TBR so hard!

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Agreed. When you're weak in a particular area and encounter one of those passages...you'll end up with 0/7 :laugh:. I've gotten over it though and truly believe that every mistake is an opportunity to further my scientific knowledge.
 
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enTropeeeeeeeee said:
Agreed. When you're weak in a particular area and encounter one of those passages...you'll end up with 0/7 :laugh:. I've gotten over it though and truly believe that every mistake is an opportunity to further my scientific knowledge.
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However, a flaw to that logic is that there are unlimited amount of different passages that could come up regarding unlimited numbers of variation on subjects we learnt in bio. Sure, learning from mistakes will help if we were to encounter similar passages and questions, but how likely would that be I wonder?

If the passage is like half a page long with diagram that takes you 3 minutes to analyze and half of all the passage questions come from different parts of the passage and passage which you have just a little bit of clue about due to the level of detail, I just don't know how I am going to do alright on those passages.
 
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You are not alone...I am doing Gen Chem now, and just finish with section III (equilibrium)...it's demoralizing...I dont if I am not gonna give up on my dream of becoming a physician. But it's good to know that I am not alone.
 
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BestDoctorEver said:
You are not alone...I am doing Gen Chem now, and just finish with section III (equilibrium)...it's demoralizing...I dont if I am not gonna give up on my dream of becoming a physician. But it's good to know that I am not alone.
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me no likee that topic
 
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LOL, the equilibrium chapter in TBR is a hard one. was scoring upper 80s and 90s till i hit that chapter. It's sister chapter, kinetics, is just the same. Overall, i take it as a learning process.
 
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zoner said:
However, a flaw to that logic is that there are unlimited amount of different passages that could come up regarding unlimited numbers of variation on subjects we learnt in bio. Sure, learning from mistakes will help if we were to encounter similar passages and questions, but how likely would that be I wonder?

If the passage is like half a page long with diagram that takes you 3 minutes to analyze and half of all the passage questions come from different parts of the passage and passage which you have just a little bit of clue about due to the level of detail, I just don't know how I am going to do alright on those passages.
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To the first half: stop memorizing. This is about practice. It's not about "learning scientific knowledge." It's about learning to quickly problem so lve. You don't need exact answers. You need decent approximations. You don't need to fully understand each passage or experience; you simply need to understand it well enough to eliminate 3 bad choices.

As for the 2nd: maybe you need to improve your reading comprehension speed. Bio is a lot like VR. Often, you simply have to be quick and reading a passage and applying your knowledge to that passage as well as finding any important details.
 
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apumic said:
To the first half: stop memorizing. This is about practice. It's not about "learning scientific knowledge." It's about learning to quickly problem so lve. You don't need exact answers. You need decent approximations. You don't need to fully understand each passage or experience; you simply need to understand it well enough to eliminate 3 bad choices.

As for the 2nd: maybe you need to improve your reading comprehension speed. Bio is a lot like VR. Often, you simply have to be quick and reading a passage and applying your knowledge to that passage as well as finding any important details.
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SN2ed mentioned this as well, but I was failing to see the correlation. Perhaps I could approach these passages from another angle. Thanks for tip!
 
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mzblue said:
LOL, the equilibrium chapter in TBR is a hard one. was scoring upper 80s and 90s till i hit that chapter. It's sister chapter, kinetics, is just the same. Overall, i take it as a learning process.
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um... you know most people aren't scoring 80s and 90s on TBR passages on here, right?
 
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zoner said:
um... you know most people aren't scoring 80s and 90s on TBR passages on here, right?
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I don't know about blue, but I'm not really sure what people here have scored. It seems like it's been all over. I was scoring 80-90 on most sections when I was studying. If you're in the 50-75 range, you're probably eliminating the obvious (wrong) answers but really struggling to pick between the best 2 answers. If that's you, careful reviewing of your right AND wrong answers will be helpful.
 
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apumic said:
I don't know about blue, but I'm not really sure what people here have scored. It seems like it's been all over. I was scoring 80-90 on most sections when I was studying. If you're in the 50-75 range, you're probably eliminating the obvious (wrong) answers but really struggling to pick between the best 2 answers. If that's you, careful reviewing of your right AND wrong answers will be helpful.
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80-90 is like getting one wrong per passage?
 
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zoner said:
80-90 is like getting one wrong per passage?
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Yes... or for me at least, it was usually 2 passages perfect and then like 2-3 wrong on the 3rd passage! I tended to go in strings -- 15 right, then 3 in a row wrong, 10 right, then 2 wrong, etc.
 
