This is my story - Cautionary Tale

[mariam webber]

Hello all after reading many posts on this wonderful forum i have decided to share my story which should serve as a cautionary tale for many aspiring candidates. think before jumping.
it will be 5 years since i graduated with a AuD degree from #2 school (no need to name it as everyone knows). My jubilation has now turned into desperation and disappointment due to many reasons. Most importantly
#1 > Lack of growth
#2 > Impossible to move into other "healthcare" fields... or industry jobs outside audiology
#3> same mundane hearing aid testing role. GOD! i didnt know this is what i was reading for
#5> Salary in the dumps (stayed nearly flat since i started working)
#6> Coworkers in audiology are too boring and just happy with 9-5 job...growth is not they care about

points 1 and 2 are the most bothersome... I went around did a quick survey among recent AuD grads and found that of the 42 people who responded 35 people said : THEY WOULD NEVER RECOMMEND THIS TRACK to anyone"!!!!!!!!!!!! and that they would have never signed up for this degree if they had done real research

what is most painful is that even for administration both/business jobs no one (recruiters or managers) have no clue how to value AuD degree! they would rather get a BA History or English or even NURSING person to be a Project Manager etc role... This i didnt see it coming...

I really wish all the potential candidates read this and many other notes on this forum and be VERY CAREFUL on their decision , AuD is doomed even if you get your degree from the top 10 institutes...

Its an UNSELLABLE degree outside Audiology,,,, which is a small pool with no growth and poor salary future. I get shock when i read couple of posts where folks studying for Engineering left the program and started audiology.. i could only gasp in disbelief.

what am i doing now to correct the course....?? degree in epidemiology .... atleast i can find jobs in large institutes!! and I am very happy that my cohorts are fantastic analytical folks unlike my audiologist friends who are utterly disappointing...

I look forward for a healthy debate here.
Mariam

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[CBA300]

Thank you for sharing your story. I would like to quickly add mine as well: I entered an Au.D. program having thought that I had done my research and believed audiology was a solid career choice. It may or may not be (and I applaud your call for healthy debate on this topic). As my time in the program went on, I became more aware of the realities of the field and much disappointment naturally followed. Your list of disappointments closely matches mine. I was also extremely disappointed with the professionalism of my classmates (that's a whole new thread entirely). By the time I had realized that I did not want to enter such an embattled profession, and realizing that the work itself was not intellectually fulfilling in any way, I was well along in the program and decided to finished the program. After an utterly miserable 4th year, I graduated and immediately entered a master's degree program in another field. I now happily work in that field and enjoy excellent pay, benefits, professional colleagues, challenging work, and many opportunities for advancement, essentially none of which audiology could offer.

My loosely collected thoughts:

1. We need audiologists, and there are people out there who should become audiologists and who will be a blessing to those they serve.

2. However, becoming an audiologist comes with great costs and sacrifices. I would draw a parallel to the teaching profession here...it better not be about the money, the respect, or the opportunity for advancement.

3. The future of audiology is uncertain and is difficult to predict with any reasonable accuracy. This of course, is likely true for almost any profession, but I don't feel audiology has made any major strides as a profession over the past 10-15 years, and that lack of momentum could very well continue well into the future.

4. The Au.D. is essentially a failed idea. Training is far too long, in-depth, and expensive for the scope and complexity of the work that 90% of audiologists perform, which amounts only to a technician-level role (i.e. basic hearing evaluation and HA fitting). I'm sure the "sunken-cost" fallacy is at work. We want to believe the Au.D. was a good idea and that it will pay off in the long run. It wasn't and it won't.

5. Yes, people should definitely think twice before entering this profession. More and more individuals are speaking up about their experiences, and we should encourage this, instead of becoming angry or defensive. But audiology isn't alone (have you checked out the optometry or pharmacy forums lately?) And this certainly isn't limited to healthcare professions (law school is a really bad idea too).

6. I'm always baffled when I see audiology ranked in lists of top professions, although I shouldn't be. Those lists are poorly researched and the rankings are determined using very poor indicators of job satisfaction. They do a massive disservice to those looking for quality career advice.

7. This is a really important discussion to have...I hope we can continue it

 

[mariam webber]

Wow 268 views and one reply!!! Thanks for your response. You nailed it when you said point # 4.
I am sure many of the members here are dissatisfied even feel misguided or cheated.. but cannot swallow the pill. I love to hear more healthy discussion on this platform. bye friends

 

[mariam webber]

So CBA300 did you finish your MPH degree or was it an MBA? You did declare that your current job (not Audio) gives great promise both salary as well as growth.. can you share more about the kind of role and progression one can make?

 

[Raconteur07]

Well, if you go through four years of doctoral education and submit to a career performing hearing evaluations and fitting hearing aids, I'd imagine that you'd be disappointed enough in that decision to blame it on the profession as a whole.

However, if you take your education seriously and utilize your training, you can find a career performing a variety of assessments and providing rehabilitative therapies for many diverse audiologic and vestibular cases.

The point is, the Au.D., like any other degree, is only worth what you put into it, and I'm not referring to the cost of the degree. If you decide to become an audiologist under an ENT after graduation, you may want to brace yourself for the monotony of back-to-back evaluations and HA fittings. If, however, you seek a more diverse clinical setting or greater growth salary-wise, consider a hospital or university setting. Private practice, if approached correctly, will also grant you a great deal of control over the quality of your career.

I've met audiologists who are unsatisfied with their careers, but they are largely outnumbered by those who absolutely love what they do. The previous posters may have had negative experiences in the field (or at least they may have if they had not changed careers), but that is in no way predictive of anyone else's future experience.

 

[BrianaGrace17]

Well, if you go through four years of doctoral education and submit to a career performing hearing evaluations and fitting hearing aids, I'd imagine that you'd be disappointed enough in that decision to blame it on the profession as a whole.

However, if you take your education seriously and utilize your training, you can find a career performing a variety of assessments and providing rehabilitative therapies for many diverse audiologic and vestibular cases.

The point is, the Au.D., like any other degree, is only worth what you put into it, and I'm not referring to the cost of the degree. If you decide to become an audiologist under an ENT after graduation, you may want to brace yourself for the monotony of back-to-back evaluations and HA fittings. If, however, you seek a more diverse clinical setting or greater growth salary-wise, consider a hospital or university setting. Private practice, if approached correctly, will also grant you a great deal of control over the quality of your career.

