unprofessional funeral home - thoughts appreciated

[bravotwozero]

Wish I could come up with a thread title, but I'm so ticked off right now, I'm having a hard time thinking.

A week or so I had a patient in cardiac arrest, didn't make it. Spoke to family, seemed nice, and understanding, took it well. Case got submitted to ME, to see if they wanted to take the case, and never heard back from anyone until almost a week later.

I get this notice in the form of a forwarded email chain from my Medical director, who I actually get along with and think is a great guy:

'Dr Bravotwozero, please see below. If you're unable to complete the death certificate, i'll have to do it.'

Forwarded email from funeral home to some hospital administrator says 'we tried to contact Dr Bravotwozero but he said he was in Austin (details changed for privacy), and that he couldn't fill out the death certificate and to get another doctor to complete it, this patient doesn't have a pcp'

...except this conversation NEVER actually happened. Nobody contacted me until I got this whopper of an email about filling out anyone's death certificate. Not only did nobody contact me, the funeral home never even assigned the death certificate, which they know is the first step needed in getting the certificate filled out by the physician.

Only after I replied to my medical director calling them out on this BS, do I get a formal notice the next day asking to fill out the death certificate.

It gets better.

I log into my account, which had to be unlocked because I hadn't had to fill one out in like 5 years, and I'm trying to do this while on a busy ED shift because i'm getting hounded by these stupid emails.

Blank screen, no death notice to be found.

I call the help desk, and they look up the case and say the death certificate has been filled out by a PCP.

So now, you have lies upon lies. I get contacted in an imaginary conversation (lie #1), I refuse to sign the certificate in said conversation (lie #2), and the non existent PCP magically pops up and signs the death certificate before I even get a chance (lie #3).

Still, no apologies, none of the funeral home knuckleheads want to acknowledge their mistake. I told the admin to demand they offer a formal apology, but I have low confidence this is going to happen.

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[bravotwozero]

I guess what really bothers me is that their statement is an attack on my integrity and character - they are basically saying that I was refusing to do my job.

We all know what kind of standards we as doctors have to adhere to. But I guess when you run a funeral home, you can get away with being a lying, dishonest sack of feces.

Thoughts?

Am I overreacting and just need to calm down? Or would you be upset if you were me?

 

[dadaddadaBATMAN]

I guess what really bothers me is that their statement is an attack on my integrity and character - they are basically saying that I was refusing to do my job.

We all know what kind of standards we as doctors have to adhere to. But I guess when you run a funeral home, you can get away with being a lying, dishonest sack of feces.

Thoughts?

Am I overreacting and just need to calm down? Or would you be upset if you were me?

I would be upset as well. Having said that yes you’re probably over reacting a bit.

this sounds as though they are incompetent more than anything. I would not be surprised if they had that conversation with the wrong hospital or physician who told them to F off.

If I was going to do anything I would probably contact the patient’s family directly to let them know a death certificate has been filled out by dr. Primary care, so they can use it for insurance or whatever, and express condolences.

This serves two purposes:
1. It is a good and decent thing to do, and saves family time getting important paperwork done
2. It may prevent a board complaint if this incompetent funeral home is selling the same bs to the family they told your admin. While this can’t hurt you since it’s obviously bs, it will cost you time and aggravation

I would not opt for any further contact with funeral home save to note in a brief email that they are mistaken, and outline the facts.

Apologies are a bunch of empty words. Besides which they probably won’t apologize

If there is a regulatory body for funeral homes (no idea) you could complain to them.

From a quick google, my state does have a board for funeral home directors. They have a complaint line not unlike our own. This likely varies by state

 

[dadaddadaBATMAN]

I guess what really bothers me is that their statement is an attack on my integrity and character - they are basically saying that I was refusing to do my job.

We all know what kind of standards we as doctors have to adhere to. But I guess when you run a funeral home, you can get away with being a lying, dishonest sack of feces.

Thoughts?

Am I overreacting and just need to calm down? Or would you be upset if you were me?

Also, if I was going to ask my director to do anything about this it would be to send the funeral home a bill for my time doing their job (85% joking)

 

[southerndoc]

I wouldn't let it bother me. Incompetence is ripe in every profession, and this exhibits incompetence in what the funeral home did.

