The enlisted road to an MD

[Stellar]

Hello, before asking my question I would like to give a bit of a background on myself.

I am 17 years old, will be graduating high school with a very respectable GPA and SAT scores, while maintaining a heavy course load (ie AP classes).

I have been talking to a Navy recruiter concerning options of enlisting as my first step on the road to earning a medical degree. He is very adament about getting me to enlist and I am not sure if he is genuinely concerned or if I am a quota he is trying to fill, so I am attempting to ask objective sources about the plan he has offered me.

I qualified to become a Hospital Corpsman (HM) in the Navy (92 ASVAB score) and would sign a 5-year contract into this rate. He has informed me of the Seaman-to-Admiral (STA-21) program which would allow me to earn my undergrad after completing A and C-school. I was told that upon being commissioned as an officer I would be "put through medical school". I'm not sure if he is referring to applying to the HPSP scholarship, or just automatically being admitted into a civilian medical school, upon which I would finish my obligation, or choose to stay the 20 years.

My question is: Is this plan, firstly, factual, and secondly, feasible?
I have also been accepted into a well credited college (University of Texas at Dallas) for pre-med majors, and would the military road be more beneficial than the civilian one?

Preferably I am asking people with experience and first-hand knowledge, but any input will help.

The biggest arguement to me seems to be the pay vs. no-pay benefits. The Navy picks up the bill. The trade-off for that, as far as I can tell, is being placed, instead of choosing your specialty. I do have the desire to serve my country, and this is the main reason I am considering this option.

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[Homunculus]

don't do it.

recruiters are always about quotas. don't forget that.

you won't be "put through medical school" any more than anyone else is-- you'll have to complete prereq's, take the MCAT, get accepted like everyone else, then hope they allow you to go. i doubt this recruiter knows anything about getting into medical school, and that alone should be a red flag to you.

a 5 year committment is a long time, and who knows what could happen. take the college route, *then* after getting accepted to medical school decide if the military is for you.

--your friendly neighborhood quota filling HPSP caveman

 

[dry dre]

The best road to becoming a physician is to go straight to college now, even if starting at a community college. Work as much as you can while in college while not affecting your grades, and take student loans to make ends meet (and for God's sake live a college student lifestyle, don't go buying cars etc).

Once you are in the service, the "enlisted to officer" programs are competative, not everyone who is qualified gets to take part. To sell this program as "something you'll be able to do" is a bit dishonest (or whatever term you'd like to use). Even if you got into this program, did well enough in school to impress med schools, there is no gaurantee that the navy will LET you go to med school. The fact of the matter is that the statistics are probably strongly against you in realizing your enlisted-->officer-->med school-->doctor plan.

I strongly admire your initiative and dedication, and I also think you're better off staying a civilian and going to college for now. You can ALWAYS sign up next year, or the year after.

Take the serious note of the following: The more you talk to the recruiter, the more opportunity he'll have to use his mojo on you, and the more you will feel obligated to enlist. HIS career is partially tied on his ability to get YOU to enlist...never forget that when thinking about how genuine he is being.

 

[dry dre]

The biggest arguement to me seems to be the pay vs. no-pay benefits. The Navy picks up the bill.

On this note, the 'high average' student loan debt at my med school is about $190,000...that's including undergrad and med school loans all totalled. The monthly payment on this type of debt equals a bit less than $1,000 a month.

The lowest average pay for low-paying physician specialties right now is ~$130,000. Many physicians start at over $200,000 a year, some over $400,000.

So, if you rack up a lot of student loans, you'll be paying ~$12,000 in loan payments. For most all docs, this is never a problem. Bottom line, don't worry that you need to go into the military to pay for med school.

 

[MoosePilot]

He's trying to recruit you to meet his numbers. Once you're in, he's done with ya.

With the ops tempo the way it is, you might find it difficult to do your undergrad while you're serving. People do, but trying to do school work while you're in Baghdad isn't easy. Finding time to take your pre-reqs, volunteer, shadow, and all the things your contemporaries will be doing will kick your butt.

Go through college, get accepted into med school. You can apply to USUHS or for HPSP if you want. You don't even need to do ROTC.

 

[docbrown76]

Stellar:
N.A.V.Y. (Never Again Volunteer Yourself)!! In all seriousness, you do have to watch-out for recruiters. They will tell you whatever you want to hear and them some. Do your homework before you make any decisions!!