I've met audiologists who are unsatisfied with their careers, but they are largely outnumbered by those who absolutely love what they do. The previous posters may have had negative experiences in the field (or at least they may have if they had not changed careers), but that is in no way predictive of anyone else's future experience.

Thank you so much for that great insight! I'll be applying to AuD programs in the fall, and sometimes it's difficult to feel hopeful when these posts put a downer on something you've always wanted to do. It's good to know I have options.

 

[CBA300]

I agree that in many instances, you can only get out of your education what you put into it. Yet, no matter how hard you study and how much of an expert you become, there are still limitations that hold back the profession of audiology from becoming what it's leaders envision. While hospital positions are likely to provide more diversity along the scope of practice, hospital audiology departments are almost always sub-organized under ENT departments. This leaves audiologists with some autonomy, yet they still must serve at the pleasure of the MD's.

While university settings might seem favorable, those positions are rare and do not provide the salary and opportunity for advancement and tenure afforded to Ph.D. faculty members. The brass ring is of course private practice. For those with an entrepreneurial drive and sharp business acumen, it could be worth it. But I fail to see how private practice could prevent the audio/HA fitting infinite loop scenario, given that success in private practice (i.e. profit) is derived from a sole-source: HA sales.

Obviously I'm playing devil's advocate here. It's pretty obvious that the OP and I made an error in choosing audiology. We regret it, and it should be understandable that we want to ensure that those considering audiology fully understand and appreciate the good, the bad, and the ugly of the field. I continue to browse the SDN forums because I am interested in health-care career issues and would like to help folks make good choices, because I know first hand the serious consequences of an ill-informed decision. We need better data on job satisfaction among audiologists. Anecdotal evidence doesn't cut it. A good start is Bennett, H.N. & Steiger, J.R. (2010). Au.D. student attitudes toward the profession. Audiology Today, 22, 6 (53-63). On page 58, table 9, you'll find survey results indicating that 44% of sampled Au.D. students had doubts about their career choice - a staggering sum, especially when considering the real and opportunity costs of pursuing an Au.D.

In short, yes individual effort plays a role in job satisfaction and success, but many systemic forces are beyond our individual control. Hop over to audiologyonline.com and browse some of the job listings. You'll find multiple companies seeking an audiologist "slash" HIS, offering the same job, the same salary, and the same benefits package to a person with either a high-school diploma, OR eight (that's right, 1-2-3-4-5-6-7-8) years of post-secondary education. This is breathtaking disparity.

These are simply facts that need to be considered and discussed as an inconvenient truth.

 

[Raconteur07]

I'll concede that audiology should probably be further along in its development as a profession than it is, though it's had plenty of opposition in the past. While I'm not as starry-eyed as the most wishful of audiologists, I'd argue that the profession is far from danger and not beyond hope.

I actually read the Bennett &Steiger article very recently and I was not totally surprised by the findings. As important as I believe audiologists are to the medical field, I'd be surprised if I ever heard a little boy or girl say they wanted to grow up to be an audiologist.

Still, the profession continues to battle for autonomy and respect. A nee piece of legislation that would expand the covergae Medicaid provides for aufiologic services has recently been introduced in Congress, and students continue to apply to grad school in hopes of helping individuals with audiologic impairments.As I said, I am optimistic about the outlook of my profession.

...I typed this on my phone...please excuse any errors...

 

[CBA300]

I very much respect your commitment to the profession. In the next 10-15 years, it would be great if audiology advanced to a position where the scope of training is commensurate with actual practice. It's certainly true that no little boy or girl says they want to be an audiologist when they grow up, and that really gets to the heart of the image and diversity problem that plagues audiology (This was somewhat discussed in a recent thread).

What is the most common story you hear of how someone became an audiologist? The most common story I hear is that she (and I do mean she) initially wanted to be an SLP, and then decided against it. Because she also had one or two audiology classes as part of her undergraduate major, she chose audiology as a default. This sharply reduces the diversity of the Au.D. applicant pool, given the fact that an overwhelming majority of SLP/AUD undergraduate majors are female. The entire entry model into audiology needs to change. Audiology would do well to draw more males, more biomedical/hard science majors, and more engineering majors into the profession, yet there is a zero recruitment effort out there. How many people are chatting it up about audiology on SDN? 4-5 people? It's got the lowest traffic of every single forum and the conversations that do take place aren't that lively. Perhaps it's just ignorance, or perhaps it's because audiology is a very hard sell. In either case, the problem still remains.

 

[TheEarDoc]

I'll toss my 2 cents in on this subject.

I love what I do and still enjoy going to work just about every single day, but as others have mentioned I could have felt the same sense of gratification for helping people with a lot less education.

I received my Au.D. and worked for a couple of years, then was tired of the monotony of hospital Audiology (sorry even with vestibular, aural rehab, hearing aids, adult and pediatric diagnostics, tinnitus, and hearing aids you get bored with it and feel you know the majority of what there is to know!) and decided to pursue my associates degree for an RN with the hopes of becoming a nurse practitioner. Well I made it through one year of my associates degree program (with all A's), but discontinued my nursing degree because the hospital I worked for made life that rough on me as an audiologist (no support, constant badgering, constant billing issues that I was somehow made responsible to fix, and no budget to speak of!) and because I got married and was tired of working 40 hours a week and doing 20+ hours per week of classes and clinical rotations. I switched out of the private sector and joined the VA. I received almost a 20k bump in salary (yes you read that correctly) and make nearly what I would make as a nurse practitioner starting out. I also don't have to deal with a lot of the BS I would have had to deal with as an RN or nurse prac in the same hospital I was working for. Now if the VA reintroduced it's program where they would send me to school and pay me my current salary to become a mid level practitioner such as a physician assistant or nurse practitioner then I will sign up in a heart beat! It's coming to I bet with the demand for mid level practitioners in health care.

