Top med school admissions w/ a low GPA

[Etzio]

Ok ive seen how you guys like to flame people on here, but I don't really care so here go nothing.

Im a second semester junior at a university that is considered "tier 1" by US News but is not well known, and for intents and purposes, basically sucks.

My gpa is only a 2.8 after 2.5 years, due to family problems, depression, personal problems, and lack of focus. I haven't given it my all yet, its a new year and its a chance to be a new me. Im going to try my best to make everyday of this new year a success. Hopefully, ill see where that goes.

The unfortunate part is that I can only bring my gpa up to a 3.2 before I graduate. Im going to take some time off, do a few other things, before I apply.

Let me get a few things out of the way here, please read these before you start flaming me.

1) I REALIZE THAT I AM NOT COMPETITIVE RIGHT NOW EVEN FOR REGULAR MED SCHOOLS, AND MY PRIMARY FOCUS IS ON MY GPA AND MCAT.

2) I AM NOT DELUSIONAL ENOUGH TO THINK THAT I HAVE A SHOT AT TOP MED SCHOOLS, IN FACT I KNOW I WON'T GET IN.

3) I WOULD BE MORE THAN HAPPY TO GO TO ANY MED SCHOOL ON MY LIST, THE MAJORITY OF THEM ARE NOT TOP TIER ANYWAYS.

4) IM ASKING THIS MAINLY OUT OF CURIOSITY, I WILL NOT KILL MYSELF IF I DON'T GET INTO HARVARD.

My dream schools are Columbia or Stanford, AND THESE ARE NOT MY REALISTIC DREAM SCHOOLS.

So just out of curiosity, for someone in my position, if I can show a strong upward trend, kill the MCAT, have some good ec's and LORs, would they even look at me or has it never done before?

Thanks.

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[torshi]

Ok ive seen how you guys like to flame people on here, but I don't really care so here go nothing.

Im a second semester junior at a university that is considered "tier 1" by US News but is not well known, and for intents and purposes, basically sucks.

My gpa is only a 2.8 after 2.5 years, due to family problems, depression, personal problems, and lack of focus. I haven't given it my all yet, its a new year and its a chance to be a new me. Im going to try my best to make everyday of this new year a success. Hopefully, ill see where that goes.

The unfortunate part is that I can only bring my gpa up to a 3.2 before I graduate. Im going to take some time off, do a few other things, before I apply.

Let me get a few things out of the way here, please read these before you start flaming me.

1) I REALIZE THAT I AM NOT COMPETITIVE RIGHT NOW EVEN FOR REGULAR MED SCHOOLS, AND MY PRIMARY FOCUS IS ON MY GPA AND MCAT.

2) I AM NOT DELUSIONAL ENOUGH TO THINK THAT I HAVE A SHOT AT TOP MED SCHOOLS, IN FACT I KNOW I WON'T GET IN.

3) I WOULD BE MORE THAN HAPPY TO GO TO ANY MED SCHOOL ON MY LIST, THE MAJORITY OF THEM ARE NOT TOP TIER ANYWAYS.

4) IM ASKING THIS MAINLY OUT OF CURIOSITY, I WILL NOT KILL MYSELF IF I DON'T GET INTO HARVARD.

My dream schools are Columbia or Stanford, AND THESE ARE NOT MY REALISTIC DREAM SCHOOLS.

So just out of curiosity, for someone in my position, if I can show a strong upward trend, kill the MCAT, have some good ec's and LORs, would they even look at me or has it never done before?

Thanks.

Nah unless you really did kill the MCAT and had crazy EC's but other than that it's very unlikely, prob with a high MCAT and crazy EC's might not even happen either.

 

[theWUbear]

I'd imagine if you get straight A's to get that 3.2, get a 40 or above on the MCAT, you are well published, have significant clinical experience, and you apply right before starting an SMP (so that in December when still waiting you can write an update letter saying you just got a 4.0 and honors at med classes at Gtown or BU) you'd have a shot

 

[theWUbear]

if I can kill the MCAT would they even look at me ?

Nah unless you really did kill the MCAT

herp derp

 

[rhesuspieces]

Like the others said, you should probably look into doing a SMP. If you KILL the MCAT and have great EC's (research, leadership, teaching, and volunteering in addition to clinical experience) you might have a shot at your dream schools.

Of course, as you begin to apply, your "dream schools" might change significantly. I certainly look at schools in a different light now that I'm smack in the middle of the application cycle.

Also, I f-ing LOVE, LOVE Assassin's Creed. Got Brotherhood for xmas, finished it in 5 days. Awesome.

 

[slowbutsteady]

Heidi Klum is more likely to leave Seal for you than you getting into Stanford.

Why are you wasting your time and ours by piling hypothetical on top of hypothetical?

 

[iniquus]

So just out of curiosity, for someone in my position, if I can show a strong upward trend, kill the MCAT, have some good ec's and LORs, would they even look at me or has it never done before?

Thanks.

Don't jump ahead of yourself. Focus on the present, these are a lot of big what-if's.

Don't pad your GPA. If you really think you're a better student, take and ace upper-level science classes. Get strong LORs and ECs...this is the easiest part because they are more in your control than MCAT/GPA are.

