Roy7

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A classmate of mine has a situation and I wanted to get some feedback from people here.

Our school has a 3x limit on step 1 failures. Fail step 1 more than 3x and you are dismissed from the school.

So he failed 3x.

Now is it possible for him to transfer out to a Caribbean school? If so, what's the process like? He just recieved his third failure and is freaking out.

And no, this classmate is not me (I'm a PGY1).

Thanks in advance.
 

Aphtalyfe

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A classmate of mine has a situation and I wanted to get some feedback from people here.

Our school has a 3x limit on step 1 failures. Fail step 1 more than 3x and you are dismissed from the school.

So he failed 3x.

Now is it possible for him to transfer out to a Caribbean school? If so, what's the process like? He just recieved his third failure and is freaking out.

And no, this classmate is not me (I'm a PGY1).

Thanks in advance.
He would probably have to transfer to one of the lower tier Caribbean schools (I don't think AUC, SGU, Ross, or Saba would take them) and retake their equivalent of 5th semester.
 
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Roy7

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Thanks for the reply! What are some of these lower-tier schools? Also what's this fifth semester?

Thanks in advance.
 

Aphtalyfe

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Thanks for the reply! What are some of these lower-tier schools? Also what's this fifth semester?

Thanks in advance.
Go check out valuemd and they have forums for all the Caribbean schools. Besides SGU/AUC/Ross/Saba the rest are considered "Lower tier." There are A LOT.

5th semester is the semester that most Caribbean schools have to take shelf exams, review/study for Step 1, do pre-clinical training.

A lot of the lower tier Caribbean schools have lower pass rates for Step 1, so I bet some of them don't have a limit on Step 1 failures.
 

JonathanMD

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Thanks for the reply! What are some of these lower-tier schools? Also what's this fifth semester?

Thanks in advance.
I vaguely remember Saba taking on a few US dismissals. I would go ahead and contact all 4 schools to make sure. (Although I'm sure that none of them take dismissals from any of the other Big 4.)

If not SGU/Ross/AUC/Saba, then your best bet is St. Matthew's University or American University of Antigua. Those are the two that I hear the most about and actually know a SMU grad who is doing her internship year right now in Arizona.

(BTW, I would never go to either SMU or AUA. The Big 4 were always the last option I gave myself. If they rejected me I would've had to rethink what I wanted to do in life. If your friend (or anyone else) makes it from there, good job.)
 

aProgDirector

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I;m a bit late to this thread, but:

1. If your friend failed Step 1 three times, I am concerned that going to a carib school will not help. Chances of passing Step 1 are not good, and then there's the other steps, and the boards, etc. This could simply spend more money without a benefit.

2. Failing Step 1 three times will also make him/her ineligible for a medical license in many states.

3. Even if he/she gets into a carib school, and then passes Step 1, they are likely going to find it difficult to get a residency spot with poor step scores and failing out of a US medical school.
 
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Roy7

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I really appreciate the response - and that's also where I've been stuck as a friend - do I encourage him to go or attempt to continue, or just tell him to hedge his losses and move on to other things.

He's had considerable difficulty up to this point (he had to retake first year), and still is in the studying for step 1 process/possibly starting third year, while all his freshman classmates are now starting residency.

My reasoning was more that - since he's already in debt nearly 200k, might as well try to get the most from that, rather than just taking a hit and making 1000 dollar monthly payments for the next 30 years.

Oh, and he's currently 43... So, I guess the decision is up to him, I'll mention the option and see what he wants to do.

Thanks again.
 

phospho

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man, threads like these scare the crap out of me... 200K in loans, unemployed, no degree, and nothing to show for it.

I just started at a U.S. MD school, and I keep thinking to myself - what if I can't hack it? What if I can't pass step 1? I'd like to think that U.S. medical schools accept us because they know we will do fine.

Do you know if your friend could have done better? Did he just not study enough? Anything from his experience that you think people should learn not to do?

:scared:
 

dragonfly99

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This is a vote for not going to the Caribbean, for the reasons APD says.
It sounds like medicine may just not be the profession for him. If he likes health care,then maybe some other health care related thing like public health, that is less hard science-based? I am very concerned about the debt, and I also think it's kind of strange if he has 200k debt from just a couple years of med school. I thought if students have to repeat a year they usually don't have to pay another year's tuition? Perhaps he could talk to the school about forgiving the last year's tuition...they may say no, but nothing ventured nothing gained.

I am worried about whether this person might have to end up declaring bankruptcy. Depending on his other skills, he might be able to do OK financially in another profession, even well enough to pay back his loans. Pharmaceutical reps, for example, can do OK. There are folks who skipped residency and went into that field, and have done well.
 

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This is a vote for not going to the Caribbean, for the reasons APD says.
It sounds like medicine may just not be the profession for him. If he likes health care,then maybe some other health care related thing like public health, that is less hard science-based? I am very concerned about the debt, and I also think it's kind of strange if he has 200k debt from just a couple years of med school. I thought if students have to repeat a year they usually don't have to pay another year's tuition? Perhaps he could talk to the school about forgiving the last year's tuition...they may say no, but nothing ventured nothing gained.

I am worried about whether this person might have to end up declaring bankruptcy. Depending on his other skills, he might be able to do OK financially in another profession, even well enough to pay back his loans. Pharmaceutical reps, for example, can do OK. There are folks who skipped residency and went into that field, and have done well.
I agree that the Caribbean option probably isn't the best and will likely put him in a situation with more debt and still no ability to practice. I'm guessing he'll probably have trouble passing Step II since he had this much trouble with Step I anyway. Having 3 failures means he already can't be licensed in lots of states, and going to a low tier Caribbean school further limits his licensing abilities.

As for money, he can try to consolidate his loans under the direct loan program to get the new hardship accommodations where he doesn't have to pay more than 15% of the difference between his income and 150% above the poverty line. His debt will then be discharged after 25 years (10 if he gets a public service job). As for schools paying for the repeated year, I haven't heard of that at my school. Anyway, you're probably still stuck borrowing for living expenses. And student loans aren't dischargeable in bankruptcy, so that won't help him.
 

Ariee

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Do not do it! This is a really bad idea. The solution is not going to another school. The solution is figuring out why the individual is having such a difficult time with Step 1 and studying correctly for it.

A

That person would have to pass Step 1 to be let into the Carib schools, IMO.
 

Cougartime

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I vaguely remember Saba taking on a few US dismissals. I would go ahead and contact all 4 schools to make sure. (Although I'm sure that none of them take dismissals from any of the other Big 4.)

If not SGU/Ross/AUC/Saba, then your best bet is St. Matthew's University or American University of Antigua. Those are the two that I hear the most about and actually know a SMU grad who is doing her internship year right now in Arizona.

(BTW, I would never go to either SMU or AUA. The Big 4 were always the last option I gave myself. If they rejected me I would've had to rethink what I wanted to do in life. If your friend (or anyone else) makes it from there, good job.)
Okay - so I'm debating Ross vs SMU - why do you say this about SMU? What's bad about SMU? Thank you.
 

dragonfly99

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I would not recommend anyone to go to SMU or ANY of those other Caribbean med schools that are not accepted in all 50 US states for licensure. I think for those schools, there are reasons why their grads are not considered acceptable in some states. Even if you think it is just because the school is too new, I don't think it is worth the risk and expense of going down there. Ross also, from what I have heard, has been having problems; the advantage of it is that at least it's been around for many years and some residency program directors know about it and have had good experiences with their graduates.