SUNY Upstate medical students in cheating scandal

[Taurus]

Upstate Medical students may be disciplined if investigation shows they cheated on quizzes

Upstate Medical University is investigating whether some fourth-year medical students scheduled to graduate in May cheated in a medical literature course.
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[weightyheart]

so is this one of those BS courses on how to search the medical literature? if so, then B.F.D.

 

[Taurus]

so is this one of those BS courses on how to search the medical literature? if so, then B.F.D.

Not if it goes on your Dean's letter which you have to show when you apply to residency, fellowship, etc. It will affect you when you get your license and privileges at hospitals.

It probably won't stop you but it will make your life just a big harder. You now have to explain what happened. Even a small blemish like this can negatively affect you if you want do competitive residencies, fellowships, jobs, etc.

So it's a bigger deal than you think.

 

[DrBowtie]

The bigger deal is that these classes exist just to add busywork to our already busy lives.

 

[Perrotfish]

What an awful, awful thing to do to graduating fourth year students.

 

[weightyheart]

my point is that this should not be a big deal, it should not be considered cheating in the first place. working together/sharing answers on a bs, searching medical lit, online quiz is not even close to being the same as cheating on a proctered exam during preclinical years.

 

[lockjaw]

my point is that this should not be a big deal, it should not be considered cheating in the first place. working together/sharing answers on a bs, searching medical lit, online quiz is not even close to being the same as cheating on a proctered exam during preclinical years.

Dishonesty is dishonesty, no matter what type of assignment it's on, big deal or not. If it was made clear in the honor code that collaborating on an online quiz is not acceptable, then getting disciplined for it is absolutely fair.

 

[weightyheart]

"dishonesty is not dishonesty", all dishonesty is not the same. how many times have you driven above the speed limit? how many times have you told small lies to your family or friends? i obviously don't know the details of this incident, but its easy to technically break the rules without having it seem like you've done anything wrong. the punishment should fit the crime.

 

[lockjaw]

"dishonesty is not dishonesty", all dishonesty is not the same. how many times have you driven above the speed limit? how many times have you told small lies to your family or friends? i obviously don't know the details of this incident, but its easy to technically break the rules without having it seem like you've done anything wrong. the punishment should fit the crime.

Then maybe I should have said "cheating is cheating" - if they broke the honor code, then they cheated. End of story. Cheating is always a big deal - just because it's an online class doesn't mean it's okay to cut corners and expect to be able to get away with it.

 

[robu058]

"dishonesty is not dishonesty", all dishonesty is not the same. How many times have you driven above the speed limit? How many times have you told small lies to your family or friends? I obviously don't know the details of this incident, but its easy to technically break the rules without having it seem like you've done anything wrong. The punishment should fit the crime.

+1

 

[lockjaw]

how many times have you driven above the speed limit?

And look what can happen if you do that and are not honest about it:
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=809921

Seriously, knowingly lying/cheating/etc. is a big deal in the medical profession. Just because it was an assignment that was "not a big deal" in the eyes of some doesn't mean they were being less dishonest. That argument won't fly with those in the administration who are in charge of making sure the honor code is upheld.

 

[PistolPete]

I've heard from several attendings the infamous story of a UCSF student who got expelled in April of his 4th year of medical school for some honor code violation (don't know what specifically). I can't even imagine what that student was going through: $250,000 in debt and no future.

Best to just put the nose to the grindstone, do the work, and graduate. Honorably.

Hopefully those SUNY students still graduate and move past this, and learn from their mistakes.

And to the previous post, that's crazy that SUNY would rescind that pre-med's acceptance over a speeding ticket! Crazy! Hope it gets worked out.

 

[NOsquid]

What an awful, awful thing to do to graduating fourth year students.

+1 holy ****

Plus, per the article it seems some of them are being disciplined simply for not ratting out their peers

 

[Taurus]

my point is that this should not be a big deal, it should not be considered cheating in the first place. working together/sharing answers on a bs, searching medical lit, online quiz is not even close to being the same as cheating on a proctered exam during preclinical years.

I think that there are lots of dumb things in medicine and a lot of things get overblown.

That's why I feel like I'm walking on eggshells when I'm in medicine.

People chose to enter this field. If you want to play in it, you have to know how the game is played. Otherwise, they'll kick you out. Not saying it makes sense or is fair. It's just the way the game is.

 

[mTOR]

^Man I love you in this thread (no homo)


...and am now completely boggled at how you could endorse the professional territoriality that you do in the "oh noes teh super nurses are taking ova!!!1!eleven!!one" doomsday thread


I have the same opinions as you here -- but my criticism is borne out of cynicism towards medical training and utter disillusionment about the profession.