Undergrad Summer Internship Question

[AznDoc]

Hi guys,
Thanks a whole lot for all of the contributions that you guys are making. Having found this forum I have had so many of my questions answered, but here is one that I have been pondering as of late. Is the business internship a requirement during b-school (it sounds like it is)? Also, I have a cousin who works at JP Morgan Chase as an investment banker and he said that I would be able to do an internship out there with his team during my junior and senior year. Is that a good idea or should I just continue to spend my summers at Pfizer doing research until medical school? Let me know what you are thinking or share some observations and experiences. Thanks.

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[Xmulder]

AznDoc, here is what my premed advisor (an old, distinguished doctor) told me about a very similar situation I had. He said, medical school slots are so few and precious, that he and others like him (when the admissions committee sits down to review app's) are looking for applicant candidates who clearly are *committed* to the practice of medicine. He and these committees "actively" discourage (and look down) on those applicants who "dabble" in non-medical, non-clinical, or non-humanitarian ventures such as management consulting or investment banking. He told me that "to do so would raise a very large flag as to whether this person genuinely wanted to become a doctor and practice medicine." I think this is consistent with the fact that many ppl in the medical community openly or secretly dislike people with MBA's, whom they view as dishonest or having financial ulterior motives.

So in summary, while I think doing a finance internship may be interesting, doing so would raise questions about your commitment, when these committees review your application and your work/volunteer experience. They may likely ask, "if this person is so interested in becoming a doctor, why is he/she pursuing a finance internship near the end of their college experience?" Since the med school application process is so difficult and acceptance rates are in the single digits, this would unnecessarily weaken your application. The last thing you want to do is to introduce some doubt (however small) in the minds of these admissions folk. See my point? on the other hand, there are probably other internships that would be equally interesting but would not raise any questions at all -- rather, would support your med school application.

Hope this helps.

 

[mward04]

AznDoc, here is what my premed advisor (an old, distinguished doctor) told me about a very similar situation I had. He said, medical school slots are so few and precious, that he and others like him (when the admissions committee sits down to review app's) are looking for applicant candidates who clearly are *committed* to the practice of medicine. He and these committees "actively" discourage (and look down) on those applicants who "dabble" in non-medical, non-clinical, or non-humanitarian ventures such as management consulting or investment banking. He told me that "to do so would raise a very large flag as to whether this person genuinely wanted to become a doctor and practice medicine." I think this is consistent with the fact that many ppl in the medical community openly or secretly dislike people with MBA's, whom they view as dishonest or having financial ulterior motives.

So in summary, while I think doing a finance internship may be interesting, doing so would raise questions about your commitment, when these committees review your application and your work/volunteer experience. They may likely ask, "if this person is so interested in becoming a doctor, why is he/she pursuing a finance internship near the end of their college experience?" Since the med school application process is so difficult and acceptance rates are in the single digits, this would unnecessarily weaken your application. The last thing you want to do is to introduce some doubt (however small) in the minds of these admissions folk. See my point? on the other hand, there are probably other internships that would be equally interesting but would not raise any questions at all -- rather, would support your med school application.

Hope this helps.

I say do what interests you most. If you are not passionate about research, they are going to ask you about it in the interview and get nailed because you can't talk about it with interest. Plus, if the internship at JP is health-oriented then it will be applicable. Make it applicable and the interviewers will not care.

Another option is to do research during the year and do the JP internship during the summer.

 

[ortho-mdmba]

You have three summers in undergrad and using one to do a business related experience will not be looked down upon and can actually spark an interesting debate and conversation with interviewers as they are mainly seeing "clones" all day.

The only piece of advice about the JP internship will be, try to do it in something related to healthcare- equity research, i-banking. I am sure JP has a healthcare division. And round it out with some hospital volunteering and/or research as you are already doing.

You may have to answer more challenging questions regarding healthcare financing and economics but look at this as an opportunity to shine and separate yourself from the pack.

State your goals clearly and demonstrate passion and you'll be fine. That said you need the numbers too . You unfortunately cannot patch up a lackluster app with business experience as some applicants do with research.