Perhaps I could offer a few pointers regarding your journey to medical school via the Navy. I have traveled that road you speak of, and finally I am about to start medical school this summer. As a former corpsman, I can honestly say that you will receive excellent (medic) training and will surely have the opportunity to serve. You will work side-by-side with many physicians over a 5 year period as well as gain invaluable patient care experience. This may help solidfy your decision to pursue medicine as a career. Additionally, you will recieve active duty pay and the GI Bill for college (best used after your service obligation).

But, consider your decision wisely. The road to medical school will take much longer than if you attended college immediately following HS. Also, the seamen-to-admiral program is highly competitive. Taking classes while in the Navy is possible, but it can be problematic (depending on your duty station and job duties).

If you go the Navy (enlisted) route, I suggest becoming a corpsman, save money, take some classes, get out after your obligation, and use your GI Bill to attend college full-time.

Anyway, if you have any specific questions feel free to PM me.

Joe

UNSOM 2009

 

[bruinwang08]

Stellar:

You could also consider asking the recruiter about the new "National Call to Service Program." Details about it are in this website:

http://www.news.navy.mil/search/display.asp?story_id=10055

I'm actually a college freshman right now and considered taking two years off to enlist in this program (answering the "call," right?). Haven't actually talked to a recruiter about it though. Gonna see how things work out here and consider my circumstances carefully before I get myself into an unnecessary spat with a recruiter. 😀

bruinwang08

PS the above posts contain invaluable advice. I was accepted to West Point my senior year of HS but ultimately chose UCLA and stayed civilian to pursue my medical career in large part to communicating with such experienced people. 👍 As you can probably gather, though, it hasn't dampened my desire to serve the country (being around a bunch of ungrateful, lazy boneheads all day might've actually strengthened that desire, but that's a different issue ). The program's just one to consider if you're still thinking about enlisting.

 

[Croooz]

Now, now....let's see where to start.

Yes, you can become a physician after having been enlisted the question you need to ask yourself is how soon and in control of that process do you want to be. If you just have to serve then look into billets which do not deploy. As a HM the main one that comes to mind is the cardiovascular techs. If you can get a GUARANTEED "C" school out of "A" school and you can get into CVT school then the chances are good after all your training is done you'll be able to do your prereqs and finish your degree.

Quite honestly if there is no real reason to join then I would stay out and go the civilian route. As a HM, I believe, they are sending all of them to 8404, Field Med school, which is basically how to be a HM with the USMC. After you get this NEC you are branded for LIFE. Even as an officer this 8404 will follow and haunt you.

The decision is yours but if I were in your shoes, which I was, scores and classes and all....I would stay out. Go civilian and get financial aid. It just isn't worth it IF your goal is to be a physician. While I have some great experiences which I would never regret in the end it just isn't worth it.

BTW, once you sign you mean absolutely nothing to the recruiter. My recruiter would pick me up from school, drive me around, buy me lunch, sit and talk about the Navy & life, drive me home...my own chauffeur...TILL I SIGNED. After this, I came up to him with "Hey what's up Tony..." "My name is ET1 Gomez, learn it!" Basically he cast me off once the papers were signed and I didn't see him till he came to pick me up to go to boot. I did the delayed entry so I was signed up a year before I graduated high school but never bothered going to the DEP classes.

Do yourself a favor and don't be so quick to give away years of your life. You'll never get them back and there's too much going on in the world to take the chance if you don't have to.

Not sure which is worse, joining straight out of high school or after med school. Right now it's your choice later on will be a loan decision. Look into other "military" alternatives. In the end I would just stay out and go to school and then med school. If you still want to fulfill your military itch then wait till residency.

This is of course if you do not want to do any high speed stuff. If that is your bag then enlist. Go SEALs, PJ, CCT, Force Recon, Special Forces.....but besides those I just can't see signing up.

 

[cavaor]

I have to agree with alot of the posts..Don't do it. I have seen far too many good friends who were pretty good students thinking along the same route you were...and in the end...not pursuing what they really wanted because of "work" getting in the way. The best route is from college IMHO. If you really want to serve, you can always look into HPSP for Medical school. Don't let the money be the deciding factor...especially this early on.

