Take a postbacc course or not

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SouplantationLover

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Hello fellow nontrads!

I need help deciding whether I need to take some form of postbacc or SMP courses. I've done OK in college as a science major (3.7+) and have a decent MCAT score. Since I am considerably older, I've been advised to take a postbacc course before applying to MD school. Now, I do have money saved up and if it means better chance of getting into a good medical school, I would consider it. However, since I am older, I do want to start school ASAP. I would appreciate it if I could get some advise on how to proceed.
 
Is your sGPA close to your overall 3.7? If your sGPA is decent and your advisor thinks your MCAT score is good enough, you could just get some more relevant clinical experience then apply next cycle?
 
If you are applying next cycle, you could take a course in winter and spring and have your grades ready for next application season. You may want to take biochemistry if you have not already. Also, anatomy and physiology, immunology or endocrinology might be beneficial.

Schools will recommend courses within the last 5 years. If it's been longer than that, I would recommend a couple of course before next summer.
 
Talkbirthytome said:
If you are applying next cycle, you could take a course in winter and spring and have your grades ready for next application season. You may want to take biochemistry if you have not already. Also, anatomy and physiology, immunology or endocrinology might be beneficial.

Schools will recommend courses within the last 5 years. If it's been longer than that, I would recommend a couple of course before next summer.
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Hi thanks for your input. I graduated a while ago (5+) but have taken most science courses as I was a science major. I am currently working full time, so it would be difficult for me to take actual courses (not online) from community college. I'm not sure if I can take same courses again just to prove that I can still ace it?
PapaGuava said:
Is your sGPA close to your overall 3.7? If your sGPA is decent and your advisor thinks your MCAT score is good enough, you could just get some more relevant clinical experience then apply next cycle?
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My sGPA is 3.7. I don't know what is a good MCAT score for MD anymore...But I definitely need more clinical experiences. What would you recommend?
 
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I work full-time too and have to take classes in the evening and on Saturdays. There are also hybrid courses where the majority of the work is online but you go to campus a few times a quarter for exams and labs.

Have you done a lot of shadowing?
 
Talkbirthytome said:
I work full-time too and have to take classes in the evening and on Saturdays. There are also hybrid courses where the majority of the work is online but you go to campus a few times a quarter for exams and labs.

Have you done a lot of shadowing?
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My work is not really 9-5 as I do a lot of overtime and my community college doesn't really offer much night classes that are relevant to me. I haven't done much shadowing. What do you think it's a good amount of time for shadowing? I definitely need a LOR from one. And if you don't mind me asking, how did you find a physician to shadow?
 
Talkbirthytome said:
I work full-time too and have to take classes in the evening and on Saturdays. There are also hybrid courses where the majority of the work is online but you go to campus a few times a quarter for exams and labs.

Have you done a lot of shadowing?
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Are you applying in 2019?
 
I am in the cycle now. Two II so far. :luck:

Bummer on the classes. You may not need to even do updates there. I would focus on your ECs. Any positions where you are with patients would help. Do you know any physicians or friends who know physicians? Even your own primary care provider might be open to you shadowing them.

I am already a clinician with my own patient panel + I have specialty training in private practice from physicians + I first-assisted with physicians in the OR so I can bypass traditional shadowing. Schools are going to want to see that you have been in a patient setting for a good amount of time ... 100 hours or more.

Is there a free clinic where you live?
 
Talkbirthytome said:
I am in the cycle now. Two II so far. :luck:

Bummer on the classes. You may not need to even do updates there. I would focus on your ECs. Any positions where you are with patients would help. Do you know any physicians or friends who know physicians? Even your own primary care provider might be open to you shadowing them.

I am already a clinician with my own patient panel + I have specialty training in private practice from physicians + I first-assisted with physicians in the OR so I can bypass traditional shadowing. Schools are going to want to see that you have been in a patient setting for a good amount of time ... 100 hours or more.

Is there a free clinic where you live?
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Congrats on your IIs! Many more to come, I am sure! Are you applying for MD, DO, or both? Yes, updating my college work is a challenge for me as I've completed most relevant classes as an undergrad and thankfully aced them. I don't see how I can repeat the same classes. Were you able to take same courses again and get credits for them?