You haven't prepared for the MCAT yet, so you can't bank on killing the MCAT. You shouldn't entertain unrealistic notions. There's not many students with 2.8/3.2 GPA that murder the MCAT-- not that it's impossible.

There's definitely more to the process than numbers, but your chances at those top tier schools, and many mid-tier schools are almost zero with a 3.2 GPA. That's if you get to the 3.2 GPA-- I'm sure that's you assuming its straight As here on out.

 

[imer]

I like your chances of watching the Super Bowl on Kim Jong-il's lap better than your getting into med school - but what's the point if you have no dreams - gl

 

[myPsychAlt]

what's a Tier 1 school that's "not well known"?

 

[Blown Away]

Ok ive seen how you guys like to flame people on here, but I don't really care so here go nothing.

Im a second semester junior at a university that is considered "tier 1" by US News but is not well known, and for intents and purposes, basically sucks.

My gpa is only a 2.8 after 2.5 years, due to family problems, depression, personal problems, and lack of focus. I haven't given it my all yet, its a new year and its a chance to be a new me. Im going to try my best to make everyday of this new year a success. Hopefully, ill see where that goes.

The unfortunate part is that I can only bring my gpa up to a 3.2 before I graduate. Im going to take some time off, do a few other things, before I apply.

Let me get a few things out of the way here, please read these before you start flaming me.

1) I REALIZE THAT I AM NOT COMPETITIVE RIGHT NOW EVEN FOR REGULAR MED SCHOOLS, AND MY PRIMARY FOCUS IS ON MY GPA AND MCAT.

2) I AM NOT DELUSIONAL ENOUGH TO THINK THAT I HAVE A SHOT AT TOP MED SCHOOLS, IN FACT I KNOW I WON'T GET IN.

3) I WOULD BE MORE THAN HAPPY TO GO TO ANY MED SCHOOL ON MY LIST, THE MAJORITY OF THEM ARE NOT TOP TIER ANYWAYS.

4) IM ASKING THIS MAINLY OUT OF CURIOSITY, I WILL NOT KILL MYSELF IF I DON'T GET INTO HARVARD.

My dream schools are Columbia or Stanford, AND THESE ARE NOT MY REALISTIC DREAM SCHOOLS.

So just out of curiosity, for someone in my position, if I can show a strong upward trend, kill the MCAT, have some good ec's and LORs, would they even look at me or has it never done before?

Thanks.

Take a look at this. GPA vs Mcat

https://www.aamc.org/download/157450/data/table24-mcatgpagridall2008-10.pdf.pdf

 

[bucks2010]

As others have said, I think there are way too many assumptions and "what if's" in your post. Just do the best from here on out to build your application and you can evaluate which schools to apply to when you have a clearer picture of what your application will look like.

 

[getdown]

what's a Tier 1 school that's "not well known"?

I think OPs referring to University of Chicago. It's top 10 in USWN but is a Div III school in the midwest with a name that often causes people to mistake it as a state school.

Personally, I think if you get that 3.2 and you really do well on the MCAT (33+) I would say you have an outside shot of getting into an MD somewhere. Try your local state schools. You may even be a good candidate for a DO so you don't have to waste a year in an SMP.

However, if you do end up around 3.1/3.0 which I think is what will happen than an SMP is probably what you should do.

 

[WingedOx]

I think OPs referring to University of Chicago. It's top 10 in USWN but is a Div III school in the midwest with a name that often causes people to mistake it as a state school.

well I certainly wouldn't call UC "unknown" especially to anyone in the academic world.

and for intents and purposes, basically sucks.

...but on the other hand, THAT sounds like the University of Chicago.

 

[Malice]

Ok ive seen how you guys like to flame people on here, but I don't really care so here go nothing.

Im a second semester junior at a university that is considered "tier 1" by US News but is not well known, and for intents and purposes, basically sucks.

My gpa is only a 2.8 after 2.5 years, due to family problems, depression, personal problems, and lack of focus. I haven't given it my all yet, its a new year and its a chance to be a new me. Im going to try my best to make everyday of this new year a success. Hopefully, ill see where that goes.

The unfortunate part is that I can only bring my gpa up to a 3.2 before I graduate. Im going to take some time off, do a few other things, before I apply.

Let me get a few things out of the way here, please read these before you start flaming me.

1) I REALIZE THAT I AM NOT COMPETITIVE RIGHT NOW EVEN FOR REGULAR MED SCHOOLS, AND MY PRIMARY FOCUS IS ON MY GPA AND MCAT.

2) I AM NOT DELUSIONAL ENOUGH TO THINK THAT I HAVE A SHOT AT TOP MED SCHOOLS, IN FACT I KNOW I WON'T GET IN.

3) I WOULD BE MORE THAN HAPPY TO GO TO ANY MED SCHOOL ON MY LIST, THE MAJORITY OF THEM ARE NOT TOP TIER ANYWAYS.

4) IM ASKING THIS MAINLY OUT OF CURIOSITY, I WILL NOT KILL MYSELF IF I DON'T GET INTO HARVARD.

My dream schools are Columbia or Stanford, AND THESE ARE NOT MY REALISTIC DREAM SCHOOLS.

So just out of curiosity, for someone in my position, if I can show a strong upward trend, kill the MCAT, have some good ec's and LORs, would they even look at me or has it never done before?

