UMO trainee's experience

[UMOcandidate]

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10-10-DMO billet list (11 total):

NEDU- panama city
UCT-little creek
sub-Bangor
sub-Groton
sub-kings bay
sub-Guam
NUMI-Groton
clinic-Groton
clinic-charleston
clinic-charleston
clinic-Portsmouth, NH

The 2 dive billets were unexpected and much appreciated. The 2 UMOCs with legitamate family co-location issues were accomadated. Billeting was performed our first week back in Groton.

 

[levikk]

Probably meeting them at the ER where BC physicians do their thing and then reporting back to the CO.

That is the lot of a GMO in CONUS.

At most, BLS transport to the ER where the BC physicians can do their thing, followed by a status report to the CO.

pgg - That's actually not true. Most ER's around the world are not equipped to deal with diving casualties, i.e. they don't have a chamber with qualified personnel to run it ready at all times. That is one of the unique aspects of being a UMO. If there is an active duty diving casualty in your area, and you are on call, YOU are the provider of care running treatment tables from inside/outside of the treatment chamber. Most USN diving commands have a chamber spun up 24/7 with an on-call chamber team ready to respond within 30 minutes. In some areas, the UMO's carry the phone for civilian casualties as well, for the very reason that most ER's aren't equipped to handle diving casualties.

Agreed with pgg though, once our dive treatment is done, we make every effort to get them to a higher level of care for follow-up and to get a residency trained physician to see them, if it's needed.

As for actually receiving the casualty, usually the UMO is not on dive side and will be called to come to the site. The divers do the dirty work of bringing the casualty to the surface, there's not much we could do underwater...

 

[Maverick10]

Hey everyone, after googling some Navy GMO stuff I was once again reunited with SDN and was glad to see that there was an active UMO thread. I'm a few years away from all of this, but I want to find out as much as I can now, so that I'll be somewhat informed when it's time to make some decisions.

I know that I want surgery (CT, Ortho, Trauma, or Transplant) and I'm fully aware b/c of that, I'll almost certainly do a GMO tour first. I always wanted to serve in the military, and I'll admit that I was attracted to Navy medicine in part because of the advertised emphasis on discipline, physical standards, and unique opportunities accompanying some of the billets for Navy docs--especially GMO tours (too many promo videos I suppose). But the more I learn about GMO stuff, especially FS, FMF, & now UMOs, I'm coming to terms with the fact that most of those opportunities aren't really all they cracked up to be in a sense. But with that said, and probably to the benefit of the entire USN and USMC, I'm also beginning to more fully appreciate that my primary role will always be just to be the best damn doc for our sailors, marines, and their dependents that I can be...so whatever, I'll just throw on a Navy jersey and go do an Ironman and then hit the shooting range or something afterwards to get it out of my system.

I suppose that my biggest concern rather will be how to become a better doc (and not fall behind or let my skills atrophy) while serving as a GMO for 1, 2, 3, or even possibly 4 years--so that I won't be too disadvantaged when going back to GME and am head-to-head with PGY-2s fresh out of their surgical internship.


Anyhow, I'm sorry about the long intro...here's just a few questions I had about UMO stuff:

1) What's so special about serving as a UMO? Besides the obvious training, what make's them different than any other regular GMO at some clinic doing physicals and sick call all day--b/c I'm guessing that there isn't a diving-related emergency daily.

2) What are the differences between serving as a UMO at a sub or dive duty stations? And why are dive billets more sought after--I mean it's not like you're out there swimming with the SEALs everyday right?

3) What about deployments for UMOs? I thought subs only had corpsmen? And if you're serving w/ a dive unit, do you deploy with their unit and just stay on the ship?


Please forgive my ignorance and thanks for any light shed on the subject.

 

[levikk]

1) What's so special about serving as a UMO? Besides the obvious training, what make's them different than any other regular GMO at some clinic doing physicals and sick call all day--b/c I'm guessing that there isn't a diving-related emergency daily.

So, I'll start by saying that the Navy is transitioning away from the GMO program, the stated goal is to go to completely residency trained physicians serving the fleet in the near future. To that end, more and more people are going straight through. GMO's are a dying breed...

