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[Heavenly4505]

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😡Hi all,

I was wondering if anyone could offer any insight or advice on what they would do in my situation. This is what is happening. I will be applying for vet school in 2009 for the class matriculating in 2010. I have had an extremely hard time finding a vet office that will let me come in and volunteer/shadow. I've sent out resumes, followed up by e-mails and phone calls, all explaining that I would be willing to work for free. I've been trying for over a year. Finally, one of them e-mailed me a few weeks ago and agreed to let me come in and volunteer/shadow. I started last week, and to be honest, I'm extremely uncomfortable. The doctor is not approachable at all and borders on rude. The very first day, he told me to "keep my mouth zipped and don't interrupt him or ask any questions" (his exact words). Well, I respect the fact that he doesn't want questions while he's examining patients because that would be disruptive and might make owners uncomfortable. However, I've tried asking him questions in between patients or after the clinic has closed, and he will just walk aways like he doesn't hear me.

He told me in his original e-mail that I needed to keep a journal of my experiences and of everything I've seen, so the first day I showed up with a notebook and pen, intending to write down procedures only, NOT patient names or any specifics, and he told me that he "doesn't tolerate recording devices of any type, including a notebook." So, now, I just wait until I get home and try to recall everything I've seen. His techs are wonderful (small office, only 2 techs and him), but he doesn't make me feel comfortable at all. When I'm observing him, he acts like I'm in the way, so I try to stand back as much as possible, but I'm afraid that makes me look uninterested! I've even tried E-MAILING him my questions outside of the clinic, and he just doesn't respond. He never speaks to me, or to the techs for that matter, never thanks anyone for anything. When I try to talk to him, he either doesn't respond, or is very hateful. I just don't know what to do. I don't feel like this experience is getting my anywhere. It's not like I'll be able to get a letter of rec. from him because he won't let me do anything other than shadow and he's not even trying to get to know me! How can he write a letter about someone he knows nothing about?

I guess my question is this. If you were in my situation, would you try to stick this out since it was so difficult getting into an office? Or would you quit shadowing there and keep bugging other offices, in hopes that someone else will let you come in? What if I quit this office and can't get anyone else to let me come in? I'm not able to work many hours because I have class four days a week plus I have two small children and my volunteer work. I desperately need SA vet experience. I have other things going on: I currently volunteer at the local animal shelter, I will be volunteering at a horse rescue in April, and both this summer and last summer I have been (will be) an intern at the local zoo working hands on with the animals and zoo vets. I am still leaning toward SA as my focus, but how can I get SA experience if nobody will let me come in? I've literally tried EVERY office within a 90 mile radius (I live in a very small town in Indiana). I don't know what to do. Anyone's opinions on what you would do given my situation would be greatly appreciated. Have a great day!

 

[msmrtrthnyllb]

😡Hi all,

I was wondering if anyone could offer any insight or advice on what they would do in my situation. This is what is happening. I will be applying for vet school in 2009 for the class matriculating in 2010. I have had an extremely hard time finding a vet office that will let me come in and volunteer/shadow. I've sent out resumes, followed up by e-mails and phone calls, all explaining that I would be willing to work for free. I've been trying for over a year. Finally, one of them e-mailed me a few weeks ago and agreed to let me come in and volunteer/shadow. I started last week, and to be honest, I'm extremely uncomfortable. The doctor is not approachable at all and borders on rude. The very first day, he told me to "keep my mouth zipped and don't interrupt him or ask any questions" (his exact words). Well, I respect the fact that he doesn't want questions while he's examining patients because that would be disruptive and might make owners uncomfortable. However, I've tried asking him questions in between patients or after the clinic has closed, and he will just walk aways like he doesn't hear me.

He told me in his original e-mail that I needed to keep a journal of my experiences and of everything I've seen, so the first day I showed up with a notebook and pen, intending to write down procedures only, NOT patient names or any specifics, and he told me that he "doesn't tolerate recording devices of any type, including a notebook." So, now, I just wait until I get home and try to recall everything I've seen. His techs are wonderful (small office, only 2 techs and him), but he doesn't make me feel comfortable at all. When I'm observing him, he acts like I'm in the way, so I try to stand back as much as possible, but I'm afraid that makes me look uninterested! I've even tried E-MAILING him my questions outside of the clinic, and he just doesn't respond. He never speaks to me, or to the techs for that matter, never thanks anyone for anything. When I try to talk to him, he either doesn't respond, or is very hateful. I just don't know what to do. I don't feel like this experience is getting my anywhere. It's not like I'll be able to get a letter of rec. from him because he won't let me do anything other than shadow and he's not even trying to get to know me! How can he write a letter about someone he knows nothing about?

