Too Ambitious?

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What is up the large number of stellar applicants this year thinking they're not worthy? As soon as I get some time I'm gonna write a sticky post to address this stuff because we're just repeating ourselves at this point.
 
The only thing I would lose is the "a volunteer experience in a clinical research study" bit. It sounds like you're just reaching to fill up your app.
 
What is up the large number of stellar applicants this year thinking they're not worthy? As soon as I get some time I'm gonna write a sticky post to address this stuff because we're just repeating ourselves at this point.

On the pre-allo board they would be accused of flaunting their excellent credentials. Good thing such talk doesn't fly here. 😉

I think the major problem is that MD-PhD program don't routinely publish their average MCAT and GPA scores, so applicants are stuck knowing that they probably need to score higher than the medical school average found in the MSAR, but not by how much.

I've heard rumblings that the head honchos at the NIH are trying to motivate all the programs to put this information together and publish it in a nice, official form, but don't know if that's true or how long it'll take.
 
http://www.aamc.org/members/great/mdphd/presentations/garrisonhandout.pdf

Page 3: Interview Invites
Not invited: n=800, 3.46 / 28.1
Invited: n=898, 3.77 / 33.9

Page 4: Acceptances Post Interview
No offers: n=314, 3.68 / 32.7
One offer: n=310, 3.71 / 34.0
One offer from nonMSTP & MSTP: n=36, 3.71 / 33.8
Multi offer from nonMSTP & MSTP: n=9, 3.82 / 35.7
Multi offer from only MSTP: n=199, 3.81 / 35.7
Multi offer from only nonMSTP: n=30, 3.73 / 32.9
 
That is a sweet pdf. Finally some recent and realistic data about MD/PhD.

Thanks for post.
 
Thanks everyone for your advice! It was all very helpful! 🙂
 
What is up the large number of stellar applicants this year thinking they're not worthy? As soon as I get some time I'm gonna write a sticky post to address this stuff because we're just repeating ourselves at this point.

If I were an AdCom, the OP would lose major points from me.

They are either:

a) lying

b) being braggadocios

c) long on bookmarks, but dumber than a sack of bricks when it comes to common sense

None of these virtues are attractive in a potential MD/PhD
 
Excuse me sir, but I'll have you know that I am dumber than MULTIPLE bags of bricks. Perhaps three. Maybe four. Hard to say.

Definitely smarter than one alone, though. That's for sure. Oooh, shiny.
 
Yeesh GWD, calm down 🙂

I doubt they're lying. I don't think many people come in here to brag. The national average for accepted students is so high we're pretty much splitting hairs to brag anyways. As for c, stupid questions are allowed. If you can't ask them here, where else can you ask them? I ask to keep the forum a friendly place to ask questions.

My first post:

http://drslounge.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=3886

(lol at thread #3886, this is thread #539130, I'd move it to the MD/PhD forum but it didn't exist back then 😎)
 
I'm going to have to disagree with you on this one Neuronix.

I can appreciate your ambivalence, even your benevolence, but I stand by what I said.

That post was SOOOO stupid, it is verging on asininity.

I only get a chance to check out a couple of threads a day, and this one is complete garbage.

We all know that in the current funding environment, the NIH is not going to hold your hand, let alone tolerate such an insolent lack of judgement.

But in the interest of amicability, I'll defer to your comments... and hope I pick a thread with more substance tomorrow.
 
I'm going to have to disagree with you on this one Neuronix.

I can appreciate your ambivalence, even your benevolence, but I stand by what I said.

That post was SOOOO stupid, it is verging on asininity.

I only get a chance to check out a couple of threads a day, and this one is complete garbage.

We all know that in the current funding environment, the NIH is not going to hold your hand, let alone tolerate such an insolent lack of judgement.

But in the interest of amicability, I'll defer to your comments... and hope I pick a thread with more substance tomorrow.

:bang:


dude - SDN has way better icons now!
 
Dude if you do not have chance, than I am (with my 32 and 3.8) a goner for sure.

I will agree with GWD on this: if you have acquired 3.98, sure you know how difficult and rare it is. You should (at least in theory) know that you have a very good shot at any of the schools.

The original question, however, can be stated differently. "How can I improve my odds?" If you add more clinical service and volunteer work, it will greatly help you app.

That being said, I will cut little slack to the OP as I went to through my crisis after I got my MCAT back last week.

Anyway, good luck to all 09ers
 
If I were an AdCom, the OP would lose major points from me.

They are either:

a) lying

b) being braggadocios

c) long on bookmarks, but dumber than a sack of bricks when it comes to common sense

None of these virtues are attractive in a potential MD/PhD.

GWD said:
I'm going to have to disagree with you on this one Neuronix.