If questioned about your commitment, simply state you tried out your other interest which crystallized your commitment to medicine and that you would have been guessing for life whether medicine was the right choice or not.

Hope this helps

 

[Xmulder]

I completely disagree with this and it is quite unfortunate that your premed advisor is giving this kind of advice but I guess that's how its done in the "old days". This is one of the reasons why medicine is stuck in the rut today.

Your assertion in the last statement is naive and baseless. MBAs?? I thought he asked about a summer internship. I'll address separately.

Here is the matchlist of MD/MBAs from Penn (Scroll down and notice the MDs in other ventures on your way):

http://www.whartonhealthcare.org/healthcare_dept_news/placement_news.htm

Radiology, University of Pennsylvania Health System/Presbyterian Hospital, Philadelphia, PA
Radiology, Massachusetts General Hospital, Boston, MA
Combined Residency Program Harvard Orthopedics, Boston, MA
Internal Medicine, Massachusetts General Hospital, Boston, MA
Internal Medicine, Hospital of the University of Pennsylvania, Philadelphia, PA



How about Yale (click on "residency matches tab"):

http://mba.yale.edu/framesets/mdmba.asp?/mdmba/mdmbahome.htm

Johns Hopkins Hospital, Internal Medicine
Cornell University, Internal Medicine/Primary Care
Johns Hopkins Hospital, Ophthalmology
Brigham and Women?s Hospital, Internal Medicine/Primary Care
University of Pennsylvania, Radiology
Yale University, Orthopedic Surgery
University of Colorado Health Sciences Center, Diagnostic Radiology
Massachusetts General Hospital, Brigham and Women?s Hospital, Beth Israel Deaconness Hospital and Children?s Hospital, Dermatology

Sorry I couldn't find Duke's but I hear that many of the dept chairs at Duke have MBAs now.

Dislike?!? I don't think so.

Hey, Ortho, chill. No need to take what I said personally. I was simply relaying what my premed advisor passed on. His views, which I happen to disagree with, but then again he's the one w/ the bigger voice on these committees so his is the one that counts. Hate to break it to you, but many old physicians still hold this point of view, regardless of what you feel or believe. I don't appreciate your tone and no need to get defensive. Everyone is entitled to his/her opinion.

And why are you citing these residency placements? Who's talking about this anyway? I never said MD/MBAs couldn't get into a good residency program. We weren't even talking about MD/MBAs. I raised the MBA part only to illustrate many doctors' disdain for business. Your list is meaningless since I could cite an equally impressive list from JD/MBAs, MD/PhD's , or just straight MD's. Pls don't act like you know it all in this area. I agree it is beneficial to give the OP varying views, but don't dock mine.

Last, stop bragging in your serving on a admissions committee. Big deal? So do I -- and several of my friends. Get a life.

You want to express your POV, do it nicely, like mward.

Who peed in your Cheerios?

 

[Xmulder]

Not much of an apology there, Ortho, with your addendum.

Ahh, you think you are so smart, eh?

Actually I served on both adcoms for undergrad and med school. And I don't brag about it like your pathetic ass. And no, I am not at Dartmouth, that was just one of the programs I was considering. I also share my avatar with several roommates... You think you are so smart, huh? You can't pin me down that easily. Whereas if you had asked nicely, I would have simply told you.

And here I thought you were in B-school now...and understood the whole point of networking was to make friends, not enemies. Clearly, you missed that lesson.

Mward, as the moderator, should kick your patronizing and conniving ass off this post.

 

[AznDoc]

Thanks for the input. I completely understand that getting into med school requires having top-notch work on the resume, and in no way will I attempt to cover up a poor CV with research. There is definitely a lot of hard work ahead of me (as well as all of us), and more for me to research and think about before I do this internship. Personally I have had a blast doing research at Pfizer this summer and the recent poster session was a completely new and exciting experience for me. However, I do also enjoy finance, business, and accounting, and the best place to get heavy exposure would be at a bank like JP. To me it seems like doing two research internships and one financial one would add more dimension to my application, and thus separate me from the crowd. Thanks for all the help so far, if you think of anything else please keep it coming.