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zanaida10

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Undergrad cheating...what if your not in the crowd?
I attend a school know for its weed out system of Pre-Med classes. I really struggled through my them and wasn't the happiest person at the end of my gen bio's and gen chems...and physics. Lately I found out for most of these classes students have gone beyond cheating during exams, people actually have the Test Bank. Apparently it's pretty common with a lot of students who have parents in education programs and can cut through companies and get this stuff for their kids. And of course they share it like crazy. It annoys me that this is how many kids get their A's. I know cheating will never end but heres my question: is a Test Bank fair resource if some students can manage to get them? BY TEST BANK I DO NOT MEAN OLD EXAM, I MEAN LICENSED BOOKLETS OF EXAM QUESTIONS THAT ONLY TEACHERS LEGALLY HAVE ACCESS TO...
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Depakote

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[B]Undergrad cheating...what if your not in the crowd?[/B]
I attend a school know for its weed out system of Pre-Med classes. I really struggled through my them and wasn't the happiest person at the end of my gen bio's and gen chems...and physics. Lately I found out for most of these classes students have gone beyond cheating during exams, people actually have the Test Bank. Apparently it's pretty common with a lot of students who have parents in education programs and can cut through companies and get this stuff for their kids. And of course they share it like crazy. It annoys me that this is how many kids get their A's. I know cheating will never end but heres my question: is a Test Bank fair resource if some students can manage to get them?
[/QUOTE]
couple of questions...

by test bank, do you mean copies of old tests or something more formal? If students have access to materials that aren't contraban (illicitly obtained copies of the test to be given) how is this any different than using a text book or other review book?

would you use it if you had access to it, or are you just upset that you don't?
 

Depakote

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I should add that old tests are a great study resource. Unless the professor makes it a point to collect them, they're usually fair game.

(in fact, at my med school for this block the block director has a number of old tests on reserve in the library for student use)
 
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Zakaqel

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The basic idea of using a test bank the teacher has used before is not cheating. Most of the good profs I have had so far are the ones who give out previous tests as a study-guide. All the profs who use the same tests/test banks are usually lazy. In fact, I knew this one prof who was so cool/nice but never changed his tests. I had hid tests from about 5 years ago and they didn’t change whatsoever. What usually pisses me off are the kids who have the tests/test banks and don’t share. I made sure that I gave a copy of the test to whomever wanted one.
 

EpiPEN

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I say fair. I mean, you don't just instantly get A's from a test bank. I you have to actually do all those problems.
 

zanaida10

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No I dont mean old exam, thats fair game. I mean TEST BANK, so lets say for every Text book, the company makes a List of questions for each chapter...its a booklet that only teachers have access to. Its legally only obtainable to the professors who are using that text book. However, some students manage to make their parents (who are in the teaching field) use their license and obtain it. I do have the opportunity to use it if I decide to befriend them and use them and ect...but I don't feel comfortable with the idea. And yeahs its always sticky asking people their opinion on cheating because a. you sound like a turd if you get all prissy and say you would never. b. you sound jealous. So I don't know what I would do, honestly maybe if I was that desperate. However, I have had the opportunity to cheat before and didn't take it because I felt guilty. Make it what you want it...its not about me. But the majority of the student population probably does not have the opportunity to obtain the Test Bank...I think some kid ordered one through his dads practice through a Tokyo shipper??? ughh.
 

Depakote

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If it's driving you that crazy, you can always play the ignorance card...

Hi Professor______,

I've noticed some of my classmates using [insert name of test book here] to prepare for the exams. Do you feel that this would be a good study guide? Would you recommend I use it?

Thanks,
zanaida10

If they're not drawing the test answers from that book, then you can use it with a clear conscience, if they are then maybe they'll change their tests.

This does run you the risk of having to name names, but that gets into your schools cheating policy/honor code/etc.
 

EpiPEN

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If it's driving you that crazy, you can always play the ignorance card...



If they're not drawing the test answers from that book, then you can use it with a clear conscience, if they are then maybe they'll change their tests.

This does run you the risk of having to name names, but that gets into your schools cheating policy/honor code/etc.

I smell a rat :laugh::laugh::laugh::laugh:
 

bioteach

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All publishing companies flood professors with test banks in both paper form and CDs. All of those test banks always come with the answers as well. When I first started teaching I always wrote my own tests and the older teachers would laugh and say that I will eventually go to using the test banks like everyone else because its so much easier. I tried the test banks for a few semesters and then went back to writing my own. Test bank questions are often poorly written and smack of laziness on the part of the professor.

I've always wondered about those hundreds of copies of test banks out there. I myself will have over a dozen when I quit teaching and start medical school this fall. I'm giving mine to other profs in the department, but I'm sure there would be $$ to be made for an unethical person.

No the test bank is not a fair reference. It is supposedly for professor eyes only. I suppose its the professor's own fault if they are lazy enough to take directly from them. However it also adversely affects the students that don't have access to them. I'd tell the professor anonymously - perhaps even a note under the door?
 