Thanks.

ok here's what you do.

GPA: You need all A's from here on out. You will probably have to do SMP w/ all A's as well.
MCAT: You need to murder it, rape its dead body, and then urinate on it, too.
ECs: You have a couple of options here - cure AIDS or cancer, take your pick.
LOR: You need the usual - 2 sci professors, 1 humanity, 1 research, 1 volunteer, also one from PotUS or Dalai Lama.

If you do these, you may have a shot. The adcoms won't have wet dreams about your application, but you'll at least get some interviews.

 

[Etzio]

I like your chances of watching the Super Bowl on Kim Jong-il's lap better than your getting into med school - but what's the point if you have no dreams - gl

That wasn't necessary. If you don't have anything constructive to say, then please don't write on my thread.

I'd imagine if you get straight A's to get that 3.2, get a 40 or above on the MCAT, you are well published, have significant clinical experience, and you apply right before starting an SMP (so that in December when still waiting you can write an update letter saying you just got a 4.0 and honors at med classes at Gtown or BU) you'd have a shot

Right I do plan to do all of those things. Right now im trying to write a proposal to pursue a public health related research project in China after I graduate. Im doing it out of pure interest, rather than an application boost. Im also going to start shadowing, join other clubs, and obviously try to be much more academic oriented from now on.

Like the others said, you should probably look into doing a SMP. If you KILL the MCAT and have great EC's (research, leadership, teaching, and volunteering in addition to clinical experience) you might have a shot at your dream schools.

Of course, as you begin to apply, your "dream schools" might change significantly. I certainly look at schools in a different light now that I'm smack in the middle of the application cycle.

Also, I f-ing LOVE, LOVE Assassin's Creed. Got Brotherhood for xmas, finished it in 5 days. Awesome.

3 things:

1) As mentioned earlier, I finally got over what was holding me back, and hopefully will be able to make a good comeback from now on. Im not really sure if a strong upward trend with good MCATs and great ECs would matter, because schools like Stanford and Columbia probably get thousands of applicants with all of those + a good GPA, but its worth a shot I guess.

Would an extra year of undergrad help? I could hypothetically get it up to a 3.4 if I do that.

2) Gamer chick = Awesomeness.

3) I got Brotherhood over break, started playing it at 9:34 am, beat it at 7:44 pm (yes I kept exact track of time) with a two hour break in between. So I beat you . Though it wasn't one of my most productive days, I just realized I misspelled his name, there is no "t", I wonder if I can edit that…..

As others have said, I think there are way too many assumptions and "what if's" in your post. Just do the best from here on out to build your application and you can evaluate which schools to apply to when you have a clearer picture of what your application will look like.

Your right, there are a lot of what ifs in this. I would be very happy to go to either USC (love the west coast, good school, chicks in LA are hot), Drexel (meh), or BU (good school, don't know much about it).

One of the main things that held me back was my depression that I was a failure. Ever since freshmen year I came into college from a poor academic performance in high school. While all of my friends got into Ivy League schools, I got rejected from 7/10 colleges I applied too. I came into freshmen year with an inferiority complex and beat myself up for it by just focusing on my past failures and missing out on the present. My parents are strict Chinese, so they always thought of me as "inferior" for not going to Ivy league schools like my cousins and other friends. All of that made me feel dumb because I was influenced by other people. I got help for these feelings and read a lot about the psychology behind fears and failures. I really don't care what other people think anymore and am just focused on my goal to get into med school. Its unfortunately a little late than I would like, but I want to give it my all to see what I truly am capable of.

So there are a lot of "what ifs" but I like to have some hope that I can succeed after failing for so long. Im sure that I won't get into Columbia or Stanford, no matter how much I manage to turn things around from here, and im okay with that. If people want to think of me as stupid or inferior for not going there then f*ck them. I was only just curious if its ever been done in the history of med school admissions.

Stupid question of the day:

Since im Chinese with a low GPA, and the majority of Chinese people I know have nothing less than a 3.8….will med school adcoms raise eyebrows when they see a Chinese applicant with a 3.2 (hypothetical), 38?….will they wonder why its not a 3.9/40 like other Chinese students, or does it not work like that?

 

[latrala2300]

ok here's what you do.

GPA: You need all A's from here on out. You will probably have to do SMP w/ all A's as well.
MCAT: You need to murder it, rape its dead body, and then urinate on it, too.
ECs: You have a couple of options here - cure AIDS or cancer, take your pick.
LOR: You need the usual - 2 sci professors, 1 humanity, 1 research, 1 volunteer, also one from PotUS or Dalai Lama.

If you do these, you may have a shot. The adcoms won't have wet dreams about your application, but you'll at least get some interviews.

 

[Silverfalcon]

Take this seriously: before you worry about getting into top medical schools, try to think about getting into at least one.

 

[Etzio]

ok here's what you do.

GPA: You need all A's from here on out. You will probably have to do SMP w/ all A's as well.
MCAT: You need to murder it, rape its dead body, and then urinate on it, too.
ECs: You have a couple of options here - cure AIDS or cancer, take your pick.
LOR: You need the usual - 2 sci professors, 1 humanity, 1 research, 1 volunteer, also one from PotUS or Dalai Lama.