 

[blueSkies]

Hello Stellar,
you're wise to ask these questions--good job! I concur with the general theme above: the enlist-then-get-commissioned-then-go-to-med-school route your recruiter proposed, while technically possible, is probably a sub-optimal path given your grades, etc. Additionally, may I propose the following:

1. Go to college on ROTC scholarship. All four services offer several types of scholarships in exchange for a service commitment. Once in ROTC, there is a "Pre-Health Scholarship" (USAF terminology?) that bumps your undergrad scholarship up to 100% tuition (if it's not already) and additionally secures an HPSP med school scholarship for you upon graduation. This is the route I took and would be happy to discuss it with you. Ultimately, I backed out of the Pre-Health program senior year of college in favor of 4 active duty years. Those 4 years made a strong med school application package and I'm now finishing up 2nd year med school.

2. There are many routes to M.D. Your recruiter proposed:
- High School -> Enlist -> Active Duty -> College -> Med School
The traditional route is:
- HS -> College -> Med School
Others include mine. . .
- HS -> College (ROTC) -> Active Duty -> Med School
. . .and one very popular at Harvard Med, Yale Med. . .
- HS -> College -> "Something unique for a few years" -> Med School
. . .or. . .
- HS -> Do something unique for a few years -> College -> Med School
Bottom line: there is no one path, some are more difficult/less traditional, but YOU can make any of them work.

3. If you have the choice between officer and enlisted, and you aspire to big things, go officer. I do not mean this as an insult to our great enlisted corps; there are certainly great officers/civilians who served first as enlisted (ref: Gen Tom Franks, et many al.). However, the positions you are placed in, and challenges you face from day 1 as an officer, are much more geared toward leadership and management then are junior enlisted positions. That said, I do have a brilliant cousin who enlisted in the USMC "for the experience" prior to attending a top law school.

4. There is no rush to get to college, med school, etc. In fact, it will likely make your applications much stronger if you add a few years of interesting endeavours. The top med schools accept fewer and fewer students directly from undergrad. Ref: Harvard only takes 33% directly from undergrad, Yale the same. This follows a trend started by the top law and business schools, who started doing this years ago.

5. Another option: Start college at UT-Dallas, then enlist in the Reserves once in college. However (ALERT! ALERT!) this WILL put you at risk for deployment, which WILL pull you out of college, no questions asked.

6. Another option: State college paid for by National Guard. I don't know the details of this, but up here in Massachusetts, the National Guard (Army and USAF, I believe) pay 100% of tuition at any state (UMass) college if you commit to one-weekend-per-month-two-weeks-per-year with them for a certain number of years. Again, I don't know the details. . ..

Alright, that's probably enough from me. Good luck with your decisions; feel free to email or PM me. Best,

-BlueSkies

 

[RichL025]

Stellar,

Blue Skies posted a nice breakdown to show that there are many, many different paths to get to medical school. Crooz has chipped in with his usual strongly negative advice (least that be taken as criticism, let me say I understand where he's coming from).

The one thing I would add to this dicsussion is regarding your statement:

I do have the desire to serve my country, and this is the main reason I am considering this option.

You will have to balance your desire to serve with your desire to attend medical school right away, versus delayed.

Worst case scenario - you enlist for 5 years, and are unable to get any of those attractive sounding programs the used car salesman, *oops*, I mean recruiter, dangled in front of you.

Ask yourself - if this happens, would you view those 5 years as being wasted? Or would you say to yourself that you got to do and learn some great things while serving your country (at war), and now you get to start college & medical school with a bit of an advantage over your peers.

In my opinion, your answer to the above question will determine whether or not enlisting is the right route for you.

Some background on me: I choose this option as blueskies described:
HS -> Do something unique for a few years -> College -> Med School

In my case the "something unique" was 12.5 years as an enlisted / NCO in the US Army. I didn't figure out that I wanted to (eventually) go to medical school until after about 5 years (and a bit more on the maturity index) in - the next 7.5 were spent havingfun in some incredible jobs, saving money, and eventually working my way over to the National Guard so I could start undergrad. Now I'm a 3rd year at USUHS.

Looking back, I would not have changed a thing.

But that's me. Answer the question I posed to you above (answer it yourself, I mean, no need to tell us 😉 ) honestly, that will help you decide whether enlisting in the Navy is right for you.

