the Asian Paradox...

[jojocola]

we feel we need to work harder just to get to the same level as other minorities do, yet we're not a minority. the definition of URM is clear and asians are definitely not underrepresented when it comes to academia and high-learning.

/thread

Man, i was just feeling the same way before i opened my bio book a few minutes ago. It's really hard to get any academic spotlight when your competing with your own ethic backround. Sigh.....*begins to read.*

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[soso809]

Trying being Queer! Than you'll know what it's really like to be hated!! Ok, I'm leaving now.

 

[RaaMD]

I think it's useless to complain about something which you probably won't be able to change anyways.

Good thing many founding leaders like Abraham Lincoln and pioneering scientists didn't have your attitude.

 

[riceman04]

Is the country really 25% black? I thought it was more like 15%?

no around 15% seems right!

 

[DoctaJay]

So what do you want? Do you want every African-American with a 26 MCAT and 3.3 GPA to get into medical school? Do you want the next chief surgeon to be black? You want the next science nobel prize winner to be black instead of white? Are you mad because there are very few blacks in college and medicine?

And actually, Asians are still discriminated against in medicine. Although the percentage of medical schools and physicians in the us are asian, how many of them occupy the top levels of the medical hierarchy? There are much fewer Asian adcom members, chief surgeons, neurosurgeons, etc. than their percentages in medicine. And on another note, why is there only 1 Asian American in Grey's Anatomy? I count NO INDIANS, which is completely unrepresentative of reality.

Grey's anatomy is written and directed by a black woman. If you haven't noticed, the whole plot is center the nazi, not meridith gray.

 

[MonkeyNuts!]

Wasn't funny. You deserved it.

Yeah, if I'm wrong. IF. And I am just as incapable of error as you are of not embracing pseudovowels.

Of course they have a hard time adapting to Hollywood (not acting). Really it's the other way around. That's why we get so few/such limited roles. Not because of a lack of talent. If you'll notice, the Asians that do make it onto the big screen in major roles often outshine the others but go unappreciated. And, um, Caucasians don't need to adapt to Hollywood, this is America.

Well, that's what I really meant by Asians can't act. It's too hard for them to fit into the mold of a caucasian dynamic. Like someone said, all the Asians on TV right now have gotten the Caucasian acting down. Sandra Oh, dude from Blade, etc. The only exception I've ever seen was when they needed Asians to act like their own nationalities, which so far has been Lost.

Yes, I realize martial arts came from Asia (wtf?!). We don't all care so much for them anymore.

Hah that's as much as a generalization as Asians like martial arts. Except that the numbers support the latter.

In fact, the martial arts have been embraced just as much if not moreso by non-Asians. It's not us that flock to see Jackie Chan movies. Love for the martial arts has become part of American pop-culture.

First statement, maybe, even though the number of martial artists in the world most likely shows a majority of Asians, things like UFC/Pride/King of the Cage have made it popular for non Asians.

That still doesn't mean its not part of our culture or that we like it any less.

 

[MonkeyNuts!]

Many Asian Americans (esp. Southeast Asians) go into the us by being smuggled in (in boats), and many Asian Americans are sold into slavery in sweatshops and sex rings. So yeah, quit generalizing about how Asians got to America.

Bah. MiesVanderMom, don't bother in rational discussion with these Asians. Their AP/KP/CP/VP/etcP is so finely attuned from years of brainwashing from Asian cliques. This particular one doesn't want to concede that generalizations are based on some truth. Can't reason with them with generalizations, cuz then the rice hits the fan.

 

[Wanderer259]

Or: And I can stereotype whites because let's face it. Alot of those generalizations, although not 100% true in every instance across the board, do hold alot of water. They like feeling morally superior, drinking cheap beer, listening to rock music, and playing guitar. They are hairy. Deal with it. It's called culture. (Ok well maybe the hairy thing could go, but oh well).

I completely admit that this is true.

 

[deleted102545]

As an asian applying to medical school I'm more worried about adcoms thinking I'm doing it because "it's the thing for us to do" instead of because I want to.

 

[lil1gigglez]

And I can stereotype Blacks because let's face it. Alot of those generalizations, although not 100% true in every instance across the board, do hold alot of water. They like eating fried chicken, listening to rap music, and playing basketball. They have big genetalia and are athletic but have really low IQs. Deal with it. It's called culture. (Ok well maybe the low IQ thing could go, but oh well).

Who doesn't like fried chicken?

