Talk me into, or out of, a MBA?

[urge]

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Good idea to get a MBA? Not worth the time and cost? What would I do with it, other than write MBA everywhere?

Discuss.

 

[Sergio99]

Hello, Urge,

Good idea for what? You are the one who will decide that. Whether it is worth the time and the money is something we cannot decide for you.

I got an MBA in 2001. Taking night classes, one at a time, took me three years or thereabouts. My wife, my children and my son-in-law came to my graduation. I don't "use" it, but I don't regret having done it.

In my humble opinion, if you are going to enjoy it, have the time and have the money, go for it; you are not going to regret it. Do an MBA and whatever else you like, if you have the chance.

Greetings

 

[aredoubleyou]

depends what you want to do with it. Hospital administration, group leadership, go for it. Business/ consulting/ analyst....then PM me, theres a few important things to know.

 

[somedumbDO]

You don't need an MBA to open up a strip club.

Now... you tell me....

 

[cfdavid]

Save your money, time, and effort. You can learn just as much PRACTICAL stuff doing a few courses in economics, accounting, and finance. Oh, and common sense.

Then, you'll be able to speak the language. You can even get into specifics, but will you be inputing into ledgers? No. CPA's do that.

Don't do it. It's basically a scam, unless you're making business your focus (and I don't mean the business of medicine).

I don't mean to insult those with MBA's either, but I can support what I'm suggesting if needed. Just one of a million examples is the myriad of very successful "small" business owners without any formal education at all. They abound.

NOW, if you're talking about pedigrees to do top tier "consulting" or IB work, then you need it just because. But, not because that, as opposed to other endeavors, will make you truly more qualified. Again, I welcome a debate on this one, but expect a challenge in return.


cf

 

[GoodmanBrown]

Save your money, time, and effort. You can learn just as much PRACTICAL stuff doing a few courses in economics, accounting, and finance. Oh, and common sense.

Then, you'll be able to speak the language. You can even get into specifics, but will you be inputing into ledgers? No. CPA's do that.

Don't do it. It's basically a scam, unless you're making business your focus (and I don't mean the business of medicine).

I don't mean to insult those with MBA's either, but I can support what I'm suggesting if needed. Just one of a million examples is the myriad of very successful "small" business owners without any formal education at all. They abound.

NOW, if you're talking about pedigrees to do top tier "consulting" or IB work, then you need it just because. But, not because that, as opposed to other endeavors, will make you truly more qualified. Again, I welcome a debate on this one, but expect a challenge in return.


cf

I agree w/ CF. Seems like 40% of an MBA is for the networking, 40% actual knowledge, and 20% common sense. That's just what I personally gather having chatted with a few folks who have MBAs from some decent universities.

 

[335230]

ok

 

[IlDestriero]

http://www.heinz.cmu.edu/school-of-public-policy-management/medical-management-mmm/index.aspx

This would probably be better than an MBA for a physician. Do you want to become a hospital administrator or board member? Is that a realistic option for you? It seems like a big waste of time and money, unless you want to get out of medicine.
(Wow, Dr. Happy and I agree about something!) 😀
Cheers.

P.S. Investing in a strip club might be a good investment. People always find some money for their vices.

 

[335230]

ok

 

[IlDestriero]

Il D, you are buying me a drink at the next ASA with all your money..

Why not. But I'm not going this year. Someone has to stay and keep the lights on.
P.S. My $$ didn't come from practicing medicine.😉
and I'm hardly rich. Consider it a really big Jet style FU account. The ultimate FU account. Hahahaha

 

[urge]

I saw an ad in here for a 1 yr distance MBA. Seems like it does not take much to learn. Many chairs and higher ups are going for it and claiming they are the second coming of Jesus. I'm viewing it as a "Masters in Business? I have one too; I'm not impressed" bargaining chip against administrators.

 

[IlDestriero]

I saw an ad in here for a 1 yr distance MBA. Seems like it does not take much to learn. Many chairs and higher ups are going for it and claiming they are the second coming of Jesus. I'm viewing it as a "Masters in Business? I have one too; I'm not impressed" bargaining chip against administrators.

