Too late for ERAS?

[MellyFresh]

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Hello all. I haven't actually posted here since before med school, but I'm reaching out to everyone on this. I've looked through somewhat similar posts, but they seem to be from 2008 or so.

I am a 4th year medical student who had taken the year off to pursue an international research opportunity in Asia. Two months into the fellowship, I had a family emergency and now I'm back in the US. I'm wondering if I can still hustle a residency application for Emergency Med.

Things in my favor:
250+ Step 1
AOA
4.0 (yeah, we still have letter grades)
Intense extra-curriculars (co-founded clinic, tutoring, etc)
NIH research fellowship
Published first author for trauma-related piece

Things that hurt me:
It's super late
Haven't taken Step 2 yet (was planning to take it when I got back next year)
No SLOEs for emergency med. Can get one my November 1 and a second before December
The earliest I can do an away is November


Should I just try again next year? My dean says I can come back at the end of October and still finish, but I don't want to risk not getting the right program.

Thank you all in advance for your input!

 

[Ronin786]

Why don't you just apply and see what happens? Choose good programs you'd be interested in and apply to them and maybe send emails letting them know what your situation is.

If you get interviews then go on them, if not get getting sorted out and go for it again next year.

 

[MellyFresh]

Thanks a million for the quick response and the good advice! I think I'm torturing myself because my research fellowship will keep me on stateside until December so I'm trying to be decisive. But this makes sense because I can gauge the response and take it from there. Thanks again.

 

[cal8719]

tough call... I really don't know what to tell you.


Just thought I would mention that on ERAS there is a question that asks "Have you ever applied for residency before."

Not saying that is definitely a bad thing, just a thing.

 

[NotAProgDirector]

tough call... I really don't know what to tell you.


Just thought I would mention that on ERAS there is a question that asks "Have you ever applied for residency before."

Not saying that is definitely a bad thing, just a thing.

If there is such a question, I can't see it from my end.

 

[mercaptovizadeh]

Hello all. I haven't actually posted here since before med school, but I'm reaching out to everyone on this. I've looked through somewhat similar posts, but they seem to be from 2008 or so.

I am a 4th year medical student who had taken the year off to pursue an international research opportunity in Asia. Two months into the fellowship, I had a family emergency and now I'm back in the US. I'm wondering if I can still hustle a residency application for Emergency Med.

Things in my favor:
250+ Step 1
AOA
4.0 (yeah, we still have letter grades)
Intense extra-curriculars (co-founded clinic, tutoring, etc)
NIH research fellowship
Published first author for trauma-related piece

Things that hurt me:
It's super late
Haven't taken Step 2 yet (was planning to take it when I got back next year)
No SLOEs for emergency med. Can get one my November 1 and a second before December
The earliest I can do an away is November


Should I just try again next year? My dean says I can come back at the end of October and still finish, but I don't want to risk not getting the right program.

Thank you all in advance for your input!

What is your goal in terms of residency? Community? Mid-tier? Top-tier?

I think from your stats you would be great at mid-tier programs even now. Otherwise your application is pretty much top-tier, but you have some pieces missing, i.e. late application and letters. On thing you could do if you are deadset on a top-tier place, is take another year off doing research or whatever and then apply next September. Of course, that's a drastic option and may not be worth the time for you...

 

[MellyFresh]

Thanks for the input. That's the option. I'm still able to do my current research until January, at which time I'm sure I can find something reasonably worthwhile to do. I'll still get the publications, etc out of the current fellowship so it won't be a wasted year. I'm not deadset on a top tier program, but I don't want to miss out on one because of paperwork/interviews fill up. BUT, I am back in the US with family problems that would be helped if I just finished school and started getting through residency.

 

[gutonc]

Thanks for the input. That's the option. I'm still able to do my current research until January, at which time I'm sure I can find something reasonably worthwhile to do. I'll still get the publications, etc out of the current fellowship so it won't be a wasted year. I'm not deadset on a top tier program, but I don't want to miss out on one because of paperwork/interviews fill up. BUT, I am back in the US with family problems that would be helped if I just finished school and started getting through residency.

Family issues and starting residency can be a volatile mix.

 

[MellyFresh]

Yes, that is most often the truth. These problems are more financial than anything; the joys of taking care of aging parents!

 

[membrname]

Family issues and starting residency can be a volatile mix.