 

[8744]

Try to understand that a person's ethnicity is a very important part of who they are, regardless of where they were born or what kind of people they grew up with. You can laugh at people whom you think are "race-obsessed", but I'm sure they feel sorry for you because you have nothing to obsess over.

Well sure. We have a Greek festival at my church every year with all of that fun ethnic crap but be don't obsess about what particular gradation of Greek we happen to be or try to construct some byzantine system of classification for our ancestral grievances. In fact, the old-school Greek-Americans like in "My Big Fat Greek Wedding" are dying out. In my home state of Lousiana, the Greeks are indistinguishable from everybody else. Heck. I even speak Greek, I have been told, with a southern accent.

 

[ether^O^]

Bah. MiesVanderMom, don't bother in rational discussion with these Asians. Their AP/KP/CP/VP/etcP is so finely attuned from years of brainwashing from Asian cliques. This particular one doesn't want to concede that generalizations are based on some truth. Can't reason with them with generalizations, cuz then the rice hits the fan.

Actually, I'm OK with people making generalizations about races, because I also think they're based on facts (I've actually posted previously on driving the same point). The only problem is, Asians are the only people that are being generalized so frequently in public. For example, do you ever see generalizations made in the public or in the media about blacks or hispanics? NO, because it's "racist." How often do you see Asians being generalized in the media or wide public? Often. For example, in the movie Crash, Asians are seen as amoral, bad drivers, have backward beliefs, and have accents. They are the only race that did not redeem themselves by performing an ethical act (as the other races did). And I'd like to echo the sentiments of previous posters about the roles Asian American males get. It's pretty absurd.

So my point is, because no other races get generalized in the public and the media, Asians shouldn't be either. It's called equality. Stereotyping Asians is the only socially acceptable stereotype people can make in our society. We need to change that by making it unacceptable.

 

[ether^O^]

Well sure. We have a Greek festival at my church every year with all of that fun ethnic crap but be don't obsess about what particular gradation of Greek we happen to be or try to construct some byzantine system of classification for our ancestral grievances. In fact, the old-school Greek-Americans like in "My Big Fat Greek Wedding" are dying out. In my home state of Lousiana, the Greeks are indistinguishable from everybody else. Heck. I even speak Greek, I have been told, with a southern accent.

That's precisely why minorities in America are forced to care about their ethnicities and cultures: because we can't blend in. If Asians, blacks, and hispanics looked white and can blend in, why would we care about our previous culture and heritage? We'd be regular Americans and can adopt American culture. Unfortunately, America (whites) still see us as outsiders, so we need to hold on to our roots to protect ourselves. Think about it.

 

[MonkeyNuts!]

Actually, I'm OK with people making generalizations about races, because I also think they're based on facts (I've actually posted previously on driving the same point). The only problem is, Asians are the only people that are being generalized so frequently in public. For example, do you ever see generalizations made in the public or in the media about blacks or hispanics? NO, because it's "racist." NO, because it's "racist." How often do you see Asians being generalized in the media or wide public? Often. For example, in the movie Crash, Asians are seen as amoral, bad drivers, have backward beliefs, and have accents.

You must not get comedy central. Or watch family guy. Or the simpsons. Or Chris Rock. Or Dave Chapelle (his stand up is like 100% stereotypes.). Any African American TV show, from Fresh Prince of Bel Air to Girlfriends uses them too, either to address them or make comedy out of it. Definitely not restricted to Asians.

 

[MonkeyNuts!]

And on top of that, remember the Asian effort to make a film that would break all stereotypes about Asians, the disaster titled "Better Luck Tomorrow"? Aside from being a non-martial arts movie - it didn't knock down the geeky library Asian stereotypes, the accents, the bad driving, the chingchong would you like a fortune cookie. It only confused people, bringing in drugs, guns, murder, sex with hookers, and extremely piss poor acting.

So Asians didn't like the stereotypes. They created a movie to end them all. Instead they only addressed one or two of them and created false images of punk Asian kids and contributed negative stereotypes. We're just as much responsible for the existence of stereotypes.

 

[allthaticanbe]

You must not get comedy central. Or watch family guy. Or the simpsons. Or Chris Rock. Or Dave Chapelle (his stand up is like 100% stereotypes.). Any African American TV show, from Fresh Prince of Bel Air to Girlfriends uses them too, either to address them or make comedy out of it. Definitely not restricted to Asians.