 

[notdeadyet]

One other thing to keep in mind that sometimes seems glossed over is the fact that there are MANY, many ways to serve your country, the military being one. I realize that with many young men, it's the military that interests them, and that's totally understandable. I was the same way.

But if your interest is truly service to your country, if you find that you're hesitant to join the military for some reason, know that there are many other organizations in which you can serve your country and make it a better place without enlisting.

 

[Croooz]

Crooz has chipped in with his usual strongly negative advice (least that be taken as criticism, let me say I understand where he's coming from).

Lest we forget I will be applying for USUHS or HPSP so I can't hate the military that much. I just choose to give the down & dirty side. We're all smaht people and can read thru the good & bad I'm just not going to line up my stories with those lies the recruiters are spewing.

 

[BOHICA-FIGMO]

He's trying to recruit you to meet his numbers. Once you're in, he's done with ya.

With the ops tempo the way it is, you might find it difficult to do your undergrad while you're serving. People do, but trying to do school work while you're in Baghdad isn't easy. Finding time to take your pre-reqs, volunteer, shadow, and all the things your contemporaries will be doing will kick your butt.

Go through college, get accepted into med school. You can apply to USUHS or for HPSP if you want. You don't even need to do ROTC.

I second that. The only reason to enlist would be to enlist for 4 years, get out, use GI bill to pay for college, use HPSP/USUHS to pay for medschool. Otherwise, enlisting will not help you become a military physician.

 

[dry dre]

I second that. The only reason to enlist would be to enlist for 4 years, get out, use GI bill to pay for college, use HPSP/USUHS to pay for medschool. Otherwise, enlisting will not help you become a military physician.

I don't know what the GI bill is worth nowdays, but when I got out, the total amount (that you get over 36 months, or four 9 month school years) was about the same as ONE year of total attendance costs. In other words, the GI bill alone paid for 25% of my in-state tuition costs over 4 years.

 

[spc213]

Stellar,

blueSkies and drydre give some great advice and do a good job of outlining your options. Additionally, you can also consider tuition assistance, which, in some cases, you can receive in addition to GI Bill benefits if you are a member of some Reserve programs.

Forgive me, but your story made me chuckle, because of a very similar story I heard recently. A guy who works in my building, a little older than you, decided one day that he wanted to be a pilot. Since his girlfriend recently joined the Navy, he went to go see a Navy recruiter. After telling the recruiter his story and taking the ASVAB, the recruiter assured him that since he qualified to be an aviation technician that he could then transfer to flight school in four years (conveniently) at the end of his enlistment -- as if it was a done deal. Of course he signed, and as far as he knew he was a shoe-in for flight school. Unlike you, he has no plans for college, and that part of the discussion never came up with his recruiter. As a pilot (Army), I know what's involved with flight school, and when I asked him if he planned to get a degree (required for commissioning), or if he got his flight school course guarantee in writing (of course he didn't), he just looked at me blankly. Ultimately, my understanding is that he was able to void his delayed-entry contract, but not everyone is that fortunate.

You are smart to be asking these questions now. Good luck.

 

[flynavy]

I am 17 years old, will be graduating high school with a very respectable GPA and SAT scores, while maintaining a heavy course load (ie AP classes).

Then go to a very respectable college, maintain a heavy course load, and score well on the MCAT.

I have been talking to a Navy recruiter concerning options of enlisting as my first step on the road to earning a medical degree. He is very adament about getting me to enlist and I am not sure if he is genuinely concerned or if I am a quota he is trying to fill, so I am attempting to ask objective sources about the plan he has offered me.

Enlisting in the Navy, no matter what your rate, will only prolong and complicate your road toward medicine. Trust me, go to college, do well, and then apply to med school. HPSP isn't going anywhere...the Navy will need MDs when you graduate college.

I qualified to become a Hospital Corpsman (HM) in the Navy (92 ASVAB score) and would sign a 5-year contract into this rate. He has informed me of the Seaman-to-Admiral (STA-21) program which would allow me to earn my undergrad after completing A and C-school. I was told that upon being commissioned as an officer I would be "put through medical school". I'm not sure if he is referring to applying to the HPSP scholarship, or just automatically being admitted into a civilian medical school, upon which I would finish my obligation, or choose to stay the 20 years.