There's been a lot of information posted in this thread, so I'll try not to repeat too much. Your options: Marine GMO, fleet GMO, Flight or UMO. Marines will most likely get deployed in some fashion, that's your best bet if you want to "get in the fight." Fleet GMO's get stuck in clinics or on the bigger ships, some love it, some don't. Flight is one of the more popular programs, but they tend to be put in billets where they have required clinic time (which maybe isn't all that bad). Most of them really love their jobs, they get deployed a lot too. UMO's go through a much more rigorous training than anyone else, it's PT heavy and that's what attracts a lot of people to it. Also, you get to work with some hooyah communities, usually where people really want to do their jobs so you get less of the riff raff malingering in medical than you do as a general GMO.

Most UMO billets are not at clinics.


2) What are the differences between serving as a UMO at a sub or dive duty stations? And why are dive billets more sought after--I mean it's not like you're out there swimming with the SEALs everyday right?

The difference is the people you see every day. Most dive/specwar commands have mandatory PT and just generally a different attitude. Subs are hooyah as well, but it tends to be more clinic time (just because there's so many more personnel aboard subs) and there are more of the malingerer types in the sub community. In short, at dive and specwar commands, you aren't trained to be an operator, but they encourage you participating in their training evolutions. So, you get to dive a lot and just do some fun stuff most people don't ever get to experience.

3) What about deployments for UMOs? I thought subs only had corpsmen? And if you're serving w/ a dive unit, do you deploy with their unit and just stay on the ship?

Subs only have IDC's (independent duty corpsmen). UMO's do not deploy as part of a sub ships crew. However, some specwar commands (SDV) do send UMO's for short missions aboard subs, but you're there for the specific specwar aspect of the mission. There is some opportunity for deployment as a UMO, some of the specwar groups go over for 4 - 6 months. Mostly though, you'll get some TAD's (temporary active duty) to go support for a brief period, usually less than a month. If you're looking to deploy for sure, don't do UMO, those billets are highly sought after and very few in number.

Deploying with a dive unit is usually for one of those short TAD's. Typically, you stay on the ship as support for medical emergencies. However, you will get in the water if you want to. Again, these guys love to see the docs get involved, so you are encouraged to participate.

Hope that helps.

 

[pgg]

So, I'll start by saying that the Navy is transitioning away from the GMO program, the stated goal is to go to completely residency trained physicians serving the fleet in the near future. To that end, more and more people are going straight through. GMO's are a dying breed...

To the Navy's credit, there has actually been some progress in converting GMO billets over the last few years.

However, the first time I heard that Navy GMOs were a dying breed was in 1997. Straight-through training was coming in the near future then, too.

Anyone accepting Navy HPSP today should do so with the expectation that they too will serve as a GMO prior to completing residency. Realistic expectations limit disappointment.

 

[levikk]

To the Navy's credit, there has actually been some progress in converting GMO billets over the last few years.

However, the first time I heard that Navy GMOs were a dying breed was in 1997. Straight-through training was coming in the near future then, too.

Anyone accepting Navy HPSP today should do so with the expectation that they too will serve as a GMO prior to completing residency. Realistic expectations limit disappointment.

This is actually an interesting topic, I am fairly new to the Navy, and the whole time I've been hearing GMO's will be phased out too... there is another side to this issue though, the Navy really suffered in their recruiting over the middle of this decade, so numbers of interns will be way down. I'm not sure how this will affect GMO's, but I suspect in order to fulfill this transition and fill navy residency programs, less and less people will be entering the GMO world.

I don't have the answer on this one as it is way above my pay grade; though it does appear future medical officers will have a much greater chance of NOT being a GMO. For instance, the past couple of years several interns at Portsmouth have gone straight through each year in ER, Surgery, Ortho, IM... this used to be unheard of.

That being said, pgg probably gives good advice. Just remain flexible and remember that both GMO/residency are viable options after your internship.

 

[UMOC101]

It's been a while so I thought I'd post an update. Billet's for our class were:

2 dive
2 sub
4 clinic
1 NUMI

Billet selection was primarily based on family situation. While his SHOULD be fair, it's worth noting that over half of the class had some form of family situation. Class rank had nothing to do with billets chosen. I've talked with several of my classmates since graduation, and over half are disappointed in our jobs and I anticipate that 4-5 will leave the community immediately after our first tour.