Look into the MMM. Heinz/Carnegie Mellon is a respected program and a top University, vs. a fly by night internet/murse degree. You might as well have a real degree for your time and money, even if it's 2 years.

 

[Narcotized]

.

 

[doctor712]

Urge,

Then there's David Lubarsky; Chairman at U of Miami who has his MD and MBA (as do a few others in the dept.) Ends up publishing, in part, about the economics surrounding operating room efficiency, informatics and the like. Why did he get his MBA?

(posted on the UM Anesthesia website) (prior to Miami, he was at Duke, so that's where I think he refers to during the 90s years).

"On Call: How did you become interested in informatics and getting your MBA?
Dr Lubarsky: As for informatics, a new chairman dragged me into it kicking and screaming in the early ‘90s. Bringing the program into the informatics age was one of the requirements when he accepted the position. That included going to a paperless medical record for anesthesia, which I thought was just the dumbest thing anybody could ever do. I anticipated all the problems, but I failed to realize the amazing benefits it would confer on our ability to monitor our practice and to make beneficial changes on behalf of our patients. I'd like to say I had an open mind. If someone shows me a better way to do something, a better hammer to pound in the same nail, I'm all for that, because I always believe in working smarter, not necessarily harder. I think everybody needs to work hard, but the answer is not always in doing more yourself, but in figuring out the best way to do something.
I pursued my MBA because as vice chair for the department, I functioned like a chief operating officer, and the concepts of change management, incremental cost accounting and negotiating were critical in my job. I realized an MBA could give me a deeper understanding of the skills that I needed and the solutions to the problems that I faced. These concepts make a real difference in understanding the way a hospital or department runs from a business or administrative perspective. I am working with the medical school and the business school on developing a four-week elective, perhaps for senior medical students, to introduce those business principles that I feel practicing physicians would be able to utilize on a daily basis."

Just a decent reason to get an MBA when you're pursuing a career in academics, especially if you're on a leadership path. As for some of the
comments around the MBA degree itself, the rigor, what they teach, yeah, I have no idea...

D712

 

[sevoflurane]

Lubarsky is a great speaker. He can sell ice to an Eskimo.

 

[doctor712]

And an all around cool and smart guy.

D712

 

[Sergio99]

Hello,

You don't need an MBA to open up a strip club.

Just one of a million examples is the myriad of very successful "small" business owners without any formal education at all. They abound.

Of course, I know a lot of people who make much more money than all of us put together, who had no formal education. I have friends who know more economics and business than many MBAs, and if you are interested in real economics, you can read on your own a lot more than any university can teach you, because most universities will teach you only the politically correct economics.

However, this is very similar to the questions we get about going into anesthesia, so I will give you my standard answer for the person who wants to get into anesthesia, which will be the right answer for this as well: if you are doing it for the money, you will be utterly disappointed, don't do it. It is hard, demanding, not rewarding enough. You are better off getting into some kind of business on your own. But if you are doing it for the fun of it, because you like the academic challenge, because you like collecting diplomas and will be happy telling your children and grandchildren about it, for your personal pride, then it is very worth it, very rewarding, go ahead and do it. Few things in life will give you as much satisfaction as of having an additional university diploma.

Greetings

 

[cfdavid]

Hello,





Of course, I know a lot of people who make much more money than all of us put together, who had no formal education. I have friends who know more economics and business than many MBAs, and if you are interested in real economics, you can read on your own a lot more than any university can teach you, because most universities will teach you only the politically correct economics.

However, this is very similar to the questions we get about going into anesthesia, so I will give you my standard answer for the person who wants to get into anesthesia, which will be the right answer for this as well: if you are doing it for the money, you will be utterly disappointed, don't do it. It is hard, demanding, not rewarding enough. You are better off getting into some kind of business on your own. But if you are doing it for the fun of it, because you like the academic challenge, because you like collecting diplomas and will be happy telling your children and grandchildren about it, for your personal pride, then it is very worth it, very rewarding, go ahead and do it. Few things in life will give you as much satisfaction as of having an additional university diploma.

Greetings

I agree with this philosophy. I'm personally not as impressed with "official" credentials, but I see your point.

Perhaps part of the fun would be to challenge existing theory (one could debate the professors about Keynes vs. Mises). I just don't think I'd spend that kind of cash to challenge often very flawed theory, which is what is too often taught in business school as Narc described.