LOL...don't count on it. You'll have a hard enough time getting into medical school without the military (remembering that 2/3 of allopathic applicants never get accepted). From a military prespective, you'll have to first get into STA-21 (unless you leave the military to go to medical school, then get commissioned when you get accepted), then get a line commission, then get approved to leave the line and change to staff corps (medical corps)...not to mention getting superior college grades, taking the MCAT, and getting accepted to med school. It's clearly harder.

 

[DrBloodmoney]

Introduce your foot to your ass early...

you'll be doing a lot of kicking yourself for going enlisted. In fact, I can think of only a few things worse for your goal of an MD (blinding yourself with a hot poker being one of them).

 

[RichL025]

Introduce your foot to your ass early...

you'll be doing a lot of kicking yourself for going enlisted. In fact, I can think of only a few things worse for your goal of an MD (blinding yourself with a hot poker being one of them).

Oh, yeah?

Have you ever been enlisted?

 

[bobbyseal]

As an HPSP student I know of a couple people who were in my OIS company that had enlisted prior.

Both of them are great people and they will eventually become great physicians. The main downfalls of their situation that I see and I imagine they will agree are the following:

1) Advanced age. Both of these people were in their late 20's-early 30's by the time they were able to even apply to medical school. They had to finish their time commitments and get their college education. So add 4 years of med school and then at least 3 years of residency = old.

2) Inability to attend a "strong" college that would help them get into medical school while in the service. Both folks that I know ended up getting degrees with colleges associated with the military. IMHO, this will not help your chances of getting into med school. Frankly, you're better off going to the University of (insert your home state here) than one of the military associated colleges. However, you could always finish your time in the military and then do 4 years at a strong college. My only point is that not many people get a degree from harvard while they're on active duty as a medic with the army.

3) Decreased chance of getting into an allopathic medical school. Now, I know I'm going to get flamed here, but in my small sample of people I know prior enlisted, they're all at osteopathic schools. Looking back on what I wanted going into medical school, osteopathy was not it.

So, I guess you need to be alright with starting med school later in life and not getting a degree from a strong college while in the military. Finally, say what you will about your chances of getting into an allopathic school. This statement was just based on a small sample size.

 

[RichL025]

Bobbyseal,

1) Advanced age. Both of these people were in their late 20's-early 30's by the time they were able to even apply to medical school. They had to finish their time commitments and get their college education. So add 4 years of med school and then at least 3 years of residency = old.

Wow, I wonder if their OA slowed them down significantly on surgery rounds. Did they get their scripts for Aricept filled from the student health center? 😉

I would hardly call late 20s - early 30s "advanced age". If I was going to do it all over again, I might choose that as the perfect age to go, actually. I feel sorry for those who attend medical school at 22. They seldom have a clue about what they're getting into, and often don't have the life experience to put it into perspective.

Yeah, working 80 hours a week can suck. But then again, when you've been exposed to people who have to do that just to make ends meet , it makes it seem a little less intimidating....

Inability to attend a "strong" college that would help them get into medical school while in the service. Both folks that I know ended up getting degrees with colleges associated with the military. IMHO, this will not help your chances of getting into med school. Frankly, you're better off going to the University of (insert your home state here) than one of the military associated colleges. However, you could always finish your time in the military and then do 4 years at a strong college. My only point is that not many people get a degree from harvard while they're on active duty as a medic with the army.

True, but how many people can attend Harvard while they are working a full-time job doing something else non-military?

FWIW, I started my degree with BS "video classes" and such while still on active duty, and then finished it while in the NG after I got off active duty. My degree from University of Florida does not say "took the easy way out" <g>.

Several classmates of mine currently have degrees from Campbell, which is one of those that I think only exists on military bases. Also, University of Maryland (a *ahem* real brick-and-mortar college) also does alot of classes on military bases.

I agree, however, that it is not realistic to expect to get a 4 year degree suitable for pre-med while on active duty. But then again, a civilian friend of mine is working full time in EMS in Florida. He's been trying to finish a pre-med degree for 6+ years now.

3) Decreased chance of getting into an allopathic medical school. Now, I know I'm going to get flamed here, but in my small sample of people I know prior enlisted, they're all at osteopathic schools.

Well, my sample is certianly "skewed" because I'm at USUHS, with a pretty good selection of former enlisted. One guy was recently accepted who has >18 years enlisted - he was a flippin E-8!!!!!