If you do these, you may have a shot. The adcoms won't have wet dreams about your application, but you'll at least get some interviews.

I can deal with the GPA or MCAT, I was hoping for some more practical EC's like creating better blimps. Blimp accidents kill over 1 American(s) every year- a clear necessity for improvement. As for the Lama, I know im Chinese, but I unfortunately fell out of touch with him a while ago….man I should really stay in touch with my contacts.

 

[Etzio]

Take this seriously: before you worry about getting into top medical schools, try to think about getting into at least one.

I know, and I already addressed that in my original post, and that's what im focusing on. I just asked this question out of pure curiosity rather than an actual assessment of my chances.

 

[MightyMoose]

I think the best suggestions thus far have been to:


1) Take more upper division science courses to prove you can handle the hard sciences.

2) Work on establishing strong LOR's.

3) Gain some valuable EC's that include hospital and some research exp.

4) Do the best you can on the MCAT.


Assuming you have a good MCAT ~30+ and a 3.2, you are a good candidate for an SMP, which is designed for people in your situation. The SMP can demonstrate that you are ready for the rigors of medical school and can handle the work load. I can't say this would be absolutely necessary, because there are a number of other factors that play into a successful application, but it wouldn't hurt to apply to both medical schools and SMP's in the same year. Usually SMP's start accepting applications at the end or the beginning of the year (December/January), so you will have some idea as to how successful your application is before you apply.


I also agree with the above posters in regards to your projected GPA. We all hope to pull straight A's, but sometimes things come up or we make mistakes, etc. and classes don't go the way we plan. Planning 1.5 years of straight A's with your current track record is going to require some serious commitment to school and means you're going to have get your Depression, etc. under control. Not to mention that you have additional stressors weighing heavily on you for your MCAT performance, so you will need to make sure you take the time to study for that effectively as well.

My suggestion would be to not rush it, take the classes you can handle (but try to take at least 12 credits per semester, or whatever qualifies you as full-time at your school) and as you learn how to study efficiently and manage family and personal problems with school you can gradually increase your course load. I would also make sure you have some dedicated time to study for the MCAT without many other academic demands (possibly during the summer after you graduate). Sure, this all means that you might be putting medical school out a year or two later than you initially hoped for, but that is nothing in the grand scheme of things.

As far as your dream schools, it's not likely, but you never know. That's why they are dream schools.

 

[nabeel76]

I am sure it's been done before, but honestly the odds are stacked against you. I know of several people, one of them is my cousin, that have managed to get into Harvard Med with a 3.3-3.4 GPA from unknown schools. They didn't kill the MCAT either, however, they were extremely non-traditional applicants and had extraordinary life experiences which served them well in the medical school application season. I know that my cousin had acceptances to both Harvard and Hopkins in addition to multiple top tier schools.

As a interesting fact however, my cousin managed to get acceptances to almost all of the top tier (Harvard, Hopkins, Columbia, Penn, etc.) schools that she applied to but did not get acccepted at any of her state schools (UVA, VCU, EVMS), nor any of the lower tier and mid tier schools (Gtown, Jefferson, Drexel, MCW, St. Louis etc.), which seemed a little strange. Either way it just goes to show you that although your chances are slim, if you have what they are looking for in terms of life story or EC's you might still have a shot at the top schools.

 

[Dianyla]

MCAT: You need to murder it, rape its dead body, and then urinate on it, too.

Really not necessary.

 

[Etzio]

I think the best suggestions thus far have been to:


1) Take more upper division science courses to prove you can handle the hard sciences.

2) Work on establishing strong LOR's.

3) Gain some valuable EC's that include hospital and some research exp.

4) Do the best you can on the MCAT.


Assuming you have a good MCAT ~30+ and a 3.2, you are a good candidate for an SMP, which is designed for people in your situation. The SMP can demonstrate that you are ready for the rigors of medical school and can handle the work load. I can't say this would be absolutely necessary, because there are a number of other factors that play into a successful application, but it wouldn't hurt to apply to both medical schools and SMP's in the same year. Usually SMP's start accepting applications at the end or the beginning of the year (December/January), so you will have some idea as to how successful your application is before you apply.


I also agree with the above posters in regards to your projected GPA. We all hope to pull straight A's, but sometimes things come up or we make mistakes, etc. and classes don't go the way we plan. Planning 1.5 years of straight A's with your current track record is going to require some serious commitment to school and means you're going to have get your Depression, etc. under control. Not to mention that you have additional stressors weighing heavily on you for your MCAT performance, so you will need to make sure you take the time to study for that effectively as well.

My suggestion would be to not rush it, take the classes you can handle (but try to take at least 12 credits per semester, or whatever qualifies you as full-time at your school) and as you learn how to study efficiently and manage family and personal problems with school you can gradually increase your course load. I would also make sure you have some dedicated time to study for the MCAT without many other academic demands (possibly during the summer after you graduate). Sure, this all means that you might be putting medical school out a year or two later than you initially hoped for, but that is nothing in the grand scheme of things.

As far as your dream schools, it's not likely, but you never know. That's why they are dream schools.

