Top 5 please.

[Marsdgrove33133]

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Hello there people. I need some advice. My pre-med advisor doesn’t approve of any foreign med school so i took it upon myself to find this list of schools and i am wondering if you guys can tell me which the top 5 are. Please include some info on why,(i.e. Stafford Loans, Residency, etc) This would help me out a lot. Thanks and good luck to everyone who is trying to get in.

Mars 😀


University of Health Sciences (Antigua)
American University of the Caribbean (St. Marten)
Central American Health Sciences University (Belize)
Grace University School of Medicine (Belize)
International University of the Health Sciences (St. Kitts)
Medical University of the Americas (Nevis)
Ross University School of Medicine (Dominica)
Saba University School of Medicine (Saba)
Spartan Health Sciences University (St. Lucia)
University of Sint Eustasius Medical School (St. Eustasius)
St. George's University School of Medicine (Grenada)
St. James School of Medicine (Bonaire)
St. Mary's School of Medicine (St. Lucia)
Universidad Iberoamericana (Santo Domingo)
St. Martinus (Curacao)

 

[Top Gun]

I can tell you what the top 4 are: SGU, Ross, AUC, and Saba. I'm not sure what the fifth one would be. Maybe St. Matthew's or MUA-Nevis.

 

[McGillGrad]

There are only 4 that allow you to be licensed in all 50 states. The rest do not. That is the only way you can categorize them.

AUC, SGU, Ross and Saba

 

[Top Gun]

There are only 4 that allow you to be licensed in all 50 states. The rest do not. That is the only way you can categorize them.

AUC, SGU, Ross and Saba

Oh yeah, I forgot, only the ones I mentioned allow you to be licensed in all 50 states. If you go to St. Matthew's for instance, they don't have California approval, so you can't get a license to practice there, or in a few other states.

 

[rimon7381]

St. George's University
American University of the Caribbean
Saba University
Ross University

these 4 are recognized by all 50 states including NY and CA.
Among the 4 Saba is the cheapest and St. George's is the most expensive one in terms of tuition.

 

[oldpro]

I agree the 4 then MUA and maybe SMU loans are now a bigger problem and these schools have loans, all 6

 

[JoeNamaMD]

I can tell you what the top 4 are: SGU, Ross, AUC, and Saba. I'm not sure what the fifth one would be. Maybe St. Matthew's or MUA-Nevis.

Out of the top 4 I would stay away from the other schools, SGU Ross and AUC have high USMLE pass rates. The proof? They all qualify for Stafford loans, one of the criteria to get Stafford loans for an off shore program is their USMLE pass rate. UAG is another option which is in Mexico but is 6 years in length.

Saba is not yet recognized in Texas. Only AUC, SGU, Ross, and UAG grads are able to practice in Texas.

 

[Marsdgrove33133]

Guys thanks for the Help. I have another question. My brother went to SGU however he doesnt really know that much about the other three schools. I would like to know about AUC's and SABA's 3rd year and 4th year. I know that SGU takes care of everything for their students and that ROSS is not that bad but i dont know about AUC and SABA. For example. Are the clinicals all done in one hospital or are they spread out? Does the school set them up for you or do you have to do everything yourself? I saw the list of schools on AUC and SABA but i have heard that they might be DO "friendly" hospitals.

Again thanks for the help

Mars

 

[oldpro]

Out of the top 4 I would stay away from the other schools, SGU Ross and AUC have high USMLE pass rates. The proof? They all qualify for Stafford loans, one of the criteria to get Stafford loans for an off shore program is their USMLE pass rate. UAG is another option which is in Mexico but is 6 years in length.

Saba is not yet recognized in Texas. Only AUC, SGU, Ross, and UAG grads are able to practice in Texas.

No Offense but you have no idea what you are talking about! SABA is an Awesome school and has no federal loans

MUA and SMU are doing ok

MUA and SABA are owned by the same people

All grads from all schools can practice in Texas you do not have to be approved, the approval is for clinicals Like NY, it is case by case for any FMG in Texas.

Federal Loans are grandfathered in and Congress has tried twice over the last 10 years to take them away from the Caribbean schools, these schools had the loans 20 years ago and it was decieded some years ago that no new Caribbean school could have the federal aid so no other school then SGU, AUC and ROSS can qualify, ( Has nothing to do with USMLE PASS RATES, in fact the way the test is given now is different then a few years ago)

but many could if it was allowed.

