MD Tips for Getting a Surgical Residency

[IsleyOfTheNorth]

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I'm a non-trad (>35 yo) M0 matriculating this Fall to a lower-tier MD school.

I'm angling towards surgery and, assuming I stay on that path, I'm trying to plan out my med school years so as to give me the best chance at matching. I'm going to assume that Step will be P/F by then unless I hear otherwise.

Now the question: How can I best present myself as a surgical residency candidate?

1. M1/M2: What can I do in M1 and M2 to increase my chances at matching surgery?

2. M3/M4: What I can do between now and M3 to best prepare for my surgical rotations?

3. What are some good ways of getting good connections with program directors and others? (Other than audition rotations.)

4. What stereotypes about surgeons are true?

5. How much will my age affect me? Would a serious increase in physical fitness increase my chances? I'm not in terrible shape, but hardly in great shape.

I'm not "Surgery or Bust", I just feel like it's the best fit for me. That may change of course, but for now that's my target.

Thank you in advance for your advice!

 

[longhaul3]

I'm a non-trad (>35 yo) M0 matriculating this Fall to a lower-tier MD school.

I'm angling towards surgery and, assuming I stay on that path, I'm trying to plan out my med school years so as to give me the best chance at matching. I'm going to assume that Step will be P/F by then unless I hear otherwise.

Now the question: How can I best present myself as a surgical residency candidate?

1. M1/M2: What can I do in M1 and M2 to increase my chances at matching surgery?

2. M3/M4: What I can do between now and M3 to best prepare for my surgical rotations?

3. What are some good ways of getting good connections with program directors and others? (Other than audition rotations.)

4. What stereotypes about surgeons are true?

5. How much will my age affect me? Would a serious increase in physical fitness increase my chances? I'm not in terrible shape, but hardly in great shape.

I'm not "Surgery or Bust", I just feel like it's the best fit for me. That may change of course, but for now that's my target.

Thank you in advance for your advice!

1. Research in your department of interest. If undecided, do research in the most competitive one you are considering. Shadow so you can realistically narrow your interest to 2-3 specialties.

2. Pay attention to your studies, learn anatomy better than average.

3. Get involved in your home department. Go to grand rounds when possible, meet the residents, get involved in research. If they already know you, they will be looking forward to when you get to rotate on service with them. Not likely that you will make meaningful connections with PDs outside of your own institution, although you may meet a few if you present your research at a national meeting. You said other than away rotations, but those are the most important.

4. Busy, detail-oriented, fast-paced, usually terse bordering on curt. Don't be offended when you get a one-word email reply.

5. Your fitness will not impact your ability to match unless you are so unfit that you can't make it through your surgery rotations and interviews. You will definitely be an outlier in terms of age, and the hardest part will be keeping up with your peers on overnight calls and such, which could be as often as q3-4 in-house for 3-4 years, plus q2ish senior/chief home call after that.

The most important factor in you matching in a surgical field is your desire to do so. Most people realize during their clerkships that they are not interested in that kind of life. If you decide you are, and you work for it, you will almost definitely be able to match in some surgical specialty.

 

[IsleyOfTheNorth]

Thank you very much for your reply!

... which could be as often as q3-4 in-house for 3-4 years, plus q2ish senior/chief home call after that.

What does q3-4 mean?

 

[Alkaidius]

The most important factor in you matching in a surgical field is your desire to do so. Most people realize during their clerkships that they are not interested in that kind of life. If you decide you are, and you work for it, you will almost definitely be able to match in some surgical specialty.

In my experience the surgeons can practically smell their own lol. Pretty sure my preceptor knew immediately I wasn’t interested and it really showed in both how I was treated and my reviews, despite me usually being pretty good about trying to stay engaged and interested.

What does q3-4 mean?

It means you’ll be getting paged every 3-4 hours.

 

[Dr. Anonymouss]

Thank you very much for your reply!



What does q3-4 mean?

q is a pharmacological letter meaning every

 

[IsleyOfTheNorth]

In my experience the surgeons can practically smell their own lol.

That's exactly it. I want to make sure I smell like a surgeon. 🙂

 

[Morc]

That's exactly it. I want to make sure I smell like a surgeon. 🙂

AXE body spray. Stock up now before the gunners do

 

[Tastysalmon]

Honestly gen surg isn’t that competitive to match to unless you’re angling for like MGH or something... just do well, get some research, honor your surg rotation and you'll be alright

 

[IsleyOfTheNorth]

Honestly gen surg isn’t that competitive to match to unless you’re angling for like MGH or something... just do well, get some research, honor your surg rotation and you'll be alright

So what would be some things I could to do to ensure that I honor my surgery rotation?

 

[libertyyne]

So what would be some things I could to do to ensure that I honor my surgery rotation?

you are jumping the gun here.
1. Do the best you can in school.
a. Ace your exams
b. Ace your boards
c.do not fail anything.
d. See C again.
2. Test your interest./build connections.
a. shadow a surgeon
b. go to grand rounds at your home program.
c. Do some research
d. attend a conference or two.
e. attend your surgical interest groups.
3. Do well on the wards.


There is no secret sauce. Most of it is hard work, and showing up.
Once you are done with all of that then apply.