From what I hear, the billet process for the last class was that the UMO director (1st tour UMO with no operational experience) chose the billets. It might pay to be nice to him.

If I could do it over again, I would not have chosen this community. I feel that those that chose FMF or FS are far happier.

I know that there are UMO's who are very happy with their jobs, and those are the one who typically give the slideshows to recruit new members. I just want to inform others that if you come into this community expecting to get a cool dive, recon, EOD, or SEAL job, you have a greater than 75% chance of being disappointed. The focus of this community has and will continue to be radiation health and pleasing the nukes. I would talk to as many former UMO's as possible and ask them about their experiences. If you are still gung-ho, plan on having a crappy first tour. If you are fortunate enough to get a cool job first time out, bonus. At least you won't be disappointed if you are like the majority of my class.

 

[blee]

Out of curiosity, where were those billets located?

 

[BOHICA-FIGMO]

Out of curiosity, where were those billets located?

Bremerton - undersea medicine clinic
Bahrain - expeditionary combat command
Groton x 2 - NUMI and sub-escape trainer (pre-billet)
San Diego x 2 - BUD/S (joint spouse) and SWG 3 (pre-billet)
Great Lakes - requested for personal reasons
Two washed back to next class.

It is not all doom and gloom like some people would say, but I will add a few things.

-- Unless you are married or already board certified, you basically have very little input into your assignment (with a few exceptions). The only guys who got what they wanted were: (a) joint spouse (b) previously board certified docs who were pre-billeted (c) or asked for something (Great Lakes) that very few people want.

-- it is clear in the UMO community that the second tour guys get priority and the UMOC trainees get short shrift. I understand this, but the number of interns who choose FSO or FMF over UMO is something like 4:1. Wonder why?

-- I was clearly UNIMPRESSED by the current head of undersea medicine. His comments were disorganized and he didn't even look us in the eye when speaking to us, either as a group or privately. I think this is the result of being given so many hats to wear and so many responsibilities that UMOC billeting gets placed way, WAY, down the priority list. That being said, there will be a new guy in charge this summer, and everyone runs things differently.

-- be careful what you say, because this forum IS monitored. We were told that the comments made by certain members of previous classes was known as the "student doctor scandal." Take it for what it is worth.

 

[UMOC101]

So, the "student doctor scandal".......

The UMO course director found out about it, and called/emailed his classmates (levikk among them). Obviously you can read the posts above to see how upset some were. When we got back to Groton, the course director told us he didn't think it was a big deal and that it was the senior UMO's who were upset. He said he thought he knew who did it, and that they "had poor career preservation instincts". He had quite a bit of input to our billets (and from what I hear, he makes the billet decisions now), and I would not be surprised if the billets decisions were influenced by these posts.

I want to take a second to reiterate my reason for making this post. I want applicants to have a fair and balanced view of the UMO community. When someone comes in and says they were stationed with SDV or MDSU, I want people to realize that that is not the typical UMO job. If you plan on getting something like that as a first billet, you will likely be disappointed. I don't remember anyone showing pictures of the BSO-18 (clinic) or NSSC (sub) billets. Applicants need to understand that it is FAR more likely that they will get one of these assignments for their first tour (especially with pre-selection for residency trained folks, family co-location applicants, and second tour folks eating up the good billets). I will freely admit that there are some great billets, but they are fewer in number than the crappy ones. If making this known to applicants upsets fellow UMO's, so be it. I find it quite telling when someone else tries to silence the truth.

 

[orbitsurgMD]

So, the "student doctor scandal".......

The UMO course director found out about it, and called/emailed his classmates (levikk among them). Obviously you can read the posts above to see how upset some were. When we got back to Groton, the course director told us he didn't think it was a big deal and that it was the senior UMO's who were upset. He said he thought he knew who did it, and that they "had poor career preservation instincts". He had quite a bit of input to our billets (and from what I hear, he makes the billet decisions now), and I would not be surprised if the billets decisions were influenced by these posts.