Do you think it would be harmful to address family issues in an interview? I have major issues that affected my medical school performance big time (mom died, dad started abusing drugs, siblings subsequently put into foster homes). I know they would wonder if I'd let those same problems affect me during residency, but I really have learned how to cope with them a lot better now. I want to let interviewers know my reasons for blemishes on my application, but don't want to scare them away from ranking me

 

[gutonc]

Do you think it would be harmful to address family issues in an interview? I have major issues that affected my medical school performance big time (mom died, dad started abusing drugs, siblings subsequently put into foster homes). I know they would wonder if I'd let those same problems affect me during residency, but I really have learned how to cope with them a lot better now. I want to let interviewers know my reasons for blemishes on my application, but don't want to scare them away from ranking me

They're going to ask about your med school performance, what happened and how you managed it. So while I wouldn't be the one to bring it up, expect to have to address it.

 

[JediZero]

OP, it really depends on what you want. You have to weigh your family's needs against what you can realistically provide for them while you're here, and how much the research fellowship means to you. There's no wrong or right answer.

If you can get ERAS in this week and schedule away rotations ASAP, you might still have a shot. EM is a bit slow in the cycle, it seems like invites just started picking up this week (many have yet to send any). The SLOE is a problem, but you can contact programs and let them know what's up. You're a very strong candidate, and I would imagine they would be accommodating provided everything else is in order. Do you have other LOR's?

Do you think it would be harmful to address family issues in an interview? I have major issues that affected my medical school performance big time (mom died, dad started abusing drugs, siblings subsequently put into foster homes). I know they would wonder if I'd let those same problems affect me during residency, but I really have learned how to cope with them a lot better now. I want to let interviewers know my reasons for blemishes on my application, but don't want to scare them away from ranking me

We all have to learn to deal with stuff on top of medical school, but yours sounds truly awful. I'm sorry to hear what happened. Still, you're human, and at least some programs will listen to your story. The story you want to tell is a) this is what happened and what emotional, temporal and material effects it had on my performance, b) things have resolved to the point where they are manageable (unless that is unequivocally not the case), and c) here is what I've learned, how I've grown, what I'm doing to compensate, and why I will be a better doctor because of it. The last point is the most important, and it's the real answer to any "what are your weaknesses" question.

The first two points should be addressed in the "explain any gaps or lapses in your medical education" box in ERAS. The third should be in your personal statement and interviews.

 

[MellyFresh]

OP, it really depends on what you want. You have to weigh your family's needs against what you can realistically provide for them while you're here, and how much the research fellowship means to you. There's no wrong or right answer.

If you can get ERAS in this week and schedule away rotations ASAP, you might still have a shot. EM is a bit slow in the cycle, it seems like invites just started picking up this week (many have yet to send any). The SLOE is a problem, but you can contact programs and let them know what's up. You're a very strong candidate, and I would imagine they would be accommodating provided everything else is in order. Do you have other LOR's?



We all have to learn to deal with stuff on top of medical school, but yours sounds truly awful. I'm sorry to hear what happened. Still, you're human, and at least some programs will listen to your story. The story you want to tell is a) this is what happened and what emotional, temporal and material effects it had on my performance, b) things have resolved to the point where they are manageable (unless that is unequivocally not the case), and c) here is what I've learned, how I've grown, what I'm doing to compensate, and why I will be a better doctor because of it. The last point is the most important, and it's the real answer to any "what are your weaknesses" question.

The first two points should be addressed in the "explain any gaps or lapses in your medical education" box in ERAS. The third should be in your personal statement and interviews.

Thanks JediZero! I've been dealing with the same family stuff for 15 years and have been lucky enough to not have my grades suffer (I have a great husband, great friends, low sleep requirements, and a hardwired ability to multitask). They are stable demands of two disabled parents. I just could not remain in China because I need to help them financially (as I have in the past) and my husband will have better work here and I will have more income to make this possible than when I was in China. When I took the research opportunity, we had a what I thought would remain a stable care-taking situation which unexpectedly failed.

I can get ERAS in by the middle of next week since my Dean is on board. Still worried about getting an away but if I'm open to different programs, it looks like something might be open per VSAS. I also contacted a couple of program directors and coordinators to have them weigh in. The consensus was that it's not too late for me! I have 2 LORs (surgery and an IM faculty who helped develop our free clinic) which will be uploaded this week and I can get one SLOE from my home institution for a rotation I did through the department (my worry is that we do not have a residency program). I will take that advice of informing programs of delays in SLOE. Hopefully they will understand.

