Undergrad scientific journal

[pezzang]

How important are publications from the Undergraduate scientific journal in applying to med school? How hard is it to be published in the undergrad scientific journal?
Would it be better to be the first author in undergrad scientific journal than becoming the fifth author of a mediocre professional journal? Are there any rankings in different undergrad scientific journals in terms of prestige? Usually, on average, how many articles are published in a single undergrad scientific journal annually?

AND how do you think admissions weigh undergrad scientific journal in state vs private schools and ivy vs non-ivy? I could see how either case could be more preferred by med schools so i was curious what you think.

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[pezzang]

58 Views so far and nobody has any ideas?

 

[QuakerPreMed]

My initial thought was "there are undergrad scientific journals?" and I assume that's the same response a lot of Adcom members would have. Being fifth author on a JBC or PNAS paper is a heck of a lot better, I would say.

 

[etf]

Being fifth author on a JBC or PNAS paper is a heck of a lot better, I would say.

if i were on an adcom, i'd definately prefer the former than the latter; but i would actually want to read this article in the undergrad journal. i'd rather have a kid that did something on his/her own than just someone who is piggybacking on other people's work for admissions purposes.

 

[etf]

oh, and by former i mean the undergrad journal, not "jbc"

 

[TheAmazingGOB]

My initial thought was "there are undergrad scientific journals?"

I also had this reaction. Lets be honest, almost all undergraduate research is piggybacking the work of others and adcoms know that so being 4th or 5th or 80th author on a paper shouldn't matter.

What they really want to see is that you've done research period, publications are just icing on the cake as the number of publications an undergrad will get is totally dependent on the project and PI.

 

[pezzang]

do most undergraduate institutions not have undergraduate scientific journal that they publish annually?

 

[Green Pirate]

lol i think you're looking into this too much. if you get published that's great, make sure you mention it any interviews so the adcoms know you learned something and got something out of the research experience. whether you are published 5th in some medical journal, 1st in an undergrad journal, or not published at all will not make or break your app--IMO, only gpa, MCAT, and possibly shallow medical exposure can do that for you.

 

[DropkickMurphy]

do most undergraduate institutions not have undergraduate scientific journal that they publish annually?

Well, it depends- some do and some don't.....some of them have them, and others have departmental magazines that are referred to as journals. That is of course stretching the definition of the word very thin.

 

[Mus]

Penn has an undergraduate research journal run completely by students called PennScience: Journal of Undergraduate Research (www.pennscience.org). We publish an average of 4-5 papers per issue 2 times a year. We've had authors who told us that when they were applying for graduate and medical schools, their interviewers have been really interested in their PennScience publications. I think it's great to be published in an undergraduate research journal - not only may it look good for applications, you also get to learn about the manuscript review process early on.

 

[acf11]

My initial thought was "there are undergrad scientific journals?".

check out http://www.jyi.org

 

[soeagerun2or]

Professional journals >> undergraduate journals. It's akin to a national meeting vs. a meeting for undergraduates at your school. If you get in to the national meeting 1) the national meeting has a wider audience & participation base meaning 2) your work is substantial.

Undergraduate journals are fine and if that's all you can get your work into great, it is far better than not doing anything at all.

 

[premeddick]

lol i think you're looking into this too much. if you get published that's great, make sure you mention it any interviews so the adcoms know you learned something and got something out of the research experience. whether you are published 5th in some medical journal, 1st in an undergrad journal, or not published at all will not make or break your app--IMO, only gpa, MCAT, and possibly shallow medical exposure can do that for you.

I am not sure I totally agree with this. Why does it seem like in order to get into great medical schools (ie research oriented) it takes more than just a good gpa and mcat? It always seems like the people who get into these medical schools have great volunteer experiences or research experiences or clinical experiences... If someone has a first author paper or even lower in a peer reviewed professional journal, in my opinion, it trumps someone who was president of a club or shadowed a doctor for a couple hours or even published in an undergraduate journal. 30+3.5 doesn't necessarily get you into medical schools (it probably just gets you in the door), its the other stuff that makes or breaks an application.