I want to take a second to reiterate my reason for making this post. I want applicants to have a fair and balanced view of the UMO community. When someone comes in and says they were stationed with SDV or MDSU, I want people to realize that that is not the typical UMO job. If you plan on getting something like that as a first billet, you will likely be disappointed. I don't remember anyone showing pictures of the BSO-18 (clinic) or NSSC (sub) billets. Applicants need to understand that it is FAR more likely that they will get one of these assignments for their first tour (especially with pre-selection for residency trained folks, family co-location applicants, and second tour folks eating up the good billets). I will freely admit that there are some great billets, but they are fewer in number than the crappy ones. If making this known to applicants upsets fellow UMO's, so be it. I find it quite telling when someone else tries to silence the truth.

So the response to the past bad behavior by BUMED and the operational medicine leadership, justifiable public criticism that not surprisingly affects recruitment (nothing like being caught in lies and deceptions) is now to threaten punishment to those who disclose their dissatisfaction.

Someone drilled their pilot holes a little too deep before screwing on their thinking cap.

Student doctor "scandal." That's great. I am hoping for Gawker-style disclosures now. What the BUMED just doesn't get is that when you piss someone off so much that they want to quit at the very first opportunity they have, they also make longstanding critics who have no fear of career-harming consequences. Those critics become in time senior and respected physicians whose negative opinions carry weight.

Really, it is sad.

 

[UMOC101]

So the response to the past bad behavior by BUMED and the operational medicine leadership, justifiable public criticism that not surprisingly affects recruitment (nothing like being caught in lies and deceptions) is now to threaten punishment to those who disclose their dissatisfaction.

Someone drilled their pilot holes a little too deep before screwing on their thinking cap.

Student doctor "scandal." That's great. I am hoping for Gawker-style disclosures now. What the BUMED just doesn't get is that when you piss someone off so much that they want to quit at the very first opportunity they have, they also make longstanding critics who have no fear of career-harming consequences. Those critics become in time senior and respected physicians whose negative opinions carry weight.

Really, it is sad.

I couldn't have said it better myself.

If you bait and switch enough people, someone is going to say something.

 

[Gastrapathy]

So the response to the past bad behavior by BUMED and the operational medicine leadership, justifiable public criticism that not surprisingly affects recruitment (nothing like being caught in lies and deceptions) is now to threaten punishment to those who disclose their dissatisfaction.

Someone drilled their pilot holes a little too deep before screwing on their thinking cap.

Student doctor "scandal." That's great. I am hoping for Gawker-style disclosures now. What the BUMED just doesn't get is that when you piss someone off so much that they want to quit at the very first opportunity they have, they also make longstanding critics who have no fear of career-harming consequences. Those critics become in time senior and respected physicians whose negative opinions carry weight.

Really, it is sad.

Those critics don't have to become senior physicians for their opinion to carry weight. People read the SDN.

My take is that, if you want to be a UMO, train after a primary care residency. For everyone else, you'll have more fun with the greenside.

 

[UMOC101]

Those critics don't have to become senior physicians for their opinion to carry weight. People read the SDN.

My take is that, if you want to be a UMO, train after a primary care residency. For everyone else, you'll have more fun with the greenside.

1. >3,000 views of this thread already. People are reading it.

2. Agree 100%. The residency trained folks get to "pre-select" billets. What an advantage that is!! I'd add that if you choose to do UMO as a second tour (ie. after FMF or FS and before residency) you will NOT be given any special consideration for billets. The guy in my class that had already done a FMF tour ended up with the worst assignment in the class.

 

[pgg]

The guy in my class that had already done a FMF tour ended up with the worst assignment in the class.

I have to ask - what on earth is a guy who's already done a 2+ year FMF tour doing signing up for another 3 years of GMO time in the dive community?

 

[UMOC101]

I have to ask - what on earth is a guy who's already done a 2+ year FMF tour doing signing up for another 3 years of GMO time in the dive community?

Hoping for a sweet dive billet, of course.

 

[pgg]

Hoping for a sweet dive billet, of course.

Heh.

On a related note, am I the only one who thinks there is something wrong with a doctor who electively avoids residency that long?

 

[AF M4]

Heh.

On a related note, am I the only one who thinks there is something wrong with a doctor who electively avoids residency that long?

I've met a couple majors and one lieutenant colonel who've managed to bounce around in the AF without getting a residency. Generally they're fairly nice guys who are easy to have a beer with and will enthusiastically tell you stories about the cool places they've been all night. Ask them a clinical question though and they'll turn white as a ghost, and they will not see sick call even under threat of getting tased.