I also think he was wrong about his/her comment. Its so true that many stereotypes are the ground work for many TV shows and movies. Asians are made fun of but so are black, whites, hispanics and etc. Many people don't get offended about the jokes made about other races and therefor they don't seem to see a problem yet when there is a joke about their race they quickly remeber it.
Anyways I was jumping around alot and I just wanted to say that it dumb to say that asians are made more fun of on TV than any other race.

 

[ether^O^]

You must not get comedy central. Or watch family guy. Or the simpsons. Or Chris Rock. Or Dave Chapelle (his stand up is like 100% stereotypes.). Any African American TV show, from Fresh Prince of Bel Air to Girlfriends uses them too, either to address them or make comedy out of it. Definitely not restricted to Asians.

See, the only problem with that argument is that all of these programs make fun of all races (including whites). Chapelle and Rock may concentrate on African Americans, but they stretch out to the Hispanics, whites, and Asians also. Unfortunately, there are many instances of people making fun of Asians in the media only and not targeting others. The most blatant examples of that is Adam Corrolla taking cracks at Asians any chance he gets (and ignoring hispanics/blacks), the Tsunami Song on Hot 97, and the use of "Chink" on BET. I can go on and on, but you never hear "******" (except by blacks like Rock & Chapelle, and if you think about it, most of their jokes about Blacks aren't even derogatory, it's just social commentary) or "****" in the media, do you? I think you can only make fun of Asians (even if you are "Asian) if you're willing to generalize about EVERY race. I am, but I don't think most people are.

 

[ether^O^]

And another thing: Has anyone heard the song "Black Korea" by Icecube? Didn't think so, because racism against Asians in the media is accepted. Most of the jokes about blacks that Chris Rock & Chapelle make are not even negative. Do they really make fun of blacks for having low IQs and not doing well in school? How many jokes of Asians having small genetalia, having no sex drive, and being short do you hear?

 

[MonkeyNuts!]

And another thing: Has anyone heard the song "Black Korea" by Icecube? Didn't think so, because racism against Asians in the media is accepted. Most of the jokes about blacks that Chris Rock & Chapelle make are not even negative. Do they really make fun of blacks for having low IQs and not doing well in school? How many jokes of Asians having small genetalia, having no sex drive, and being short do you hear?

How does IceCube still find work...

Chris Rock is always talkin about ***gers versus ***gas. Chapelle has his homeless black man skits, his jokes about blacks and cocaine, being "genetically predisposed to liking a chicken." I forget who said it but one of them was describing their experience going to black teens to give an inspirational talk and the punch line was something like "play basketball, rap, or sell some crack." Maybe Chris Tucker. Eddie Murphy always picked on gays. I've watched a decent amount of their standup and tv/movie comedy routines and they usually contain a good deal of stereotyping.

 

[MonkeyNuts!]

See, the only problem with that argument is that all of these programs make fun of all races (including whites). Chapelle and Rock may concentrate on African Americans, but they stretch out to the Hispanics, whites, and Asians also. Unfortunately, there are many instances of people making fun of Asians in the media only and not targeting others. The most blatant examples of that is Adam Corrolla taking cracks at Asians any chance he gets (and ignoring hispanics/blacks), the Tsunami Song on Hot 97, and the use of "Chink" on BET. I can go on and on, but you never hear "******" (except by blacks like Rock & Chapelle, and if you think about it, most of their jokes about Blacks aren't even derogatory, it's just social commentary) or "****" in the media, do you? I think you can only make fun of Asians (even if you are "Asian) if you're willing to generalize about EVERY race. I am, but I don't think most people are.

I definitely think I have heard "N**ger" more in movies, music, and cable tv than "chink." As for Adam Corrolla, I have no idea and I haven't heard the Tsunami song so I can't comment on either of those.

 

[Mr. Tee]

As an asian applying to medical school I'm more worried about adcoms thinking I'm doing it because "it's the thing for us to do" instead of because I want to.

ditto. all my activities are "stereotypical" too maybe I shoulda taken up drama and rock climbing when i had the chance.

 

[MonkeyNuts!]

ditto. all my activities are "stereotypical" too maybe I shoulda taken up drama and rock climbing when i had the chance.

Lol do you have martial arts listed on there. I do. 7 years worth. What system do you do if you do it.

 

[p9142]

And I can stereotype Blacks because let's face it. Alot of those generalizations, although not 100% true in every instance across the board, do hold alot of water. They like eating fried chicken, listening to rap music, and playing basketball. They have big genetalia and are athletic but have really low IQs. Deal with it. It's called culture. (Ok well maybe the low IQ thing could go, but oh well).