So I guess my story is, if I had to do it all over again I would have either become a physician assistant (6 years of schooling, less loans, and a higher salary than I make now, and a heck of a lot more job opportunities and room for upward advancement), a nurse practitioner (5 years or schooling, I had the grades where I wouldn't have needed loans, or I could have had a work place pay for my continuing education after I became an RN as the VA does this frequently, and made more in salary, and had more job opportunities and chance for upward advancement), or became a clinical psychologist (same as the other 2!). I graduated with a degree in Psychology, Pre-med Biology, and a minor in speech language sciences. I could have done med school, psychology grad school, or Audiology. I chose Audiology and when I chose it the Au.D. was just a couple years old so we were told a lot of stories about what it would do and we were part of the guinea pig classes. Now if this type of information was around that I see on this forum when I was in undergrad I would not be typing as the eardoc, I would be typing as the nurse prac or PA.

I really hope the AuD gets to where it needs to be (optometry level of independence, respect, and salary), but I don't think I will see it in my lifetime. Some of the things they could do to increase our skill set and our salary and our career opportunities would be:

1. Pharmacology courses to diagnose and treat middle ear infections and basic allergies (writing scripts for amox, cipro, flonase, singulair, etc.)
2. Sunset hearing aid dealers. No more hearing aid dealers after X date only Audiologists or working under an audiologist's licensure to be a hearing aid dealer
3. Hybrid with a MBA program so we have some billing, coding experience and can offer some health care business skills to give more upward advancement
4. Direct access for medicaid, medicare, private insurance (if we had #1 and #2 we would have this already)

IF we could do those 4 things you would see the AuD salary, demand, career opportunities, and upward advancement surge. Until these things happen we are where we are. I know many AuD's don't agree, and that's OK. That's part of the reason I am not active in AAA is because I know I would be shunned if I said these things.

 

[chicoborja]

I can see #4 eventually happening but not #1 to #3 in the foreseeable future. I have also become disenchanted with audiology. I really don't foresee audiology salaries going up unless we have a marked increase in private practice ownership. I have only worked in academia but am familiar with the sad state of practices in the private sector. I plan on either moving to the VA, getting a job as an assistant professor, or going to PA school. The third option is probably untenable due to the opportunity cost but the first two are realistic. For those interested in research careers, audiology is quite an interesting area but clinical practice is quite mundane.

 

[eastr90]

The OP and CBA300 bring up some good points. One should consider the career carefully.

 

[eastr90]

Helpful statistic from from the 2013 Jan/Feb issue of Audiology Today by Wilson and Kluesing: A survey of 300 audiologists found that only 54% of AuD holders (both for residential and distance) would do it again.

More food for thought.

 

[CBA300]

eastr90, thank you very much for sharing your story. As you can see, you are certainly not alone in coming to these stark realizations about audiology. What's interesting is how many stories of discontent (and downright disgust) are surfacing on this forum. When you consider the low number of individuals who actually post here, it makes you wonder how many more stories are out there that will never be brought to light. Also eastr90, I know leaving a graduate program can be difficult, so be sure to take care of yourself during this time while your transition into something better. It sounds like you already have a positive outlook, and that's a great thing. Just curious, do you have any thoughts on what you will pursue next? Another grad program, or just forget about this ridiculous thing called grad school and enter the workforce? I wish you the best of luck either way!

 

[eastr90]

CBA300 I would PM you with my responses but it appears you don't receive them.

 

[CBA300]

Just enabled PM's...can you try again?

 

[eastr90]

Not quite sure if you received it. PM me if it didn't.

 

[RexdB]

I've been an audiologist for many years and have found it to be a rewarding profession. I literally know hundreds of audiologists who feel fulfilled and happy in what they are doing. Like many professions though, the early years on the job can be trying as you earn your sealegs and get more exposure to the lay of land. If you really are interested in helping people with hearing loss - then stick with audiology. Money, career advancement, notoriety and even expansion into other healthcare opportunities often come with time. Although Audiology has some challenges...it's also full of opportunity. Individuals who seize those opportunities will find themselves on a similar parallel to colleagues in other professions. It is a field though where you have to make it happen for yourself as it's too easy to just fall in line and be a member of the herd. If you are willing to take some chances, work hard and think out of the box - I am more than confident that you will find enormous personal satisfaction as an audiologist in terms of achieving your own goals as well as helping people who need and appreciate your services.

 

[CDLissa]

Thank you for your input RexdB!

I am excited and really looking forward to beginning my career in audiology

 

[RexdB]

My pleasure and good luck with your studies :>)

 

[Nope-Not-Again]

I can just add entering an Audiology program was probably the most stressful thing I ever did, with faculty who treated the students as grunt level employees, and the practicums were the first place I'd ever really encountered political correctness. It's one thing to show behavior that an outside observer would agree is inappropriate, it's another to be told your behavior is insulting and demeaning based on inferred meaning and psychology.

Essentially I had an instructor who decided I wouldn't make it in the profession and it was her job to see me out. Time after time I'd see a patient, think everything had gone fine and they were satisfied with my demeanor, then be ripped up one side and down the other about all the horrible things she'd seen in my interview and hearing test. I'd already worked for years in a hospital as an orderly and I can tell you it takes a lot more people skills and bedside manner to walk up to a stranger on a gurney and put a catheter in them than to do a hearing test. At that hospital I'd received several praises for my work with patients and never a single complaint. I tried rationalizing with this person and logic, the final straw was being told I wasn't aware of my behavior and it was so bad no one would say anything to me about it.

I quit in disgust, at the cost of going deep into debt and nearly having a nervous breakdown. I was paying to be trained, not be on the receiving end of a personal vendetta. I was never again able to consider anything in the medical professions as I'd keep having nightmares of being stuck again in a dead end, no win situation, and people think I excel at customer service but for years I keep feeling like this instructor was going to come around the corner and start tearing me down again.

The message is if you're reading this and thinking about Audiology, don't go into it.

 

[kacikins]

I'm a little confused. It sounds like your bad experiences stem from the academic program you're enrolled in and specifically one supervisor. How does that relate to the entire field of audiology? It just seems like you're making a pretty big speculation by suggesting prospective students should stay away.

School is such a small percentage in the entirety of your career. You couldn't stick it out just a little bit longer? And honestly, that instructor was probably just trying to make you a better clinician, that IS one of their jobs. Look at the big picture. ONE instructor should not make or break you.