Seriously, I have this electric fly swatter and I told one guy I was going to shock him unless he saw some patients. He thought I was kidding.

 

[BOHICA-FIGMO]

I've met a couple majors and one lieutenant colonel who've managed to bounce around in the AF without getting a residency. Generally they're fairly nice guys who are easy to have a beer with and will enthusiastically tell you stories about the cool places they've been all night. Ask them a clinical question though and they'll turn white as a ghost, and they will not see sick call even under threat of getting tased.

Seriously, I have this electric fly swatter and I told one guy I was going to shock him unless he saw some patients. He thought I was kidding.

On a related, related note: you won't make O-5 in the Navy unless you are board certified in something.

 

[CajunMedic]

Out of curiosity, were there any prior service enlisted HM's in the UMO course? I wonder what the chances of someone who was an operator as enlisted (either SWCC or HM with the dive medic NEC) would have towards billeting?

I'm looking at career options-currently working with a reserve recruiter to enlist as an HM. I am interested in serving in either of the above rates, not strictly as a segue to UMO.

 

[orbitsurgMD]

Out of curiosity, were there any prior service enlisted HM's in the UMO course? I wonder what the chances of someone who was an operator as enlisted (either SWCC or HM with the dive medic NEC) would have towards billeting?

I'm looking at career options-currently working with a reserve recruiter to enlist as an HM. I am interested in serving in either of the above rates, not strictly as a segue to UMO.

UMOs will not be billeted as special warfare operators.

If you are looking at enlistment as a hospitalman, you should know that is utterly different from UMO as a physician and officer. There is no segue to UMO from being a HN except by way of medical school and internship.

 

[pgg]

I've met a couple majors and one lieutenant colonel who've managed to bounce around in the AF without getting a residency. Generally they're fairly nice guys who are easy to have a beer with and will enthusiastically tell you stories about the cool places they've been all night. Ask them a clinical question though and they'll turn white as a ghost, and they will not see sick call even under threat of getting tased.

Seriously, I have this electric fly swatter and I told one guy I was going to shock him unless he saw some patients. He thought I was kidding.

My current hospital CO did a bunch of flight surgery time and then a prev med residency. Great guy. As a path to administrative or executive medicine multiple GMO tours and residency avoidance seems to be OK. (If nothing else, it's 10x better than putting someone from the NC or MSC in command of hospitals.) What always gives me the of suspicion are the guys who say they want to practice medicine but can't pull themselves away from the GMO Adventure Summer Camp world to do a residency.


As for the taser-motivator - my specialty is not at risk of being used as converted-GMO-billet material, but if ordered to that duty someone would probably have to tase me repeatedly to get me to see sick call. Not work avoidance or laziness, mind you - it's just that I've forgotten enough (and paradoxically learned enough) that I'd be really uncomfortable practicing that kind of medicine.

 

[pgg]

On a related, related note: you won't make O-5 in the Navy unless you are board certified in something.

I don't believe board certification is a requirement. Maybe just 'residency trained'? A couple people I know picked up O5 before taking their specialty boards.

 

[AF M4]

My current hospital CO did a bunch of flight surgery time and then a prev med residency. Great guy. As a path to administrative or executive medicine multiple GMO tours and residency avoidance seems to be OK. (If nothing else, it's 10x better than putting someone from the NC or MSC in command of hospitals.) What always gives me the of suspicion are the guys who say they want to practice medicine but can't pull themselves away from the GMO Adventure Summer Camp world to do a residency.

As for the taser-motivator - my specialty is not at risk of being used as converted-GMO-billet material, but if ordered to that duty someone would probably have to tase me repeatedly to get me to see sick call. Not work avoidance or laziness, mind you - it's just that I've forgotten enough (and paradoxically learned enough) that I'd be really uncomfortable practicing that kind of medicine.

Naw...if you've been tased once, that's all it's gonna take. And I didn't actually "tase" him; merely a purely accidental slip that happened to produce an unexpected electrical discharge while the superior officer happened to be in the vicinity. We've all promised to take more precautions in the future.