(I see I must keep checking and posting here to dis-spell the misinformation posted at times, when I read it see my avatar )

Please lets stick to the facts and whats true not what you think is true.

 

[godschosenone]

There are only 4 that allow you to be licensed in all 50 states. The rest do not. That is the only way you can categorize them.

AUC, SGU, Ross and Saba

Uh, no, actually, it's not the only way... I remember having a pre-medical advisor; what a waste of money. "My pre-med advisor does not approve of foreign medical schools." Why would s/he be allowed to approve or disapprove of any decision such as this? If you're going to consider Caribbean med schools, simply eliminate the nonsense that spews forth from the mouth of your pre-med advisor. Apparently he knows little to nothing of anything except the narrow perspective from which his eyes see. Do your own research, and you will see for yourself.

 

[Meatwad]

Uh, no, actually, it's not the only way... I remember having a pre-medical advisor; what a waste of money. "My pre-med advisor does not approve of foreign medical schools." Why would s/he be allowed to approve or disapprove of any decision such as this? If you're going to consider Caribbean med schools, simply eliminate the nonsense that spews forth from the mouth of your pre-med advisor. Apparently he knows little to nothing of anything except the narrow perspective from which his eyes see. Do your own research, and you will see for yourself.

McGillGrad has a valid point. If your plan is to practice in the US, choosing a Caribbean school that doesn't allow you to go to Cali has big disadvantages.

1) Large amount of population lives in California. By barring yourself from practicing there, you are keeping yourself out of a big market.

2) Lots of residency programs in Cali. More programs you can apply to = better chance at matching

3) Who knows how many more states will follow California's list of approved/disapproved schools in the future? You willing to take that gamble?

 

[pavel_freidman]

Guys thanks for the Help. I have another question. My brother went to SGU however he doesnt really know that much about the other three schools. I would like to know about AUC's and SABA's 3rd year and 4th year. I know that SGU takes care of everything for their students and that ROSS is not that bad but i dont know about AUC and SABA. For example. Are the clinicals all done in one hospital or are they spread out? Does the school set them up for you or do you have to do everything yourself? I saw the list of schools on AUC and SABA but i have heard that they might be DO "friendly" hospitals.

Again thanks for the help

Mars

Ross is affiliated with about 49 teaching hospitals throughout the country. In the last week, it just added 4 including hospitals affiliated with Miller School of Medicine and Emory University. The 5th semester is situated in Miami as an Advanced Introduction to Clinical Medicine. After that, students are free to apply for rotations at any of the Ross affiliated hospitals, which in many cases are fully accredited US MD teaching hospitals. You can read more about the list of hospitals at www.rossu.edu/med.

 

[godschosenone]

McGillGrad has a valid point. If your plan is to practice in the US, choosing a Caribbean school that doesn't allow you to go to Cali has big disadvantages.

1) Large amount of population lives in California. By barring yourself from practicing there, you are keeping yourself out of a big market.

2) Lots of residency programs in Cali. More programs you can apply to = better chance at matching

3) Who knows how many more states will follow California's list of approved/disapproved schools in the future? You willing to take that gamble?

My point was that it is not the only way to categorize Caribbean med schools. They can be categorized in many different ways such as USMLE 1st time pass rates (which is always controversial), comfort of the island, size of the school, rate of attrition prior to taking Step 1, how likely you are to be mugged or killed by the local population, etc. Narrow-mindedness gets us nowhere. California is not the only issue. Nor will it ever be. But all of us in US schools have it so much easier. I have 2 friends who had to go to Caribbean schools.

 

[oldpro]

My point was that it is not the only way to categorize Caribbean med schools. They can be categorized in many different ways such as USMLE 1st time pass rates (which is always controversial), comfort of the island, size of the school, rate of attrition prior to taking Step 1, how likely you are to be mugged or killed by the local population, etc. Narrow-mindedness gets us nowhere. California is not the only issue. Nor will it ever be. But all of us in US schools have it so much easier. I have 2 friends who had to go to Caribbean schools.