Who doesn't like fried chicken?

I don't get what this has to do with culture.

 

[MonkeyNuts!]

I don't get what this has to do with culture.

Well some stereotypes have roots in culture.

1.) "All Asians are rice farmers." Good deal of Asia is argicultural.
2.) "Black people can only rap or play bball." African Americans have contributed significantly in the realms of music, entertainment, and sports.
3.) "White people sail. It's like sex to these people." Sailing is a proud caucasian tradition (although definitely shared by other cultures).
4.) "Asians like martial arts." Asians have been developing systemized fighting for nearly 2000 years. It's become a way of life for many of them.

etc.

 

[Mr. Tee]

Lol do you have martial arts listed on there. I do. 7 years worth. What system do you do if you do it.

heh, no martial arts here. but i do drive a honda

 

[Pewl]

1.) Asian males can't act.

Are you kidding me? Some of the best actors/actresses in the world are Asian. But, obviously their talents are best seen in films of THEIR OWN LANGUAGE AND CULTURE. I'd like to see johnny depp pull off a serious role in Asia and get the same acceptance from an Asian population.

 

[MonkeyNuts!]

Are you kidding me? Some of the best actors/actresses in the world are Asian. But, obviously their talents are best seen in films of THEIR OWN LANGUAGE AND CULTURE. I'd like to see johnny depp pull off a serious role in Asia and get the same acceptance from an Asian population.

That's what I was trying to say!!! I clarified a couple posts after that. What I meant was they can't act in Hollywood.

 

[p9142]

Well some stereotypes have roots in culture.

1.) "All Asians are rice farmers." Good deal of Asia is argicultural.
2.) "Black people can only rap or play bball." African Americans have contributed significantly in the realms of music, entertainment, and sports.
3.) "White people sail. It's like sex to these people." Sailing is a proud caucasian tradition (although definitely shared by other cultures).
4.) "Asians like martial arts." Asians have been developing systemized fighting for nearly 2000 years. It's become a way of life for many of them.

etc.

Sorry, I should have mentioned what confused me. How does the statement "black people have low IQs" relate to culture.

 

[dannylee718]

Total equality cannot be achieved in a world where so many social equations exist. Inequality is expected.

The best we can do is to find the closest balance in this potpourri of variables and constants.

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actually, that doesn't really mean anything. i'm just trying to get my post count up.

 

[ether^O^]

How does IceCube still find work...

Chris Rock is always talkin about ***gers versus ***gas. Chapelle has his homeless black man skits, his jokes about blacks and cocaine, being "genetically predisposed to liking a chicken." I forget who said it but one of them was describing their experience going to black teens to give an inspirational talk and the punch line was something like "play basketball, rap, or sell some crack." Maybe Chris Tucker. Eddie Murphy always picked on gays. I've watched a decent amount of their standup and tv/movie comedy routines and they usually contain a good deal of stereotyping.

You have to look at the context that these words are being used. You never see a white person, asian person, hispanic person, etc. call a black man a ****** in the media unless it was to make social commentary or to make a film about racism (i.e. American History X). However, you do hear the word "chink" and "gook" being thrown around like hotcake, like it was just another word. Stereotypes about Asians are almost always negative (short, small penises, flatchested, etc.), whereas stereotypes about blacks are almost always positive (good at sports, music, speaking, etc.). You never hear stuff about blacks having low IQs, can't do math, etc. in jokes

 

[MonkeyNuts!]

You have to look at the context that these words are being used. You never see a white person, asian person, hispanic person, etc. call a black man a ****** in the media unless it was to make social commentary or to make a film about racism (i.e. American History X). However, you do hear the word "chink" and "gook" being thrown around like hotcake, like it was just another word.

I have yet to hear it on TV, movies, or music. If others have heard it frequently, please elaborate, I would like to know.

You also have to look at the word "Ni**er" in context. It's not said by hispanics, asians, and especially whites because of the slavery that this country experienced. Not referring to blacks as "Ni**ers" is almost a form of atonement. Looking at "chink" and "gook", they were used widely by American forces in Korea and Vietnam when they were fighting against them. Perhaps the difference in historical usage of the terms defines the frequency of their use. But regardless, I personally have not heard "chink" or "gook" in music, TV, and rarely in movies (only one I can think of is Dragon: The Bruce Lee Story).