Also, I certainly didn't intend to imply that residency or fellowship trained specialists be forced to see the endless supply of URIs and hangovers that meander into sick call every morning. However it does make me antsy when a physician who's pulling down bonuses for being board certified in aerospace medicine hasn't seen a sick flyer in over a year.

 

[BOHICA-FIGMO]

I don't believe board certification is a requirement. Maybe just 'residency trained'? A couple people I know picked up O5 before taking their specialty boards.

You are correct. I probably should have rephrased it to say: board certified, board eligible, or currently in residency training. The point is, you at least have to be in the process of achieving board certification to get promoted.

 

[Kris1]

So I'm a FAPer with a three year active duty service obligation. I fully expect that I will serve as an EM physician at some base hospital during my obligation but what I really want is something "high speed low drag" given my prior service as an enlisted Marine. Is the Navy likely to listen and give me a dive billet after my first tour of duty if that is what it takes to keep me in after my obligation is up?

 

[backrow]

So I'm a FAPer with a three year active duty service obligation. I fully expect that I will serve as an EM physician at some base hospital during my obligation but what I really want is something "high speed low drag" given my prior service as an enlisted Marine. Is the Navy likely to listen and give me a dive billet after my first tour of duty if that is what it takes to keep me in after my obligation is up?

Unlikely that the EM specialty leader would release you to UMO training in my opinion, but you never know. I think that would be the biggest hang up.

 

[UMOC101]

So I'm a FAPer with a three year active duty service obligation. I fully expect that I will serve as an EM physician at some base hospital during my obligation but what I really want is something "high speed low drag" given my prior service as an enlisted Marine. Is the Navy likely to listen and give me a dive billet after my first tour of duty if that is what it takes to keep me in after my obligation is up?

1. What is FAP?

2. I'm extremely sorry to say this, but your prior service matters 0.0000% when it comes to billiting in the UMO community (unless you're a Frog who can get someone to request you specifically).

3. Please read the rest of my quotes, but there is nothing "high speed, low drag" about this community. Seriously! The last class had a guy who couldn't even do 1 pull up. Instead of booting him or sending him to some crappy rad health job, they're rolling him back into the next class.

Under the current regime, you can negotiate billet prior to agreeing to accept UMOC orders. I'm not sure how that will change down the road, given we a getting a new speciality leader in the next 6-12 months.

If you want to PM me with what you consider "high speed, low drag", I'll be more than happy to tell you what UMO billets fit your needs.

 

[Kris1]

1. What is FAP?

2. I'm extremely sorry to say this, but your prior service matters 0.0000% when it comes to billiting in the UMO community (unless you're a Frog who can get someone to request you specifically).

3. Please read the rest of my quotes, but there is nothing "high speed, low drag" about this community. Seriously! The last class had a guy who couldn't even do 1 pull up. Instead of booting him or sending him to some crappy rad health job, they're rolling him back into the next class.

Under the current regime, you can negotiate billet prior to agreeing to accept UMOC orders. I'm not sure how that will change down the road, given we a getting a new speciality leader in the next 6-12 months.

If you want to PM me with what you consider "high speed, low drag", I'll be more than happy to tell you what UMO billets fit your needs.

FAP stands for Financial Assistance Program. It is designed for residents in medical specialties and the military pays a lump sum in addition to a monthly stipend directly to the resident during his or her residency in exchange for a military commitment to serve as an attending.

I don't expect any prior military service to help me in my future service. I was just simply throwing that in.

I recall from my last billet as a Marine that I worked in the capacity of retaining Marines (though I myself was getting out ironically). In order to retain Marines we would offer otherwise out-of-reach billets or training to them. I was just curious if a chance at UMO was similar in that regard.

That's frightening to hear that their physical fitness standards are so low.

 

[BOHICA-FIGMO]

So I'm a FAPer with a three year active duty service obligation. I fully expect that I will serve as an EM physician at some base hospital during my obligation but what I really want is something "high speed low drag" given my prior service as an enlisted Marine. Is the Navy likely to listen and give me a dive billet after my first tour of duty if that is what it takes to keep me in after my obligation is up?

the answer is maybe. However, after you have done your staff EM gig somewhere, there is a good chance they would let you go to do dive medicine. There are a number of billets that "prefer" (if not outright require) board certification (EM and FP are most popular, but there are others). The current class and the previous class both had board certified EM docs with prior service.

