You have a lot of experience with our field, even if in different roles previously, and as such you are still committed to going into psychiatry, I personally think that means a great deal. I have no freaking idea about all the number stuff anymore even though I'm only a few years out of med school myself, all hell seemed to break loose in the last couple of years regarding the match. Apply broadly as other's said previously, and you maybe surprised where you get interviews.

 

[Waldeinsamkeit]

You're golden. Just apply broadly.

What schools do you think I’m competitive for?

 

[Skiiiiiing]

What schools do you think I’m competitive for?

Those specializing in the treatment of Cluster C is my guess.

 

[Waldeinsamkeit]

Those specializing in the treatment of Cluster C is my guess.

Lulz

If you’re on SDN, you’re broken

 

[OldPsychDoc]

What schools do you think I’m competitive for?

Ones that want a good resident who wants to care for the mentally ill and has hands-on experience in how to do it.
(So maybe the toppest-top, research towers of academia will spurn you--but you're good otherwise.)

 

[Stagg737]

Imo, biggest thing that will help you is really strong LORs and solid evals from attendings (in all fields) on your MSPE. With the amount of experience you have in the field, you should have stellar LORs from people in psych. My pre-clinical grades were poor, and my clinical grades were mediocre, but my evals were very strong and I got plenty of love from mid-tier programs. I even had a few PDs/APDs straight up tell me my LORs and evals are what got me the interviews.

I think you'll be fine since you said you did average on your Step 1. Just apply broadly like everyone has said. You could take step 2 and kill it if you want to be more sure. Psych is getting more competitive due to good lifestyle and the ability to stay private unlike many other specialties that are becoming employees. But psych still isn't that competitive for a US MD. Look at the NRMP data to confirm.

I'd advise people to have both Step/Level 2 scores in early. I feel like that's becoming more and more important, and having a totally complete application when it goes out definitely won't hurt.