I've actually asked my primary care physician and she unfortunately said no to my request. My current work is medical research related but not clinical. I've done some volunteering in the hospital helping patients and families, which I would not describe as particularly exciting, as I didn't really get to do much other than finding them correct rooms, forms, food, and simply talking to them to ease their minds. (Is this considered clinical volunteering?) I am not sure if there is a free clinic nearby, but I would be interested in volunteering on the weekends, or shadowing.
 
SouplantationLover said:
Congrats on your IIs! Many more to come, I am sure! Are you applying for MD, DO, or both? Yes, updating my college work is a challenge for me as I've completed most relevant classes as an undergrad and thankfully aced them. I don't see how I can repeat the same classes. Were you able to take same courses again and get credits for them?

I've actually asked my primary care physician and she unfortunately said no to my request. My current work is medical research related but not clinical. I've done some volunteering in the hospital helping patients and families, which I would not describe as particularly exciting, as I didn't really get to do much other than finding them correct rooms, forms, food, and simply talking to them to ease their minds. (Is this considered clinical volunteering?) I am not sure if there is a free clinic nearby, but I would be interested in volunteering on the weekends, or shadowing.
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Thank you! It is a wild ride. I am only apply to MD programs. I am taking classes that I have not completed previously. Unless the schools you are applying to want recent courses, no need to look into that at this time.

That is great volunteering but it's not clinical. It is hard to get into the clinical setting if you aren't actually working there. Volunteering, even if it isn't medical, is really important to a lot of schools. Shadowing is huge as well - you have to prove that you have seen physicians in action enough to know medical school makes sense for you. If you go MD/PhD, you may not need as many clinical hours but you will need tons of research.
 
Talkbirthytome said:
Thank you! It is a wild ride. I am only apply to MD programs. I am taking classes that I have not completed previously. Unless the schools you are applying to want recent courses, no need to look into that at this time.

That is great volunteering but it's not clinical. It is hard to get into the clinical setting if you aren't actually working there. Volunteering, even if it isn't medical, is really important to a lot of schools. Shadowing is huge as well - you have to prove that you have seen physicians in action enough to know medical school makes sense for you. If you go MD/PhD, you may not need as many clinical hours but you will need tons of research.
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Talkbirthytome said:
Thank you! It is a wild ride. I am only apply to MD programs. I am taking classes that I have not completed previously. Unless the schools you are applying to want recent courses, no need to look into that at this time.

That is great volunteering but it's not clinical. It is hard to get into the clinical setting if you aren't actually working there. Volunteering, even if it isn't medical, is really important to a lot of schools. Shadowing is huge as well - you have to prove that you have seen physicians in action enough to know medical school makes sense for you. If you go MD/PhD, you may not need as many clinical hours but you will need tons of research.
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You are doing great! What would you consider clinical volunteering? Also, what would you consider a good MCAT score for nontrads? I know a few nontrads who are in med school, but all of them applied with a 518+. I wonder a score between 512-515 is good enough for top schools or MDPhD program. My state doesn't have any "easy" schools, not that any med school is easy to get in.
 
512-515 is not good enough for top programs. Those schools are averaging 518-520. In addition, many of those students will have tons of direct clinical research and volunteering. As a non-trad, research experience is exceptionally difficult to acquire if you don't already have a connection.

If you already have a good GPA then I don't think where you take your pre-reqs/refreshers is particularly relevant. I'd just focus on convenience, cost, and speed, then get a really good MCAT score.
 
DocJanItor said:
512-515 is not good enough for top programs. Those schools are averaging 518-520. In addition, many of those students will have tons of direct clinical research and volunteering. As a non-trad, research experience is exceptionally difficult to acquire if you don't already have a connection.

If you already have a good GPA then I don't think where you take your pre-reqs/refreshers is particularly relevant. I'd just focus on convenience, cost, and speed, then get a really good MCAT score.
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Hello! I see...What would be a direct clinical research experience? I know I have enough basic research experience as it is how I make my living. I do want to get into a large med school with lots of options, and it seems like I may have to retake the MCAT (barf). Were you a nontrad too? I am under the impression that most successful nontrads score 518+ or equivalent of.
 