I agree to a point but really take my school SJSM, it's only about 6 years old and has only a handfull of Grads and a couple fully Lic docs. It's low budget and does have basics but no extras like SGU and AUC. Really it is not comparable to these schools and will not be in the near future. You can become a MD from the school but only with hard work. No MCAT is needed to apply and be accepted

SGU,AUC and ROSS will not accept a student into MD courses without the MCAT but accepts students into "Premed" without it then promotes them to the MD courses and this could be in only one short semester in some cases so its a way around taking the MCAT.

Look bottom line, Caribbean Medical schools are not US schools, material is the same but no matter how much they try to say they are like US schools they are not and never will be, every school, for profit, Non profit, is driven by $$$ and thats it, they all seek the $$$ from us and tell us that the clinicals are awesome and such ( was not that long ago AUC had no spots in the US for it's students and they had to do clinicals in the UK at that time) the reality is it's a business and we are cattle to them.😎

 

[jiy76]

SGU, Ross, SABA, AUC and St. Matthews are the best carrib schools out there. St matts would have to be considered last cause its not approved in all 50 states as of now. The other 4 are so i would try there first but if u dont mind not workin in cali then st matts is fine.All provide solid educations.

 

[AlleghenyPOD]

I've also heard great things from Spartan Health Sciences university.

 

[Meatwad]

I've also heard great things from Spartan Health Sciences university.

... sarcasm?

 

[McGillGrad]

It sounds like you were rejected from the four 50-state schools are trying to make yourself feel better by defying all logic and lying to yourself.

Being allowed to license in all 50 states takes everything academically into consideration and only allows those who are superior in a myriad of categories (USMLE, quality of teaching, attrition rate, admissions requirements... ad nauseum). That makes your argument moot and amateurishly ignorant.

Uh, no, actually, it's not the only way... I remember having a pre-medical advisor; what a waste of money. "My pre-med advisor does not approve of foreign medical schools." Why would s/he be allowed to approve or disapprove of any decision such as this? If you're going to consider Caribbean med schools, simply eliminate the nonsense that spews forth from the mouth of your pre-med advisor. Apparently he knows little to nothing of anything except the narrow perspective from which his eyes see. Do your own research, and you will see for yourself.

 

[godschosenone]

It sounds like you were rejected from the four 50-state schools are trying to make yourself feel better by defying all logic and lying to yourself.

Being allowed to license in all 50 states takes everything academically into consideration and only allows those who are superior in a myriad of categories (USMLE, quality of teaching, attrition rate, admissions requirements... ad nauseum). That makes your argument moot and amateurishly ignorant.

Your response is malevolent for no apparent reason. I just know what some of my friends have had to go through living in places like Grenada and Saba. Being trapped in a 3rd world for 2 years is, in fact, another variable you fail to mention. Once again, yours is not the only argument. Nor are you the only opinion. Though your narcissistic ways sure suggest otherwise. Insight can only come with recognition. Consider the following upon introspection while asking yourself, "Do I...? Am I...? etc":

1. have a grandiose sense of self-importance
2. preoccupied with fantasies of unlimited success, power, brilliance, beauty, or ideal love
3. believes that he or she is "special" and unique and can only be understood by other special people
4. requires excessive admiration
5. strong sense of entitlement
6. takes advantage of others to achieve his or her own ends
7. lacks empathy
8. is often envious or believes others are envious of him or her
9. arrogant affect.

May you one day see the pathology of your ways.

 

[McGillGrad]

You have no argument. Location is secondary to quality of education and future opportunities. Your are deluding yourself if you think 2 years of comfort make up for a lifetime of limited/missed opportunities.

Your response is malevolent for no apparent reason. I just know what some of my friends have had to go through living in places like Grenada and Saba. Being trapped in a 3rd world for 2 years is, in fact, another variable you fail to mention. Once again, yours is not the only argument. Nor are you the only opinion. Though your narcissistic ways sure suggest otherwise. Insight can only come with recognition. Consider the following upon introspection while asking yourself, "Do I...? Am I...? etc":

1. have a grandiose sense of self-importance
2. preoccupied with fantasies of unlimited success, power, brilliance, beauty, or ideal love
3. believes that he or she is "special" and unique and can only be understood by other special people
4. requires excessive admiration
5. strong sense of entitlement
6. takes advantage of others to achieve his or her own ends
7. lacks empathy
8. is often envious or believes others are envious of him or her
9. arrogant affect.

May you one day see the pathology of your ways.