A better sample, perhaps, would be my (Army) OBC class (HPSP + USUHS). While the memories are getting a bit fuzzy, it seemed that among all the prior enlisted in my OBC class (maybe 20% of the class), they were about 50/50 split between osteopathic & allopathic schools. Statistics is the one med school class I truly sucked at, but confounding factors in that would be the increased representation of osteos in the military to begin with, or it could indeed be that more of those former enlisted had "trouble" getting into allopathic schools (excepting USUHS) - you could crunch the numbers either way, I assume.

In short, I have to respectfully disagree that being former enlisted is any kind of handicap. In the specific example of USUHS, it's an actual advantage (although they'll deny it <g>)

 

[Croooz]

Rich,
I'm sooooo glad you beat with a response. Late 20's old....oh my...social security is right around the corner for me. Can you attend OIS in a walker?

 

[DCM]

I will be starting medical school at 28, so I understand the pros and cons of having another experience before school. Given what the OP has provided, I would very strongly recommend doing ROTC or similar and an officer program if you need a way to pay for school. If you can get a decent fin aid package, I recommend going on your own and having every door open to you; go straight to med school, or be an officer or join the peace corps and really strengthen your application. As mentioned earlier this is a common path to the top grad schools and a great life experience.

This is not in any way to minimize the enlisted experience. Many of the best officers I know are priors and the corpsman in particular are impressive.

 

[bobbyseal]

Wow, I wonder if their OA slowed them down significantly on surgery rounds. Did they get their scripts for Aricept filled from the student health center? 😉

I would hardly call late 20s - early 30s "advanced age". If I was going to do it all over again, I might choose that as the perfect age to go, actually. I feel sorry for those who attend medical school at 22. They seldom have a clue about what they're getting into, and often don't have the life experience to put it into perspective.

Yeah, working 80 hours a week can suck. But then again, when you've been exposed to people who have to do that just to make ends meet , it makes it seem a little less intimidating....

First, I agree that taking a year or two off may be a good thing. However, if you sign up with a 5 year commitment and then need another 4 years to get your college degree, you're already 27 starting med school. You're looking at age 34-37 to be done with your training. That is a sizeable amount in lost earning potential.

FWIW, I started my degree with BS "video classes" and such while still on active duty, and then finished it while in the NG after I got off active duty. My degree from University of Florida does not say "took the easy way out" <g>.

Tuition is $3k a year at Florida for in state students. If you need the military to help you cover that, then I got to admit you're in dire straits. Frankly, if the OP's goal is to become an MD, he can just as easily go to his state school and not spend that much money doing so. I think recruiters prey upon the whole college expense while in state tuition at many universities is affordable.

Statistics is the one med school class I truly sucked at, but confounding factors in that would be the increased representation of osteos in the military to begin with, or it could indeed be that more of those former enlisted had "trouble" getting into allopathic schools (excepting USUHS) - you could crunch the numbers either way, I assume.

I think someone posted awhile back about the increasing numbers of osteopathic students and the decreasing numbers of allopathic students in the military. Take it for what you will. But, by and large allopathic schools have higher average MCAT scores than osteopathic schools. Also, USUHS is a school which would certainly attract prior enlisted who enjoy being in the military. But, it's hard to recommend enlisting in the military if your hope is to become a doctor. One would be taking two big leaps of faith: 1) that you will like the military 2) that you will still want to become a doctor while taking organic chemistry.

In short, I have to respectfully disagree that being former enlisted is any kind of handicap. In the specific example of USUHS, it's an actual advantage (although they'll deny it <g>)

I definitely agree about USUHS and being prior enlisted. But honestly, you limit your future medical education by attending USUHS. This is because you have to do a residency within the military GME programs. This is why I'm so glad that I'm HPSP and was able to defer. I got the option of applying to any program in the country for residency. If you go to USUHS, you have the option of a handful of military residency locations and programs.

 

[RichL025]

bobbyseal,

First, I agree that taking a year or two off may be a good thing. However, if you sign up with a 5 year commitment and then need another 4 years to get your college degree, you're already 27 starting med school. You're looking at age 34-37 to be done with your training. That is a sizeable amount in lost earning potential.

I would respectfully submit that if someone out there is really calculating their "lost earning potential", then the military is NOT the right path for them, period.

Plus, when both you and I are sitting on our rocking chairs at the old Doctor's home, do you really think we're gonna compare our lifetime accumulated salaries?