 

[aud_dropout]

I can absolutely believe Nope-Not-Again's story. It's almost the same as my own. There's no "sticking it out" when you're being torn down constantly like that, especially as you realize that the others in your cohort are being held to a different standard, and if you don't leave, people like that make sure you get kicked out anyway. And one professor, especially one with tenure, can certainly break you in small departments with subjective evaluations. I learned after leaving that my program had a reputation for many years for forcing students out and having a toxic atmosphere.

My advice wouldn't necessarily be to avoid the profession, but to check into programs very, very carefully. Do students actually seem happy? Is it common for students to leave the program? Are undergrads at the school even attempting to attend as a graduate student? Then, if you get into a program and find out there's a bad professor (or a few) causing problems or you're finding your mental health taking a nosedive, don't assume you'll manage to get through. Be ready and willing to transfer if problems like this start. It's not worth your mental health.

 

[Nope-Not-Again]

I'm a little confused. It sounds like your bad experiences stem from the academic program you're enrolled in and specifically one supervisor. How does that relate to the entire field of audiology? It just seems like you're making a pretty big speculation by suggesting prospective students should stay away.

School is such a small percentage in the entirety of your career. You couldn't stick it out just a little bit longer? And honestly, that instructor was probably just trying to make you a better clinician, that IS one of their jobs. Look at the big picture. ONE instructor should not make or break you.

I can add two things:

First is I was flat out told to leave by this instructor, who wasn't my adviser but was politically connected in the department. That's hardly a way to make someone a "better clinician," but they were happy to take my tuition money.

Second is this was several years ago, and told from the perspective of someone who would be at midpoint in a career if I had stayed--which would have been nearly impossible. Less than a third of my classmates still work in the profession, and as the original poster on this thread noted the salaries are flat, the ability to transfer skills into something else in healthcare is minimal, and it's mostly a glorified hearing aid tester and salesperson.

So yes, I can say without a doubt this was the worst mistake of my life, and anyone wanting a happy and successful career should never consider Audiology.

 

[zebra78244]

Hello all,


I have been lurking these forums for a few years and would like to put in my 2 cents.. I have a bachelor’s degree in speech and hearing sciences like many of you on this board. I was on track to become an AuD, and was accepted to 3 AuD programs in my state. After speaking to various AuD’s who had been working in the field in different settings I was advised to not pursue it. The major reasons were (pay, growth, and job availability). The handful of AuD’s that I met who were happy, typically were women, worked part time, and their husband made a lot of money (not being sexist, that’s what I experienced).

I did not come from a family with a lot of money or education, I got my bachelors degree debt free due to scholarships, but taking 65-80k (tuition plus cost of living, for public in state programs) for 4 years of a clinical doctorate was a stretch for me. I took a few years off to think about what I wanted to do, and eventually got my state license as a Hearing Aid Specialist after training for 6 months. I have worked for the following companies: Beltone, Miracle Ear, HearEx/USA, Sams Club, BJ’s, and Costco. I have since left the field, finished an MBA and now worth in healthcare administration and love it. Just to be clear I am not here to defend or uphold hearing aid specialists, I could care less. This is specific to getting a AuD to work in the hearing industry.

The largest problems with this field: (the funny this is, they barely ever mention this stuff in AuD school or undergrad)

1. Less than 10% of insurance covers hearings aids, and if it does reimburse it is nowhere near the full amount of the sale price of a pair of aids. Most PT’s will have to finance or pay out of pocket. (If only 10% of insurance covered dentists, physicians, prescription drugs, those industries would go bankrupt)

2. Direct billing for tests is only possible in a select few select situations without a referral, meaning unless you get a ENT referral you will not be reimbursed for your hearing tests.

3. Most places Beltone, Miracle Ear, HearEx/USA, Sams Club, BJ’s, and Costco do the entire test for free. Do not kid yourself, they are doing the same test. (Air, Bone, Srt, Mcl, Ucl, Word Discrim).

4. The top6 manufacturers (Siemens, Resound, Starkey, Phonak, Widex, Oticon) have sold everyone out, they do not give a crap who sells the aids as long as they are selling a ton, the top 6 are selling to audiologists/ent practices, boutique franchises (beltone, miracle ear, audibell), and big box (BJ’s/Costco) all at different prices, Do not kid yourself, the technology is not that different….Its all marketing and sales tactics

5. No long term growth selling aids, you salary is directly tied to how many aids you can sell.

6. Nobody really cares that you have an AuD, success is really determined by your sales skills, the problem is that in AuD school, they do not cover a single thing about selling, just altruistic nonsense about helping people hear..aids cost money.

Back in the day, in the early 90’s it was the golden age, you could make 150k+ easy selling aids. Not any more. The economy has taken a dump, not everyone has money anymore, there is way more competition, and the biggest problem of all is Costco, they will eventually cause the demise of every private practice. Nobody is selling a top notch product at that price point. I have seen successful private practices close within 2-3 years of a Costco opening close by. Costco really isn’t to blame, blame the top6 for selling to Costco. Do not kid yourself, you are selling hearing aids, right now it is all about price, and unfortunately no one will ever be able to compete with Costco. For those of you thinking private practice will be the cure, just lookup how much a 5000 piece mailer for advertising costs, then multiply that cost 2x a month forever.

Few issues I have seen posted by other people:

You shouldn’t expect to be paid much = Then why would you waste 65-100k on a doctorate….lol You could have saved alot of money and worked at walmart if you did not want to get paid much

Its only worth as much as you put into it = A load of BS. You can only sell so many people in one day, and then you have returns…

ENT’s do not respect us= Why should they, you are not a Doctor=Physician. Get this through your heads, you will never do surgery, you will never prescribe meds, you will never do anything that you did not cover in AuD school. You are only generating real profit if you sell aids. Why should they pay you a fat base salary, to do hearing tests that a guy down the street does for free. Its plain numbers, its business. Personally who cares…. I care about money in my pocket, not respect

Sunset hearing aids dealers= Will never happen ever, they are selling Top6 hearing aids, Top6 loves them, and will help crush any legislation that is against hearing aid dealers

If you are already close to finishing you AuD, I would say get a job at VA, or at a top6 company as a support rep, everything else will be the same, test and sell.