Last question: With all this hustling, I won't be able to take step 2 until the end of Dec. I'm hoping to float my application until then with my step 1 score. Am I dreaming?

Thanks!

 

[MellyFresh]

Do you think it would be harmful to address family issues in an interview? I have major issues that affected my medical school performance big time (mom died, dad started abusing drugs, siblings subsequently put into foster homes). I know they would wonder if I'd let those same problems affect me during residency, but I really have learned how to cope with them a lot better now. I want to let interviewers know my reasons for blemishes on my application, but don't want to scare them away from ranking me

I have had troubles with family but your story is truly heartbreaking and I'm sure the right programs will see how resilient and strong you are!!

 

[mcl]

Last question: With all this hustling, I won't be able to take step 2 until the end of Dec. I'm hoping to float my application until then with my step 1 score. Am I dreaming?

Thanks!

I believe that with the stats you posted above, few programs will have any hesitation in offering an interview if they have one to offer, regardless of when you take Step 2. Go ahead and schedule it so you can respond with an actual date if they asked.

 

[JediZero]

Thanks JediZero! I've been dealing with the same family stuff for 15 years and have been lucky enough to not have my grades suffer (I have a great husband, great friends, low sleep requirements, and a hardwired ability to multitask). They are stable demands of two disabled parents. I just could not remain in China because I need to help them financially (as I have in the past) and my husband will have better work here and I will have more income to make this possible than when I was in China. When I took the research opportunity, we had a what I thought would remain a stable care-taking situation which unexpectedly failed.

I can get ERAS in by the middle of next week since my Dean is on board. Still worried about getting an away but if I'm open to different programs, it looks like something might be open per VSAS. I also contacted a couple of program directors and coordinators to have them weigh in. The consensus was that it's not too late for me! I have 2 LORs (surgery and an IM faculty who helped develop our free clinic) which will be uploaded this week and I can get one SLOE from my home institution for a rotation I did through the department (my worry is that we do not have a residency program). I will take that advice of informing programs of delays in SLOE. Hopefully they will understand.

Last question: With all this hustling, I won't be able to take step 2 until the end of Dec. I'm hoping to float my application until then with my step 1 score. Am I dreaming?

Thanks!

You're welcome! I'm only an applicant myself, so take my advice with a grain of salt, but I'm trying to keep my ear to the ground as much as everyone else here. 😉

You did a smart thing by being proactive and calling PD's to see if this was feasible. By the numbers on page ten, only 20% of programs would give an interview invite without Step 2 scores, so that may be something of a gamble. However, as you've discovered, PD's are people, too, and I'm sure many would both be willing to hear your story and be thrilled to have you as a candidate. There will probably be some that won't do it because it's a hassle, but enough should be on board to make this possible.

Still, if it's at all possible, try to take boards earlier. It will keep more doors open, and that's really the main thing you need right now. =)

 

[MellyFresh]

I believe that with the stats you posted above, few programs will have any hesitation in offering an interview if they have one to offer, regardless of when you take Step 2. Go ahead and schedule it so you can respond with an actual date if they asked.

Thanks for weighing in!

I lied. I have one more question. I'm not sure if I mention returning from Asia in my PS. I drafted it and it's already a page and I'm not 100% sure on if it's appropriate to address it here. Thank you all again!

 

[MellyFresh]

You're welcome! I'm only an applicant myself, so take my advice with a grain of salt, but I'm trying to keep my ear to the ground as much as everyone else here. 😉

You did a smart thing by being proactive and calling PD's to see if this was feasible. By the numbers on page ten, only 20% of programs would give an interview invite without Step 2 scores, so that may be something of a gamble. However, as you've discovered, PD's are people, too, and I'm sure many would both be willing to hear your story and be thrilled to have you as a candidate. There will probably be some that won't do it because it's a hassle, but enough should be on board to make this possible.

Still, if it's at all possible, try to take boards earlier. It will keep more doors open, and that's really the main thing you need right now. =)

Thanks for the response! I'm hoping I've tapped into the 20% because the ones I'm applying to have on their websites that they don't require Step 2 before consideration. I hope this is accurate! Only time will tell, haha.

 

[JediZero]

Thanks for the response! I'm hoping I've tapped into the 20% because the ones I'm applying to have on their websites that they don't require Step 2 before consideration. I hope this is accurate! Only time will tell, haha.

Yep. And don't be afraid to check with the ones who don't say, or even the ones who say that they do require it- the worst they can do is say no. 😉