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I would say that if you're not getting 80-90s in a given section, consider that a weakness. I learned this the hard way. Sigh... haha
 
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In my experience, the average person (who gives feedback) gets about 65 to 70% correct in the physics, general chemistry, and organic chemistry. They get about 60 to 65% in the biology. Verbal is a rollercoaster that ranges from 75% on the first few sets to 60% on the last few sets. These people go on to get about 30 on the MCAT.

If you want any reassurance on specific chapters, you should read through the Berkeley Review discussions thread. Some people listed their section by section scores and their MCAT score. It seems to fit with the numbers above. People averaging over those scores for the chapter homework scored above 30 and people averaging below those numbers scored below 30.

If you are getting 80% or higher on every section, then you are killing the sections. Each chapter is written with some built-in misses to ensure people read through the answer explanations and learn some POE strategies.

Apumic has the perfect perspective for using the books ideally.
 
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loveoforganic said:
What do you mean by a "built-in miss?"
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There are some questions that are intentionally ambiguous, like #11 in electrochemistry. Depending on how you interpret it, it might be that the error causes an underestimation of the final value (making the real value higher) or that the error is too high and the final value is actually lower. Error analysis is a type of question that bothers many students, so this particular question will likely be missed by 50% of the population, who will then read a blurp about working through an error analysis question. This approach doesn't make students feel good, but it does develop better test-taking skills.

If you read through the answers, some of these built-in miss questions start with what is almost an apology along with a brief explanation of why the question is being asked. The primary goal of these questions is to reach the students who skim the reading and might miss some test taking strategies along the way.
 
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loveoforganic said:
What do you mean by a "built-in miss?"
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I would guess these are simply bad questions. For example, I recall there being a few that I got wrong and brought to my physio prof because I knew the "correct" answer wasn't right. Sure enough, their answer was, at best, "the least incorrect" but most certainly not correct. Those are certainly frustrating, but I can see their value in forcing students to learn to solve ambiguous problems. It seems like those were a lot more common on bio than anything else. I rarely had a problem with ambiguous problems in ochem or physics and gchem was simply a pain because of the calculation-heavy sections at times.
 
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apumic said:
I would guess these are simply bad questions. For example, I recall there being a few that I got wrong and brought to my physio prof because I knew the "correct" answer wasn't right. Sure enough, their answer was, at best, "the least incorrect" but most certainly not correct. Those are certainly frustrating, but I can see their value in forcing students to learn to solve ambiguous problems. It seems like those were a lot more common on bio than anything else. I rarely had a problem with ambiguous problems in ochem or physics and gchem was simply a pain because of the calculation-heavy sections at times.
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I concur 1000.7% here!

I have helped edit the physics and done some minor work on the latest general chemistry book. I've been in the discussions about leaving certain questions in versus removing them, and the list of questions is usually small. Any ambiguous questions or insane calculations are there for a definite purpose. The insane calculations often show the traditional, long solution followed by some trick for eliminating three wrong answers. IMHO seeing the long solution makes the short cut stick better.

As for biology, you are right on the mark. While I have only been through them from a test taker's perspective, I remember thinking exactly what you said. There's no correct answer, but there is a least incorrect one. I get the idea of hunting for a best answer, and fully admit that on the MCAT I did that on more than one occasion. But I still hated those questions.
 
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Yeah, TBR passages were very difficult. I averaged about 80% in the chemistry, peaking at maybe 85% on subjects I knew. I had a terrible time with acid-bases and titrations. Just not a math person. Physics was ok on the first three sections, then the rest of the sections were up and down. Probably averaged about 55-60% in that. Bio took me a very long time to get used to. Just a mess the first two months of studying. The passages are definitely harder than aamc practice tests.
 
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So 80-90% is supposed to be really good? I'm thinking of Phase III. What are you guys thinking of? I get 70-80% on genetics/biochem but I figured that is where I need a lot of work then. For physics, there seem to be only a couple "built in misses". The rest seem like difficult questions but completely doable. I don't know about that stoich chapter in gchem tho. If I have anything like that on my mcat, I might be in trouble haha.
 
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I have to ask, do you guys/girls feel the toughness of these passages make TBR great for studying or worse (compared to other books)? I am about to order my TBR books tomorrow so I would like to get your opinions on whether or not it is worth it if you guys don't mind sharing. Thanks
 
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s48jet said:
I have to ask, do you guys/girls feel the toughness of these passages make TBR great for studying or worse (compared to other books)? I am about to order my TBR books tomorrow so I would like to get your opinions on whether or not it is worth it if you guys don't mind sharing. Thanks
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TBR is worth it. Get the books. The only thing I didn't like about them was their Electricity and magnetism chapter. They never really explained the right hand rule. I thought Princeton did a better job with that.
 
