Third Time's a Charm - Seeking Feedback & Advice

[Jonny_Tsunami49]

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Hello SDN,

I am seeking out feedback and advice as to how I can make myself a better applicant this upcoming admissions cycle. This will be my third time applying and so I would like to rectify the issues I have encountered the previous two cycles. My question to you all is what areas can I improve upon? What is the best way to address the grade exclusion issue? Any advice as to seeking research opportunities? Would taking a couple of science courses in a post baccalaureate program be worthwhile?

Academics
- B.S. in Biological Sciences
- University is a #2 on the Barron’s Ranking
- University does not offer a committee review

ADEA AADSAS GPA:
Cumulative: 3.37
Science: 3.06
Non-Science: 3.87

Undergraduate GPA:
Cumulative: 3.45
Science: 3.30

*Major GPA discrepancy is in part due to a grade exclusion of an F in a chemistry course. This policy was put into action following a poor grade on the first exam that was given after the University’s withdrawal date. Upon speaking with my advisor, I essentially placed my efforts in my other courses and was set on simply having the class excluded since I could not withdraw. I have mentioned this in my application for the in-state programs that have requested a supplemental application.

Work Experience:
- Orthodontic Clinician / Assistant [600 hours]
- Water Chemist / Analyst [175 hours]

Dentistry Experience: 520 hours
- Orthodontics – Unpaid Intern [450 hours]

*This experience is separate from the one mentioned above in 'Work Experience'.
*Some of you may question the imbalance of shadowing hours. I want to emphasize that this is not favoritism but more so that I had more opportunities in this specialty to obtain clinical experience.​

- General Dentistry – Observer [70 hours]

Extracurricular / Volunteer / Community Service: 450 hours

• Free Dental Clinic: 30 hours
• Boys and Girls Club Tutor: 155 hours
• Senior Class Council: 235 hours
• 4th year dental student observing: 30 hours

2015- 2016 Admissions Cycle

Admissions Timing
- Application sent and complete in mid-July.
- Beginning my senior year at university.
- Programs were awaiting Fall and Spring semester grades as well as B.S. degree

DAT Attempt 1 [Late June]
PAT: 19
QR: 19
RC: 19
BIO: 17
GC: 16
OC: 17
TS: 17
AA: 18

Dental School Designations): (5)

UNC, ECU, VCU, PITT, BUF

I did not receive any interviews and was denied from all five programs. Programs notified me that the most appropriate course of action was to improve my DAT scores prior to applying again.


2016 – 2017 Admissions Cycle

Changes from last application:
- B.S. degree in Biological Science.
- Dean’s List for Spring 2016.
- Minor increase in Cumulative & Science GPA.
- Major increase in DAT scores.
- Increase in shadowing [General and Ortho] and extracurricular activities [Tutoring & Free Clinic Volunteering].
- Employment as an Orthodontic assistant.


Admissions Timing:
- Application sent in early June.
- Application was not considered complete until August due to:
(1) new DAT scores.
(2) late submission of a LoR.

DAT Attempt 2 [Early August]

PAT: 20 (+1)
QR: 22 (+3)
RC: 20 (+1)
BIO: 23 (+6)
GC: 19 (+3)
OC: 21 (+4)
TS: 21 (+4)
AA: 21 (+3)

Dental School Designations): 10 programs

UNC, ECU, WVA (applied very late), VCU, UL, NSU, PITT, UNE, BUF, MWU-IL

I did not receive any interviews and was denied from all ten programs. I have contacted said programs regarding feedback and will have to wait as late as May to hear back. However, one program has advised enrolling in a post baccalaureate program and performing well on higher level science courses.

Current plan for 2017 - 2018 Admissions Cycle

- Take higher level science courses [Histology, Cell Biology, etc.] during the summer, fall, and spring.
- Work part-time at current orthodontic office.
- Shadow at another general dentist office and perhaps another specialty.
- Attend more free dental clinics.
- Have all materials (LoR, DAT scores, transcripts, etc) ready prior to June 1st.


Any advice or feedback is welcome. Thank you as always.

 

[DOC YANKEM]

Great stats, but didn't you ask yourself what went wrong during the 2nd attempt? You should have received at least 1 interview! I would look at the "fluff", such as personal statement and letters of recommendation. There has to be a red flag somewhere. Applying late in August put you at a disadvantage, you should submit your application earlier than August for first batch.