Stereotypes about Asians are almost always negative (short, small penises, flatchested, etc.), whereas stereotypes about blacks are almost always positive (good at sports, music, speaking, etc.). You never hear stuff about blacks having low IQs, can't do math, etc. in jokes

I'm really curious as to what you have seen in terms of Chris Rock, Tucker, Eddie Murphy, Dave Chapelle - because none of them are really comments. Like if a white guy said some of the same things they use in their acts, he would get mauled.

 

[8744]

That's precisely why minorities in America are forced to care about their ethnicities and cultures: because we can't blend in. If Asians, blacks, and hispanics looked white and can blend in, why would we care about our previous culture and heritage? We'd be regular Americans and can adopt American culture. Unfortunately, America (whites) still see us as outsiders, so we need to hold on to our roots to protect ourselves. Think about it.

My state is about 30 percent black, 15 percent-or-so hispanic, with a smattering of other races. I'd say that if you can't blend in with those kind of odds you aren't trying too hard. The idea is that people escape their backwards-ass cultures to get a fresh start in America as Americans, not to arrive here and hide in some ethnic enclave holding on to thier ancestral customs.

We still have a few people at my church who have been here for fifty years and still barely speak english, still think of themselves as Greeks, and have made no effort to assimilate. They are very irate with the younger generation who have married outside of the Greek community (like I did), who don't speak Greek, and who are Americans without the silly hyphen.

Besides, it's not your ethnic heritage which I find funny, it's the contortions that people on this forum apparently go through to exactly quantify their particular level of oppression and disadvantagedness. (Is that a word?)

 

[ether^O^]

I have yet to hear it on TV, movies, or music. If others have heard it frequently, please elaborate, I would like to know.

You also have to look at the word "Ni**er" in context. It's not said by hispanics, asians, and especially whites because of the slavery that this country experienced. Not referring to blacks as "Ni**ers" is almost a form of atonement. Looking at "chink" and "gook", they were used widely by American forces in Korea and Vietnam when they were fighting against them. Perhaps the difference in historical usage of the terms defines the frequency of their use. But regardless, I personally have not heard "chink" or "gook" in music, TV, and rarely in movies (only one I can think of is Dragon: The Bruce Lee Story).


I'm really curious as to what you have seen in terms of Chris Rock, Tucker, Eddie Murphy, Dave Chapelle - because none of them are really comments. Like if a white guy said some of the same things they use in their acts, he would get mauled.

It may surprise you, but Chinese and Japanese Americans have a pretty long history in the United States. When Chinese Americans worked on the railroads in the 1800s, they were always the ones sent to blow up parts of the mountain with dynamite, resulting in a lot of Chinese deaths. Many were also worked to death. Japanese Americans were interned during WWII: lost their homes, jobs, families without even having participated in the war.

Songs for you to download: Tsunami Song, Black Korea. Watch Crash and see if the Asians redeemed themselves by doing anything ethical at the end. Watch the Last Samurai: Hm...the white guy lives at the end and gets the Japanese girl, while all the other Japanese soldiers die? Great.

 

[ether^O^]

My state is about 30 percent black, 15 percent-or-so hispanic, with a smattering of other races. I'd say that if you can't blend in with those kind of odds you aren't trying too hard. The idea is that people escape their backwards-ass cultures to get a fresh start in America as Americans, not to arrive here and hide in some ethnic enclave holding on to thier ancestral customs.

We still have a few people at my church who have been here for fifty years and still barely speak english, still think of themselves as Greeks, and have made no effort to assimilate. They are very irate with the younger generation who have married outside of the Greek community (like I did), who don't speak Greek, and who are Americans without the silly hyphen.

Besides, it's not your ethnic heritage which I find funny, it's the contortions that people on this forum apparently go through to exactly quantify their particular level of oppression and disadvantagedness. (Is that a word?)

The country is what? 78% white? The most powerful people (economically & socially) in the country are what? White? My point is that Greeks can blend in with white society just like any other Caucasian. Asians, blacks, and hispanics can't. Obviously, greeks also have the choice to hold on to their roots & culture.

 

[Schaden Freud]

Dude, what exactly are you arguing for? This thread was started to suggest that Asians should be given URM preference for med school admissions. That discussion has been over for about 2 pages now...

The other issues you bring up are certainly fair, of course. Yes, Asians are not as well-represented as whites, in Hollywood and in society in general. But as other posters have said again and again- it's only because they are a tiny fraction of the population. Being demographically outnumbered means that your ability to influence the culture will be limited, but does not mean that you are necessarily a victim of discrimination.

