UIC, UF, UPitt, UMB?

[h2o82]

I wanted to ask if anyone could give me any help with choosing which school to accept an offer. I got accepted to all four schools. My career goal is to go into pharmaceutical R/D. Thanks for the help.

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[eelo]

I wanted to ask if anyone could give me any help with choosing which school to accept an offer. I got accepted to all four schools. My career goal is to go into pharmaceutical R/D. Thanks for the help.

Gee....... knowing you as well as I do <sarcasm>, and knowing just sooooo much about your likes, dislikes, personal situation, needs, desires, transportation, weather preferences, etc, etc........

My sole recommendation is to pick one that will give you in-state rates.

 

[Rebecatfl]

UF has an excellent reputation and wonderful research facilities.. At least this is what i've heard from an alumni

 

[genesis09]

At UIC you do get some lectures from industry people. There are many pharmaceutical companies in the Chicago area.

 

[h2o82]

Gee....... knowing you as well as I do <sarcasm>, and knowing just sooooo much about your likes, dislikes, personal situation, needs, desires, transportation, weather preferences, etc, etc........

My sole recommendation is to pick one that will give you in-state rates.

all i want is some information on the schools... especially related to pharmaceutical r&d, not a psychological evaluation. the degree and the oportunities while at the school are what matters, not weather, likes and dislikes.

 

[WVUPharm2007]

Pitt and Florida are both really good schools. I think Pitt is one of the best school in the East, personally. UPMC is one of the top hospitals in the nation from what I hear from the Yinzers up North. It's like #14 or something.

The only bad part about going to Pitt is that you have to root for a football team that, as my motto over to the left reads, sucks.

Honestly though, if it were me, I'd go to the school that is the cheapest because you're just getting an undergraduate PharmD. Graduate school would be a different story.

 

[eelo]

all i want is some information on the schools... especially related to pharmaceutical r&d, not a psychological evaluation. the degree and the oportunities while at the school are what matters, not weather, likes and dislikes.

But that's not what you asked. In the original post, you asked people to help you choose a school. How can anyone other than you do that? You gave us no other information, nothing about what you're looking for and what might cause you to lean more toward one or the other. We can't read your mind, we can only read what you write. You asked for help choosing a school, and I gave it to you.

As a bonus, I gave you a little help in formulating a question.

 

[iwannabpharmer]

Honestly though, if it were me, I'd go to the school that is the cheapest because you're just getting an undergraduate PharmD. Graduate school would be a different story.

Sorry, I got confused at what you meant by undergraduate PharmD? I thought this was a Doctorate, are there other kinds of PharmD's?

 

[WVUPharm2007]

Sorry, I got confused at what you meant by undergraduate PharmD?

Even though it is a doctorate, it's still an undergraduate degree. You don't need to be a graduate to get a PharmD, you just need prerequisite courses. Some people like to say they are in grad school when they enter pharmacy school, but they are wrong. A graduate degree in the pharmacy field is to get a PhD in something like pharmaceutics, medicinal chemistry, etc. If he wants to get into the pharma industry, his best bet is true pharmacy graduate school.

I thought this was a Doctorate, are there other kinds of PharmD's?

Uh...yeah...the only type of PharmD is a PharmD...

 

[MPBenJ]

I think Pharmacy school is considered graduate school. We are not classified as undergrad for financial aid or anything else. I have never heard anyone refer to PharmD programs as undergrad.

 

[iwannabpharmer]

I agree with MPBenJ. Even though you do not receive the Bachelor's - you're moving directly into a Doctorate program. I've heard rumors though that they may require 4 years instead of the usual 2 before getting a PharmD. So, it can't be an undergraduate degree just because you do not officially get a bachelor's.

By the way, I have a Bachelor's and I am getting a Master's in May. So going back for Pharm school means I'm getting my undergraduate degree again? I don't think that's correct.

PharmD = Doctorate of Pharmacy.

You can even ask people to call you 'Doctor' if you want.