I think coming from corporate America before med school has opened my eyes to a lot of business school jargon. It's not like medicine, which is evidence based (or should be). Often, these MBA's will latch onto the latest FAD in MBA-dom and come up with some very interesting masturbatory chatter/semantics. In some ways I think this can get in the way of simple common sense.

cf

 

[Sergio99]

Hello, cfdavid,

Perhaps part of the fun would be to challenge existing theory (one could debate the professors about Keynes vs. Mises)

As long as you do it in a way that makes you look like a weirdo and a fanatic ignorant that can be easily dismissed. Otherwise you will end up by the wayside with a bullet in your head: Wall Street and Big Banking are very protective of their turf.

I think coming from corporate America before med school has opened my eyes to a lot of business school jargon. It's not like medicine, which is evidence based (or should be). Often, these MBA's will always latch onto the latest FAD in MBA-dom and come up with some very interesting masturbatory chatter/semantics. In some ways I think this can is intended to get in the way of simple common sense.

I agree with you, perhaps with the corrections noted above.

Greetings

 

[aneftp]

MBA for physicians are a craoshot. Since you already have a professional degree your "upside" income potential vs your current physician income isn't the same upside as someone with a BA getting an MBA.

Plus the majority of people won obtain their MBA are partially or entiirely paid for by their employers.

If you really want to make big bucks you must get into those top tier programs at Stanford, Wharton,Harvard.

An MBA at other respected programs will still require working your way up the ladder unless you just happen to be at the right time and place.

But do what you love. If you are truly love the business side, go for it you have time and money.

I have been considering an MBA program myself for the past 5 years. I keep on bouncing back and forth on it. I love business and I understand all the accounting tricks since I have been self employed since I have gotten out of residency.

The 4 people who are MDs who have gone back for their executive MBAs all got subsidize by their hospitals/universities. That's why many people won't get an MBAs less someone else's paying for it.

 

[PharmaTope]

MBA for physicians are a craoshot. Since you already have a professional degree your "upside" income potential vs your current physician income isn't the same upside as someone with a BA getting an MBA.

Plus the majority of people won obtain their MBA are partially or entiirely paid for by their employers.

If you really want to make big bucks you must get into those top tier programs at Stanford, Wharton,Harvard.

An MBA at other respected programs will still require working your way up the ladder unless you just happen to be at the right time and place.

But do what you love. If you are truly love the business side, go for it you have time and money.

I have been considering an MBA program myself for the past 5 years. I keep on bouncing back and forth on it. I love business and I understand all the accounting tricks since I have been self employed since I have gotten out of residency.

The 4 people who are MDs who have gone back for their executive MBAs all got subsidize by their hospitals/universities. That's why many people won't get an MBAs less someone else's paying for it.

ya i wouldnt do it. hospitals wll not pay a lot for it either. my hospital pays out 4k in tuition a year. it is laughable and not worth my time. meanwhile corporations pay the full MBA costs.

MBA is a waste everyone has one. its all networking. id only do it if from a top notch business school otherwise it is worthless.

 

[Masseter Spasm]

Personally, I find the LMA much more useful than an MBA.

 

[Narcotized]

.

 

[Sergio99]

See where I imply the majority of economic thinking out there reminds me of the crap I learned in college? Little did I know how exactly right I was. I just found out Obama's head economic advisor went to the same school as I with the same teachers. Clearly, Aunt B never figured out on her own that she was fed a bunch of crap, and now that crap is guiding our economic policy. God help us.

Actually, Narc, it is working like a charm, just as intended: the people making decisions and writing policies are getting richer and the rest of us are getting poorer.

Don't cry.

 

[notinkansas]

A reason to pursue MBA is that it gives you options if you get fed up with medicine and want out, or want to move up to a less pt care type position. I'd only do it if you don't take time out to do it full time- either part time and pay cash, or do an executive MBA. That minimizes the opportunity cost.

I kinda wish I had one. i've had the opportunity come up out of the blue to purse a consulting job. The interview process is moving along. If I had MBA I could be looking to start at a higher level with this company. In any case, it will be a couple more interviews before I know if a job offer is forthcoming.