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The right hand rule they used in that chapter was the right hand palm rule, which honestly is so much more useful than the curl your finger rule that is so emphasized in schools.


Are there people out there who werent doing so hot in the BR passages but after reviewing the passages, they rocked the aamc's? I always get butterflies in my stomach while doing them and then freak out leading to a not so hot score. 😕

LastPolarBear said:
TBR is worth it. Get the books. The only thing I didn't like about them was their Electricity and magnetism chapter. They never really explained the right hand rule. I thought Princeton did a better job with that.
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LastPolarBear said:
TBR is worth it. Get the books. The only thing I didn't like about them was their Electricity and magnetism chapter. They never really explained the right hand rule. I thought Princeton did a better job with that.
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Great, thanks for the advice! Ill order it tomorrow when the post office is open haha their ordering process is ancient.
 
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Truestar01 said:
The right hand rule they used in that chapter was the right hand palm rule, which honestly is so much more useful than the curl your finger rule that is so emphasized in schools.


Are there people out there who werent doing so hot in the BR passages but after reviewing the passages, they rocked the aamc's? I always get butterflies in my stomach while doing them and then freak out leading to a not so hot score. 😕
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I heard people mention just this on some other threads. I have been using the BR books and banking on this to be true when I do the AAMCs. I started the BR passages doing poorly, but my scores are jumping up to the 80% range. This is not to say that I don't get the 50% once in a while. I'm hoping this trend continues on...
 
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I don't get when people say their score is 80-90% or 60-70%. How do they know? my score varies within the same chapter depending on which homework phase it is. Sometimes HWP2 is harder than 3. I just can't concretely say what my scores are...
 
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BerkReviewTeach said:
In my experience, the average person (who gives feedback) gets about 65 to 70% correct in the physics, general chemistry, and organic chemistry. They get about 60 to 65% in the biology. Verbal is a rollercoaster that ranges from 75% on the first few sets to 60% on the last few sets. These people go on to get about 30 on the MCAT.

If you want any reassurance on specific chapters, you should read through the Berkeley Review discussions thread. Some people listed their section by section scores and their MCAT score. It seems to fit with the numbers above. People averaging over those scores for the chapter homework scored above 30 and people averaging below those numbers scored below 30.

If you are getting 80% or higher on every section, then you are killing the sections. Each chapter is written with some built-in misses to ensure people read through the answer explanations and learn some POE strategies.

Apumic has the perfect perspective for using the books ideally.
Click to expand...

are these people who are getting these percentage in TBR section still studying the subject afterwards? I mean are you saying that they would still probably end up with around 30 even if they study the subject further after theya re done with teh passage?
 
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zoner said:
I don't get when people say their score is 80-90% or 60-70%. How do they know? my score varies within the same chapter depending on which homework phase it is. Sometimes HWP2 is harder than 3. I just can't concretely say what my scores are...
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I was pretty consistent across phases. If you're varying a lot w/in a give section, you're probably weak in some areas. Start identifying them.

zoner said:
are these people who are getting these percentage in TBR section still studying the subject afterwards? I mean are you saying that they would still probably end up with around 30 even if they study the subject further after theya re done with teh passage?
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I'm gonna go w/ "yes." If they're getting 80-90%, there's still improvement to be had, so at least in my experience, I continued to study. Getting any wrong tells me I don't know the material as well as I should. Keep in mind that breaking 30 puts one in the top 20% or so. Improving beyond 30 isn't something most people can do.
 
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Whoa! For the record, i wasn't trying to flaunt a good score or anything. I was just trying to say that the my score dropped drastically in the equilibrium section. I'm not making 90's on every phase. on average i'm in the 80's. And yes, to score in the 90s, i think i got only 2 questions wrong (total) for the passages in that phase. For example, i did a phase yesterday where i scored 7/7 on most of the passages or 6/7 and 5/6 and then scored a 3/7 on the first one. That decreased my average to the low 80s so my scores are far and few between. on average, i'm in the 5/7 to 7/7 with occassional 3/7 or 4/7 which i flag with a red highlight for a repeat.

Plus i was referring to the gen chem. Doing great in the ochem as well. The physics is just killer. i just managed to go from the upper 60's and low 70s to the 80s for the physics so i say practice works. For my first physics phase, i scored a pathetic 48%. i had to sit down and figure out why i did so awful and then worked from there.