 

[DyersEve]

It has been repeated here ad nauseam but it cannot be stressed enough. While you still can, do whatever is in your power to get into an American medical school. Your best bet is to do well in your undergrad years. Unfortunately, I did not possess the maturity, seriousness or the time management and study skills that I know have early in my college career. I would give a lot to have a few mulligans with regards to college.

 

[oldpro]

Decent Job! 👍

Practice should be the goal

Students should go where they will succeed and have ways to pay for this!

You are forgetting some alternatives:


1) Foreign Schools ("off shore") designed for US students

While these schools are in a foreign country, they are designed for and marketed to US students. They have a USMLE oriented curriculum and clinicals in the US. These schools are generally located in the caribbean

A. Recognized by all 50 states

• St Georges
• Ross
• Saba.
• AUC

B. All the others

• MUA
• St James
• SMU
• etc

2. Foreign Schools that admit US students

These schools are designed for foreign students but admit significant numbers of US and Canadian Students. US students are a minority and clinicals are held in the host country. All of these schools are recognized in all 50 states. Classes are generally held in the host country. language. In general, these schools are of good quality. The major drawback is lack of US clinicals.
Mexico

• Guadalajara
  I believe preclinical is in English and clinicals are, obviously, done in Spanish.

Australia

• 
  U of Sydney
  Flinders
  Queensland
  Bond
  possibly others

Isreal

• Bengurion
• Technicon

Czechoslovakia

• Charles
• possibly others

Ireland

• Royal College of Physicians and Surgeons
• a few others

Poland

• several

​

3. Foreign schools that rarely admit US students
All the others.

 

[Meatwad]

Hmmm, good list, but I'd probably argue Ireland should be equal with, if not above, the Caribbean. The only thing is it probably has more Canadians than Americans. Same for the 3 Israeli schools; very impressive matches, and don't have as much "stigma," as schools in the Caribbean. I think Technion's incoming students had like a 3.6/28 last year, which is very respectable.

 

[Meatwad]

2. Foreign Schools that admit US students

These schools are designed for foreign students but admit significant numbers of US and Canadian Students. US students are a minority and clinicals are held in the host country. All of these schools are recognized in all 50 states. Classes are generally held in the host country. language. In general, these schools are of good quality. The major drawback is lack of US clinicals.​

Mexico

• Guadalajara

• I believe preclinical is in English and clinicals are, obviously, done in Spanish.​

Australia
​

• U of Sydney​
  Flinders​
  Queensland​
  Bond​
  possibly others​

Isreal

• Bengurion
• Technicon

Czechoslovakia

• Charles
• possibly others

Ireland

• Royal College of Physicians and Surgeons
• a few others

Poland

• several

Actually, just to point out some caveats here:

the only school whose English language program is California approved in the CR is Chalres University First Facutly. They have a second and third faculty also in Prague, neither of which are approved.

As for Poland, several is misleading; only one school's English program is legit in California: Jagiellonian University. They just got the approval a month ago, at that.

 

[oldpro]

Actually, just to point out some caveats here:

the only school whose English language program is California approved in the CR is Chalres University First Facutly. They have a second and third faculty also in Prague, neither of which are approved.

As for Poland, several is misleading; only one school's English program is legit in California: Jagiellonian University. They just got the approval a month ago, at that.

Yes thats True! European schools are not automatic all 50😉

 

[Meatwad]

Yes thats True! European schools are not automatic all 50😉

Yep, most people don't realize the native language programs are almost always approved, but not the English language programs.

I was pretty impressed,frankly, when Jagiellonian just got approval for their 6 and 4 year English programs. Not only was it a normal approval, but fully retroactive! I don't think even Saba's approval was retroactive.

 

[Meatwad]

Good catch on the English language programs in Europe. Those are probably better classifed with the "off shore" group. Like the carib schools, they primarily cater to US students.

With regard SexCrime's comments on ranking RCSI and Isreali schools. The list is not a ranking. I certainly did not mean to imply that the carib schools were number 1. They were simply listed first because they are most familiar. I agree that Isreali, Irish and Australian programs are better than most (if not all) carib schools.

Yeah, I didn't mean to put words in your mouth, my mistake. I agree that the Caribbean is certainly the most well-trodden path for Americans and Canadians, but if you want a more complete (?) medical school experience, Ireland, Israel, and Australia in particular would probably fit you a bit better. These are legitimate unis that do lots of research, especially Israel recently (I think they just had 2 Nobel laureates receive the prize at Technion). Of course, European schools are also research universities, but are not really known for impressive match lists.

