Teaching hospitals?

[deleted642188]

Hi Y'all

I have a quick question about how a teaching hospital can further enhance a med student's education.

I understand that most Teaching hospitals are tertiary care and have many clinics which offer many opportunities to fully understand a certain fioeld/discipline.

But are there any other significant aspects of a teaching hospital that makes teaching hospitals a good learning environment?

EDIT:
I realized I made an erratum in asking
rephrased question: how would clerkships be like in a teaching hospital that is owned by the school like Rush Medical Center, Massachusetts General, U Miami, etc.? Is there anything special about clinical rotations at these types of hospitals?

Can all academic hospitals be teaching hospitals too?
Sorry for any confusions

What say you @Catalystik @gyngyn et al?

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[mimelim]

I don't really understand your question. A non-teaching hospital is not going to have medical students at it. Ergo, it is not a learning environment, never mind good vs. bad.

Do you mean academic vs. community hospitals?

 

[Spinach Dip]

A hospital provides acute healthcare.

A teaching hopsital provides acute healthcare while training new physicians/nurses/etc.

I didn't think that was difficult to understand.

 

[LizzyM]

I suspect that the OP is thinking about some medical schools that do not have affiliated teaching hospitals and do most of their teaching in ambulatory care settings and promote a "community health" model with a goal of training primary care providers. With more and more care being done in ambulatory care settings, I can see where it makes sense to some degree and I can understand the OP's confusion.

 

[mimelim]

A hospital provides acute healthcare.

A teaching hopsital provides acute healthcare while training new physicians/nurses/etc.

I didn't think that was difficult to understand.

This is not necessarily true. Hospitals provide healthcare. There is a lot of chronic health management that occurs at a hospital. There are also people that need long term care that regularly happens at a hospital.

 

[WingedOx]

I suspect that the OP is thinking about some medical schools that do not have affiliated teaching hospitals and do most of their teaching in ambulatory care settings and promote a "community health" model with a goal of training primary care providers. With more and more care being done in ambulatory care settings, I can see where it makes sense to some degree and I can understand the OP's confusion.

Well that or when inpatient training is done at various community hospitals for schools like RFU that don't have their own primary affiliate.

 

[deleted642188]

I don't really understand your question. A non-teaching hospital is not going to have medical students at it. Ergo, it is not a learning environment, never mind good vs. bad.

Do you mean academic vs. community hospitals?

Well I was talking about the hospitals of a Medical school vs a non-academic hospital

i guess my point would be how would clerkships be if I attended a school with no academic hospitals like Rosalind Franklin/SUNY Buffalo vs a school with its own hospital like Stony Brook, U Miami, Cornell Weill, Rush Medical Center, etc.

and are there differences in teaching style?

 

[mimelim]

Well I was talking about the hospitals of a Medical school (ie Rush Medical Center, SUNY Downstate/Stony Brook, Mt. Sinai and etc.) vs a non-academic hospital

That doesn't really clarify much... I'll just take a stab at it...

A single hospital may be in multiple of these categories:

Teaching hospital - A hospital where students, residents, and fellows are taught.
Academic hospital - A hospital affiliated with a medical school or university.
Community hospital - A hospital not affiliated with a specific medical school or university.

Your initial question doesn't make sense because you are asking about comparing medical experiences between places that have medical students vs. places that don't have medical students. There are significant differences between academic and community hospitals. Typically academic hospitals will have more research opportunities, more organized didactics etc.

 

[deleted642188]

That doesn't really clarify much... I'll just take a stab at it...

A single hospital may be in multiple of these categories:

Teaching hospital - A hospital where students, residents, and fellows are taught.
Academic hospital - A hospital affiliated with a medical school or university.
Community hospital - A hospital not affiliated with a specific medical school or university.

Your initial question doesn't make sense because you are asking about comparing medical experiences between places that have medical students vs. places that don't have medical students. There are significant differences between academic and community hospitals. Typically academic hospitals will have more research opportunities, more organized didactics etc.

i see where my mistake is then....

then maybe I should rephrase my question: how would clerkships be like in a teaching hospital that is owned by the school like Rush Medical Center? Is there anything special about clinical rotations at these types of hospitals?


Can all academic hospitals be teaching hospitals too?
Sorry for any confusions

 

[mimelim]

i see where my mistake is then....

then maybe I should rephrase my question: how would clerkships be like in a teaching hospital that is owned by the school like Rush Medical Center? Is there anything special about clinical rotations at these types of hospitals?