I'm a non-trad, not a smart ass. I'm just working hard like the rest of you to get a decent score. Oh, and i'm praying, too😉

zoner said:
80-90 is like getting one wrong per passage?
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Truestar01 said:
The right hand rule they used in that chapter was the right hand palm rule, which honestly is so much more useful than the curl your finger rule that is so emphasized in schools.


Are there people out there who werent doing so hot in the BR passages but after reviewing the passages, they rocked the aamc's? I always get butterflies in my stomach while doing them and then freak out leading to a not so hot score. 😕
Click to expand...

Oh, I see. I guess I might have gotten a little burnt out when reading that chapter. I was honestly confused as hell when trying to follow the examples.
 
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I feel so much better now. The bio passages are also killer. not as bad as the physics but for a while i was stuck between 60% and 72% till i hit 92% on chapter 4. I think the thing with bio is that i took it long ago and it's to much stuff to remember. Plus, sometimes the passages points to things in the passages that i miss when i read or it incorporates info in a crazy, but good, way. I'm starting to treat is as reading comprehension although some of the answers rely so much on logic that i feel i need a crash course in intro to logic.

I need to work on the physics. Sometimes i'm scared and don't want to do physics but after the last 2 phases, i'm not as scared as i used to be. I just need some activation energy .
Practice makes perfect, everyone. We're all struggling now but lets keep at it.

BerkReviewTeach said:
In my experience, the average person (who gives feedback) gets about 65 to 70% correct in the physics, general chemistry, and organic chemistry. They get about 60 to 65% in the biology. Verbal is a rollercoaster that ranges from 75% on the first few sets to 60% on the last few sets. These people go on to get about 30 on the MCAT.

If you want any reassurance on specific chapters, you should read through the Berkeley Review discussions thread. Some people listed their section by section scores and their MCAT score. It seems to fit with the numbers above. People averaging over those scores for the chapter homework scored above 30 and people averaging below those numbers scored below 30.

If you are getting 80% or higher on every section, then you are killing the sections. Each chapter is written with some built-in misses to ensure people read through the answer explanations and learn some POE strategies.

Apumic has the perfect perspective for using the books ideally.
Click to expand...
 
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Nice. good to see another nontrad🙂. I think actively reading the explanations help. For me, it helped me understand some of the logic behind the right choices. Even if you get a question right, still read the rationale. TBR is hard, but with time, you get the hang of it. I need to work on physics tonight and i'm just not feeling it.

zoner said:
😛 less worried now

nontrad here as well
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TPR does a great job on the electricity and magnetism chapter. I actually used it for physics 2. 90 looooong pages of info but worth it. I heard TBR improved their electricity chapter in the new books. Not there yet so i can't tell how good it is now.

LastPolarBear said:
TBR is worth it. Get the books. The only thing I didn't like about them was their Electricity and magnetism chapter. They never really explained the right hand rule. I thought Princeton did a better job with that.
Click to expand...
 
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zoner said:
are these people who are getting these percentage in TBR section still studying the subject afterwards? I mean are you saying that they would still probably end up with around 30 even if they study the subject further after theya re done with teh passage?
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To be totally honest, I'm not sure. I just surveyed people who told me their scores as to how they did in the various sections. I compared it to what people have been saying in the BR discussions threads. I never got detailed feedback, but the general information semms to fit what i mentioned above for both groups. It makes sense that someone getting a certain percentage on practice materials will get a score equivalent to that percentage on the real exam. Unless anxiety undermines you or you get a completely obscure exam, you should score on the real exam about where you're scoring on your practice materials.
 
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but one thing that doesn't make sense is that if they are still studying the material after getting a certain low score on TBR and still getting equivalent score on the real mcat, that means, there is really no logical reason to study further, and that TBR passages are basically diagnostic and the level you are when you do those TBR passages are where you will be on the real mcat.

this is either saying that the real mcat is harder or that people are not studying further after doing the passages and that the passage itself aren't helping to improve the real mcat score.
 
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zoner said:
but one thing that doesn't make sense is that if they are still studying the material after getting a certain low score on TBR and still getting equivalent score on the real mcat, that means, there is really no logical reason to study further, and that TBR passages are basically diagnostic and the level you are when you do those TBR passages are where you will be on the real mcat.

this is either saying that the real mcat is harder or that people are not studying further after doing the passages and that the passage itself aren't helping to improve the real mcat score.
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Seriously dude, you're worrying about the wrong stuff.

Study, take the TBR exams for practice and AAMC exams to gauge progress and leave it at that. You're wasting your time by hand waving about all this stuff that won't give you a better score.
 
