Tips on how to survive medical school with a family

[Medwife16]

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Hi all! My Husband and I will be starting the Med school journey this coming August! Although we are both excited that he is accepted and finally going to pursue what he always wanted, we previously learned about the tough hours med/residency will entail. 1- We both love spending family time. He got accepted to school near both our parents but everyone tells us that he will barely have time for us/ 2- How do we cope with the overnight hours? We both hate the idea of him not coming home for dinner, to spend time with the kids, much less over night hours/rotation. How often are these 24 hour+ rotations that he won't come home to the family? We could use some advice. Family and friends just say Medical school is not for us since he is so family centered. However, this is truly what he has always wanted to do but because of the horrible hours he is having second thoughts.


-my apologies if I posted on the wrong threat, just started out in the forum.

 

[Chibucks15]

My fiancee moved 5 hours out to my school with me away from our families. I try to treat school like a regular full time job as much as possible. 7Am-6PM unless there are big exams. My neighbor has a wife and a toddler far away from their families and they're doing great. My school has a huge significant other group that organizes events for adults and playdates for people with kids and everything which I've heard really helps. Basically my fiancee told me its nice to have a group to go hang out with that understands some of the stressors that come along with medical school. I'm very family centered also and while its been stressful at times I've been able to balance it all to a relative degree

 

[Medwife16]

. 7Am-6PM unless there are big exams

How about 3/4 year. I had understood that there are 24+ rotations when you do not go home ?

 

[wanderingorion]

How about 3/4 year. I had understood that there are 24+ rotations when you do not go home ?

I think there are call nights pretty regularly on some rotations.

 

[jrlob91]

How about 3/4 year. I had understood that there are 24+ rotations when you do not go home ?

It depends on the rotation. Surgical rotations (gen surg, ob) will contain longer hours with some call days like you have described. Medicine is a long road, these days will only get longer when your husband transitions into residency and beyond. Understanding that and finding ways to support him is key to a marriage in med school and beyond. I have a wife and a toddler and would not have gotten through it without her support and willingness to sacrifice her life for 8+ years for me.

 

[Chibucks15]

How about 3/4 year. I had understood that there are 24+ rotations when you do not go home ?

There will be times where it isn't possible to be as available as you both would like...that's the nature of the job sometimes. But the best advice I got from a doc before I started was don't look too far ahead. Enjoy the present when its more possible to set your own schedule and find ways to lessen the stress of being on call. Like during a break time he calls home and talks to everyone or something along those lines. I medical school is something he's always wanted to do he will be mad at himself later on for not doing it. A lot of people make it through the whole process with families and kids, it isn't a walk in the park but it's doable

 

[Roxas]

My advice: ditch the family

 

[Sea Otter]

He won’t have to spend nights at the hospital during his first two years. During years three and four, 24 hour shifts are still not very common but do occur occasionally.


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[Perrotfish]

Hi all! My Husband and I will be starting the Med school journey this coming August! Although we are both excited that he is accepted and finally going to pursue what he always wanted, we previously learned about the tough hours med/residency will entail. 1- We both love spending family time. He got accepted to school near both our parents but everyone tells us that he will barely have time for us/ 2- How do we cope with the overnight hours? We both hate the idea of him not coming home for dinner, to spend time with the kids, much less over night hours/rotation. How often are these 24 hour+ rotations that he won't come home to the family? We could use some advice. Family and friends just say Medical school is not for us since he is so family centered. However, this is truly what he has always wanted to do but because of the horrible hours he is having second thoughts.
.

There are really three separate phases to this: preclinicals, clinicals, and residency:

Preclinicals: The first two years are just school: lectures (most schools don't make you attend in person) and lots of studying. There is a good chance that for those two years he will be physically present at home almost constantly as he watches lectures and studies. The difficulty here is finding a balance between study time and family time. It can be hard for many non-medical students to accept how many hours a medical student needs to study just to get through classes, and it can be hard for a perfectionist medical students to accept that its OK to take 10 hours more off each week even if it means droping from the top quartile of the class to the middle of the class. Its also tough to figure out how many hours is 'enough', since some people need to put in 80 hours just to stay at the middle of the class while others coast through in the top quartile working 40 hours per week. My advice: don't criticize him for putting to much time into studying, and neglecting the family, until he's had his first test. After that you can have a discussion, if you feel the need, based on his grade relative to the rest of his class. If he got a 95% on the first anatomy test he might be able to throttle down a bit, while if he got a 75% after around the clock studying then that just might be your life for the next two years. Finally be aware that preclinicals end with step 1 studying, 6 weeks of test preparation that even the most half assed medical students usually devote every waking hour to. During that time don't expect more than 10-20 minutes per day of support. On the other hand with preclinicals there is also a good amount of vacation time (a summer, winter break, and in many schools a spring break as well). when he has no responsibilities at all, so lots of time to get in memories then if you are free.

