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Testing out LORs?
Started by spade92
You signed a affirmation (or didn't you?).
By asking them for a LOR for another job or something to get a sense of what the LOR writer thinks of you. I still wouldn't be reading the LOR for medical school. Is this wrong in your opinion?
If you are doing it for the express purpose of circumventing your promise, yes.
Ugh then I risk getting a bad LOR. I still don't see what's so wrong if I didn't read the med school LOR. The jobs I want to apply to that have a LOR requirement don't have any sort of confidentiality agreement.
If you are using this maneuver to circumvent confidentiality, then I submit that it is a breach of your promise.
Even though I'm technically not breaking any rules? You have to understand the severity of a less than stellar LOR and the risks that come with it.
Perhaps, but a bad LOR is rare and tells the admissions committee. One, you made such a bad impression on someone that they would agree to write you a letter of recommendation only to discredit you as an applicant, and two that you made such an impression on a letter writer, but had no idea of the impression that they had of you and still asked them about a letter of recommendation.
Anyway, Gyngyn is saying that you are breaking a moral promise that you made when you waived your right to see your letters of recommendation. If you went ahead and did what you describe, is it likely that anyone would ever find out? Probably not, but also consider the consequences you would face if someone did.
Maybe you should look at it this way. If you have a letter writer who you aren't sure will write you a good recommendation, why are you using their letter in the first place? Ideally, your letter writers should be people with whom you have developed a significant relationship with to the point where you are confident their recommendation will be good. Of course, you can rarely ever get ideal writers like that since professors are busy or have multiple letters to write, etc, but perhaps you should consider a different LOR author if you suspect that someone wrote poorly about you.
Anyway, Gyngyn is saying that you are breaking a moral promise that you made when you waived your right to see your letters of recommendation. If you went ahead and did what you describe, is it likely that anyone would ever find out? Probably not, but also consider the consequences you would face if someone did.
Maybe you should look at it this way. If you have a letter writer who you aren't sure will write you a good recommendation, why are you using their letter in the first place? Ideally, your letter writers should be people with whom you have developed a significant relationship with to the point where you are confident their recommendation will be good. Of course, you can rarely ever get ideal writers like that since professors are busy or have multiple letters to write, etc, but perhaps you should consider a different LOR author if you suspect that someone wrote poorly about you.
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Just because there isn't a specific rule governing an action doesn't make a promise worth breaking.
Believe me, I've been in this business longer than you might imagine. I do understand the sanctity of a promise as well as the effect of a weak letter. If I can't believe that a letter was written without fear of discovery, it's not worth the electrons it was written with.
Technically, a physician prescribing oxycodone for a patient describing intense pain fully aware that said patient is an addict, is not breaking the rules.
However, ethically and in every other way, the physician is.
If you are that concerned about what the professor would say about you then I think you should ask someone else and stop trying to be technically correct while circuitously working a back channel.
However, ethically and in every other way, the physician is.
If you are that concerned about what the professor would say about you then I think you should ask someone else and stop trying to be technically correct while circuitously working a back channel.
1. gyngyn is absolutely correct in that just because it's not technically against the rules doesn't mean it's not wrong
2. If you feel like you have to "test" a letter, it's probably a good idea to find a different writer - you should be absolutely confident in your letter writer's intention to give you a solid letter
3. Even if you moved past all this and decided to "test" you have no idea how "good" this letter really is or if the letter you're seeing is the same quality as the letter you're sending to medical schools
2. If you feel like you have to "test" a letter, it's probably a good idea to find a different writer - you should be absolutely confident in your letter writer's intention to give you a solid letter
3. Even if you moved past all this and decided to "test" you have no idea how "good" this letter really is or if the letter you're seeing is the same quality as the letter you're sending to medical schools
Most have already said something along these lines, but I have to add that I just wouldn't feel right doing that. One of my writers asked me to review the letter, but I told them I was confident that their letter would improve my application and refused the offer. Not a saint here, but every small step you take to uphold your values, the more ethical professional you will become.
Not sure how that would work. Wouldn't the safeguards check the legitimacy of the writer and safely store a letter once uploaded? OP could easily ask the writer to write a separate letter for a different job. Even though this job must also be verified... If he knew the employer then he could game the system.
Frankly, OP, planning it out demonstrates how unethical it is.
i dont know why this issue comes up a lot, but i would never ask for a LOR from someone i had the slightest inclination wouldn't write me a strong LOR.
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@gonnif has the rules on this...they're pretty serious. I asked hypothetically bc it was brought up in another thread. They have a contract with COCA(?) and every LOR used begins an investigation of some sort
I understand being worried about the quality of the letter...which is why you must ask people you trust, who believe that you are not just a good candidate for med school, but a phenomenal one. I asked each of my LOR writers for a STRONG letter and given my relationship with these professors/physicians, I don't have any doubts about the quality of the letters. There is one school for which I have to submit a letter from a writer who doesn't know me that well, but there is no getting around it. If you have a bunch of strong letters and one positive but weak letter, I don't think that's THAT big of an issue. When schools set up requirements like that, they have to know that not all students will have had strong relationships with every professor in the sciences.
Do not breach these rules.
Do not breach these rules.
I think a lot of these letter testers are coming from a field where it is NOT viewed as a breach of ethics, such as in business. They may not understand that it's different in this field.
Asking for LORs is scary, particularly for people with counter-dependent tendencies. It's completely unlike GPA, MCAT, or research: where you are largely are in control of your own destiny.
There's no Examkrackers book for LORs where you can do everything perfectly to get a great letter. Fundamentally, you have to trust the letter writer not to jeopardize your future, and this can be hard to do for many.
There's no Examkrackers book for LORs where you can do everything perfectly to get a great letter. Fundamentally, you have to trust the letter writer not to jeopardize your future, and this can be hard to do for many.
Mods, please sticky!!
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I don't get this as most people's letter writers will often write letters for multiple things. Does amcas typically ask them when they do this? I've never heard this before