It may surprise you, but Chinese and Japanese Americans have a pretty long history in the United States. When Chinese Americans worked on the railroads in the 1800s, they were always the ones sent to blow up parts of the mountain with dynamite, resulting in a lot of Chinese deaths. Many were also worked to death. Japanese Americans were interned during WWII: lost their homes, jobs, families without even having participated in the war.

Songs for you to download: Tsunami Song, Black Korea. Watch Crash and see if the Asians redeemed themselves by doing anything ethical at the end. Watch the Last Samurai: Hm...the white guy lives at the end and gets the Japanese girl, while all the other Japanese soldiers die? Great.

 

[8744]

The country is what? 78% white? The most powerful people (economically & socially) in the country are what? White? My point is that Greeks can blend in with white society just like any other Caucasian. Asians, blacks, and hispanics can't. Obviously, greeks also have the choice to hold on to their roots & culture.

Not hardly, unless you count hispanics as whites and even then I'm not sure. someone correct me if I'm wrong but while whites might be the largest "ethnic" group, they are no longer the majority.

You disconnect is associating power with race. It may be true that most of the powerful people in the country are white but this does not translate into any benefits for average white guys. That's why I always thought it was funny when I was a pizza driver many, many years ago to hear the "brothers" talking about how much power whitey had. Maybe. But I was still driving pizza and doing crappy minimum wage jobs.

 

[ether^O^]

Not hardly, unless you count hispanics as whites and even then I'm not sure. someone correct me if I'm wrong but while whites might be the largest "ethnic" group, they are no longer the majority.

You disconnect is associating power with race. It may be true that most of the powerful people in the country are white but this does not translate into any benefits for average white guys. That's why I always thought it was funny when I was a pizza driver many, many years ago to hear the "brothers" talking about how much power whitey had. Maybe. But I was still driving pizza and doing crappy minimum wage jobs.

Whites are definitely still the majority of the country (I meant around 70%, not 78). Hispanics and blacks only account for about 24% and asians about 4%

 

[MonkeyNuts!]

It may surprise you, but Chinese and Japanese Americans have a pretty long history in the United States. When Chinese Americans worked on the railroads in the 1800s, they were always the ones sent to blow up parts of the mountain with dynamite, resulting in a lot of Chinese deaths. Many were also worked to death. Japanese Americans were interned during WWII: lost their homes, jobs, families without even having participated in the war.

Songs for you to download: Tsunami Song, Black Korea. Watch Crash and see if the Asians redeemed themselves by doing anything ethical at the end. Watch the Last Samurai: Hm...the white guy lives at the end and gets the Japanese girl, while all the other Japanese soldiers die? Great.

Just call me EternalDevilsAdvocate. Yeah I'm aware of those two references in history.

For the Japanese, although they were put in concentration camps - which would be a source for atonement - they also blew up Pearl Harbor, so I can't see America being as apologetic as they would for slaves. As for Chinese on railroads, yeah that could arguably be a source for atonement.

However, the Vietnam War/Korean War was much more recent then those two events, so "chink" and "gook" probably are more desensitized because of that.

But again, regardless, compared to "cracker" and "ni**er", I rarely hear the Asian ones.

 

[45408]

Most of the jokes about blacks that Chris Rock & Chapelle make are not even negative. Do they really make fun of blacks for having low IQs and not doing well in school? How many jokes of Asians having small genetalia, having no sex drive, and being short do you hear?

How many jokes are there about blacks being in prison, doing drive bys and fathers abandoning their children? Let's see. A LOT. Stop whining.

You have to look at the context that these words are being used. You never see a white person, asian person, hispanic person, etc. call a black man a ****** in the media unless it was to make social commentary or to make a film about racism (i.e. American History X). However, you do hear the word "chink" and "gook" being thrown around like hotcake, like it was just another word. Stereotypes about Asians are almost always negative (short, small penises, flatchested, etc.), whereas stereotypes about blacks are almost always positive (good at sports, music, speaking, etc.). You never hear stuff about blacks having low IQs, can't do math, etc. in jokes

Oh, really? How about "IQ and the Wealth of Nations"? Look it up. There are articles in the newspaper all the time about the blacks in prison (I think 32% of black men have done time, and they discuss that in the media all the time), dropping out of school, etc. Meanwhile, I can't think of a single negative thing someone has said in the media recently about Asians. Take off the blinders. You're way too sensitive.