Clinicals: Clinicals suck, because they're actually two separate jobs that run in parallel to one another: you have to go the hospital and pretend to work there, and you also have to study for tests just like in preclinicals. The hours will vary enormously by school and rotation. We had one site at my school that expected students to take true Q4H overnight call. Others incorporated a day/night float system that involved 78 hours/week (6 13 hour shift per week) of work in the hospital, one week of which was at night. Other rotations were much more lax, with 40 hour/week schedules and frequent days off. Its entirely school dependent. The hardest part, though, was that on the brutal rotations you still needed to find another hour or two after you got home to plod through practice test questions. Again, though, there were quite a few weeks of total vacation time when I was completely free, much more than in a job, so that made up for the bad hours somewhat. The last 6 months or so of 4th year usually involves only 20-40 hours/week of work, so he will get lots of chances to see you during that time as well.

Residency: More than anything else, the residency that your spouse chooses will determine how hard this process will be on your family. Part of the issue is that residency is just harder, and part of the issue is that medical school, if you are struggling, tends to accommodate you, while residency generally will not. The number of hours required for residency, as well as the length of the residency, depends entirely on the residency you choose. Many ER, family medicine, and psychiatry residencies have no more than 2-3 months in the entire residency of 80 hours/week or 24 hour calls, and you finish training in 3 years. Many surgical residencies have almost nothing but 80 hour/week months, and those residencies last for 5 years. If your spouse chooses to pursue subspecialty training (for example to go from being a surgeon to a pediatric surgeon) he might be working those hours for as many as 8 years. There isn't much vacation either, 2-4 weeks/year depending on the residency and often no other holidays off. it sucks.

IMHO the most important conversation to have now, before you start, is to determine exactly how many years and hours of residency training you are willing to suffer through. Will you feel abandoned if he pursues a 5 year, around the clock surgery residency rather than a 3 year 60 hour/week family residency? Are you going to be OK if he subspecializes and adds an additional 1-3 years to his training after residency? Is he going to be OK if, after 4 years of hard work he has fallen in love with a surgical subspecialty but you say you need him to do a 3 year family residency program for the sake of his family? This isn't a question you want to answer after you are several years into this process.

I have seen lots of people make it through medical school with a family, but it helps if everyone is 100% clear about what they're getting into.

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

How about 3/4 year. I had understood that there are 24+ rotations when you do not go home ?

Yeah it happens, and it will for sure happen in residency. A big part of it is just making sure everyone involved has realistic expectations of what is going to happen during the school/training period. While training can be sucky there are many fields where you can have a much more manageable schedule once you get into practice, so ultimately I think it is worth it and that it takes recognizing the fact that time commitment of training =/ the time commitment for rest of your lives. You just have to put up with some long days until he gets there. I personally know multiple physicians with 5 kids and they had most of them during school/residency. The best thing your husband can do is probably find a doc he can talk to who has done all of this with a family to get some guidance and perspective.

 

[Goro]

Hi all! My Husband and I will be starting the Med school journey this coming August! Although we are both excited that he is accepted and finally going to pursue what he always wanted, we previously learned about the tough hours med/residency will entail. 1- We both love spending family time. He got accepted to school near both our parents but everyone tells us that he will barely have time for us/ 2- How do we cope with the overnight hours? We both hate the idea of him not coming home for dinner, to spend time with the kids, much less over night hours/rotation. How often are these 24 hour+ rotations that he won't come home to the family? We could use some advice. Family and friends just say Medical school is not for us since he is so family centered. However, this is truly what he has always wanted to do but because of the horrible hours he is having second thoughts.


-my apologies if I posted on the wrong threat, just started out in the forum.

Have them get used to this line of questioning:

You: What are you doing?
Him: Studying

 

[Snoopy2006]

@Perrotfish pretty much nailed it above. Everything in that post rings true.

Much of his (and your family's) success will depend on your commitment to the process. There will be many times when running the entire family falls to you. You have to expect and accept that so resentment doesn't develop. From a (former) med student's perspective, non medical family often find it difficult to understand or accept the hours we have to put in to succeed. There's always more to learn, more to do.

During my intern year, a couple of my best friends had absolute saints as wives. They handled absolutely everything on the family/kid side so their husbands could work their required hours and study. It's not going to be easy or fun, but both you and your husband will find ways to divide and conquer so that he can make it through school/residency and your family ends up in a better place years down the line. But it's going to be challenging at times.