I know that these issues are not all specific to Audiology, they are affecting pharmacy, optometry, many other fields, etc. But Audiology is at the bottom of the totem pole as far as return on investment. I am not telling anyone to not pursue the AuD, I am saying if a year out of AuD school you are unhappy, I will just say I told you so….

Not getting the AuD was the best financial decision I have ever made in my life

My 2 cents

Good luck to all on the future

 

[zebra78244]

bump. I would love to hear more opinions from people in the field.

 

[TennaciousD]

1. Less than 10% of insurance covers hearings aids, and if it does reimburse it is nowhere near the full amount of the sale price of a pair of aids. Most PT’s will have to finance or pay out of pocket. (If only 10% of insurance covered dentists, physicians, prescription drugs, those industries would go bankrupt)
This is actually completely wrong. Dentists and Physicians have seen their salaries decrease significantly over the years BECAUSE their services are covered by insurance. If you have ever worked in billing/insurance you would know that relying on insurance payments to keep a business running is a losing battle. The fact that HAs are not covered by insurance is part of the stability of the field. Now, I believe insurance SHOULD cover HAs, just like they cover wheelchairs, prosthetics, etc., but to make a point that the lack of insurance coverage for HAs brings down the field is simply incorrect.

2. Direct billing for tests is only possible in a select few select situations without a referral, meaning unless you get a ENT referral you will not be reimbursed for your hearing tests.
This is incorrect as well. Any physician can make a referral to an Audiologist. It does not have to be an ENT. The referral process, while at times cumbersome for the patients is in place to ensure that prior to fitting a hearing aid there are no underlying medical conditions that need to be dealt with prior. Also many private insurances do not require a physician referral. Now , I would argue that audiologists, just like optometrists, should have direct-access as medical causes of hearing loss generally represent less than 5% of all cases of reported hearing loss, but the issue is a political issue. The ENTs are against direct access to Audiologists, because it will reduce the amount of office visits, MRIs, CT scans that can bill, this reducing their income.

3. Most places Beltone, Miracle Ear, HearEx/USA, Sams Club, BJ’s, and Costco do the entire test for free. Do not kid yourself, they are doing the same test. (Air, Bone, Srt, Mcl, Ucl, Word Discrim).
Once again, you are incorrect. HIS in most states, by law, are not allowed to complete anything other than a hearing screening. Most complete only pure tone air testing then have the patient sign a medical waiver (which is the only way they can sell HAs). The reason they give their hearing screenings away for free, is that by law, scope of practice, and definition of their field they are not recognized as a medical professional and cannot by law (it would be fraud) compete these tests AND bill the patient or insurance for the exam.

4. The top6 manufacturers (Siemens, Resound, Starkey, Phonak, Widex, Oticon) have sold everyone out, they do not give a crap who sells the aids as long as they are selling a ton, the top 6 are selling to audiologists/ent practices, boutique franchises (beltone, miracle ear, audibell), and big box (BJ’s/Costco) all at different prices, Do not kid yourself, the technology is not that different….Its all marketing and sales tactics
This is true. The HA companies have no interest in who sells their devices. As an audiologist, the only protection you have is to not get into a scenario where you are dependent upon one company. Most HIS are locked in contractually to selling 1 company. The audiologists greatest power against these companies is the right to sell another company if/when needed.

5. No long term growth selling aids, you salary is directly tied to how many aids you can sell.
Long-term growth is any field is limited by the billing processes involved. Not many healthcare fields have long-term growth. Most physicians, make similar salaries over their careers unless, they achieve partner or management status or going into private practice with a successful business model. This is exactly the same for audiology. If you want to advance and increase your salary, you must achieve to leadership positions, increase your education (add a Ph.D., M.B.A., etc. just as many physicians do), or open a private practice. If you want long-term growth go into business.

6. Nobody really cares that you have an AuD, success is really determined by your sales skills, the problem is that in AuD school, they do not cover a single thing about selling, just altruistic nonsense about helping people hear..aids cost money
Nobody cares about your degree. That is true in any field. The degree does not make the career. Many people believe that once they get a degree they are entitled to an amazing careers for amazing pay. The degree is simply the hoop you must jump through in order to embark on the career. This has been said before and I will repeat it. If you accept a job that is simply diagnostics and selling HAs, then respect will be hard to come by. If you work for an ENT that treats you as a tech, then you ARE a tech. The knowledge and skill that are acquired in an Au.D. program and the audiologists scope of practice allow you to do more, but you have to push yourself to actually do those things. Nobody in this world is going to GIVE you the perfect job. You have to earn jobs like that. If you want a rewarding career in anything, including audiology, you must earn it everyday of your career.

I appreciate that you and others on the board did not have a good experience. The field is not for everyone. Many people struggle to find their niche in the world and change fields multiple times before finding the career for them. The part I don't understand is the desire to caution everyone else interested in the field, based on your own myopic experience that is exclusive to your choices, experiences, and perspective. You are 100% completely entitled to your feelings about your experiences, but they are yours only and are not unique to audiology. All fields have their pros and cons. True success in any career will be determined by the choices you make and not by some underlying global failure inherent in the field.

 

[james6911]

I want to address some of this
#1 > Lack of growth - We are expected to grow at one of the highest rates next 20 years....
#2 > Impossible to move into other "healthcare" fields... or industry jobs outside audiology You have funneled your way to a specialty science, did you still expect other options? Even here you have options to choose from educational, hospital, vestibular or open your own practice. What else do you want?
#3> same mundane hearing aid testing role. GOD! i didnt know this is what i was reading for - Take up APD, Vestib, Educational AuD and Research.
#5> Salary in the dumps (stayed nearly flat since i started working) Can't argue this, other than there has been 7k in increase the last two years. Good trend... as soon as the masters fall out/retire our salary should increase.
#6> Coworkers in audiology are too boring and just happy with 9-5 job...growth is not they care about Thanks for offending the majority of people in here...