 

[WVUPharm2007]

It isn't considered graduate school. You have to have a degree, be going further in a subject similar to the undergraduate degree, and entrance to said school must require a degree to be said to be pursuing a graduate degree. Pharmacy school requires none of these. If anything, some consider it "professional" school. This itself is just a fancy euphemism of undergraduate school. If you already have a degree and are moving to pharmacy it still isn't graduate school because you are getting the entry level degree in another area. It's like getting a degree in art, then getting admitted to the medical technician program and going around calling it graduate school because you happen to have a degree. It doesn't work like that.


And at WVU, you are considered an undergraduate for the first two years of pharmacy school, then a graduate for the two years afterwards because 3rd year starts your 5th year and that's how the folks at FAFSA have it all set up...or so I'm told.

 

[iwannabpharmer]

What if someone is in a Medical Scholars program? Northwestern, for instance, has a program where you immediately go into medical school after you finish your four years of undergraduate. Is that still an undergraduate medical degree?

And I don't think you necessarily have to be going further from undergraduate to be considered graduate school. A person can study bio in undergraduate, and then art in graduate school.

 

[WVUPharm2007]

Ok, look, it's still an undergraduate degree.

Here's a good way to test this.

When you actually get to pharmacy school, go to the Medicinal Chemistry dept. with all of the people working towards PhDs and proclaim that the PharmD is a graduate degree. They will laugh at you...at best.

Want practical experience? I used to help the grad school chemists in my school's Med Chem dept do elementary synthesis during my first year of pharmacy school and they would always ask me if I was considering going to grad school when I was done with undergrad.

I can't believe I'm actually getting into an argument with the people on the kiddie board.....

 

[MPBenJ]

I can't believe I'm actually getting into an argument with the people on the kiddie board.....

Wow. How could you possibly lower yourself by arguing with people from the "kiddie" board!!! I love how some people on this forum feel so superior to the pre-pharmacy people.

From USC's Pharmacy School website:

"All students entering the School of Pharmacy are considered graduate students".

This is a dumb argument.... but I think you're wrong. Granted, getting a PhD is totally different than getting a PharmD.... that doesn't mean one is a graduate student and the other isn't. Professional students ARE considered graduate students. Believe whatever you want.....

 

[WVUPharm2007]

Wow. How could you possibly lower yourself by "arguing" with people from the "kiddie" board!!!

I actually ask myself that all the time. Most of the advice given on this forum is drawn from a laughably tiny bit of experience. I especially like it when the topic of "best school" comes up. Or what the theoretical average admin committee is looking for. There isn't a person on the continent that is really qualified enough to answer these questions for every pharmacy school in the country, yet people sure as heck do make **** up that sounds good. That's why I call it the kiddie board. The blind leading the blind.

What a stupid remark. I love how people on this forum feel so superior to the pre-pharmacy people.

The people on the pre-pharmacy ("this forum") forum feel so superior to the people on the pre-pharmacy forum? Huh. Interesting.

But that doesn't matter because I'm intrinsically superior to you anyway. So, ha!

From USC's Pharmacy School website:

"All students entering the School of Pharmacy are considered graduate students".

Ok, maybe at USC they are considered graduate students. Good for them. That still doesn't make it a graduate degree. By definition and how it's dealt with where I go to school they are not. I'm proud of your search engine skills. I really am. I can google **** up, too. For instance, UCONN considers the PharmD an undergraduate degree. First thing that popped up on google. God, I love that google.

A specific quote:

The Pharm.D. is a professional degree such as those earned by attorneys [JD] or doctors [MD] -- not a graduate degree.

So is a PharmD from UCONN less cool than a "graduate" PharmD from USC? Hahaha.

This is a dumb argument.... but I think you're wrong.

I agree, reversing the parties of course, as I am never wrong. I am only occasionally mistaken.

I'm not even sure why you choose to get on my case on this one. I'm not the one that started it am I?

