Top programs??

[navs]

From the recent post, I started thinking what the most prestigious programs in the country are??

The type of programs that when u say their name draws respect.

This is just for fun, so I hope no one is taking this emphatically.

My opinions, in no order:

Stanford, UCSF, Wash U., Mayo, Hopkins, MGH, Brigham...

That is just my list, anybody else...

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[Winged Scapula]

Renowned for what? There is NO hospital/residency program/medical school which is "tops" in all areas. For example, Penn/CHOP great for Pediatric Surgery but much less renowned for other areas. Baylor is well known for Cardiac Surgery (thank you Dr. Debakey) but probably has less of a name elsewhere.

Care to share why you ranked the programs you did, in that order? I can't think of many areas in which I would personally rank Stanford as number 1.

 

[dr.evil]

Hey Kim, I think he said in no particularly order on his list but I agree that Stanford would likely not be on any #1's.

Anyway, top programs, #1 places to go for residency, who's the best, and talk like this always makes me chuckle to myself. It reinforces the ego factor many medical students have. I need to be the best at the best place in the nation and make sure everyone knows I went to the best place. As many people say, the best residency in the country is the one where you match.

Of course there are programs that are at the top in research money and academic reputation (often for traditional reasons) both of which may be important if you need to be the chair of some "high profile" institution. But will these programs produce the top clinicians in their field. The odds are against them there. Will some of these places see the strangest patholgoy? Sure. But does that make it superior for training. I tend to say no.

As I've traveled on interviews and seen the "top" programs as well as the "regular" places, I've noticed that different emphasis is placed on different parts of training. When I entered medical school I definitely did not want to do bench research for 2 years in residency. I wanted to be a clinician, period.

So, if I had some strange pathological problem, I may go to Mayo for treatment. If I need my gallbaldder removed, I'll stay close to home.

 

[Winged Scapula]

Originally posted by LionTrees:
•Hey Kim, I think he said in no particularly order on his list but I agree that Stanford would likely not be on any #1's.
.•••
...oops, you're right, he did say that. Oh well, as you've pointed out, I wouldn't include Stanford high up on the list either for residency training or clinical medicine.

If I needed an artificial heart I'd probably stay here, just as you advise staying close to home for a chole.

Something for the kiddies to keep in mind, if you want to be a good clinician, a bread and butter physician, remember that you may not see that type of stuff at a high powered academic institution. My residency program probably isn't in anyone's Top 10, but tertiary type stuff? Its all over the place here. How many appys have I done in my 7 months here? 1. How many have the interns at the local community program done? Dozens. How many Whipples do we do here? At least 2-3 a week. How many do they do at the local community program? My 3rd year friends there tell me they've yet to see one.

This is not to say that you don't get the basics at those high falutin' places - you do. They cannot graduate you having never done an appy, hernia, etc. However, you will also be seeing a lot more unusual pathology, regardless of your specialty, pathology which takes away from the bread and butter stuff, than you would at more mundane places.

As Liontrees says, unless you want some high falutin' fellowship or to be an academic chair pick the program at which you will be the happiest, not just because its "tops". Believe me, residency is miserable enough without having to be unhappy with your choice just because its the "best".

 

[navs]

Dude or dudettes,

Take it easy. I was just having some fun. Wow, everyone here is so touchy when it comes to just speaking ur mind.

I was just doing this for fun, nothing more.

And by the way, I don't think there is anything wrong in going to a high powered program for the name, u can't tell me it doesn't look good on ur resume!! Just like it is okay for people wanting to stay at home, or go to a comm. program, it is also okay to want to rub elbows with some of the leading institutions in the country and thus some of the leaders in ur field.

Hey but that is just my two cents worth.

Like I said though they are in no particular order, just the way they popped in my head. And yes, I guess, I am talking about academic/ research oriented programs, isn't that what sets the good programs apart?? The type of cutting edge research they're doing??

Sorry if I offended anyone, just wanted to goof around a little.

 

[dr.evil]

Didn't mean to come off so "touchy". I just struggle with the concept that cutting edge research/academia means better training program. I do not mean to take anything away from research because I believe it's essential for the advancement of medicine. I just think you need to be trained well clinically first and then pursue research in fields you feel you can add to.

And by the way, I don't think there is anything wrong in going to a high powered program for the name, u can't tell me it doesn't look good on ur resume!! ••

I think that is kind of my point. You should never go to a place just b/c you want to build your resume. Seems to prove my "ego theory".

Just to join your conversation, other strong academic institutions should probably include Vanderbilt & UT-Southwestern. I'm considering both for residency b/c they are very strong clinically and have very few deficiencies.

 

[Winged Scapula]

yeah hey - I didn't mean to come off so touchy either. Its just that the whole issue of "top programs" is a highly charged one for most people.

I agree with Liontrees - I have a hard time understanding going to a place FOR the name - while top tier programs may be known for their research funding they aren't necessarily known for the quality of their clinical teaching. So unless you want to be a researcher I can't understand going to someplace known for that.

Does it look good on a resume? Sure, but does it make a significant difference if all else in your file is mediocre? IMHO, no.

It is your perogative to prefer a program for its name, just as you state others have the right to prefer lower-tier community programs. I just don't understand it unless it has lots more to offer you than just a name.

 

[GreatPumpkin]

Penn State that is in Hersey right? Who cares about the residency program, just give me a chocolate bar.

Hi Kim!

 

[navs]

Hi Kim,

I didn't know how "touchy" this topic REALLY was.

Sorry If I've offended u or anybody else.

I promise not to bring up the topic again!!

Scouts honor!!

 

[joethestuff]

We'll hold ya to it, you pretentious jerkoff.

see ya

 

[dr.evil]

<img src="graemlins/laughy.gif" border="0" alt="[Laughy]" /> After laughing my butt off at joethestuff, I thought I'd add one more remark whether you like it or not.

When it's all said and done, you may very well be in with a group of docs who have trained in all types of programs throughout the country. So what? Well, education does not end after residency and many new ideas can be attained from your partners.

For instance in surgery: Say Kim and I were in practice and she's seen/done many more Whipple's than I have, I have the opportunity to assist her and attain a better knowledge of the procedure. This works in reverse if I have done many endograft vascular procedures and she had not. Every program will be low on its "numbers" (speaking surgery here) in some areas and extremely strong in others. You need to pick the residency that coincides with your interests.

If your interests change and you decide to practice in a field you are not particularly well trained in, fellowships exist.

This whole conversation takes me back 4 1/2 years ago when my pre-med "buddies" tried to figure out which was the best medical school to go to. I chose correctly cuz I chose the cheapest (my state school).