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ridethecliche said:
Seriously dude, you're worrying about the wrong stuff.

Study, take the TBR exams for practice and AAMC exams to gauge progress and leave it at that. You're wasting your time by hand waving about all this stuff that won't give you a better score.
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seriously, ok, too much coffffffzzzzee
 
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ridethecliche said:
Seriously dude, you're worrying about the wrong stuff.

Study, take the TBR exams for practice and AAMC exams to gauge progress and leave it at that. You're wasting your time by hand waving about all this stuff that won't give you a better score.
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Zoner's question and concerns are valid because BRTech is a well respected voice in the SDN community. He basically told Zoner that anecdotal information from other BR users correlate Zoner's performance to his/her real score on test day. I disagree with this statement because if that is the case, then why am I studying further? It just doesn't make any sense because there's plenty of room for improvement. Getting acclimated to the whole MCAT style will yield higher scores across the board. Learning concepts in more depth and detail will yield higher scores. I personally refuse to believe that my scores are statistically set.

I certainly hope they're not! But then again, I'm studying and have never taken the MCAT before. I'll definitely continue my religious devotion to this test and hope everything turns out well. Zoner you should do the same. 👍
 
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enTropeeeeeeeee said:
Zoner's question and concerns are valid because BRTech is a well respected voice in the SDN community. He basically told Zoner that anecdotal information from other BR users correlate Zoner's performance to his/her real score on test day. I disagree with this statement because if that is the case, then why am I studying further? It just doesn't make any sense because there's plenty of room for improvement. Getting acclimated to the whole MCAT style will yield higher scores across the board. Learning concepts in more depth and detail will yield higher scores. I personally refuse to believe that my scores are statistically set.

I certainly hope they're not! But then again, I'm studying and have never taken the MCAT before. I'll definitely continue my religious devotion to this test and hope everything turns out well. Zoner you should do the same. 👍
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To bring this all back to MCAT terms, think of studying like to an enzyme. Your natural science aptitude is Vmax, while your ability to learn is Km. With no study time, your score (Vo) will be VERY low. With maximal studying, you will approximate your Vmax (but never actually reach it). Beware of competitive inhibitors (friends, other homework); noncompetitive inhibitors (your girlfriend, who will take over your life regardless of whether you need to study or not); and uncompetitive inhibitors (anxiety, illness).

We all begin at some level and our scores on practice exams, passages, etc. correlate with where we begin and end. Yes, there is bound to be improvement, but realize that the improvement you will make is directly related to your ability. It's not like the TBR books are some magic stuff that's going to suddenly make a radical change in your science abilities.
 
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apumic said:
To bring this all back to MCAT terms, think of studying like to an enzyme. Your natural science aptitude is Vmax, while your ability to learn is Km. With no study time, your score (Vo) will be VERY low. With maximal studying, you will approximate your Vmax (but never actually reach it). Beware of competitive inhibitors (friends, other homework); noncompetitive inhibitors (your girlfriend, who will take over your life regardless of whether you need to study or not); and uncompetitive inhibitors (anxiety, illness).

We all begin at some level and our scores on practice exams, passages, etc. correlate with where we begin and end. Yes, there is bound to be improvement, but realize that the improvement you will make is directly related to your ability. It's not like the TBR books are some magic stuff that's going to suddenly make a radical change in your science abilities.
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Well said. That actually makes a lot of sense.
 
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enTropeeeeeeeee said:
Zoner's question and concerns are valid because BRTech is a well respected voice in the SDN community. He basically told Zoner that anecdotal information from other BR users correlate Zoner's performance to his/her real score on test day. I disagree with this statement because if that is the case, then why am I studying further? It just doesn't make any sense because there's plenty of room for improvement. Getting acclimated to the whole MCAT style will yield higher scores across the board. Learning concepts in more depth and detail will yield higher scores. I personally refuse to believe that my scores are statistically set.

I certainly hope they're not! But then again, I'm studying and have never taken the MCAT before. I'll definitely continue my religious devotion to this test and hope everything turns out well. Zoner you should do the same. 👍
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My point was that it is not useful to worry about whether someone got that score after they reviewed again or not. The fact is that you need to review again, so if someone got a 45 after studying the material once and never reviewing it again, I certainly wouldn't use that as a guideline for me to not review material after working on it.

The OP has started a 'freakout' style of thread pretty often lately, and while that has led to some good discussion on studying tactics, it is my opinion that the OP is looking at datum instead of looking at trends and getting frightened every time a dip happens which is not optimal to doing well.
 
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