 

[MonkeyNuts!]

Dude, what exactly are you arguing for? This thread was started to suggest that Asians should be given URM preference for med school admissions. That discussion has been over for about 2 pages now...

The other issues you bring up are certainly fair, of course. Yes, Asians are not as well-represented as whites, in Hollywood and in society in general. But as other posters have said again and again- it's only because they are a tiny fraction of the population. Being demographically outnumbered means that your ability to influence the culture will be limited, but does not mean that you are necessarily a victim of discrimination.

Yeah that's what I was saying. Asians are not represented in Hollywood because they can't act like they do in Hollywood very well, and simply out of the fact that they ARE a minority. And as for all the claims about Asians underrepresented and discriminated in medicine, and higher positions - of course they are underrepped, again they ARE a minority. And as for the discrimination, I need to see data on how many Asians actually go for those positions and do not get them based on their race, rather than just convenience of numbers.

 

[DE12MD]

the issue with the URM situation as explained to me by a doctor who has been in charge of a residency program at an extremely prestigious university is that after some students have been accepted to medical school with lower stats due to their URM status, they sometimes find themselves in over their heads in the classes. However, rather than letting the minority students fail out, the school tends to push them through the first two years, after which no one really drops out. Then when they get to their residencies they end up not being the best doctors. The example the doctor gave me was of a resident that probably shouldn't have continued in medical school who ended up killing a patient. Then when they released him from the program they weren't allowed to write anything bad on his resume and he was accepted to a different program and is now a doctor. I find that a little scary that people who may not be good physicians will be helped along through medical school and residency just because of their URM status. That said, I am sure that there are many URMs that will be excellent physicians and should definitely be in medical school. I am just saying that sometimes increasing the number of minorities in a school should be less of a priority than getting qualified students.

 

[Lemieux]

Just out of curiousity, what constitutes Asian in the US? What about Indians, Pakistanis, Bangladeshis, and Iranians, technically these ppl would constitue being Asian, but I dont know whether the stats from medical schools include these people as being Asian or something else? Actually, the middle east itself is in Asia but in the US Asian seems to only apply to those of Korean, Chinese, Japanese, Vietnamese and other Far East people.

 

[gujuDoc]

I'm an Asian Indian and I agree that not everyone is naturally gifted with a super high IQ.

HOWEVER..........

More then 40% of doctors are Asian Indians, and that is not counting how many east asians also are in medicine or science.

Most Asian Indians who are in America are very well educated or have more then enough resources to provide their kids with good educational standards that many Native Americans, Blacks and Latinos don't have the resources to afford.

There is a significantly higher degree of educated Asian Americans then the groups that are actually considered a minority.

The Minority groups are MINORITIES IN MEDICINE not necessarily minorities on the whole.

 

[gujuDoc]

Just out of curiousity, what constitutes Asian in the US? What about Indians, Pakistanis, Bangladeshis, and Iranians, technically these ppl would constitue being Asian, but I dont know whether the stats from medical schools include these people as being Asian or something else? Actually, the middle east itself is in Asia but in the US Asian seems to only apply to those of Korean, Chinese, Japanese, Vietnamese and other Far East people.

Since when have desis (Pakis, bengalis, and Indos) not been counted as Asians??? I'd like to see the proof of that one. We are very much what constitutes the other half of asians that aren't east asians.

 

[gujuDoc]

How many jokes are there about blacks being in prison, doing drive bys and fathers abandoning their children? Let's see. A LOT. Stop whining.


Oh, really? How about "IQ and the Wealth of Nations"? Look it up. There are articles in the newspaper all the time about the blacks in prison (I think 32% of black men have done time, and they discuss that in the media all the time), dropping out of school, etc. Meanwhile, I can't think of a single negative thing someone has said in the media recently about Asians. Take off the blinders. You're way too sensitive.

I fully agree with this post even though I'm asian indian.

What's the big deal if someone says we are short??? We still have a higher chance of being educated then most black people I knew in my highschool. We were a minority in my highschool, and blacks were about 50% of the class. But let's take a look at how many actually had the chance to go to a good college and to make it big. There were many who had poor education and there are many in America who still don't even know how to read when they are almost ready to enter middle school. My friend used to volunteer at a school founded by a famous indian doctor which supported those kind of children. It was sad. There are sooooooo many uneducated latinos and african americans and their situations get worse because they don't have positive influences and good living situations in many cases. In others, they are just too poor to be able to get their hands on unlimited teaching aides and proper school supplies, etc.