 

[bobbyseal]

bobbyseal,


I would respectfully submit that if someone out there is really calculating their "lost earning potential", then the military is NOT the right path for them, period.

Plus, when both you and I are sitting on our rocking chairs at the old Doctor's home, do you really think we're gonna compare our lifetime accumulated salaries?

I see what you're saying here. But, I think it's important to get paid one's market value. I think many doctors in the military are paid far below what they are worth on the outside. Frankly, that frustrates me.

I know we've kind of veered on what the original poster had in mind and he no longer seems to be posting. Anyway, just be careful when you sign on the dotted line. You can always pay back a loan. You can never get back years on your life if you're unhappy in the military.

 

[Stellar]

First of all thanks guys for the badass responses, and invaluable advice. I havn't been posting but just trying to take in all the things you guys have been saying and eagerly reading all the posts.

I've pretty much made my decision to go to UT Dallas and get a strong undergrad there first. If the obligation to be a corpsman were even a year shorter I would not hesitate to go in and subsequently use the GI bill to finish off my schooling but this is just not seeming like something I want to do right now.

Maybe I will use the HPSP scholarship when the time comes but I'm feeling like I'm going to be taking the "traditional" path. I'm sure this forum will be a great tool for me along the way and I just want to say thanks to everyone who replied.

 

[Dr Sum Day]

Military is cool

 

[bobbyseal]

First of all thanks guys for the badass responses, and invaluable advice. I havn't been posting but just trying to take in all the things you guys have been saying and eagerly reading all the posts.

I've pretty much made my decision to go to UT Dallas and get a strong undergrad there first. If the obligation to be a corpsman were even a year shorter I would not hesitate to go in and subsequently use the GI bill to finish off my schooling but this is just not seeming like something I want to do right now.

Maybe I will use the HPSP scholarship when the time comes but I'm feeling like I'm going to be taking the "traditional" path. I'm sure this forum will be a great tool for me along the way and I just want to say thanks to everyone who replied.

Woo hoo! I beat RichL025! 😉

 

[phil413ru]

Before I just add another recommendation, I faced a slightly similiar situation but with Army National Guard instead of Active Navy....

I caution you to be pressured by anything that a recruiter says. When I first enlisted in the Army, I knew I wanted to be a doctor. I enlisted in national Guard--to help pay for undergrad. I joined as a 91B Medic (now 91W) which is like a civilian paramedic. I thought this would give me exposure. It did. However, I soon switched to ROTC scholarship. I WOULD NOT go active duty. Like other have said, it is hard to go back--it is hard to get selected. If YOU really want to be a corpsmen, and you are willing to deploy and serve your country--then do so, but realize this may be at the expense of being a doctor. If you go active duty, you must consider this.

I went Guard--which is like reserve. I switched because as you realize, Guard member are activated just as much as Active duty lately. It is hard to be concentrating hard on school and get the phone call that you have 48 hours before you are on deployment status. This has happened to my comarades. So I went ROTC. Yet this also has risk. I knew full well by doing so, I may not be a doctor-even if I got into Medical school, by my being ROTC, the Army had every right to say they wanted me elsewhere (unlikely, but possible). I had to realize that by doing ROTC, I would be willing to potentially forfeit or put on hold my dreams of being a military doctor. Fortunately, I made it into the USUHS medical school and the Army let train to be a doctor. It all worked out as I hoped.

Ultimately, you have to recognize that if you go the path your recruiter recommends, there could be a good or bad outcome. Just some food for thought--I don't want to tell you what to do because ultimately you will have to live with the consequences good or bad. I wish you the best of luck on your decision!

 

[USAFdoc]

Hello, before asking my question I would like to give a bit of a background on myself.

I am 17 years old, will be graduating high school with a very respectable GPA and SAT scores, while maintaining a heavy course load (ie AP classes).

I have been talking to a Navy recruiter concerning options of enlisting as my first step on the road to earning a medical degree. He is very adament about getting me to enlist and I am not sure if he is genuinely concerned or if I am a quota he is trying to fill, so I am attempting to ask objective sources about the plan he has offered me.

I qualified to become a Hospital Corpsman (HM) in the Navy (92 ASVAB score) and would sign a 5-year contract into this rate. He has informed me of the Seaman-to-Admiral (STA-21) program which would allow me to earn my undergrad after completing A and C-school. I was told that upon being commissioned as an officer I would be "put through medical school". I'm not sure if he is referring to applying to the HPSP scholarship, or just automatically being admitted into a civilian medical school, upon which I would finish my obligation, or choose to stay the 20 years.