Granted, getting a PhD is totally different than getting a PharmD.... that doesn't mean one is a graduate student and the other isn't.

It's not just that. The two are completely different in concept. One you are an employee of the school and you work towards completing a thesis. The other you pay your way and are awarded a degree by completing coursework.

Professional students ARE considered graduate students.

I guess it depends on where you go. Obviously USC disagrees with the conventional idea of "graduate school." They may do as they please. Maybe it really is a graduate school though and I'm wrong. Do they pay their pharmacy students stipends now? If so, I totally went to the wrong school.

Believe whatever you want.....

Don't need your permission, ya little whiny baby. I'll believe the moon is made of cheese, you'll accept it as fact, and you'll like it.

 

[sellindrugz]

WVU - This is a great argument, thanks for the laughs. You remind me very much of a friend of mine. Ha.

 

[genesis09]

UIC considers Pharmacy, Dentistry and Medicine students, professional students. You'll get the grad loan dollars, but you won't get any TA/GA-ships.

 

[MPBenJ]

OK... I think this is all semantics and it doesn't really matter..... no. I know it doesn't matter.

Hey I did start reading your blog though - it's hilarious! I love it.


Signed
Whiny little baby from Chicago

 

[MPBenJ]

Don't need your permission, ya little whiny baby. I'll believe the moon is made of cheese, you'll accept it as fact, and you'll like it.

OK... I think this is all semantics and it doesn't really matter..... no. I know it doesn't matter.

Hey I did start reading your blog though - it's hilarious! I love it.


Signed
Whiny little baby from Chicago

 

[h2o82]

So, now that we discussed the meaning of a pharmD program, does anyone have more information about those school that i can use to determine which one to attend. Thanks for all the post though, i really appreciate them.

 

[WVUPharm2007]

Honestly, if you are getting a PharmD it doesn't really matter. Where you go AFTER your PharmD to get a postgraduate education is what matters. You'll want to look into getting a PhD in Pharmaceutics, Medicinal Chemistry, etc. Those are the guys that do drug discovery and formulation. When it's all said and done, you'll be in school into your late 20s at the earliest. Yeah, suck, huh? The grad schools considered the best are different based on who you ask. I've heard good things about San Fran & Wisconsin's graduate schools.

The answer is basically:

-Which school is the cheapest
-Which school is in the coolest locale
-How much are the living expenses in said locale
-What school strikes you as the one you want to go to the most

When you weigh the options of those four points, you will see where you belong. If it were me, I'd go to Pitt or Florida.

 

[WVUPharm2007]

I'm gonna start putting ads on that damned blog. Make me some money.

 

[MPBenJ]

So, now that we discussed the meaning of a pharmD program, does anyone have more information about those school that i can use to determine which one to attend. Thanks for all the post though, i really appreciate them.

I apologize for hijacking the thread on a topic that has nothing to do with your question.

I agree that if you want to do pharmaceutical R&D, it seems like a PhD is the route for that more than a PharmD (not that you can't do research with a PharmD)... but a PhD is specifically for research while a PharmD isn't.

I'm going to UIC starting this fall, and I was told there are many many opportunitites for UIC pharmacy students to participate in research - from bench work to more clinically-related research.

I think any large research institution will have plenty of opportunities...

Where will you feel most "at home", which is cheapest, where did you have your best experience when you visited the school?

 

[iwannabpharmer]

sorry, h2o82

 

[WVUPharm2007]

Research opportunities to PharmDs are more on the clinical side of R&d than in the cold, hard science side of R&D. They are more likely to help with clinical trials than be the guy that does drug discovery. What TYPE of research you want to do will play a big role, too.

 

[h2o82]

well, there is one huge reason why i chose not to apply for a phd in pharmaceucial science or related: if sh_t hits the fan, you can always work in a pharmacy, either hospital or retail. getting a phd, you are always surrounded by the uncertainty about grant money among other things. additionally, you can also teach with a pharmD. pretty much, a pharmD is a more flexible degree than a phD.