 

[breezy94]

I am currently in grad school for audiology, and everyday I question if this was right. I feel bored and like this is a dead end. I don't like some of the major things in the field (calibrating hearing aids is not my thing). I've worked with audiologists who are so focused on the person's hearing (yes I understand this is the job) that they miss huge things about the person such as dexterity problems. I've had audiologists tell me "we don't care about that" when I mention another medical problem a patient has. This really bothers me, and I don't want to be like that. Since the ears are attached to the body, shouldn't we care about everything that goes on, or at least be aware of other diagnoses?
Don't get me wrong, there are aspects of audiology that I do enjoy, but it feels that it's becoming more and more mundane. I feel bad that someone else could have taken my spot in the program who wanted in, but because I had been on this track for my entire undergrad time, I had to find out for sure if this was right.
This forum really put into words what I have witnessed already in the short time I have been in the program. Any advice or words of wisdom would be greatly appreciated!

 

[YF786]

Hello all after reading many posts on this wonderful forum i have decided to share my story which should serve as a cautionary tale for many aspiring candidates. think before jumping.
it will be 5 years since i graduated with a AuD degree from #2 school (no need to name it as everyone knows). My jubilation has now turned into desperation and disappointment due to many reasons. Most importantly
#1 > Lack of growth
#2 > Impossible to move into other "healthcare" fields... or industry jobs outside audiology
#3> same mundane hearing aid testing role. GOD! i didnt know this is what i was reading for
#5> Salary in the dumps (stayed nearly flat since i started working)
#6> Coworkers in audiology are too boring and just happy with 9-5 job...growth is not they care about

points 1 and 2 are the most bothersome... I went around did a quick survey among recent AuD grads and found that of the 42 people who responded 35 people said : THEY WOULD NEVER RECOMMEND THIS TRACK to anyone"!!!!!!!!!!!! and that they would have never signed up for this degree if they had done real research

what is most painful is that even for administration both/business jobs no one (recruiters or managers) have no clue how to value AuD degree! they would rather get a BA History or English or even NURSING person to be a Project Manager etc role... This i didnt see it coming...

I really wish all the potential candidates read this and many other notes on this forum and be VERY CAREFUL on their decision , AuD is doomed even if you get your degree from the top 10 institutes...

Its an UNSELLABLE degree outside Audiology,,,, which is a small pool with no growth and poor salary future. I get shock when i read couple of posts where folks studying for Engineering left the program and started audiology.. i could only gasp in disbelief.

what am i doing now to correct the course....?? degree in epidemiology .... atleast i can find jobs in large institutes!! and I am very happy that my cohorts are fantastic analytical folks unlike my audiologist friends who are utterly disappointing...

I look forward for a healthy debate here.
Mariam

Goodluck to you in whichever field you chose this time around. I can say it does hurt to put in all the hard work and find out the job potential/ outlook not great. I am on the same boat but for pharmacy.

 

[AudtoBE26]

I am currently in grad school for audiology, and everyday I question if this was right. I feel bored and like this is a dead end. I don't like some of the major things in the field (calibrating hearing aids is not my thing). I've worked with audiologists who are so focused on the person's hearing (yes I understand this is the job) that they miss huge things about the person such as dexterity problems. I've had audiologists tell me "we don't care about that" when I mention another medical problem a patient has. This really bothers me, and I don't want to be like that. Since the ears are attached to the body, shouldn't we care about everything that goes on, or at least be aware of other diagnoses?
Don't get me wrong, there are aspects of audiology that I do enjoy, but it feels that it's becoming more and more mundane. I feel bad that someone else could have taken my spot in the program who wanted in, but because I had been on this track for my entire undergrad time, I had to find out for sure if this was right.
This forum really put into words what I have witnessed already in the short time I have been in the program. Any advice or words of wisdom would be greatly appreciated!

Breezy - I feel the same way as you. I recently left my AuD program after 1.5 years. I was beyond stressed every single day for the past 6 months about whether a doctor of audiology was a good career path for me, and in general! I went to a top 10 school and got straight A's so it was not an academic problem either. As you said, I found clinic to be extremely mundane, the majority of the audiologists I was with did not really seem to care and were just going through the motions. The success rate of people actually getting benefit and continuing to use their hearing aids was so low. My favorite part of audiology was talking to the patients, and in reality there is no time for this. Most audiologists just tinker with the hearing aids/programming software a bit and send the patient on their way. Extremely frustrating.

Another thing that really bothers me is the direction of the profession in general. I 100% do not believe a doctorate is necessary for the realistic scope of practice that audiologists have. A doctor of audiology simply doesn't have a place in todays industry. Hearing aids/simple hearing tests can be taken care of by dispensers and audiology assistants (and it is bull**** to say an audiologist can do a simple hearing test or fit a hearing aid any better than a trained dispenser with experience.) Not only that, but they do it for much cheaper and patients can get the hearing aids much cheaper than by going to an audiologist. This is a GOOD thing for patients, even if it is not so great for the audiology profession. If audiologists TRULY want the best options for patients, they need to embrace dispensers, big box, and internet sales. More importantly, it's not going away because it's simply not possible to fight the market.

What about the more specialized cases, not simple hearing tests and fittings related to noise induced hearing loss/age related hearing loss? Sure, an audiologist has a place there, but these cases are not only a very small percentage, but can also be taken care of by ENTs and neurologists, with rehab being done by physical, occupational therapists, speech pathologists. Audiologists cannot diagnose the pathology of a hearing loss. Audiologists do not get reimbursed for rehab.

Unless your interest is academia/research, cochlear implants, or your TRUE PASSION is audiology and you've wanted to be an audiologist since you were a little child or audiology is personal for you....find something else. I really believe that in the decade or so, audiology as it is generally practiced now will become obsolete. This sucks for audiologists but is great for people with hearing loss.

 

[AudtoBE26]

I appreciate that you and others on the board did not have a good experience. The field is not for everyone. Many people struggle to find their niche in the world and change fields multiple times before finding the career for them. The part I don't understand is the desire to caution everyone else interested in the field, based on your own myopic experience that is exclusive to your choices, experiences, and perspective. You are 100% completely entitled to your feelings about your experiences, but they are yours only and are not unique to audiology. All fields have their pros and cons. True success in any career will be determined by the choices you make and not by some underlying global failure inherent in the field.