Sorry for any confusions

Who owns the hospital doesn't mean a ton. Who manages matters more and even then, the type of hospital (academic vs. community) is going to have the largest impact.

Clerkship quality is determined by a large number of factors. The most important of which is appropriateness of the clinical site. As an MS3, you are going to learn best by being a part of the physician team. Not by being a passive observer and not by doing pure scut. A good clerkship site is going to be one with physicians/treatment teams who are amenable to MS3 involvement. Places that have established rotations/expectations that students be a part of the team are going to have good rotations. Access to pathology is another plus. You learn by having patients to treat. You want some diversity in your pathology as well as a reasonable number of patients to see every day. Having an inpatient service with 4 patients on it with 2 residents and 3 students is a waste of everyone's time. This is why large medical center hospitals are good.

 

[LizzyM]

Well I was talking about the hospitals of a Medical school vs a non-academic hospital

i guess my point would be how would clerkships be if I attended a school with no academic hospitals like Rosalind Franklin/SUNY Buffalo vs a school with its own hospital like Stony Brook, U Miami, Cornell Weill, Rush Medical Center, etc.

and are there differences in teaching style?

SUNY Buffalo has more hospitals than you can shake a stick at. https://medicine.buffalo.edu/about/hospital_and_researchaffiliations/hospital.html
What you don't see with med schools that you associate with a flagship hospital such as Weill Cornell and NewYork-Presbyterian Hospital, is that there are community hospitals that also serve as teaching hospitals for those med schools: http://weill.cornell.edu/education/curriculum/pdf/Travel_Directions_to_Network_Hospitals.pdf

 

[Mad Jack]

Hi Y'all

I have a quick question about how a teaching hospital can further enhance a med student's education.

I understand that most Teaching hospitals are tertiary care and have many clinics which offer many opportunities to fully understand a certain fioeld/discipline.

But are there any other significant aspects of a teaching hospital that makes teaching hospitals a good learning environment?

EDIT:
I realized I made an error in asking
rephrased question: how would clerkships be like in a teaching hospital that is owned by the school like Rush Medical Center, Massachusetts General, U Miami, etc.? Is there anything special about clinical rotations at these types of hospitals?

Can all academic hospitals be teaching hospitals too?
Sorry for any confusions

What say you @Catalystik @gyngyn et al?

Large, well-funded teaching hospitals have better variety of patients and cases. They're just better places to learn because you'll see more than you would at a community rotation.

 

[Mad Jack]

I suspect that the OP is thinking about some medical schools that do not have affiliated teaching hospitals and do most of their teaching in ambulatory care settings and promote a "community health" model with a goal of training primary care providers. With more and more care being done in ambulatory care settings, I can see where it makes sense to some degree and I can understand the OP's confusion.

Many DO schools don't have teaching hospitals- they have several community hospitals that provide their training. The upside is that you get good at the bread and butter, the downside is that you never see the zebras or the weird and difficult cases. It's easy to learn the bread and butter later, but it's hard to learn the zebras on the fly.

 

[deleted642188]

SUNY Buffalo has more hospitals than you can shake a stick at. https://medicine.buffalo.edu/about/hospital_and_researchaffiliations/hospital.html
What you don't see with med schools that you associate with a flagship hospital such as Weill Cornell and NewYork-Presbyterian Hospital, is that there are community hospitals that also serve as teaching hospitals for those med schools: http://weill.cornell.edu/education/curriculum/pdf/Travel_Directions_to_Network_Hospitals.pdf

Well I realized that I misworded my question from the start and used academic hospitals interchangeably with teaching hospitals before @mimelim clarified the terms.

What I meant to say was that I was curious if there is anything unique about clerkships in a medical school's teaching hospital - e.g. Rush Medical Center/Mass General. Though some of the posters have answered my question

regardless, everyone's time is much appreciated

 

[Flashfan]

I have heard the complaint from Rosalind Franklin students that it can be a bit more difficult during the residency process because they don't have a home program. Still, there are plenty of good matches.

 

[Wordead]

It is my personal belief that you get a worse educational experience if there are not residents around and it is not a true teaching hospital. On the other hand, I think you're more likely to get procedures which are fun. But procedures are not why you're in medical school.

As an aside, Rush is reportedly more private and country-clubby as a hospital than being a true teaching hospital.