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I don’t treat a ton of liver, but I’m not sure I’ve ever confidently seen an actual lesion on CBCT. Without a fiducial or lipiodal, are you all lining up external contour of liver/vascular structures and assuming the lesion is in correct spot or can you actually visualize the lesion?
Hypodense on a non contrast CT fairly often in my experience. Otherwise I'm lining up to the liver as you have alluded to and things have turned out ok

What does everyone do dose wise? I'm at 50/5 like the studies from JCO several years ago

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I don’t treat a ton of liver, but I’m not sure I’ve ever confidently seen an actual lesion on CBCT. Without a fiducial or lipiodal, are you all lining up external contour of liver/vascular structures and assuming the lesion is in correct spot or can you actually visualize the lesion?
It varies, but yes. Without fiducials you're generally lining up to the liver edge/anatomy close to the lesion. Super reasonable when you've got a lesion right against the edge that's obvious on CBCT, but less so when the lesion is deeper/further away/you have docs that aren't used to checking it.

Edit: dose depends. Generally 50/5, but it can be higher for CRC Mets, a bit lower if it's a smaller HCC in a patient with poor liver function. Depends on the clinical situation/what retrospective dose response study i feel like using to justify my decision.
 
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I don’t treat a ton of liver, but I’m not sure I’ve ever confidently seen an actual lesion on CBCT. Without a fiducial or lipiodal, are you all lining up external contour of liver/vascular structures and assuming the lesion is in correct spot or can you actually visualize the lesion?
I use fiducials at times. The simplest alternative is to fuse diagnostic imaging to the CT sim that clearly shows the target. Then you can get a 4DCT and determine if there is a lot of respiratory movement. If not, then treat with appropriate margins. If so, then consider breath hold; nowadays with the speed of VMAT and FFF, the significant majority of patients can tolerate this. The least desirable option is to treat the entire movement path.
 
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I use fiducials at times. The simplest alternative is to fuse diagnostic imaging to the CT sim that clearly shows the target. Then you can get a 4DCT and determine if there is a lot of respiratory movement. If not, then treat with appropriate margins. If so, then consider breath hold; nowadays with the speed of VMAT and FFF, the significant majority of patients can tolerate this. The least desirable option is to treat the entire movement path.
Yes. I would do all that, even with fiducials. It’s more about localizing for each treatment.
 
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Yes. I would do all that, even with fiducials. It’s more about localizing for each treatment.
Anyone doing fiducial-free breath hold with sgrt? On a C arm linac
 
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Anyone doing fiducial-free breath hold with sgrt? On a C arm linac
I’ve played with it. It’s difficult because there’s often discordance between the surface guided breath holds and the fiducial breath holds, ie the fiducials are off and the surface guidance is on/vice versa. It doesn’t give you a ton of confidence, and there’s no good way I’ve found of identifying patients where it works well/doesn't work well prospectively.
 
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I don’t treat a ton of liver, but I’m not sure I’ve ever confidently seen an actual lesion on CBCT. Without a fiducial or lipiodal, are you all lining up external contour of liver/vascular structures and assuming the lesion is in correct spot or can you actually visualize the lesion?
Anyone doing fiducial-free breath hold with sgrt? On a C arm linac

Like gfunk says with FFF mode breath hold is really the way to go on many liver cases I think.

I prefer fiducial but not always necessary IMO.

One way I like to do it when I don’t have a fiducial (obviously better if it’s a dome of liver lesion) is to contour the diaphragm. I do a lot of my liver sbrt with breath hold and real time image tracking. You can watch the diaphragm in real time and make sure it’s accurate through. Instead of monitoring fiducials you can monitor the diaphragm.

Like medgator said often the lesion is hypodense on a breath hold decent quality CBCT.

Next case I have like this I’ll try to take a screen shot at the linac.
 
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