 

[HomeSkool]

Family and friends just say Medical school is not for us since he is so family centered.

Spoken like people who have no clue what they're talking about.

I'll write you a more in-depth post some time tonight (I'm on -- guess what! -- night shift this week so I'll be up all night.) But let me just give you a little teaser: my first child was born 6 weeks after I started med school, my second was born during MS-3 year, my third was born during my second year of residency, and my fourth was born a few years after residency. Despite my training and career, I still find time to spend with my wife and kids.

 

[Goro]

Spoken like people who have no clue what they're talking about.

I'll write you a more in-depth post some time tonight (I'm on -- guess what! -- night shift this week so I'll be up all night.) But let me just give you a little teaser: my first child was born 6 weeks after I started med school, my second was born during MS-3 year, my third was born during my second year of residency, and my fourth was born a few few years after residency. Despite my training and career, I still find time to spend with my wife and kids.

You know, there's no good time to start a family when you're in Medicine until you hit Professor Emeritus. So one might as well have them whenever.

In every med school class, there will be people with kids. They're a resource for fellow parents.

For those of you considering getting married while in med school, just go to Las Vegas and have Elvis do it.

 

[HomeSkool]

You know, there's no good time to start a family when you're in Medicine until you hit Professor Emeritus. So one might as well have them whenever.

In every med school class, there will be people with kids. They're a resource for fellow parents.

For those of you considering getting married while in med school, just go to Las Vegas and have Elvis do it.

On my first day of medical school, one of the associate deans stood at the front of the room and said, "Look to your left. Now look to your right. In four years, 25% of you will have married one another."

 

[HomeSkool]

I know I said I'd write a more in-depth post tonight, but after reading the whole post history I feel like @Perrotfish covered nearly everything I would have said. I just have a couple of additions.

As I mentioned in my earlier post, my wife and I were growing our family throughout my medical training. On many occasions, I've had to miss birthdays, holidays, school programs, social events...you name it. But I've also been able to participate in many of those things, particularly since completing my residency training. As I've posted on several occasions: after residency, you can make your career whatever you want it to be. I have a colleague who's got a half-time contract with my department -- she works half as much as the rest of us, earns half as much, and spends lots more time with her kids. That's important to her, and she's arranged her life to balance things the way she wants them.

It can be hard for many non-medical students to accept how many hours a medical student needs to study just to get through classes, and it can be hard for a perfectionist medical students to accept that its OK to take 10 hours more off each week even if it means droping from the top quartile of the class to the middle of the class.

This is absolutely true. A major factor in my success and happiness is the fact that my wife went "all in" with me when I started school. She knew it would be very demanding, but neither of us fully appreciated the extent of my training's demands until I'd actually started. Once we understood what was required, though, my wife's attitude was, "I agreed to this of my own free will and choice, so I'll figure out how to adapt as needed." Never once did she punish me in any way, even when my schedule and academic requirements frustrated us both.

IMHO the most important conversation to have now, before you start, is to determine exactly how many years and hours of residency training you are willing to suffer through. Will you feel abandoned if he pursues a 5 year, around the clock surgery residency rather than a 3 year 60 hour/week family residency? Are you going to be OK if he subspecializes and adds an additional 1-3 years to his training after residency? Is he going to be OK if, after 4 years of hard work he has fallen in love with a surgical subspecialty but you say you need him to do a 3 year family residency program for the sake of his family? This isn't a question you want to answer after you are several years into this process.

My take on this is similar but not identical. I believe the decision at this point should be binary: you're either willing to tolerate any residency or you aren't. Many medical students have no idea of their final specialty when they start school. I personally went through about five different things before I discovered the second love of my life (anesthesiology). What if your husband gets halfway through school and realizes he'll only be happy as a CT surgeon? If you two have agreed that you'll tolerate nothing more than a four-year, 60-hour-per-week residency, he'll have gone through years of grueling training with no hope of landing the career of his dreams. That can lead to career dissatisfaction and resentment, which will put a huge amount of strain on your relationship indefinitely. So I feel it would be a mistake for you to say -- prior to him even starting med school -- "you can specialize in X but not Y." However, since he's voluntarily entered into a marital relationship with you, the decision isn't solely his, and you shouldn't be expected to blindly subjugate your will to his. I believe you two should discuss things very openly and come to a joint decision of whether you're "all in" or "all out". If you're "all in", you both accept the risk that he'll fall in love with a specialty that places greater demands on his time. If you're "all out", you don't accept that risk, and he should consider other careers.

Plenty of people get through med school with families. It requires time management from the student, patience from the spouse, and sacrifice by both. Easy? No. Worth it? For my family, yes. But only the two of you can decide what's right for yours.