Sorry Tenacious, but the mere fact that there is a long thread, and many many more, of AuD students and audiologists saying the same exact thing shows this is NOT exclusive to the posters own choices, experiences, and perspective. It is a fact that the audiology industry is changing due to the market forces that come with big box, internet to consumer, and an increase in dispensers. This is a topic that has been widely discussed over the past several years, online and at professional conferences. It's simple economics. Although I agree with you that choices people make play a huge role in their career satisfaction, sometimes an industry does fail because of change in the environment. Just ask the people in the print publishing industry (that pesky internet!), travel agents, blockbuster, farmers, and mail carriers...to name a few!

 

[TheEarDoc]

Breezy - I feel the same way as you. I recently left my AuD program after 1.5 years. I was beyond stressed every single day for the past 6 months about whether a doctor of audiology was a good career path for me, and in general! I went to a top 10 school and got straight A's so it was not an academic problem either. As you said, I found clinic to be extremely mundane, the majority of the audiologists I was with did not really seem to care and were just going through the motions. The success rate of people actually getting benefit and continuing to use their hearing aids was so low. My favorite part of audiology was talking to the patients, and in reality there is no time for this. Most audiologists just tinker with the hearing aids/programming software a bit and send the patient on their way. Extremely frustrating.

Another thing that really bothers me is the direction of the profession in general. I 100% do not believe a doctorate is necessary for the realistic scope of practice that audiologists have. A doctor of audiology simply doesn't have a place in todays industry. Hearing aids/simple hearing tests can be taken care of by dispensers and audiology assistants (and it is bull**** to say an audiologist can do a simple hearing test or fit a hearing aid any better than a trained dispenser with experience.) Not only that, but they do it for much cheaper and patients can get the hearing aids much cheaper than by going to an audiologist. This is a GOOD thing for patients, even if it is not so great for the audiology profession. If audiologists TRULY want the best options for patients, they need to embrace dispensers, big box, and internet sales. More importantly, it's not going away because it's simply not possible to fight the market.

What about the more specialized cases, not simple hearing tests and fittings related to noise induced hearing loss/age related hearing loss? Sure, an audiologist has a place there, but these cases are not only a very small percentage, but can also be taken care of by ENTs and neurologists, with rehab being done by physical, occupational therapists, speech pathologists. Audiologists cannot diagnose the pathology of a hearing loss. Audiologists do not get reimbursed for rehab.

Unless your interest is academia/research, cochlear implants, or your TRUE PASSION is audiology and you've wanted to be an audiologist since you were a little child or audiology is personal for you....find something else. I really believe that in the decade or so, audiology as it is generally practiced now will become obsolete. This sucks for audiologists but is great for people with hearing loss.

Hahahaha I would love to see a dealer with experience step into my clinic for one day. I've seen what happens many times when a person sees a hearing aid dealer. Now are there good and experienced dealers? Yep. I'm sure there are reputable used car salesmen too. Do I think a doctorate is required for practice? Nah. I think a master's degree was fine. I will say though I would put my skill set up on a bad day against any hearing aid dealer on a good day.

People can get a hearing aid much cheaper by going to a dealer over an audiologist? Did you really just say that? Got any proof to back that up because the majority of patients I see who have dealer provided/fit hearing aids paid well over market price compared to the audiologists in the area. Why? Because dealers cannot legally bill for diagnostic testing so they make all their money on hearing aids so they severely mark up the price on them for maximum profit. They also love to mislead patients and tell them they need new hearing aids every 2 years. I remember one of my previous private sector patients bought new RIC style hearing aids every 2 years (at 7k a pair) for 10 years from the same dealer and yet they never seemed to work well for her. Well no wonder she had a moderate to severe hearing loss and he fit her with open fitting domes with half the required gain. Why did he do that? Because they looked good and that's what she wanted so he was more than happy to give her what she wanted rather than what she needed. 1 appointment with me on her dealer hearing aids with the appropriate molds and she was hearing better than she had ever heard with the dealer after decade.

Audiologists do not get reimbursed for rehab? Again where did you pull this data from?

You seem quite ill informed.

 

[AudtoBE26]

You seem defensive, and I get it. I'm sure I would be too if I had spent the time and money to get the AuD. I would be all in.

You said you would put your skill set up against the very best dispenser. I believe you! After 4 years of intensive schooling you are going to know WAY more than a dispenser could ever know, and be able to handle the most complicated cases. My point is that in the large majority of cases your skill set isn't needed and a hearing aid specialist/audiology assistant would do just fine.

Perhaps the reason hearing aids are much cheaper at the big dispensers/box stores is because they are able to purchase them in bulk, and don't have the overhead costs of a full audiology practice/ent practice. Sure some dispensers are sleazy but the same is true of some professionals in every industry. I've followed more than a handful of audiologists who do not verify their fittings. Costco has a testing and fitting protocol that every dispenser must follow, including REM and medical referrals. Their isn't regulation among private practices so it's really hit or miss, just like with small dispensing businesses.

As for not getting reimbursed for rehab, this is a huge topic and one that we discussed endlessly in the AuD program.

It states right on the ASHA website "Note regarding Medicare scope of coverage: Medicare restricts coverage of audiology services to diagnostic testing only."

Here, a current rehabilitative audiologist talks about her frustrations with not getting reimbursed for rehab.
http://saa.audiology.org/news/so-you-want-be-rehabilitative-audiologist

Here is a current and really insightful article in The Hearing Review that summarizes the whole issue:
http://www.hearingreview.com/2015/02/must-return-rehabilitative-roots/

 

[TheEarDoc]

You seem defensive, and I get it. I'm sure I would be too if I had spent the time and money to get the AuD. I would be all in.

You said you would put your skill set up against the very best dispenser. I believe you! After 4 years of intensive schooling you are going to know WAY more than a dispenser could ever know, and be able to handle the most complicated cases. My point is that in the large majority of cases your skill set isn't needed and a hearing aid specialist/audiology assistant would do just fine.

Perhaps the reason hearing aids are much cheaper at the big dispensers/box stores is because they are able to purchase them in bulk, and don't have the overhead costs of a full audiology practice/ent practice. Sure some dispensers are sleazy but the same is true of some professionals in every industry. I've followed more than a handful of audiologists who do not verify their fittings. Costco has a testing and fitting protocol that every dispenser must follow, including REM and medical referrals. Their isn't regulation among private practices so it's really hit or miss, just like with small dispensing businesses.