I guess my question is this. If you were in my situation, would you try to stick this out since it was so difficult getting into an office? Or would you quit shadowing there and keep bugging other offices, in hopes that someone else will let you come in? What if I quit this office and can't get anyone else to let me come in? I'm not able to work many hours because I have class four days a week plus I have two small children and my volunteer work. I desperately need SA vet experience. I have other things going on: I currently volunteer at the local animal shelter, I will be volunteering at a horse rescue in April, and both this summer and last summer I have been (will be) an intern at the local zoo working hands on with the animals and zoo vets. I am still leaning toward SA as my focus, but how can I get SA experience if nobody will let me come in? I've literally tried EVERY office within a 90 mile radius (I live in a very small town in Indiana). I don't know what to do. Anyone's opinions on what you would do given my situation would be greatly appreciated. Have a great day!

Where in the world do you live? That is absolutely horrible. Find somewhere else. Wow. Ridiculous. I've driven upwards of an hour and fifteen minutes to find places that would be optimal for working/volunteering experience. Don't settle for mediocrity. I can't believe it's that hard for you to find somewhere to volunteer. Vets usually can't turn down free labor.

 

[Hobiecat1642]

That's awful--have you tried animal shelters? Sometimes shelters that have a vet can be great places to gain SA experience. Other than that, my only suggestion would be to try to gain some animal experience, that might help you get your foot in the door at other vet clinics. I also gained some of my experience through unpaid internships--maybe you could find an internship with SA? Also, have you tried going in person to other vet clinics to drop off your resume? One vet I worked for liked it when people came in person to ask, he said that made him think they were really serious about it.
Good luck with everything.

 

[akitavet]

No totally leave. I thought I had it bad working for a bipolar doc! Are you there full-time? If not (and I hope not with a jerk like that), make paper copies of your resume and apply in person to as many clinics as you can find. Ask for the office manager and personally hand them your resume explaining why you are there. Include all of your credentials including you previous experience and education. Expand your search area. I drive 42 miles each way to the clinic where I work, but there's not a better repro vet in the area and that's what I want to do. I would personally keep on at the clinic you are currently at while you look elsewhere cause hours are hours. I spent 6 weeks at a clinic I hated before going where I am now, and it felt oh so nice to quit with somewhere to go. Haha, to tell you the truth, I went to vegas the day I quit there!

 

[kekemapa04]

I would definitely find a new place to volunteer! You need to be able to approach the doctor when it comes time to ask for a letter of recommendation, and it doesn't sound like he is going to be up to the task. I would really try to find a local shelter.....even if they don't have a veterinarian, you can accumulate some animal experience which may help you get into a clinical position later. Good Luck!!!!

 

[Heavenly4505]

Thanks everyone! I do volunteer at a shelter already, but at the times I'm there, the vet is usually not there. I don't mind a commute to a new clinic, but most of them want someone with experience. Maybe after I rack up more hours at the shelter and with this current office, they might be more willing to let me come in. Also, I've done an unpaid internship at the zoo last year and will be doing another one this year. It's a great way to get exposed to different species.

 

[Sweetcaroline14]

Wow...What a jerk. I'd move on, thats for sure. No need to take verbal abuse at all. I'd suggest looking for non profits to volunteer(shelter medicine,rescue,spay and neuter clinics) at or also do a resume with cover letter stating your intent. I found that it worked well for me. I wrote a letter about my intentions, offered to "work for free" and was reliable. It seemed to work as I've been at two clinics for two years. Something good will come your way! Good Luck. Remember that you don't have to be treated horribly just to gain experience. Its just not necessary and most doctors would not participate in that type of conduct towards volunteers. He obviously has some other issues going on. I wouldn't be a part of that volcano thats about to erupt🙂