 

[Perrotfish]

I believe the decision at this point should be binary: you're either willing to tolerate any residency or you aren't. Many medical students have no idea of their final specialty when they start school. I personally went through about five different things before I discovered the second love of my life (anesthesiology). What if your husband gets halfway through school and realizes he'll only be happy as a CT surgeon?

I'll disagree with this. I think it's a perfectly reasonable compromise to ask someone not to pursue a residency/fellowship training that is heavy on hours, or that lasts more than 4 years, as long as they know that's the deal before they start school.

Lots of medical students make their peace with not being CT surgeons or Orthos because of their grades, or because of the requirement of their NHSC/military scholarships, so I don't see why someone couldn't do the same because of their family.

 

[HomeSkool]

I'll disagree with this. I think it's a perfectly reasonable compromise to ask someone not to pursue a residency/fellowship training that is heavy on hours, or that lasts more than 4 years, as long as they know that's the deal before they start school.

Lots of medical students make their peace with not being CT surgeons or Orthos because of their grades, or because of the requirement of their NHSC/military scholarships, so I don't see why someone couldn't do the same because of their family.

A lot of that depends on the psychological compositions of the OP and her husband. It's much easier for me to accept grade-based than other types of limitations. I decided I wanted to be a doctor more than a decade before I met my wife, and she realized as early as our first date that to be with me was to accept giving me considerable autonomy over my choice of specialty. She understood that, and she chose to pursue a relationship with me anyway. If she'd been unwilling to do so, we both could have cut bait before things got serious. That's what worked for the two of us: we each decided what we could and couldn't accept in our relationship before things went too far.

The OP and her husband are in the opposite situation: my wife and I had to decide if a relationship was compatible with my preexisting career goals, while the OP and her husband must determine what career goals are compatible with their preexisting relationship. If my wife and I were in that situation, our first decision point (prior to even applying to med school) would have been, "Are we both willing to see this through, wherever this road may take us?" If the answer was "no" for either of us, the whole thing would've been a no-go and I would've looked at other careers with which we both could be happy. That's the framework from which I made my recommendations to the OP.

The qualifier in all of this is that everyone's wired differently. For my wife and I -- and, I suspect, for a great many other people -- the decision must be binary: both feet in or both feet out. Others will be better served by the approach you suggest: determine a middle ground acceptable to both parties.

What I think we can agree on (I hope) is that the OP and her husband need to decide the best approach for their family prior to starting med school, and they need to remain on the same page with one another throughout. After they decide what, if any, limitations they'll jointly accept to his specialty choice, an attempt by either party to unilaterally change things could generate a sense of betrayal and resentment in the other. These decisions are important enough that they must be made (and altered, if necessary) by both parties together.

 

[ortnakas]

Don’t have kids, but I can comment on being married in medical school:
1) be married to someone that understands that med school usually has to come first. The answer to “what are you doing” will always be studying, so they have to be adept at finding their own hobbies and entertainment because watching you read is boring. You’re not going to pull your weight in chores, and you won’t have time to do lots of fun things all the time and you might have to, say, cram for your second year final on their birthday instead of going out with their friends. Make sure your spouse is aware and cool with this.
2) be someone who knows when to put your marriage first. You’ll know this is happening when you see it. #1 means this means you shouldn’t have to throw Step 1 or anything crazy, but sometimes you’re going to have to take less than an A to do something with or be there for your spouse, and you have to be okay with it.
3) don’t forget your spouse has a life outside of med school. You’re going to be swamped with studying and stress and exam nerves, but they’ll have work stress and life stress too. Even if it seems minor compared to the impending doom that Step 1 feels like, it’s not minor to them, so don’t trivialize it.

 

[Mr. Saigon]

Don’t have kids, but I can comment on being married in medical school:
1) be married to someone that understands that med school usually has to come first. The answer to “what are you doing” will always be studying, so they have to be adept at finding their own hobbies and entertainment because watching you read is boring. You’re not going to pull your weight in chores, and you won’t have time to do lots of fun things all the time and you might have to, say, cram for your second year final on their birthday instead of going out with their friends. Make sure your spouse is aware and cool with this.
2) be someone who knows when to put your marriage first. You’ll know this is happening when you see it. #1 means this means you shouldn’t have to throw Step 1 or anything crazy, but sometimes you’re going to have to take less than an A to do something with or be there for your spouse, and you have to be okay with it.
3) don’t forget your spouse has a life outside of med school. You’re going to be swamped with studying and stress and exam nerves, but they’ll have work stress and life stress too. Even if it seems minor compared to the impending doom that Step 1 feels like, it’s not minor to them, so don’t trivialize it.

When did you tie the knot?