And there are a few UMO billets with the Marines (usually Force Recon and MARSOC) ;-)

 

[Kris1]

And there are a few UMO billets with the Marines (usually Force Recon and MARSOC) ;-)

Yeah... you understand exactly where I'm coming from.

 

[UMOC101]

the answer is maybe. However, after you have done your staff EM gig somewhere, there is a good chance they would let you go to do dive medicine. There are a number of billets that "prefer" (if not outright require) board certification (EM and FP are most popular, but there are others). The current class and the previous class both had board certified EM docs with prior service.

And there are a few UMO billets with the Marines (usually Force Recon and MARSOC) ;-)

The EM guy (FP with EM experience) in my class didn't graduate (couldn't swim), and his "prior service" is questionable at best.

I think there are 6 USMC billets total (3 with Recon Batt, 2 with MSOB, 1 with MARSOC).

Again, you'll be in the best position since you can negotiate location prior to accepting UMOC orders. Even still, don't be surprised if the program director steers you towards some "sweet sub billet". He's famous for reminding folks that "Naval Reactors pays our bills".

 

[ZizAniE13]

Anyone out there know where the winter class got billeted?

 

[BOHICA-FIGMO]

Anyone out there know where the winter class got billeted?

Undersea Medicine Clinic - Pearl Harbor
Naval Surface Warfare Center - Coronado (Pre-billet)
MARSOC (2nd MSOB) - Camp Lejeune
Naval Power Training Unit - Charleston
Undersea Medicine Clinic - Bangor
Nuclear Prototype School - Ballston Spa, NY
AS 39 Emory S. Land (Sub-tender) - Diego Garcia 😱
2nd MARDIV FMF (Force Recon Battalion) - Camp Lejuene
Naval Surface Warfare Group One, Logistics Support Group - Coronado
COMSUBGRU 9 - Bangor
AS 40 Frank Cable (sub-tender) - Guam
COMSUBDEVRON 5 ("I could tell you but I'd have to kill you...") - Bangor

 

[Gastrapathy]

Undersea Medicine Clinic - Pearl Harbor
Naval Surface Warfare Center - Coronado (Pre-billet)
MARSOC (2nd MSOB) - Camp Lejeune
Naval Power Training Unit - Charleston
Undersea Medicine Clinic - Bangor
Nuclear Prototype School - Ballston Spa, NY
AS 39 Emory S. Land (Sub-tender) - Diego Garcia 😱
2nd MARDIV FMF (Force Recon Battalion) - Camp Lejuene
Naval Surface Warfare Group One, Logistics Support Group - Coronado
COMSUBGRU 9 - Bangor
AS 40 Frank Cable (sub-tender) - Guam
COMSUBDEVRON 5 ("I could tell you but I'd have to kill you...") - Bangor

Clinic jockeys for the self-selected group that want to play with operators. Charleston's nice but I think the power school is about the only thing there now (AF base too?).

Don't you mean Special Warfare everywhere you wrote Surface?

Greenside flight surgeon = better than all of these.

 

[pgg]

Clinic jockeys for the self-selected group that want to play with operators. Charleston's nice but I think the power school is about the only thing there now (AF base too?).

Don't you mean Special Warfare everywhere you wrote Surface?

Greenside flight surgeon = better than all of these.

Hell, greenside grunt doc = better than all of these.

Never quite understood why so many high-speed low-drag tip-of-the-spear guys chase dive billets. Ugh. 90% of them never seem to get any closer to "doing stuff" than the average FMF Division billet.

 

[UMOC101]

Undersea Medicine Clinic - Pearl Harbor
Naval Surface Warfare Center - Coronado (Pre-billet)
MARSOC (2nd MSOB) - Camp Lejeune
Naval Power Training Unit - Charleston
Undersea Medicine Clinic - Bangor
Nuclear Prototype School - Ballston Spa, NY
AS 39 Emory S. Land (Sub-tender) - Diego Garcia 😱
2nd MARDIV FMF (Force Recon Battalion) - Camp Lejuene
Naval Surface Warfare Group One, Logistics Support Group - Coronado
COMSUBGRU 9 - Bangor
AS 40 Frank Cable (sub-tender) - Guam
COMSUBDEVRON 5 ("I could tell you but I'd have to kill you...") - Bangor

I'd be interested to know how correct this list is. A classmate of mine recently went down to NDSTC and spoke to a few of the guys from 11-10. Only 2 had confirmation of orders (Naval Special Warfare (BUD/S) and 2nd MSOB). I think both of those were residency trained guys.