😡Hi all,

I was wondering if anyone could offer any insight or advice on what they would do in my situation. This is what is happening. I will be applying for vet school in 2009 for the class matriculating in 2010. I have had an extremely hard time finding a vet office that will let me come in and volunteer/shadow. I've sent out resumes, followed up by e-mails and phone calls, all explaining that I would be willing to work for free. I've been trying for over a year. Finally, one of them e-mailed me a few weeks ago and agreed to let me come in and volunteer/shadow. I started last week, and to be honest, I'm extremely uncomfortable. The doctor is not approachable at all and borders on rude. The very first day, he told me to "keep my mouth zipped and don't interrupt him or ask any questions" (his exact words). Well, I respect the fact that he doesn't want questions while he's examining patients because that would be disruptive and might make owners uncomfortable. However, I've tried asking him questions in between patients or after the clinic has closed, and he will just walk aways like he doesn't hear me.

He told me in his original e-mail that I needed to keep a journal of my experiences and of everything I've seen, so the first day I showed up with a notebook and pen, intending to write down procedures only, NOT patient names or any specifics, and he told me that he "doesn't tolerate recording devices of any type, including a notebook." So, now, I just wait until I get home and try to recall everything I've seen. His techs are wonderful (small office, only 2 techs and him), but he doesn't make me feel comfortable at all. When I'm observing him, he acts like I'm in the way, so I try to stand back as much as possible, but I'm afraid that makes me look uninterested! I've even tried E-MAILING him my questions outside of the clinic, and he just doesn't respond. He never speaks to me, or to the techs for that matter, never thanks anyone for anything. When I try to talk to him, he either doesn't respond, or is very hateful. I just don't know what to do. I don't feel like this experience is getting my anywhere. It's not like I'll be able to get a letter of rec. from him because he won't let me do anything other than shadow and he's not even trying to get to know me! How can he write a letter about someone he knows nothing about?

I guess my question is this. If you were in my situation, would you try to stick this out since it was so difficult getting into an office? Or would you quit shadowing there and keep bugging other offices, in hopes that someone else will let you come in? What if I quit this office and can't get anyone else to let me come in? I'm not able to work many hours because I have class four days a week plus I have two small children and my volunteer work. I desperately need SA vet experience. I have other things going on: I currently volunteer at the local animal shelter, I will be volunteering at a horse rescue in April, and both this summer and last summer I have been (will be) an intern at the local zoo working hands on with the animals and zoo vets. I am still leaning toward SA as my focus, but how can I get SA experience if nobody will let me come in? I've literally tried EVERY office within a 90 mile radius (I live in a very small town in Indiana). I don't know what to do. Anyone's opinions on what you would do given my situation would be greatly appreciated. Have a great day!

 

[clawsbeatskin]

Have you thought about asking the zoo vets you work with for a referral to small animal vets in the area? Perhaps you could find another clinic through their connections. Especially if you think the zoo vets would recommend you.

Also, have you tried speaking privately with the techs? Perhaps they know something you don't, like maybe this guy is really harsh to "weed out" the prevets he feels aren't worthy of his recommendation. Ask the techs about the prevets who have volunteered before...how long did they last, did they do something that maybe you're not doing?

 

[pika8]

I totally agree you should leave. There is no benefit to being treated terribly--and I doubt he would provide you with a good reference when you apply to veterinary school. I think the other suggestions people have given are great--could you speak with the shelter vet (even if you don't see him/her very often) and ask if he/she knows other vets you could work with? Most likely the zoo vets you work with have pets of their own and know other vets. Just try to work your connections as much as possible. Good luck!

 

[bakaduin]

Thanks everyone! I do volunteer at a shelter already, but at the times I'm there, the vet is usually not there. I don't mind a commute to a new clinic, but most of them want someone with experience. Maybe after I rack up more hours at the shelter and with this current office, they might be more willing to let me come in. Also, I've done an unpaid internship at the zoo last year and will be doing another one this year. It's a great way to get exposed to different species.