 

[Pathlesstrvld]

[*]St Georges
[*]Ross
[*]Saba.
[*]AUC
[/LIST]B. All the others

• MUA
• St James
• SMU
• Polish Schools taught in English language

[/INDENT][/INDENT]

.

I dont think you're giving Polish programs their due respect. The programs taught in English are fairly young, but some of the universities are not only historical, but have been around for centuries.

.

 

[cooldreams]

Out of the top 4 I would stay away from the other schools, SGU Ross and AUC have high USMLE pass rates. The proof? They all qualify for Stafford loans, one of the criteria to get Stafford loans for an off shore program is their USMLE pass rate. UAG is another option which is in Mexico but is 6 years in length.

Saba is not yet recognized in Texas. Only AUC, SGU, Ross, and UAG grads are able to practice in Texas.

Nothing that you said was correct. Everyone who reads your post without reading further in this thread are now dumber than when they started reading. Please edit or remove your post. Thanks.

 

[Meatwad]

I dont think you're giving Polish programs their due respect. The programs taught in English are fairly young, but some of the universities are not only historical, but have been around for centuries.

.

Until these programs publish their match lists, the pass-rates for Steps 1 and 2, secure California approval, and 2 years of rotations in the US (I think 2 schools allow this, but they lack the 3 other criteria I listed), they will continue to be in the shadow of established Caribbean schools.

 

[cooldreams]

Until these programs publish their match lists, the pass-rates for Steps 1 and 2, secure California approval, and 2 years of rotations in the US (I think 2 schools allow this, but they lack the 3 other criteria I listed), they will continue to be in the shadow of established Caribbean schools.

Jag is polish and already has cali approval. You mention this above but apparently just not forgot that.
👎

 

[Meatwad]

Jag is polish and already has cali approval. You mention this above but apparently just not forgot that.
👎

Uhh, I said until Polish schools have all of the following:

1) Pass rates and scores for Steps 1 and 2
2) California approval
3) 2 years of rotations in the US

Jagiellonian has one of these. A good start, but it won't draw as many students as even the lower-"tiered," med school in the Caribbean.

Reading comprehension is vital here, cooldreams.

 

[McGillGrad]

Reading comprehension is vital here, cooldreams.

 

[cooldreams]

Uhh, I said until Polish schools have all of the following:

1) Pass rates and scores for Steps 1 and 2
2) California approval
3) 2 years of rotations in the US

Jagiellonian has one of these. A good start, but it won't draw as many students as even the lower-"tiered," med school in the Caribbean.

Reading comprehension is vital here, cooldreams.

It sure is, especially when you note that

"Until these programs publish their match lists, the pass-rates for Steps 1 and 2, secure California approval, and 2 years of rotations in the US (I think 2 schools allow this, but they lack the 3 other criteria I listed), they will continue to be in the shadow of established Caribbean schools."

it would appear I can comprehend what you wrote better than you can as you indicate that "they lack the 3 other criteria".

you see, you actually note four criteria, mr princeton med, and you indicate that they all are missing the first three and 2 allow the fourth but lack the first 3.

Then in your rebuttal, you indicate only 3 criteria, completely ignoring your criteria of match list publishing (maybe you do not think it to be important anymore?), and indicate that now jag has one of the 3 criteria.

Reading comprehension. Fun stuff.

 

[cooldreams]

And of course you jump in to rag on me whenever you can. This is was a poor choice as it only makes you look bad for also failing to comprehend what meatwad wrote.

 

[McGillGrad]

And of course you jump in to rag on me whenever you can. This is was a poor choice as it only makes you look bad for also failing to comprehend what meatwad wrote.

It is all about cause-and-effect. If you did not 'cause' his response by saying something foolish, then my reaction would not exist.

 

[bananaface]

Let's keep it civil, please. 🙂

 

[Meatwad]

Let's keep it civil, please. 🙂

Not a problem; unlike cooldreams, I don't need to issue a rebuttal to make myself feel better.

BTW, Princeton Med School > Northern Med School, or whatever it's called; although they are both about as legitimate.

 

[cooldreams]

Let's keep it civil, please. 🙂

I was reprimanded for posting "i like swimming pools..." in a different thread. you should all feel privileged.


🙁