 

[pezzang]

i've heard that publishing in undergraduate scientific journal is a lot harder than being a fifth author of a professional journal because of the work required (all lab work + writing). Plus only less than 10 articles from undergraduate student body are competitively screened and reviewed as compared to being the fifth author in which case your PI or grad/postbac writes the paper professionally to meet the standard of journal article. also, much has to do with PI and project. but i can see how prof journal could be impressive.. so if you ask me, i would say being the first author of undergrad journal article is better..

 

[DropkickMurphy]

i've heard that publishing in undergraduate scientific journal is a lot harder than being a fifth author of a professional journal because of the work required

Having written for both.....I would say that they are not in the same ballpark. Comparing the journal geared towards undergrads and other students with a well respected journal with a decent impact factor is akin to comparing writing a final paper for freshman composition with writing a thesis.

 

[Fiddlergirl]

I wouldn't worry about it too much. Like TheAmazingGOB said, publications are just the icing on the cake. Some students (like me) end up in research labs that are just starting and barely publish anything. The Adcom isn't going to blame you for that. I think it's more important to understand the research and why it's important in case you're asked during an interview.

 

[pezzang]

Anybody else?

 

[93106]

i got an interview from baylor in february right after after i sent in an update letter that included a publication as 4th author in a professional journal. coincidental timing? perhaps...

also, one of my interviewers in a school that accepted me told me that being published in a prof journal was "something i could be proud of." he was a phd.

 

[Marquis_Phoenix]

Only publish in an undergraduate journal if you are unable to publish in a professional peer-reviewed journal.

 

[kidthor]

Why is this an either/or question? Can you not try to do both?

 

[AtreyuRocks]

I have both 1st author undergrad journal and 3rd author Neurbio. of Aging. Although the latter is better by far, imo any pub on your blossoming CV helps at this point. In my application process, I only had the former and still got interviews etc as an MD/PhD applicant. IMO: 1. Take any pub you can get. 2. all adcoms know that any pub as an undergrad is unlikely to have PhD student-status contribution (not saying this doesnt happen) hence the reason to interview you.

Here is how I would rank the following contributions with 1. being looked upon most highly:

1. 1st author Science, Nature, Cell etc
2. 1st author in mid-low impact journal
3. 3rd author or more in Science, Nature, Cell etc
4. 3rd author or more in mid-low impact journal
5. 1st author in your school's UG journal/publication

anyone else disagree? i think arguments could be made to play musical chairs with the ranking of anything listed 2-5. i would also tend to think if you got 1st author in science, cell, or nature as an UG, you either a) are full of crap, or b) completed a PhD or PhD-worthy work in which case you are placed in an entirely different category un-related to traditional md applicants =)

EDIT: also in regard to the OP's Q about the ranking of UG journals... i agree with mus that some undergrad journals are regarded more highly than others (especially since some are harder to publish in). despite this, i would think that the likelihood of all adcoms knowing this would be slim or irrelevant. regardless of your pub's prestige (pending your other stats), adcom--if interested-- would want to interview you and see how well you are able to talk about your research and contribution(s).

 

[durfen]

How important are publications from the Undergraduate scientific journal in applying to med school? How hard is it to be published in the undergrad scientific journal?
Would it be better to be the first author in undergrad scientific journal than becoming the fifth author of a mediocre professional journal? Are there any rankings in different undergrad scientific journals in terms of prestige? Usually, on average, how many articles are published in a single undergrad scientific journal annually?

AND how do you think admissions weigh undergrad scientific journal in state vs private schools and ivy vs non-ivy? I could see how either case could be more preferred by med schools so i was curious what you think.

I agree with the poster above, if your research can be published in a better journal, don't waste your time with the undergraduate stuff. I didn't waste my time with our quarterly journal.

 

[premeddick]

I would talk to your PI. If you did enough work to be listed first on an undergraduate article, then you should still be the first author if the work is good enough to go to a professional journal. A lot of "ifs" but definitely worth the extra effort if you can be first author in a professional journal.

I once had a senior investigator tell me that he would stay in the lab all day and night for a week if it meant that he would be listed as an author on a Science or Nature paper. I think in terms of brand name recognition it helps to be any author on these types of papers than a first author in a lower journal. For medical school I am not so sure. The leadership that it requires to be a first author usually means something to the adcomms.