I think we can all relate to vet offices wanting experienced vet techs and its something we all went through. Have you considered starting at the bottom of the food chain (the kennel) and working your way up? Most vet offices I have worked for hire kennel help with no experience necessary. Just make sure your intentions are known that your a prevet student and would like to eventually move into a roll as a technician or veterinary assistant. This gives the added benefit that many vet schools like seeing that you worked the kennel because it shows them that you understand all aspects of a veterinary hospital. I would venture to guess that many of your fellow applicants will have started on this route. Like others have said, dont settle for someone who treats you like dirt! Get out of that place ASAP!

 

[zpinkpanther]

Just out of curiosity, and you don't have to tell me if you don't feel comfortable... which town do you live in? I went to school in Richmond, IN (pretty small, right beside the border with Ohio), and I ran into the same problem trying to get vet-related work there. I went in person to every clinic within a 30 mile radius and handed out resumes, but didn't get anything, and one place in particular, the receptionist I gave my resume to was SUPER rude. I ended up settling for volunteering at the animal shelter and working a few hours at the Bath and Body Works in the mall to get some extra cash!

Anyway, I'd totally leave that place. You're not benefiting them because they won't let you do anything, and it's not benefiting you either, since you're not even allowed to ask questions (GEEZ!). That doc sounds like a real jerk. I thought the doc I work with was bad, but at least he's sometimes in a talky/jokey mood, and always answers my questions (although I tend not to ask them a lot anymore, since it just makes him get behind and means I have to go home later... now I just look things up in my Merck 😉). My coworkers and I always joke that our doctor is the only man we know that gets PMS But seriously, a little crankiness is sometimes to be expected, since we all know that vets work long hours and generally don't get paid wonderfully, but if the experience isn't beneficial, ditch it and find something else. I know from personal experience that Indiana is in some ways a bit of a wasteland, but I'm sure something will turn up. Maybe the shelter you work with has a vet that comes in for check-ups/vaccines/spays and neuters? Good luck!

 

[168135]

And I thought that my situation was bad...

It sounds absolutely horrible, but it is a little better than nothing. If I were in your shoes, I would stay, but search for something else in the mean time. I did some research, and the clinic that I volunteered at do a number of things that makes me feel uncomfortable... but it is better than nothing.

I found that just handing out resumes wasn't enough... I go in, introduce myself, and ask if there was someone available for me to talk to about volunteering or job-shadowing and once they told me that "They will see what they can do", I would call back and ask for an update.

Could you ask the animal shelter on what days the vet comes in and ask to volunteer on those days? It would give you a chance to observe the vet and talk to them about your situation.

Also... can you think of other places (not necessarily clinics) that may let you come in and observe? There is a wildlife park a half hour away from where I am staying now. I can't get out there now, but when my mom comes up to move me out, she could take me up there for a day or two if they let me, and I can see what they do up there with animal care.

I wish you the best of luck 🙂

 

[Heavenly4505]

I am more than willing to do kennel work and have put that on my cover letter/resume. I didn't expect to start out as a tech or even an assistant. I clean kennels at the shelter, and I am more than willing to do it in a vet office. I still can't get anyone to let me come in. A few vets have told me that it's a "liability" issue with letting a non-employee have hands-on experience with animals.

PinkPanther, this is ironic, but I'm from Richmond, Indiana, too! If you'd like to talk further, send me a message. I'm actually from Connersville, but we recently moved to Richmond. I'd be interested in hearing about your experiences.

Thanks again, everyone.

 

[carrbear21]

Don't waste your time "sticking it out". You can find somewhere else that will appreciate you and be thrilled that you are interested in their clinic, and WANT to answer all your questions. If you are younger (ie: in college) the doc probably thinks it's ok to treat you like a peon-- but it's NOT. Stand up for yourself by finding a new place that is better suited for you. 😀

 

[168135]

I still can't get anyone to let me come in. A few vets have told me that it's a "liability" issue with letting a non-employee have hands-on experience with animals.

Since when does "job-shadowing" involve handling animals? Yes, I got to handle animals when "job-shadowing", but I started out as a volunteer, signed a few forms, and started off slowly. Urgh, it is making me upset that you can't find a decent place to get experience.