EpiPEN

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But if a student wants extra practice problems that are similar to the test for practice purposes, you can't say it's wrong for him to seek those out can you?
 

bioteach

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But if a student wants extra practice problems that are similar to the test for practice purposes, you can't say it's wrong for him to seek those out can you?

That's true. Both those test banks explicitly say "FOR TEACHER USE ONLY" and instruct professors to always return them back to the publisher or destroy them rather than let them fall into students hands. Test banks are not designed as review for students. In order to seek them out you'd have to do so illegally.
 

iampremed

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Undergrad cheating...what if your not in the crowd?
I attend a school know for its weed out system of Pre-Med classes. I really struggled through my them and wasn't the happiest person at the end of my gen bio's and gen chems...and physics. Lately I found out for most of these classes students have gone beyond cheating during exams, people actually have the Test Bank. Apparently it's pretty common with a lot of students who have parents in education programs and can cut through companies and get this stuff for their kids. And of course they share it like crazy. It annoys me that this is how many kids get their A's. I know cheating will never end but heres my question: is a Test Bank fair resource if some students can manage to get them? BY TEST BANK I DO NOT MEAN OLD EXAM, I MEAN LICENSED BOOKLETS OF EXAM QUESTIONS THAT ONLY TEACHERS LEGALLY HAVE ACCESS TO...
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Since not everyone can have access to the "test bank," then yes, it's definitely unfair.
 

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hmm test bank? like the teacher editions of books that you can order off amazon? those are legit. that's not illegal or cheating. everyone can access those if they want to pay.

having old exams definitely isn't cheating either. all of the frats and sororities have old tests stored for like every class, so you need to have them yourself in order stay competitive.

i didn't have any old tests the teacher didn't give out for ochem. he would give us last year's, but not 2 years before. our test would have problems on it from the 2 years before...the greeks had these real old tests so they had a huge advantage! so much bs!! thinking back to the ppl who got As in that class, most of them were sorority girls. i know they have stored files....i need to ask them and see if i'm actually right. if so, i'm pissed! it was sooo hard to get an A...Bs both times.
 
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bioteach

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like the teacher editions of books that you can order off amazon?

Actual teacher-only test banks (the ones many professors use to create their tests) can't be purchased new anywhere. Some sites online will let people sell them. Technically, its illegal, but impossible to stop entirely. I doubt anyone has actually be prosecuted for it.
 

survivordo

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Yeah that's definitely cheating and I suspect the prof would not be happy if he/she found out. Like others have said OLD tests are great and when profs make them available it can really help you out. Here is a basic rule of thumb - if you wouldn't feel comfortable going to the prof and saying "hey I've been studying from this resource and having difficulty with this question, can we go over it together?" then you probably shouldn't be using it. This isn't something you want to mess around with, "Academic dishonesty" on your transcript does NOT look good.

Survivor DO
 

Itwashambone

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I'm going to go in a bit of a different route than everyone talking about whether on not this is cheating.

Are these classes all graded on a curve? Were you disappointed with your grades in six science classes because your grade was unfairly reduced, or because you did poorly?

I'm not saying it isn't an issue, but I am saying that it sounds like you need to be worrying less about what other people are doing wrong and more about how you can study better.
 

nabilesmail

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I think it's unfair at my school. At my school a few clubs/frats/sororities collect old practice tests and if you are a member you have access to them.

One time, I got access to a practice test (or an old test) that the professor, himself, did not hand out and 1/2 the problems on my real test were from that practice test.

It's unfair if clubs collect tests for its members and a professor recycles tests
 

Planes2Doc

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I think it's unfair at my school. At my school a few clubs/frats/sororities collect old practice tests and if you are a member you have access to them.

One time, I got access to a practice test (or an old test) that the professor, himself, did not hand out and 1/2 the problems on my real test were from that practice test.

It's unfair if clubs collect tests for its members and a professor recycles tests

Sounds a lot like life unfortunately. The people you know can give you some significant advantages. Hence the emphasis placed on networking in the real world.

The same thing happens with MCAT prep. Not everyone can afford those expensive courses. Is that fair?
 

OCDOCDOCD

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I blame the professors who use these test banks. If you're using a test that's mass produced then it shouldn't be any surprise when some students manage to get a hold of them and breeze their way through the course. Just make up your own exam and avoid this issue entirely.

I never used a test bank, but I always hated having classes that used tests that were obviously made by the book's publisher for the fact that some people would get a hold of the test and just came off as lower quality. Thankfully at my university most of the professors shunned the use of such tests.
 

ericjones2012

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1. It is the professors who I am blame on, they should NOT use the exact questions in the test bank, I know in other countries ,the professor make their own questions or change the questions at least. Also the publisher encourage the direct using test bank by professor, so their text books are easier for selling.

2. It is Unfair if the test banks are circulated with a price for students with financially disadvantage, however, this sites offers most practice questions for free http://testbankgo.info you can also ask from help from some discussion forum, as far as I know at a math forum, the users help each other on distributing the test banks
 
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