Thanks, and I will try my best to be my best from here on out. You are right to say that its a little presumptuous to assume 1.5 years of straight A's from here on out, and that I would kill the MCAT. I never said that I would do those things, I only asked hypothetically if I could, then would it help. Only time will tell how well I actually do, so im not delusional enough to assume the best case scenario will magically happen from here on out.

How much of a factor does a very strong upward trend coupled with a high MCAT actually matter (since schools like Columbia and Stanford get thousands upon thousands of applicants with high GPA and MCAT)? Im basically asking how much a strong upward trend and high MCAT mitigate (if at all) the damage done by my first 2.5 years of UG in the eyes of those adcoms?

@ nabeel: That is actually very interesting. Im just wondering what life experiences they were out of curiosity?

So answer to stupid question 1 is that race doesn't really matter in adcoms eyes even if your GPA is 2 standard deviations lower than the average Asian applicant?

If I did an extra year of UG, I could hypothetically raise my GPA close to a 3.4, would that be worth it?

Stupid question number 2: As I mentioned earlier about my traditional Asian parents, and their outlooks on life, I just constantly hate being compared too, and judged by people who are "better" than me because they go to "Ivy League" schools. I know that I shouldn't let those kinds of things get to me, and I try my best not too. Sometimes, after growing up with that kind of atmosphere, I can't help but develop an occasional inferiority complex and feel like an idiot for not meeting my culture's "expectations". I know a lot of you have no idea what im talking about, but for those who do.

How do you put aside those kinds of negative thoughts and self-defeating feelings?

Thanks a lot guys.

 

[MightyMoose]

Thanks, and I will try my best to be my best from here on out. You are right to say that its a little presumptuous to assume 1.5 years of straight A's from here on out, and that I would kill the MCAT. I never said that I would do those things, I only asked hypothetically if I could, then would it help. Only time will tell how well I actually do, so im not delusional enough to assume the best case scenario will magically happen from here on out.

How much of a factor does a very strong upward trend coupled with a high MCAT actually matter (since schools like Columbia and Stanford get thousands upon thousands of applicants with high GPA and MCAT)? Im basically asking how much a strong upward trend and high MCAT mitigate (if at all) the damage done by my first 2.5 years of UG in the eyes of those adcoms?

@ nabeel: That is actually very interesting. Im just wondering what life experiences they were out of curiosity?

So answer to stupid question 1 is that race doesn't really matter in adcoms eyes even if your GPA is 2 standard deviations lower than the average Asian applicant?

If I did an extra year of UG, I could hypothetically raise my GPA close to a 3.4, would that be worth it?

Stupid question number 2: As I mentioned earlier about my traditional Asian parents, and their outlooks on life, I just constantly hate being compared too, and judged by people who are "better" than me because they go to "Ivy League" schools. I know that I shouldn't let those kinds of things get to me, and I try my best not too. Sometimes, after growing up with that kind of atmosphere, I can't help but develop an occasional inferiority complex and feel like an idiot for not meeting my culture's "expectations". I know a lot of you have no idea what im talking about, but for those who do.

How do you put aside those kinds of negative thoughts and self-defeating feelings?

Thanks a lot guys.

As far as taking an extra year of UG, I think with your goals an SMP would be a better option for that year than UG courses.

As far as the insecurities question, you need to understand that life isn't all about where you go to school, the next step, and how prestigious your degree and career choice appears to others. This is difficult given your background, but you might want to take advantage of your schools counseling sessions (with a psychologist) to help you gain some insight and self confidence. They are there to talk to you about these kinds of things.

Good luck.

 

[imer]

That wasn't necessary. If you don't have anything constructive to say, then please don't write on my thread.


... If people want to think of me as stupid or inferior for not going there then f*ck them...

You can't be so sensitive - I gave you my honest appraisal of your situation as described. It's clear from your initial post and the rest following that you have a bit of an insecurity thing going on - OK. And a bit too worried about how others think about you - OK.

Does that mean you want to hear only how all it takes is rededication and perfect scores and it will be all right. I can't believe you didn't start each new term with those thoughts already locked and loaded. So what's missing? There are many things you'll deal with in life, some of which you cannot change even if you wish it so.

If you would (or could have) have pulled out of the tailspin sooner I would give you encouragement. But give it a rest, seeing as how your just a troll...

Grab a bucket of popcorn and hope you get the invite.

 

[Etzio]

You can't be so sensitive - I gave you my honest appraisal of your situation as described. It's clear from your initial post and the rest following that you have a bit of an insecurity thing going on - OK. And a bit too worried about how others think about you - OK.

Does that mean you want to hear only how all it takes is rededication and perfect scores and it will be all right. I can't believe you didn't start each new term with those thoughts already locked and loaded. So what's missing? There are many things you'll deal with in life, some of which you cannot change even if you wish it so.

If you would (or could have) have pulled out of the tailspin sooner I would give you encouragement. But give it a rest, seeing as how your just a troll...

Grab a bucket of popcorn and hope you get the invite.

Wow that was kind of deep, you almost sounded like a tough guy right there. Props to you sir!

Your honest appraisal could have been worded differently, that was my point.

If you read my original post (which you probably didn't beyond the first two lines), you would know that I said that I knew I wasn't going to get into either of those schools - I was curious to see that if its been done before. Even if it has, its probably only been done by URMs or caucasians. I doubt Columbia would admit a Chinese guy with a low GPA anyway.