My question is: Is this plan, firstly, factual, and secondly, feasible?
I have also been accepted into a well credited college (University of Texas at Dallas) for pre-med majors, and would the military road be more beneficial than the civilian one?

Preferably I am asking people with experience and first-hand knowledge, but any input will help.

The biggest arguement to me seems to be the pay vs. no-pay benefits. The Navy picks up the bill. The trade-off for that, as far as I can tell, is being placed, instead of choosing your specialty. I do have the desire to serve my country, and this is the main reason I am considering this option.

Go to college; kick butt with your grades, enjoy college, if you want to be a doc, and you are willing to work hard,you will get it. Do not, do NOT, beleive any promises the military makes you. If you are in already,consider it a great service to your country, if you are thinking about joining, now is NOT the time.

 

[beefballs]

My two cents,
I assume you are fairly mature for a 17 year old to actually research an idea before jumping into it. (I was not that bright) You say you have respectable grades and standardized test scores, so why enlist? There are ways to pay for school. RECRUITERS LIE they will tell you whatever you want to hear, you get nothing if it isn't in writing and even then you are subject to the needs of the corps. If you are an indivdual who feels the call of the service, that is cool but you can serve as a doctor, which seems to be your end goal anyhow. Sit down and do some planning, goals for 1 and 5 years down the road, if being an non commisioned officer is one of them then enlist, if serving in the military is one of them you can be a doc in the military. Even if you change your mind about medicine (not trying to dissuade you) if you go to college you will be armed with a degree and the opportunity of service as an officer is still there.
I was a huge F%$k-up when I was your age, I needed the military because I didn't have too many other options you do not seem to be in this boat so explore your options carefully and DO NOT TAKE WHAT THE RECRUITER SAYS AT FACE VALUE

 

[IN2bait]

Before I just add another recommendation, I faced a slightly similiar situation but with Army National Guard instead of Active Navy....

I caution you to be pressured by anything that a recruiter says. When I first enlisted in the Army, I knew I wanted to be a doctor. I enlisted in national Guard--to help pay for undergrad. I joined as a 91B Medic (now 91W) which is like a civilian paramedic.

Exactly, he went from taxis driver (91B Medic) to glorified taxis driver (91W Medic). Give me a break...the so-called medicine in these settings is common sense to anyone with even the lowest level of intelligence, even those enlisting in the military.

Paramedics have no idea what it is like to practice medicine...pay them no mind.

 

[RichL025]

Exactly, he went from taxis driver (91B Medic) to glorified taxis driver (91W Medic). Give me a break...the so-called medicine in these settings is common sense to anyone with even the lowest level of intelligence, even those enlisting in the military.

Paramedics have no idea what it is like to practice medicine...pay them no mind.

Would this count as feeding the trolls?

 

[DeepSeaCorpsman]

Okay, I am probably closer to your situation than anyone else applying to medical school today. I joined the Navy at age 17 back in June of 1996 as a Hospital Corpsman (E-1). I then attended Field Medical Service School and was assigned to a hospital in Portsmouth, VA. After two years at that command I left for dive school at NDSTC in Panama City, FL where I became a Deep-Sea Diving Medical Technician. From there I was assigned to 5th Force Recon Company and later 3rd Reconnaissance Battalion in Okinawa, Japan. While stationed with 3rd Recon BN I was selected for the STA-21 program and attended Jacksonville University. I applied to NSTC for the medical program and was selected as one of the 25 OC's/Midshipmen who were given permission to apply to medical school. I will now be attending medical school at the USUHS this fall.


The bad news for you is that STA-21 students are no longer allowed to apply to medical school. This was announced by CDR Pistey who releases the official messages for the program this past February. Basically your recruiter is leading you down a pipe dream that has no opening.

If I had it to do all over again I would have probably gone to college right out of high school. Did I mention that I had to graduate from JU in 2 years and eight months? Not to mention that I had to take the MCAT after only 1 year and eight months of college? Those are not ideal conditions at all for one who is a student doctor hopeful.

Your best bet is not to enlist. There are many, many ways to get you college education paid for and still attend medical school.