 

[eldmd_32]

I think your science gpa's a little on the lower side. The plan you've devised for the upcoming cycle is pretty solid though. Bump up your shadowing hours to 100. Depending on what you accomplish by the time you apply, you'll be able to apply more broadly. Consider also applying to schools with more seats and more oos-friendly schools

 

[DOC YANKEM]

Further elaborating on the gpa discussion... if your gpa is on the very low end near a 3.0 then you should have a good reason. Whether you had a traumatic event in your personal life or you "bit off more than you could chew", you should mention that in your application. Having a low gpa without taking higher science level courses is a red flag in my book. Best of luck.

 

[C_BryantDDS]

I think it's your GPA that's hurting you the most as well as your application not being processed until August - I submitted on AADSAS June 10 and interviewed on August 5th and was in the 3rd interview group so you could potentially be missing interview opportunities by submitting later.
Your DAT looks good after your 2nd attempt so I wouldn't necessarily take it again. I think a post bacc with some advanced science classes could definitely help you. I would also try to get up to at least 100 hours shadowing a general dentist. Additionally I would look at your school list and apply more broadly to schools that have lower GPA averages. A friend of mine was in a similar situation and after a couple of application attempts decided to apply to schools that matched her stats regardless of location and ended up being accepted to ASDOH - she was also a NC resident (I'm assuming you are based on your applying to UNC and ECU).

 

[DMDDDSHopeful]

Your case demonstrates how DAT scores aren't everything. Everything you stated is solid and strong. Take a few postbacc courses or enroll in a Masters program. Your GPA isn't all that bad, but you are competing against other reapplicants who now have near 4.0 Postbacc and/or Masters after reapplying. In comparison, they are picking them over you.

Do not retake the DAT. Obtain a few new letters or at least swap one. Get some "new" experiences. Revamp your personal statement. You need enough changes in your app, otherwise, they won't invite you again. They'll just say, "Oh, I saw this app last year. What did we do last year? Oh, we didn't invite. Well, looks like no major changes."

You'll get the same decision. You don't want that. So that would be my advice. Again, these are just opinions based on experience and doesn't guarantee anything. Best of luck! PM me if you'd like further help.

Edit: Save your money and apply between 15-25 schools. Do not limit your options.

 

[C_BryantDDS]

I was thinking a bit more about your situation and, while I do see where you're coming from, I'm not entirely sure that I would include the disclosure about the class that you failed. I could see it potentially being perceived as you giving up and accepting failure after you didn't do as well as you had hoped on the first exam. I'm assuming you retook the class and did better but the whole "focusing on your other classes and planning on excluding the course (i.e. focusing on your other courses and accepting an "F" with the purpose of retaking and excluding the initial attempt)" may make admissions question why you did not take the opportunity to speak to your professor, study harder / differently, or get a tutor rather than accepting defeat, per se, because you could have theoretically taken the opportunity to learn the material and even make a C or so and further ensure success in the retake. Based on my experiences I think that adcoms like to see perseverance and resilience rather than defeatism so I'd almost be inclined to leave that information out and, if questioned about it, you could say that you didn't do well in your initial attempt but then highlight the fact that you retook the class (i.e. didn't give up) and did better. This may not have affected your application at all but something to think about and with how competitive it is every detail matters. Good luck!!

 

[princessdentist]

I think you should apply to way more schools! like at least 20 and keep in touch with them throughout the cycle. You have a great DAT

 

[dentalgoal team]

Great organization. Great improvement on the DAT. Make sure to apply more broadly and express in your personal statement how you improved your application from the previous cycle.

 

[Patelji12]

.

 

[Jonny_Tsunami49]

Thank you all for taking the time to read this post and offering feedback.

My second inquiry is how to go about handling the academic update dilemma. I am currently enrolled (for the summer) in the post-baccalaureate science courses at my four-year university but the first term of summer classes do not finish until the 20th of June. Is it worthwhile waiting to submit the application until these grades are processed or should I just send in the application June 1st and wait until late Fall for the academic update?

Thanks again for the support.

EDIT: Classes end the 20th. Grades due by the 26th.

 

[PJDoe]

Definitely do the latter and apply EARLY. As you may be aware, ADEA AADSAS allows you to put "planned/in progress" coursework. So schools will know that they should expect academic updates. For now, I think applying early is much more important. DISREGARD THIS INITIAL POST.

EDIT: Misread your comment. If your grades are going to be ready/processed by June 20th, I would definitely wait and apply as soon as possible in July. Definitely not worth waiting until February for the academic updates to open up.

 

[Ollivander]

At this point I'd have changed my career trajectory to be honest. However, I think taking higher level courses like you're planning to do is a smart route to take if you're dead set on continuing to apply. If you had applied to a school such as LECOM last cycle I bet you'd have gotten in.

 

[Faefly]

+ 1 on others's tips

& if you apply to 16+ schools and you will probably get accepted!