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tier 2-3 programs

Discussion in 'Internal Medicine and IM Subspecialties' started by ion1, Dec 10, 2008.

  1. ion1

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    How would you rank the below programs in terms of overall intensity of the program? Is there a direct correlation between this and reputation, and therefore fellowship opportunities of a program?

    The ones that I’m debating between, with my perception of intensity ranking:

    duke > washU > uchi = umich > nw = bid = mayo

    any thoughts?
     
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  3. drjitsu

    2+ Year Member

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    I think that this is generally correct if ranking in terms of intensity, that is rigor of call schedule etc... However, I would place WashU behind Michigan for sure. WashU is q8 overnight and q4 with nightfloat. Mayo may deserve a bit higher spot as it is q6 overnight with no night float, but does not offer much early autonomy.

    That being said, I must say I'm struggling with the same thoughts as to if rigor = reputation, and most of all if rigor = better training. I think we can all agreee that front loaded programs with lots of early autonomy confer an earlier sense of accomplishment and competency, and thus offer the ego quite a good stroking. But that does not mean that the end result will be any different complared to programs where the load is more evenly spread, such as Mayo.

    Now, in terms of fellowship, I really believe you can do anything you want out of any of these places. It just depends on how easy the program makes it for you. I've had direct interaction with Mich, Mayo, and WashU, and I can say they all are very supportive. Some places you just have to take more initiave over them guiding you step by step.

    So, we must try and search out souls as to what kind of program setup will confer upon us the characteristics that we each hold to be fundamental in the role of a physician. Doing this may be next to impossible, as many of us know, you just don't know anything until you've lived it. (Insert whatever you like for "it").

    I direct you and others to my thread "education vs service in residency" for some further thoughts on the subject. I hope others have much to share on the subject.

    edit: I just noticed the subject heading of this post is "tier 2-3 programs" I really believe these are all top "tier" (whatever that means) programs. These are some of the best programs in the country with some of the most talented house staff and faculty. We do a disservice to them and ourselves by calling them "second tier".
     
    #2 drjitsu, Dec 10, 2008
    Last edited: Dec 10, 2008
  4. jdh71

    jdh71 epiphany at nine thousand six hundred feet
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    tier 2-3? :confused:

    Anyway . . .

    I personally like WashU > BID > Duke > UChi = NW = Mayo > UMich

    Obviously if this is your list, I don't want to hear any bitching. You really cannot go wrong with any of these programs. My ranking is based more on my own personal opinion and reputation and you'll see plenty of different arrangements. Someone with a list like this is lucky because they can just rank where they liked it best.
     
    #3 jdh71, Dec 10, 2008
    Last edited: Dec 10, 2008
  5. MidwestMD

    MidwestMD Junior Member
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    Like the other posters have said, you can't go wrong w/ any of these programs. Your fellowship options will pretty much be equal at any of them.

    As for reputation and rigor, these are obviously subjective and will vary from individual to individual. It really depends on where you want to live and who you got the best vibe from on the interview trail (housestaff, interviewers, city, etc).

    My personal opinion is that Duke > UofC = UMich = WashU > NW > Mayo = BID.
     
  6. Medikit

    Medikit Plastic Bag Middle Class
    Physician 10+ Year Member

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    The vibe at all of these places is very different as are the regions they are located. I wouldn't use an arbitrary ranking system but instead ask yourself where you would feel most comfortable.
     

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