Personally, I don't think that non-trads have to stand out in regards to MCAT performance unless they're lacking in GPA. My uGPA was terrible. I scored a 515 prior to entering my SMP and performed well enough to be accepted at the associated institution (not a direct linkage) for medical school. But plenty of non-trads score 510+ and get accepted with good grades, ECs, and a good background. In fact, I think the life experience is one of the most significant advantages a non-trad has over a traditional applicant.

If your research is based in something non-biological/medical then it doesn't really help that much in terms of a regular MD program. It will probably stand out slightly more for MD/PhD since it indicates that you have some experience in that arena.

That being said, the top 50 schools are pretty highly competitive since they're involved in so many things. It's great to have a goal, but don't restrict yourself based on your current aspirations; many medical students change their minds as they go through school. Mine have not changed yet, but I won't be starting rotations until next year so it could still happen. Additionally, you want to cast a wide net of 20-30 schools that fit your stats and interests so that you minimize your chances of being a re-applicant.
 
I dont think an SMP is what you'd want. Those are primarily for people who need GPA rehab, which you definitely don't with a 3.7. You didn't specify your MCAT, but I'd say if its 505ish you could apply to DO, and anything 508+ you could start considering MD too. Your age wont require you to have higher scores than more traditional applicants!

If all you need now is to round out your app with clinical experience, start getting some. It's not hard to find volunteer opportunities at hospitals or clinics. With 6 or so months between now and the next app cycle, I'd get this in ASAP, get some LORs, and apply early next cycle as is. SMPs are not what you need. Good luck!
 
DocJanItor said:
Personally, I don't think that non-trads have to stand out in regards to MCAT performance unless they're lacking in GPA. My uGPA was terrible. I scored a 515 prior to entering my SMP and performed well enough to be accepted at the associated institution (not a direct linkage) for medical school. But plenty of non-trads score 510+ and get accepted with good grades, ECs, and a good background. In fact, I think the life experience is one of the most significant advantages a non-trad has over a traditional applicant.

If your research is based in something non-biological/medical then it doesn't really help that much in terms of a regular MD program. It will probably stand out slightly more for MD/PhD since it indicates that you have some experience in that arena.

That being said, the top 50 schools are pretty highly competitive since they're involved in so many things. It's great to have a goal, but don't restrict yourself based on your current aspirations; many medical students change their minds as they go through school. Mine have not changed yet, but I won't be starting rotations until next year so it could still happen. Additionally, you want to cast a wide net of 20-30 schools that fit your stats and interests so that you minimize your chances of being a re-applicant.
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Thanks for the advice. My research is bio/med and I intend to continue. My score is between 512-515, and I hope it's good enough!
 
workaholic181 said:
I dont think an SMP is what you'd want. Those are primarily for people who need GPA rehab, which you definitely don't with a 3.7. You didn't specify your MCAT, but I'd say if its 505ish you could apply to DO, and anything 508+ you could start considering MD too. Your age wont require you to have higher scores than more traditional applicants!

If all you need now is to round out your app with clinical experience, start getting some. It's not hard to find volunteer opportunities at hospitals or clinics. With 6 or so months between now and the next app cycle, I'd get this in ASAP, get some LORs, and apply early next cycle as is. SMPs are not what you need. Good luck!
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My score is 512-515, which is average for most MD students, I think. I only have 1 score now and am considering a retake, as I really want to avoid any problems during application (my state schools has high MCAT average. I will definitely start looking for volunteer opportunities now and hopefully I can find a good fit. Thanks for the advice!
 
SouplantationLover said:
My score is 512-515, which is average for most MD students, I think. I only have 1 score now and am considering a retake, as I really want to avoid any problems during application (my state schools has high MCAT average. I will definitely start looking for volunteer opportunities now and hopefully I can find a good fit. Thanks for the advice!
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Unless you have an absolutely horrific score in one section, you should absolutely not retake a 512-515.

If you have a 3.7 and a 80 percentile or higher MCAT you really should be able to get in somewhere if you round out the rest of your app. Good luck!
 
workaholic181 said:
Unless you have an absolutely horrific score in one section, you should absolutely not retake a 512-515.

If you have a 3.7 and a 80 percentile or higher MCAT you really should be able to get in somewhere if you round out the rest of your app. Good luck!
Click to expand...

Aw thanks! I don't know if 125 (CARS) is absolutely horrific...I just don't want any schools questioning my capabilities.
 
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