Asians are numerically less in number, but statistically more Asians in America have higher education then other minorities. So stop whining.

 

[gujuDoc]

Are you kidding me? Some of the best actors/actresses in the world are Asian. But, obviously their talents are best seen in films of THEIR OWN LANGUAGE AND CULTURE. I'd like to see johnny depp pull off a serious role in Asia and get the same acceptance from an Asian population.

I beg to differ. There are some actors I like in Indian movies, but many of them are very poor actors and just a good looking figure used to fit the romance movie they are trying to depict. Its only now several years later that they have started to get real acting and not just song and dance. No I'm not against Indians, but I can be rational and admit that many Indian actors don't do a good job of acting.

 

[ether^O^]

How many jokes are there about blacks being in prison, doing drive bys and fathers abandoning their children? Let's see. A LOT. Stop whining.


Oh, really? How about "IQ and the Wealth of Nations"? Look it up. There are articles in the newspaper all the time about the blacks in prison (I think 32% of black men have done time, and they discuss that in the media all the time), dropping out of school, etc. Meanwhile, I can't think of a single negative thing someone has said in the media recently about Asians. Take off the blinders. You're way too sensitive.

These jokes about blacks are made along with a slew of other jokes about Asians, hispanics, and whites. Also, they use these jokes to blame white people and how American society has screwed them, and are never done to condescend blacks straight up. Go see for yourself.

Also, IQ and the Wealth of Nations is a freakin book. There are tons of books on why blacks/whites/asians/martians are smarter/sexier/can eat more hotdogs. So what?!? I'm talking about MEDIA. Really? You can't think of it because it's not exposed in the media. It's seen as an ok thing to do. I told you what to do: Download 1) Black Korea by Ice Cube, 2) The Tsunami Song by Hot 97, and 3) Jin Tha MC's rap battle with Sterling on Live TV, 4) Watch Crash again and tell me if the asians in that movie do anything ethical at the end. THEN, talk to me about no anti-asian racism in the media.

If you said ****** in the media, the person saying it would've gotten fired and lambasted publicly. I can't even use the word in this forum! But I can say Chink, ****, Gook. Hm...

The bottom line is: Asians face as much racism as any other race in this country.

 

[gujuDoc]

These jokes about blacks are made along with a slew of other jokes about Asians, hispanics, and whites. Also, they use these jokes to blame white people and how American society has screwed them, and are never done to condescend blacks straight up. Go see for yourself.

Also, IQ and the Wealth of Nations is a freakin book. There are tons of books on why blacks/whites/asians/martians are smarter/sexier/can eat more hotdogs. So what?!? I'm talking about MEDIA. Really? You can't think of it because it's not exposed in the media. It's seen as an ok thing to do. I told you what to do: Download 1) Black Korea by Ice Cube, 2) The Tsunami Song by Hot 97, and 3) Jin Tha MC's rap battle with Sterling on Live TV, 4) Watch Crash again and tell me if the asians in that movie do anything ethical at the end. THEN, talk to me about no anti-asian racism in the media.

If you said ****** in the media, the person saying it would've gotten fired and lambasted publicly. I can't even use the word in this forum! But I can say Chink, ****, Gook. Hm...

The bottom line is: Asians face as much racism as any other race in this country.

I don't deny that we Asians face our share of racism. But then again, most every group has some sort of racism or prejudice against them. Even whites experience racism to some degree or jokes about them, such as all these blonde jokes.

However, the point of the person who initially made this thread was to argue why they should be considered a minority for med school admissions purposes and this is what I'm arguing against. i also believe Prowler may find some of the same reasoning in this as well.

 

[MonkeyNuts!]

The bottom line is: Asians face as much racism as any other race in this country.

That's your bottom line? I thought you were trying to argue that Asians are singled out of all the races... no one would ever argue that Asians don't face racism. I'd definitely wouldn't argue that they are discriminated MORE in music, tv, movies, or singled out.

 

[Newton Bohr MD]

Why is pre-allo the place to complain about discrimination Asians face??

Here is a list of the most hated groups from the beginning of time till now:

1) Blacks

What race is hated the most world wide??

1) Blacks

What race do Asians worldwide(including Indians) hate the most?? (Most of the Asians who are keeping it real know I am right)

1) Blacks

Dang, maybe I need to start 10 threads a day and complain...