Remember the end result... some family needing a death certificate completed to obtain life insurance payment, disability benefits, gain access to checking accounts/pension/etc. This funeral home may have been just as incompetent and aggressive with the family to pay for the person's funeral as they were you to sign the death certificate.

 

[WilcoWorld]

I guess what really bothers me is that their statement is an attack on my integrity and character - they are basically saying that I was refusing to do my job.

We all know what kind of standards we as doctors have to adhere to. But I guess when you run a funeral home, you can get away with being a lying, dishonest sack of feces.

Thoughts?

Am I overreacting and just need to calm down? Or would you be upset if you were me?

We love ya BTZ, I suggest you shake it off and get back to being awesome and interacting with, you know, live people.

 

[RustedFox]

I frequently get pissed off at people's incompetence as well.

Bravo is rightly pissed off; mostly because D!ckheadFunerals went around him to the medical director and thus making the situation needlessly complex.

But hey, problem fixed. Move on.

Similarly, we keep getting phone calls about transfers from this one site, and have to tell them again and again that *** they have to use the transfer line *** and they can't just pick up the phone to say this patient has been accepted by DoctorX already and it's coming your way. Patient gets here, and nobody is aware of any plan or anything.

 

[Brigade4Radiant]

Yeah being an emergency department physician it’s just so stressful. Do you have to be nice to the patient’s family and all these ancillary services. I also never sign death certificates

 

[dchristismi]

I sign several hundred a month. I can always tell when it's a random one that doesn't know me who calls because I overhear the receptionist saying verbatum "She signs them all electronically. Yes, every day. Just send it electronically, you don't have to fax it. Yes, today..."

Funeral homes deal with a ton of crap and there is definitely time pressure, but the majority do try to work with doctors. You probably had one frazzled person who called the wrong ED, got sent to 3 different clerks, put on hold twice and got someone who had no earthly idea, looked at the wrong schedule and guessed wrong. In general, they really try to avoid calling ED docs because that's exactly what happens.

 

[e30ftw]

Yeah that's pretty annoying but ultimately has nothing to do with you. The director definitely crossed a line by lying about speaking with you and forwarding to your medical director.

Our state has a cumbersome death certificate process. I fill out 1-2 a month usually and make every effort to respond ASAP but the issue is it has to go to the funeral home first before I can electronically sign and they have a frequent login/password lock-out process for security combined with no help-desk at night or on weekends. I can fill them out at home but several times a year I get a call from the ED saying some director is calling for me to sign a death certificate so "insert important financial/executive function" can take place. I'd be totally happy to fill them out while working but if the funeral director sends it to me 3 days later when I'm camping or out of town or something and the electronic service isn't working correctly what am I supposed to do?

 

[Rekt]

I disagree. There's no reason to let people walk on you.

Write a formal letter to the funeral home enlightening them on their incompetence and how that was inappropriate that they flat out lied. The matter was taken care of but you expect this not to happen again in the future.

 

[RuralEDDoc]

I disagree. There's no reason to let people walk on you.

Write a formal letter to the funeral home enlightening them on their incompetence and how that was inappropriate that they flat out lied. The matter was taken care of but you expect this not to happen again in the future.

Alternatively, you can pick your battles. Let the minor infraction from a struggling funeral home slide and get on with your life. Maybe call the funeral home director as a courtesy. Formal letters are for the JDs.

 

[bravotwozero]

Thanks to all those who responded. Very helpful to see things from other vantage points. Was fuming before, but over it now. Don't know what i'll do, if anything at all, but again, really helpful perspectives.

 

[emergentmd]

I will say in the 20 yrs of EM, I have never let anything clinical/Admin bother me. I guess my threshold for being ticked off is higher. Its a job, I do my best for the pts, and go home with a clear/calm mind.

Now, what happened to you would irritate me somewhat. But is it worth putting in any more effort to get an apology from someone who likely have nothing to do with what happened? Just like calling customer service for someone who was incompetent. I call to get an answer/fix the issue and not get an apology b/c the person answering the call had nothing to do with what happened.

In life with all my issues/problems (outside of direct family issues).

1. If I can fix it, I will fix it.
2. If I can't fix it, I do my best and move on

There really is no good that comes out of worrying about things that you can't fix.