As for the insecurity thing, there's a reason why I have it, and its due to my cultural background and the way ive been brought up. I only realized that I had these issues recently when I went to counseling at my university at the end of last semester, until then, I just thought I was stupid and incapable as dictated by family and cultural norms, thus depressed and not motivated to work. Obviously, your not Asian, you wouldn't understand. I posted about this as well, but its ok, maybe you just lack the adequate cognitive reasoning to seek out that information in my posts, since you so avidly claim that you read them.

Now im back and focused to do work, I will become what I know I am, and it never hurts to have some hope that people with a low GPA can still have a small chance at top schools, even if it only happens once in a blue moon, or if it doesn't happen for me.

So before you start making assumptions about me being a troll when you know nothing about me, seems a bit presumptuous. Though I can be equally presumptuous about you and just feel sorry for your future patients.

 

[imer]

Wow that was kind of deep, you almost sounded like a tough guy right there. Props to you sir!

Your honest appraisal could have been worded differently, that was my point.

If you read my original post ...

No I don't read (most) whiney posts - did you grow up with a do-over-if-I-don't-get-what-I-want mentality? You have very little chance of getting in with your current pie-in-the-sky plan, you have not DEMONSTRATED the ability to perform in med school. It's really that simple.

Doesn't matter whether you are Chinese or not.

 

[Political]

my advice:

shoot for the top so that you can pray to get into the bottom

*sorry for being a douche*

 

[Astarael]

Two things:

1) You seem to be worried about the fact that you may be judged on a different scale for being Chinese. While I can't say that such a judgment won't happen, I can tell you that if an admissions committee compares your academic achievements against those of your race instead of those of the standard applicant pool, they will be in violation of their non-discrimination statement (which all schools have and mostly state the same thing).

2) I'm not sure if you've thought of this, or if you're even thinking this far ahead, but medical school is not your last chance to be educated at Columbia or Stanford. If you do what you want to - turn your grades around, do an SMP, and go to a lower ranked medical school and do really well, you might have a shot at doing a residency at Columbia or Stanford. At that point, nobody will care what your undergraduate academics were like. Just something to think about.

 

[Danlee07]

motto: hope for the best, prepare for the worst.

i'd just work my tail off with my best to get yourself in the best position. you already made your mistakes. if it doesn't work out, then it doesn't work out.

by the way, there is still a SMALL chance since you can be in the GPA 3s.

 

[Etzio]

No I don't read (most) whiney posts - did you grow up with a do-over-if-I-don't-get-what-I-want mentality? You have very little chance of getting in with your current pie-in-the-sky plan, you have not DEMONSTRATED the ability to perform in med school. It's really that simple.

Doesn't matter whether you are Chinese or not.

This isn't whiney, im not saying "omg I can't get into Columbia blah blah, my life sucks blah blah blah". Im saying "Here's my situation, has anyone ever gotten into Columbia before by fluke, just out of curiosity, but im realistically shooting for other schools, this is just a dream." Thats the difference between whining and a statement. If you didn't learn that difference when your were growing up, at least you learned it now.

If you just come to rash conclusions by reading half-baked information, then I really do feel sorry for your future patients.

 

[WellWornLad]

...will med school adcoms raise eyebrows when they see a Chinese applicant with a 3.2 (hypothetical), 38?….will they wonder why its not a 3.9/40 like other Chinese students, or does it not work like that?

It's amazing that you even find this plausible.

 

[45408]

Just remember this: why would they take you?

You have to be a better candidate than the competition, or else why would they take you? In your case, it's not going to be your GPA. I'd focus on some serious research if I were you.

 

[iniquus]

As for the insecurity thing, there's a reason why I have it, and its due to my cultural background and the way ive been brought up. I only realized that I had these issues recently when I went to counseling at my university at the end of last semester, until then, I just thought I was stupid and incapable as dictated by family and cultural norms, thus depressed and not motivated to work. Obviously, your not Asian, you wouldn't understand. I posted about this as well, but its ok, maybe you just lack the adequate cognitive reasoning to seek out that information in my posts, since you so avidly claim that you read them.

Stop whining. If you're insecure, don't blame it on being Asian. It's disgusting.

 

[Etzio]

Stop whining. If you're insecure, don't blame it on being Asian. It's disgusting.

What no! im not blaming it on anything. That's just how ive been brought up. If anything, its my fault for letting the things my parents and relatives said get to me and make me lose focus. Obviously you don't understand so just drop it.

 

[CrystalProphecy]

Egh, the borderline flame posts on this thread are getting disgusting. I just want to knock some sense into this thread before I leave it.

OP, here's the thing. You're in a bad situation, you're seeking suggestions or actual examples of people who had crap GPAs and still got into decent schools. However buffered your opening post seems (I'm not dreaming of Harvard, Columbia, etc./I just want to see my chances), you still name dropped them, pretty much stating one way or another you're hoping there's SOMEONE, SOMEWHERE who got into those schools with a 3.2, a killer MCAT, and some strong ECs.