As for not getting reimbursed for rehab, this is a huge topic and one that we discussed endlessly in the AuD program.

It states right on the ASHA website "Note regarding Medicare scope of coverage: Medicare restricts coverage of audiology services to diagnostic testing only."

Here, a current rehabilitative audiologist talks about her frustrations with not getting reimbursed for rehab.
http://saa.audiology.org/news/so-you-want-be-rehabilitative-audiologist

Here is a current and really insightful article in The Hearing Review that summarizes the whole issue:
http://www.hearingreview.com/2015/02/must-return-rehabilitative-roots/

Not defensive. Like I said you seem pretty uninformed.

Do I have gripes about reimbursement or pay in Audiology? Yep. Most professions do. Then again I also have experience in nursing and I see the CF they have going on and think "audiology ain't doing too bad!". Buying in bulk does make hearing aids slightly cheaper. That's just a simple law of economics, but they will still only be so cheap for the quality products because of the R&D required to develop a hearing aid (again as I said you seem uninformed). One can get reimbursed for rehab services if one simply knows what to code and how to code it. Most medical fields have plenty of stuff they do they cannot code for. And don't kid yourself that a hearing aid dealer would bill for a hearing exam if they were legally able to do so.

You've followed audiologists who don't do real ear? Me too. Costco.....hmmm I have friends who have been there and done that. It didn't sound like a good experience for them or the patients, but hey to each their own.

If you don't like the field that's fine. Leave now before you spend anymore time doing something you don't want to do, but do everyone a favor and don't bash the profession simply because you didn't research it well enough before you jumped into a program. Just because your grapes turned to vinegar doesn't mine everyone else's did. I'm quite happy with my chosen profession. I make good money. I am not on call. I am respected. I don't have to worry about being snuck by dirty needles or cleaning crap up all day. Yep I'm pretty content!

 

[AudiologyMaybe]

Hi all,

I'm seriously considering going into this and, after doing research, I think pediatrics is where I want to focus. Are the hearing aid dispensers as big an issue in this area? (I'm particularly interested in educational audiology, auditory verbal therapy, newborn hearing screenings- but don't know which direction I'm going in yet at this point). I think I know the answer (that it depends) but if anyone knows or has experience in this area, I'd be grateful to know! Thanks!

 

[TheEarDoc]

Hi all,

I'm seriously considering going into this and, after doing research, I think pediatrics is where I want to focus. Are the hearing aid dispensers as big an issue in this area? (I'm particularly interested in educational audiology, auditory verbal therapy, newborn hearing screenings- but don't know which direction I'm going in yet at this point). I think I know the answer (that it depends) but if anyone knows or has experience in this area, I'd be grateful to know! Thanks!

Most folks start out in peds and then switch to adults. It's the common trend in audiology. I was the opposite I started out adults and loved peds and I think I had the most peds hours of all of my class and ended up almost being a peds audiologist for a couple children's hospitals and did some contract work for a children's hospital.

Educational audiology is a totally different animal in audiology. It usually involves a decent amount of driving since each district might only have 1-2 students in the school on your case load so you will spend a lot of time traveling and doing IEP meetings. You do get lower pay often than your other audiology cohorts, but you get summers off usually.

If you want to do newborn hearing screenings you will find they are usually done by nursing staff in the OB/nursery floor and an audiologist oversees the program and does all the evals for follow-ups on the kiddos who fail the screenings and they also collect all the follow-up data and present it to the hearing screening program for the state. I know this is how it was done at 2 of the hospitals I worked at. I trained the nursing staff to run the AABR equipment and I was consulted when a baby referred and if the parents wanted to talk to me and I did all the follow-ups for the babies that referred.

Kids are a blast though. I do VA care now, so no kiddos, but I still occasionally pick up a PRN job working in an ENT office or large hospital with lots of kiddos on my caseload.

The hearing aid dealers are not usually an issue with pediatrics because usually the parents don't have much money to spend on hearing aids for their children, often times children are on some sort of Medicaid program for their hearing aids. Also dealers are often not able to fit pediatrics in many states due to certain licensure laws unless the parent signs a waiver of medical clearance (which many won't do). The worst part about being a pediatric audiologist for me was dealing with the parents. I saw just horrible and heartbreaking things children went through because of horrible parents. I still loved working with the kids though. Several still contact me that I worked with when I was first in this career. I got to see many of them grow up and be successful because of my help with their hearing loss.

 

[AudiologyMaybe]

Most folks start out in peds and then switch to adults. It's the common trend in audiology. I was the opposite I started out adults and loved peds and I think I had the most peds hours of all of my class and ended up almost being a peds audiologist for a couple children's hospitals and did some contract work for a children's hospital.

Educational audiology is a totally different animal in audiology. It usually involves a decent amount of driving since each district might only have 1-2 students in the school on your case load so you will spend a lot of time traveling and doing IEP meetings. You do get lower pay often than your other audiology cohorts, but you get summers off usually.

If you want to do newborn hearing screenings you will find they are usually done by nursing staff in the OB/nursery floor and an audiologist oversees the program and does all the evals for follow-ups on the kiddos who fail the screenings and they also collect all the follow-up data and present it to the hearing screening program for the state. I know this is how it was done at 2 of the hospitals I worked at. I trained the nursing staff to run the AABR equipment and I was consulted when a baby referred and if the parents wanted to talk to me and I did all the follow-ups for the babies that referred.

Kids are a blast though. I do VA care now, so no kiddos, but I still occasionally pick up a PRN job working in an ENT office or large hospital with lots of kiddos on my caseload.

The hearing aid dealers are not usually an issue with pediatrics because usually the parents don't have much money to spend on hearing aids for their children, often times children are on some sort of Medicaid program for their hearing aids. Also dealers are often not able to fit pediatrics in many states due to certain licensure laws unless the parent signs a waiver of medical clearance (which many won't do). The worst part about being a pediatric audiologist for me was dealing with the parents. I saw just horrible and heartbreaking things children went through because of horrible parents. I still loved working with the kids though. Several still contact me that I worked with when I was first in this career. I got to see many of them grow up and be successful because of my help with their hearing loss.

Thank you for your response; it was so thorough and helpful! I've been doing so much research yet your response gave me more solid, useful info than I've been able to find. Thanks again!