I can appreciate your ambivalence, even your benevolence, but I stand by what I said.

That post was SOOOO stupid, it is verging on asininity.

I only get a chance to check out a couple of threads a day, and this one is complete garbage.

We all know that in the current funding environment, the NIH is not going to hold your hand, let alone tolerate such an insolent lack of judgement.

But in the interest of amicability, I'll defer to your comments... and hope I pick a thread with more substance tomorrow.
Hopefully if and when you ever do become an adcom you will be more compassionate, GW. Has it been so long since you applied to medical school that you've forgotten already how intimidating and impersonal the entire process can be? The OP is obviously very bright and accomplished. She is also afraid of not measuring up somehow in spite of her accomplishments, just as all of us were at some point when we were in her position. Why is it unacceptable for even high-achieving people like the OP to admit to having insecurities and doubts? As a 19-year-old college student who is currently throwing herself neck-deep into the fray, is she really in a position to be able to objectively evaluate her own competitiveness? She has presumably only read one app (her own), and she has no experience with the process (assuming she is a first time applicant). The judgment you insist she should have is the kind of perspective that one only gains from experience. There is a reason why one must work their way through the ranks before becoming a PI. It is patently unfair to conclude that she will have poor judgment decades from now based on her current insecurity (and insolently unkind as well).
 
I'm with GWD on this one. I have to say that these questions are pretty senseless sometime, but more likely lazy to me. Rather than asking vaguely if one is competitive, why not just go on the MD/Ph.D website for a particular school and look at the average statistics for acceptance? I checked out the stats for each school prior to applying and even looked at potential researchers I would be interested in working with if I was accepted for each school. Sure, that takes time, but I think potential applicants should learn to take more initiative rather than expecting to get hand-fed.
 
I'm with GWD on this one. I have to say that these questions are pretty senseless sometime, but more likely lazy to me. Rather than asking vaguely if one is competitive, why not just go on the MD/Ph.D website for a particular school and look at the average statistics for acceptance? I checked out the stats for each school prior to applying and even looked at potential researchers I would be interested in working with if I was accepted for each school. Sure, that takes time, but I think potential applicants should learn to take more initiative rather than expecting to get hand-fed.
unfortunately, not all schools have these stats on their websites. Furthermore, its not exactly clear if one is competitive for a particular school.
Not that this burden should be placed solely on the shoulder of sdn, but rather, as people who have been accepted, you guys have a better idea of what each school is like than us applicants.

Other than that, I agree with you.
 
Stats alone do not an acceptance make. We've all heard the stories of the high stat folks who don't get in anywhere, and I can tell you that my school really does reject people with 4.0/40 stats if they don't have the right "fit." Where do you suppose the OP should look up info about her ECs or potential program fit?

If any of y'all try to say that you've never asked a "stupid" or "lazy" question, I'm calling you out for your selective memory. Any time you start something new, you're going to be in a position where you don't know much, even if you knew a lot in your previous environment. You're going to ask some questions that are pretty silly in an objective sense, but that aren't so silly in context. I can tell you that I've never been as stupid and bumbling in all my life as I am now that I'm a third year med student. It's a good thing I don't wear shoes that have to be tied. 😉
 
To the OP:

I see you pulled your info - I had seen it briefly and thought your list was fine and appropriate for your stats. Good luck in the process.

Regarding cluelessness in the process:

This is summer and I hold a lot of meetings with premeds at all places in the process about their applications. Within the last week I've spoken to:

1. Someone with an undergrad degree from an Ivy League school who is convinced they will get accepted to a top 20 school with a GPA of 3.0 and an MCAT of 30 because of all their ECs and their school's name.

2. Someone with a great GPA, an MCAT of 32 and wants to go to a state school who is worried about whether they should retake the MCAT.

3. Someone nearing completion of a doctoral degree in the sciences with absolutely no idea of what classes they need to take as pre-req's, and how to even remotely discuss their career to date, etc.

So, SDN is here because very smart people do not understand the process of med school (and other doctoral level medical professions) well. MD/PhD is the most mysterious of them all and it is not surprising that myths are out there.

So, be nice, and if you can't, then just let it slide. Most of these clueless folks will figure it out and if they are asking then they're on the right track. Premed advisors are, IMHO, a major source of wrong advice especially related to academic medicine, so it can be difficult to find out the realities.

Of the 3 above, only #1 annoyed me because they didn't want to listen to what I had to tell them and were a bit hostile to me for telling them the reality they had asked me to tell them (by virtue of coming in for a session...). People like hearing good news (#2), they'll often accept what they need to do (#3), but being told that they need to reconsider what schools they can get into isn't as popular to hear.
 
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