 

[adOggy07]

Heavenly,

That is really horrible! He sounds like a JERK. I'm not sure if this will help you, but have you sent your resumes to any 24-hr emergency hospitals in your area? Like you, I had a really difficult time getting my foot in the door on experience. I did the same thing you did, make resumes and send them out. I found in the end more of the emergency hospitals were willing to take me on because they tend to be busier and need more help. I started out doing kennel work at the emergency hospital that I work at and it was a great learning experience because we were always so busy that there was no way I couldn't get involved, even as a kennel person. After 2 months they started training me as a tech and now I work full-time as a technician at that hospital. It's been really great in terms of learning since we have a fairly large caseload, I get to draw blood and place catheters daily, which has really helped in terms of clinical skills. =) Hope that helps!!

 

[Tsuky2008]

Heavenly4505, I went through a similar experience back in August. I was working at a clinic that was owned by a female veterinarian, and she had an incredibly small practice, so I was the only other person working with her. Of course, it was great, because anytime she needed help, she let me help her, which meant I got a LOT of experience in things that I wouldn't have gotten at a big company clinic. I got to be the secretary, assistant, and tech, unless she was performing surgery at which point she would have an actual tech come in to assist her. Anyways, the experience part was awesome, but the veterinarian made me incredibly uncomfortable and in my opinion, she was very unethical. She hated it when I asked questions, and she thought that everyone else in the entire world was inept except for her. She always talked down to people and I never heard her say a kind word about a single person, other than when she would congratulate herself. 🙄 The worst part was that she would talk about the clients behind their backs, and expect me to encourage what she was saying..."This woman is f-ing nuts, what a *****!" and then she'd look at me as though she wanted me to say "I know!" and I just sat there uncomfortably, then she would get mad when I refused to agree with her. Anywho, long story short, I realized that no amount of experience was worth being in an uncomfortable situation like that. I know how it feels not to want to give something up that will put you ahead of the game, but in my opinion there's no experience worth being treated that way. I hope your situation gets better whatever you choose to do!! 😳

 

[168135]

How are you doing Heavenly? Have you decided what you are going to do? I got to thinking about you while sorting out my own frusterations and I wanted to see what you are up to.

 

[CBRGrl]

Hi,

I totally agree with everyone out there, but I have a suggestion. The guy you're working for sounds like a total jerk, but if it were me, I'd stick it out until I found another clinic to volunteer/work at. I can only speak from personal experience (I had a really hard time finding somewhere to volunteer where I live as well.) But as soon as I found a clinic that would let me volunteer, I updated my resume to include my volunteer duties and sent out my resume again to places (in my case I was looking for a paid position). I guess it's like that with other professions as well, but people are more willing to interview/hire you if you've already got some experience working at a clinic. When I sent out my new resumes, I got three interviews (including an interview at a clinic that originally told me- a week prior- that they had nothing availible). In my case I lucked out because the clinic where I was volunteering offered to pay me for my hours once I started interviewing at other places...heh. Anyway, just a suggestion!!

Also, have you talked to the tech that work there? What do they say about the Dr?

 

[Heavenly4505]

Thanks for thinking of me everyone! The good news is I received a job offer a few days ago, and I TOOK IT! It's in a much better clinic with a much nicer doctor. I will mostly be doing receptionist work to start out with, but he's going to gradually introduce me to kennel work, assisting, and eventually some tech duties. The best part is it's PAID! WOO HOO! Only two days a week right now because that's all I can afford to spare with my schooling, but it's better than what I did have. I'm keeping up with my volunteer work at the shelter, too. Things are looking up.

Good luck to all of you!

 

[Kara31191]

I'm so sorry for the bad experiences.

I live in a rather populated New England area. My family vet let me come on as an animal caretaker at the start of her clinic. Well, I am able to do a lot because there's a shortage of intelligent help here.

I originally WANTED to volunteer because I felt uncomfortable taking $ knowing that all I could do was clean a few cages and maybe put away some papers. But- it was a liability to have me work with them unpaid. So she said it would be more helpful if I worked there.

=D Hope all is well,
Kara.

 

[168135]

Thanks for thinking of me everyone! The good news is I received a job offer a few days ago, and I TOOK IT! It's in a much better clinic with a much nicer doctor. I will mostly be doing receptionist work to start out with, but he's going to gradually introduce me to kennel work, assisting, and eventually some tech duties. The best part is it's PAID! WOO HOO! Only two days a week right now because that's all I can afford to spare with my schooling, but it's better than what I did have. I'm keeping up with my volunteer work at the shelter, too. Things are looking up.