Think really hard if that is the life you want to live tho.

 

[ciestar]

Thank you very much for your reply!



What does q3-4 mean?

It means call every 3-4 days lol

 

[CherryRedDracul]

It means call every 3-4 days lol

Yes, and it does NOT mean paged every 3-4 hours. Getting paged that few times is a gift from a higher power.

 

[IsleyOfTheNorth]

d. attend a conference or two.

Think really hard if that is the life you want to live tho.

Are there any conferences in particular that stand out as good opportunites? (I'll be on the East Coast if it matters.)

I'm thinking that I won't mind the lifestyle. I'm ex-military and a bit of a workaholic. Still, I'll do some shadowing as you suggested, just to be sure.

 

[CherryRedDracul]

Are there any conferences in particular that stand out as good opportunites? (I'll be on the East Coast if it matters.)

I'm thinking that I won't mind the lifestyle. I'm ex-military and a bit of a workaholic. Still, I'll do some shadowing as you suggested, just to be sure.

Depends on the surgical subspecialty. Conferences can really get you hyped about your specialty.

For example, the RSNA (Radiological Society of North America) Annual Meeting is the largest medical conference in the world, and it was an absolute blast. A little overwhelming actually.

 

[Pepe18]

.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

I'm thinking that I won't mind the lifestyle. I'm ex-military and a bit of a workaholic. Still, I'll do some shadowing as you suggested, just to be sure.

I’m current military and don’t want the surgery lifestyle lol. Just don’t prematurely close on surgery. You never know what you could fall in love with if you keep an open mind. Not saying you won’t, just putting it out there.

 

[IsleyOfTheNorth]

I’m current military and don’t want the surgery lifestyle lol. Just don’t prematurely close on surgery. You never know what you could fall in love with if you keep an open mind. Not saying you won’t, just putting it out there.

Definitely. I know I don't want pediatrics or ob-gyn. Beyond that, I'm very open to all specialties.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

Definitely. I know I don't want pediatrics or ob-gyn. Beyond that, I'm very open to all specialties.

Never know. I knew I wouldn't want to practice path, and now it's at the top of my list.

 

[longhaul3]

Thank you very much for your reply!

What does q3-4 mean?

No problem. I see others have already clarified, but it's every 3-4 nights. "q" means "every" and can be used with a lot of different units, but when it comes to call it means days.

Are there any conferences in particular that stand out as good opportunites? (I'll be on the East Coast if it matters.)

I'm thinking that I won't mind the lifestyle. I'm ex-military and a bit of a workaholic. Still, I'll do some shadowing as you suggested, just to be sure.

You would only want to go to the conferences that are relevant to the research you do in your specific field. As a med student it would be unusual to just register for and attend a conference that you're not presenting at, even once you're well along the way to matching in your specialty.

 

[OnePunchBiopsy]

Step 1:
Up your 1 rep max

 

[CherryRedDracul]

Conferences are not always the best places to network. Attendings want to have fun, catch up with their friends, relax, and not be bothered. Good chance anyone you meet there will forget you the next day. Conferences were a good way to go out drinking with the residents and attending at my home institution and bond that way

All you need to know is work hard, get some research done, and make friends with your home department. That's all. Network if the opportunities arises, but no reason to bend over backwards doing it. If you are interested in a place, you do an away rotation there and that's enough networking.

Eh, it really depends.

If you're willing to put yourself out there and meet new people, you can make new friends and connections. Attendings will introduce you to their colleagues, and you don't know where that can take off, especially when it comes down to fellowship and job opportunities. Networking doesn't necessarily mean throwing CVs around here or there. Simply knowing people who can vouch for you can be enough.

Or you can just hang out with your colleagues and generally go out there to have fun. Nothing wrong with that.

I do agree that there is not too much value for a medical student at conference compared to the cost unless they're first author for an educational exhibit, giving a talk, etc.

I got my fellowship spot lined up because I spoke to the right people and made the right connections.

 

[Dral]

I’m afraid your age could work against you. However, you can’t change that part about you, and I doubt you wouldn’t apply surg just for that reason alone.

 

[IsleyOfTheNorth]

I’m afraid your age could work against you. However, you can’t change that part about you, and I doubt you wouldn’t apply surg just for that reason alone.

Generally speaking, at what age are surgeons likely to retire?

 

[Dral]

Generally speaking, at what age are surgeons likely to retire?

I'm not really sure to be honest. I think it's less about true or perceived career time and more about the age you are when you start training for the purposes of getting trough training. Younger people, whether true or not, may be perceived as more resilient and able to make it through rough call days, waking up early/staying late, less likely to have family needs outside of work, more likely to 'fall in line' and to not be resistant to authority, etc.

 

[IsleyOfTheNorth]

I'm not really sure to be honest. I think it's less about true or perceived career time and more about the age you are when you start training for the purposes of getting trough training. Younger people, whether true or not, may be perceived as more resilient and able to make it through rough call days, waking up early/staying late, less likely to have family needs outside of work, more likely to 'fall in line' and to not be resistant to authority, etc.

That's gold, thank you! Now I can proactively address those concerns. Luckily, none of them should really be an issue for me - ex-military, no kids, etc.