If this list is correct, 4 out of 12 are actual "dive" billets. The remainder are Naval Reactor fodder. The worst of the bunch are the prototype billets. Welcome to bootcamp medicine.

I agree 100% with the above: anything greenside>flight surgeon>blueside>undersea.

 

[BOHICA-FIGMO]

Clinic jockeys for the self-selected group that want to play with operators. Charleston's nice but I think the power school is about the only thing there now (AF base too?).

Don't you mean Special Warfare everywhere you wrote Surface?

Greenside flight surgeon = better than all of these.

Yeah, not sure how that happened...will teach fingers how to type "special" instead of surface ;-)

 

[BOHICA-FIGMO]

I'd be interested to know how correct this list is. A classmate of mine recently went down to NDSTC and spoke to a few of the guys from 11-10. Only 2 had confirmation of orders (Naval Special Warfare (BUD/S) and 2nd MSOB). I think both of those were residency trained guys.

If this list is correct, 4 out of 12 are actual "dive" billets. The remainder are Naval Reactor fodder. The worst of the bunch are the prototype billets. Welcome to bootcamp medicine.

I agree 100% with the above: anything greenside>flight surgeon>blueside>undersea.

Well, I have a hard copy in my hand...provided by the HMFIC. One of the billets changed over the weekend but everyone else is the same...

 

[UMOC101]

Well, I have a hard copy in my hand...provided by the HMFIC. One of the billets changed over the weekend but everyone else is the same...

How are the billets being allocated?

 

[BOHICA-FIGMO]

How are the billets being allocated?

Same as the past few classes: the HMFIC figures out which billets are must fill and which must be gapped. Then he tries to match up must fill billets with individual's preference, family situation, and background.

 

[BOHICA-FIGMO]

I'd be interested to know how correct this list is. A classmate of mine recently went down to NDSTC and spoke to a few of the guys from 11-10. Only 2 had confirmation of orders (Naval Special Warfare (BUD/S) and 2nd MSOB). I think both of those were residency trained guys.

If this list is correct, 4 out of 12 are actual "dive" billets. The remainder are Naval Reactor fodder. The worst of the bunch are the prototype billets. Welcome to bootcamp medicine.

I agree 100% with the above: anything greenside>flight surgeon>blueside>undersea.

Your classmate gave you good gouge except that the 2nd MSOB billet is not a board certified guy. That guy had a medical issue that forced him to roll back from the summer class.

 

[UMOC101]

Same as the past few classes: the HMFIC figures out which billets are must fill and which must be gapped. Then he tries to match up must fill billets with individual's preference, family situation, and background.

So the speciality leader decides or UMOC coordinator decides? I'm assuming class rank doesn't matter......

 

[BOHICA-FIGMO]

So the speciality leader decides or UMOC coordinator decides? I'm assuming class rank doesn't matter......

The specialty leader decides. The UMOC coordinator isn't involved. The current specialty leader doesn't use class rank; rather he prefers to take a more holistic/subjective approach. I understand that previous specialty leaders DID, in fact, use class rank as a factor in the assignment process.

 

[UMOC101]

The specialty leader decides. The UMOC coordinator isn't involved. The current specialty leader doesn't use class rank; rather he prefers to take a more holistic/subjective approach. I understand that previous specialty leaders DID, in fact, use class rank as a factor in the assignment process.

Yea, the current decision process is a complicated algorithm where by those with family co-location issues (real or engineered) come first. While I agree with co-locating someone whose wife is stationed at a certain base or in a residency program, I disagree with co-location someone who enrolled their wife in a school near the base they wanted after they saw the billet list. The current system encourages "gaming".

I would recommend completely ignoring the instructors and working on a masters degree like some of my classmates did. They were the only two to get actual dive billets.

 

[Glycereine]

I know this is quite an old thread, but I'm interested in UMO as well and am curious what the last few classes breakdowns have been for assignments.