Good luck to all of you!

CONGRATS 🙂

 

[Electrophile]

When I was getting ready to apply, there wasn't a single local vet that I found who was really willing to let me shadow. Even my own vet said it was fine, but I guess her office manager said no? Anyways, I'm not sure where the vet schools think we'd get experience with the local vets being rather stingy. They all ignored me or just plain said no. I think part of the problem was that the vet school was in the same town and so I'm sure there were a TON of pre-vets looking for shadowing opportunities. Maybe too many of them got burned by lazy or unreliable people? Here's a big tip that I learned: even if you get a direct no, just nice ask, "I totally understand...is there anyone you know who may be willing to?" and get their contact info. That way, when you call the other person, you can say "I was talking to Dr. Smith the other day (the all important name drop!!) and she highly recommended that I contact you about the possibility of doing some volunteer work or shadowing with you." It's much much better than "Hi, I'm so and so and you don't know me from Adam, but would you let me potentially maim myself doing something stupid in your kennel or surgery suite and cost your insurance to go up?" Well, not quite, but the all important name drop is really important!

The vet I got the most hours with was a chance encounter. My husband used to work for Sam's Club on the weekends when he was needing to make a few extra dollars when he started his first "real" job after undergrad, so anyone who came through the line with dog food, he'd ask about their pets. Turns out the wife of a rural mixed practice vet from 75 miles away was willing to give me one of her husband's business card. Called him up and had to get up at like 5 AM to make it down there by 7:30 AM twice a week when I didn't have class for a good chunk of the semester, but I got some decent hours in. I cleaned up blood and stuff off the floor without being asked so he got into the habit of "paying" me by taking me to lunch every day in exchange for helping out. Got a nice letter of rec too. 😀

Moral of the story...a lot of the time, it's still who you know, not what you know that will often get your foot in the door. If you're at all involved in community activities (church and that sort of thing), you may try to put out some feelers that way so maybe somebody will know somebody in another county. Be glad at least you've gotten some hours in!

 

[Truth74]

When I was getting ready to apply, there wasn't a single local vet that I found who was really willing to let me shadow. Even my own vet said it was fine, but I guess her office manager said no? Anyways, I'm not sure where the vet schools think we'd get experience with the local vets being rather stingy. They all ignored me or just plain said no. I think part of the problem was that the vet school was in the same town and so I'm sure there were a TON of pre-vets looking for shadowing opportunities. Maybe too many of them got burned by lazy or unreliable people? Here's a big tip that I learned: even if you get a direct no, just nice ask, "I totally understand...is there anyone you know who may be willing to?" and get their contact info. That way, when you call the other person, you can say "I was talking to Dr. Smith the other day (the all important name drop!!) and she highly recommended that I contact you about the possibility of doing some volunteer work or shadowing with you." It's much much better than "Hi, I'm so and so and you don't know me from Adam, but would you let me potentially maim myself doing something stupid in your kennel or surgery suite and cost your insurance to go up?" Well, not quite, but the all important name drop is really important!

The vet I got the most hours with was a chance encounter. My husband used to work for Sam's Club on the weekends when he was needing to make a few extra dollars when he started his first "real" job after undergrad, so anyone who came through the line with dog food, he'd ask about their pets. Turns out the wife of a rural mixed practice vet from 75 miles away was willing to give me one of her husband's business card. Called him up and had to get up at like 5 AM to make it down there by 7:30 AM twice a week when I didn't have class for a good chunk of the semester, but I got some decent hours in. I cleaned up blood and stuff off the floor without being asked so he got into the habit of "paying" me by taking me to lunch every day in exchange for helping out. Got a nice letter of rec too. 😀

Moral of the story...a lot of the time, it's still who you know, not what you know that will often get your foot in the door. If you're at all involved in community activities (church and that sort of thing), you may try to put out some feelers that way so maybe somebody will know somebody in another county. Be glad at least you've gotten some hours in!

Your experience sounds a lot like mine, except I was working at Wal-Mart doing the asking. That friend of a friend connection works. I also searched online for local shelters. That's how I got the majority of my experience.
I also looked into RAVS (Rural area vet service).