 

[GonnaBeADoc2222]

This type of "roll over, just get over it" attitude is why we keep getting **** on.

You go full send. Report to whatever governing body administers funeral homes. Leave bad google reviews. Write a letter to the patient's family expressing your condolences and make it clear that this mishap was in no way your fault.

This action on their part could have resulted in you being reported to your state medical board. It's time we all stand up to nonsense like this.

 

[southerndoc]

This type of "roll over, just get over it" attitude is why we keep getting **** on.

You go full send. Report to whatever governing body administers funeral homes. Leave bad google reviews. Write a letter to the patient's family expressing your condolences and make it clear that this mishap was in no way your fault.

This action on their part could have resulted in you being reported to your state medical board. It's time we all stand up to nonsense like this.

Is it really going to fix the problem? It may allow you to vent, but personally I don't let things like this bother me. This is why people get burned out so easily. They let little things like this bother them.

 

[dadaddadaBATMAN]

Is it really going to fix the problem? It may allow you to vent, but personally I don't let things like this bother me. This is why people get burned out so easily. They let little things like this bother them.

I agree with the don’t sweat the small stuff, but disagree with the “why people get burned out so easily.”

People get burned out because we work in a barbicue. It isn’t the meat’s fault that it’s hot.

I am ambivalent with going full nuclear on them by reporting to the board, feel that’s up to the individual if it’s worth it to them.

It should be done from as neutral an emotional place as possible though, because it will make it a lot more effective and allow you to decide if it’s really worth it.

 

[FrustratedFamDoc]

The bitter taste of this comes from the reminder that it all rolls down hill to you, and you will always be in the wrong, no matter what, always, and don't expect anyone else to stick up for you.

I'm FM, but it frequently happens when pharmacies tell patients that we refused refills on maintenance meds... you know, because of course I won't refill your lisinopril when I just saw you 2 mos ago. Then on follow up, they've been off xyz medication for 2 mos because we refused to fill it, and they're pissed at me. It's great. It probably happens at least once every 2 weeks.

I just dish dirt right back on the pharmacies and recommend private ones in town whom I NEVER have any issues with.

 

[WilcoWorld]

This type of "roll over, just get over it" attitude is why we keep getting **** on.

You go full send. Report to whatever governing body administers funeral homes. Leave bad google reviews. Write a letter to the patient's family expressing your condolences and make it clear that this mishap was in no way your fault.

This action on their part could have resulted in you being reported to your state medical board. It's time we all stand up to nonsense like this.

Is it really going to fix the problem? It may allow you to vent, but personally I don't let things like this bother me. This is why people get burned out so easily. They let little things like this bother them.

I agree with the don’t sweat the small stuff, but disagree with the “why people get burned out so easily.”

People get burned out because we work in a barbicue. It isn’t the meat’s fault that it’s hot.

I am ambivalent with going full nuclear on them by reporting to the board, feel that’s up to the individual if it’s worth it to them.

It should be done from as neutral an emotional place as possible though, because it will make it a lot more effective and allow you to decide if it’s really worth it.

Agree with @dadaddadaBATMAN
You don't have to roll over and take it. You also don't have to get angry about it (or at least, you don't have to act with anger). There is another way: Calmly, professionally, and effectively make the offender aware that if they make this sort of mistake with Dr. @bravotwozero then it will not be without consequences. Will it make a difference? Who knows? Maybe not, but maybe next time they're about to do this they'll recognize the name Dr. BTZ and put in a little more effort...

 

[larpleston]

I disagree. There's no reason to let people walk on you.

Write a formal letter to the funeral home enlightening them on their incompetence and how that was inappropriate that they flat out lied. The matter was taken care of but you expect this not to happen again in the future.

Where I work these nuisances are so common that fighting them would be a never ending game of whack a mole. @emergentmd is right though. At the end of the day it just doesn't matter. I let the nuisance emails pile up, delete the ones I can ignore, respond politely to the others. I go and cash my check, and let the incompetent administrators/staff/consultants squawk. That's a benefit of being in an employed, non-CMG position though. Their options are to decide if these attacks on you as a clinician are a fireable offense. If they're not, then who cares. And things like this are not.