As much as we'd love to give you a situation where a Chinese student who, after being depressed and subjected to strict Chinese parents, gets a 3.2 after messing up for 2.5 years and tries as hard as he/she can in shadowing and straight As gets into med school, we can't. Why? Because there are about 1930123019238123 like you, in the same 3.something range, with years of messed up grades, with a mediocre app to boot, hoping for a chance to med school if they stayed in school long enough to save the GPA.

But honestly, please just sit down and think what you need to do NOW. Don't put hypotheticals; just DO. Once you get to the 3.2 GPA range, once you kill the MCAT, once you finish amazing ECs, should you be concerned about where you want to apply. What does it matter if people with crap stats magically got into Columbia/"said state school on med list"? You still need to get that 3.2 regardless and you should put your all your thoughts/emotional/physical effort into doing that. Even if you realize later that med school just isn't for you, at least that 3.2 could be used for grad school, another professional school, or even a good masters/tech program you might have not considered before.

All stupid reply posts aside (which I'm sure you recognize yourself), many SDN members here have provided you some strong insight as well as advice on how to pull yourself up. A relative who got into Harvard with a lower GPA, but some pretty insane circumstances. SMPs. Taking upper divs and killing them. To just be concerned with just GETTING into a med school. Use their advice to ground yourself and motivate yourself to do better.

That is all. Good luck on your studies and don't let parents or what people say pull you down.

 

[TriagePreMed]

I WILL NOT KILL MYSELF IF I DON'T GET INTO HARVARD.

God, had to take the fun out of it, right?

 

[Ursa]

Thanks, and I will try my best to be my best from here on out. You are right to say that its a little presumptuous to assume 1.5 years of straight A's from here on out, and that I would kill the MCAT. I never said that I would do those things, I only asked hypothetically if I could, then would it help.

No it would probably hurt. *Here's your sign*

But honestly, please just sit down and think what you need to do NOW. Don't put hypotheticals; just DO.

No pun intended...?

 

[getdown]

I'm halfway surprised that no one has mentioned DO as a possibility for the OP. I mean DO = MD = doctor at any rate, unless I missed something about OP wanting only an MD school?

 

[Dianyla]

I'm halfway surprised that no one has mentioned DO as a possibility for the OP. I mean DO = MD = doctor at any rate, unless I missed something about OP wanting only an MD school?

I'm not surprised. Consider how this thread has been framed. If the OP had posted an open ended question like "Here are my stats, what are my chances/options?" then suggesting DO is a useful response. Asking if they still have a chance at Tier 1 MD schools already tells me that they probably don't want to hear "Have you considered DO?" in the replies. It'll be hard enough to swallow and digest the realization that s/he'll be lucky enough to attend a middle or bottom-tier MD school with such a low GPA, especially after attending a prestigious undergraduate university. Let that reality sink in before whacking them with the DO stick.

 

[obscurehero]

Egh, the borderline flame posts on this thread are getting disgusting. I just want to knock some sense into this thread before I leave it.

OP, here's the thing. You're in a bad situation, you're seeking suggestions or actual examples of people who had crap GPAs and still got into decent schools. However buffered your opening post seems (I'm not dreaming of Harvard, Columbia, etc./I just want to see my chances), you still name dropped them, pretty much stating one way or another you're hoping there's SOMEONE, SOMEWHERE who got into those schools with a 3.2, a killer MCAT, and some strong ECs.

As much as we'd love to give you a situation where a Chinese student who, after being depressed and subjected to strict Chinese parents, gets a 3.2 after messing up for 2.5 years and tries as hard as he/she can in shadowing and straight As gets into med school, we can't. Why? Because there are about 1930123019238123 like you, in the same 3.something range, with years of messed up grades, with a mediocre app to boot, hoping for a chance to med school if they stayed in school long enough to save the GPA.

But honestly, please just sit down and think what you need to do NOW. Don't put hypotheticals; just DO. Once you get to the 3.2 GPA range, once you kill the MCAT, once you finish amazing ECs, should you be concerned about where you want to apply. What does it matter if people with crap stats magically got into Columbia/"said state school on med list"? You still need to get that 3.2 regardless and you should put your all your thoughts/emotional/physical effort into doing that. Even if you realize later that med school just isn't for you, at least that 3.2 could be used for grad school, another professional school, or even a good masters/tech program you might have not considered before.

All stupid reply posts aside (which I'm sure you recognize yourself), many SDN members here have provided you some strong insight as well as advice on how to pull yourself up. A relative who got into Harvard with a lower GPA, but some pretty insane circumstances. SMPs. Taking upper divs and killing them. To just be concerned with just GETTING into a med school. Use their advice to ground yourself and motivate yourself to do better.

That is all. Good luck on your studies and don't let parents or what people say pull you down.

OP^^ excellent, excellent advice. With your current situation, you should really be thinking in a different way. You shouldn't be thinking about getting into top schools, because that's clearly not you. That's not a put-down, that's just to say that even if you did get in you would be unhappy. I think that's pretty safe to say.

You can pull your GPA up, but you have to kiss your social life and video games goodbye. I'm actually serious. I was able to bring my GPA up from a ~3.2 to a ~3.5 in exactly the same situation as you by taking nearly 40 credits my senior year and getting a ~3.7 both semesters. They were all hard upper-level science classes not meant to pad my GPA as much as finish my major. For me, a 4.0 at that level of work was impossible. Had I had a lighter load maybe I could've got a 4.0, but that wasn't my situation. Maybe its not for you, but I found it exhausting.

That being said, I would suggest putting every ounce of effort you can into finishing out school strong and then reassess. At that point, you should probably consider DO schools and start studying for the MCAT. For you, I would recommend the prep courses because it sounds like you could use a structured environment. Mooch off of your parents, and get the MCAT sufficiently owned and you might even have a shot at some allopathic schools.

Don't try to be someone you're not. Keep dreaming, just try to keep the dreams realistic aspirations.

my $0.02

 

[deleted366342]

Listen ignore the people who say you have to cure cancer, yada yada. It's gonna be a steep up hill climb and you have very little margin for error. At the very least you need to get all As in your science classes. Remember that the AMCAS breaks GPAs into years as well. So if you can isolate the bad grades to a single year it is to your benefit (idk your specifics with when the bad grades occurred). Focus on building up clinical experiences, and pushing up the GPA. HERE IS THE MOST IMPORTANT PART: You must must must kill the MCAT, it is a great way to clean up a lot of other mistakes.

I got into a very good med school with these stats:

Overall GPA: 3.47
Science GPA: 3.24
MCAT: 39

I absolutely tanked my science classes sophomore year. Did almost perfect the rest of the way (also freshman year was excellent... make the bad grades a blip rather than the main thing). Again the key was killing the MCAT. As other posters have said post-bac programs are very good options if you get a solid but not amazing MCAT. Robert Wood Johnson has an excellent (but rigorous) program that is in it's first year this year. I'd recommend it because you get a degree and from what I have heard with other students from the program, is that some med schools will throw out your old grades if you get the masters degree out of RWJ. Best of luck to you and feel free to ask any more questions here or PM me.

 

[CrystalProphecy]

No pun intended...?

You know, I did peruse over the pun right after I typed it out. Haha, but in all honesty I wasn't intending the pun, but it certainly is a good recommendation to try a DO school.

 

[IlaEm]

I was accepted to a top 20 medical school with a 3.4GPA and a 33MCAT. I didn't exacly kill it. Most schools I interviewed at LOVED that I traveled abroad so I think your project in China is a great idea.

 

[deleted366342]

I was accepted to a top 20 medical school with a 3.4GPA and a 33MCAT. I didn't exacly kill it. Most schools I interviewed at LOVED that I traveled abroad so I think your project in China is a great idea.

Precisely my point. Be interesting OP, have ECs that you enjoy and will be passionate about when you write/talk about it. You can get away with not having a cookie cutter app, but you need to have things that stand out. For me it was my MCAT, ECs, and my ability to be really engaging in person (or so I have been told lol).

 

[Etzio]

@ CrystalProphecy: Your advice is absolutely golden, thank you very much. I am actually realistically shooting for schools like USC, BU, Tufts, Stony Brook (I am an NY resident), NYU (Idk much about it, or if its a reach like the other two then forget it), Drexel, etc. I will definitely put my worries about getting in and those other negative aside and focus to be the best I can.

@ RUDoc and obscurehero: Congrats on your acceptances and thank you for the advice. It is inspiring for me to see that you guys did it.

@ everyone else: Thank you and I appreciate the advice. I will try my best to focus on the present and put those feelings of negativity and worries aside. I hope that if I achieve all of my goals, I will be competitive for my realistic med schools in the near future, and who knows, maybe even my dream schools (but seriously probably not lol ).

 

[Golflover]

I'd imagine if you get straight A's to get that 3.2, get a 40 or above on the MCAT, you are well published, have significant clinical experience, and you apply right before starting an SMP (so that in December when still waiting you can write an update letter saying you just got a 4.0 and honors at med classes at Gtown or BU) you'd have a shot

 

[sliceofbread136]

Welcome to SDN thread necromancer

 

[CarolinaGirl33]

I am sure it's been done before, but honestly the odds are stacked against you. I know of several people, one of them is my cousin, that have managed to get into Harvard Med with a 3.3-3.4 GPA from unknown schools. They didn't kill the MCAT either, however, they were extremely non-traditional applicants and had extraordinary life experiences which served them well in the medical school application season. I know that my cousin had acceptances to both Harvard and Hopkins in addition to multiple top tier schools.

As a interesting fact however, my cousin managed to get acceptances to almost all of the top tier (Harvard, Hopkins, Columbia, Penn, etc.) schools that she applied to but did not get acccepted at any of her state schools (UVA, VCU, EVMS), nor any of the lower tier and mid tier schools (Gtown, Jefferson, Drexel, MCW, St. Louis etc.), which seemed a little strange. Either way it just goes to show you that although your chances are slim, if you have what they are looking for in terms of life story or EC's you might still have a shot at the top schools.

If you don't mind sharing, what were these extraordinary life experiences? What does Harvard consider extraordinary?

 

[Ace-Co-A]

If you don't mind sharing, what were these extraordinary life experiences? What does Harvard consider extraordinary?

He posted that more than 3 years ago.

However... this necrobump has allowed for the identification of @Oso 's twin (below). @terp720 @agent B (I miss you). @Amba @Docility celebration!

No it would probably hurt. *Here's your sign*



No pun intended...?